Miracles never cease in these parts

[jwitt]

Number 2 is one that I had been told was long gone. Apparently not! Roswell NM. 

It is what I term a skinny trunk filifera. Check out the temperatures this palm saw! Definitely cold hardy! 

 

[jwitt]

Numbers 3 and 4. Fort Bayard, NM. Highest reported elevation Washingtonia in the US!  They see zero and below on occasion and look to have no supplemental irrigation.  My hunch is they may have been seeded in place due to the curve on the one(or possibly growing sideways) after some kind of damage.  6000'!

[jwitt]

That's it for robusta pollen free in NM. I do believe ABQ will become a source as more palms enter the seeding age. 

There are some incredibly nice filifera in Alamogordo, Las Cruces, T or C.  They just might not be robusta pollen free. 

North Texas is currently robusta free also, albeit probably temporarily..

[jwitt]

Back to my palms

Got some mold in the high desert

It was a long and wet winter for here.  Spring is probably 2-3 weeks behind. 

[jwitt]

In mid Feb, I was away and this snow hit.

14f was the low. 16f the preceding night.  This was the low for the winter.  About a half zone above normal. 

But it was a long winter because 20f hit and stuck around for about ten days. Lows in the low twenties. This was in mid November. 

No bitter or palm killing temps(for here)!

But back to miracles.....

 

[jwitt]

Been watching some "weird" yuccas the last decade or so. 

Back in 2011 when it was -10f here.  It must have stressed the yucca faxoniana, so that they all bloomed that year(they don't bloom every year).  They bloom the same time as yucca bacatta,  but the faxoniana never set seed, whereas the bacatta always do.  The moths that pollinate tall yuccas do not appear until late May, well after faxoniana have bloomed.

Except 2011. Some faxoniana set seed.  2012 weird yucca began to appear in the neighborhood.  

I believe it to be a faxoniana/baccata hybrid.  Fast growth for a yucca(7' in ten years). 

Anyways, got seeds from the 7' hybrid.  My hopes?

A fast, hardy yucca, that got pollinated by more bacatta to impart blue leaves. Dreaming. .....

Some pics from yesterday

First pic- hybrid yucca

Second pic- yucca faxoniana and bacatta blooming, Hybrid is just outside the pic, left against the wall.

Third pic- yucca faxoniana in bloom. Zoomed in at the top of the mailbox, is another hybrid.  Left of the hybrid, is a bacatta.  These blooms are several weeks late. 

Back to root damage soon......

 

Edited May 7, 2023 by jwitt
Clarification

[teddytn]

Dry or wet cold I totally get. Regardless, a trunking palm that survives negative temps repeatedly over the years is amazing to me. 

[jwitt]

Easing back to palms and eventually back to my palm root damage...

Saw a post on palmtalk where the poster has documented palms in the area.  Pretty cool to my palmophile background.

Anyways, discovered on the map, a palm(turns out it survived 2011) in Corrales. It is just outside and west of the bosque(forest).  This is the beginning of the local palm zone, or best in the metr in my mind.

Anyways, I have literally spent the last 50 (47) years playing in these hills. Still walk em to this day. Never knew of this palm. 

A side note, it is on the north side of the house. 

Center of the pic is a house(red roof) just west of the largest contiguous cottonwood forest in the world. 

zoomed in

Street view

[jwitt]

On 5/6/2023 at 9:22 PM, jwitt said:

Been watching some "weird" yuccas the last decade or so. 

Back in 2011 when it was -10f here.  It must have stressed the yucca faxoniana, so that they all bloomed that year(they don't bloom every year).  They bloom the same time as yucca bacatta,  but the faxoniana never set seed, whereas the bacatta always do.  The moths that pollinate tall yuccas do not appear until late May, well after faxoniana have bloomed.

Except 2011. Some faxoniana set seed.  2012 weird yucca began to appear in the neighborhood.  

I believe it to be a faxoniana/baccata hybrid.  Fast growth for a yucca(7' in ten years). 

Anyways, got seeds from the 7' hybrid.  My hopes?

A fast, hardy yucca, that got pollinated by more bacatta to impart blue leaves. Dreaming. .....

Some pics from yesterday

First pic- hybrid yucca

Second pic- yucca faxoniana and bacatta blooming, Hybrid is just outside the pic, left against the wall.

Third pic- yucca faxoniana in bloom. Zoomed in at the top of the mailbox, is another hybrid.  Left of the hybrid, is a bacatta.  These blooms are several weeks late. 

Back to root damage soon......

 

A yucca bacatta group. These bloom usually in late March/early April.  Blooming now.  A month or so late, and these are native, whereas faxionia are imported.  

[Quasarecho]

On 5/7/2023 at 10:23 AM, jwitt said:

Easing back to palms and eventually back to my palm root damage...

Saw a post on palmtalk where the poster has documented palms in the area.  Pretty cool to my palmophile background.

Anyways, discovered on the map, a palm(turns out it survived 2011) in Corrales. It is just outside and west of the bosque(forest).  This is the beginning of the local palm zone, or best in the metr in my mind.

Anyways, I have literally spent the last 50 (47) years playing in these hills. Still walk em to this day. Never knew of this palm. 

A side note, it is on the north side of the house. 

Center of the pic is a house(red roof) just west of the largest contiguous cottonwood forest in the world. 

zoomed in

Street view

Pretty amazing!

[jwitt]

I believe mass, whether it be rocks, earth, or the plants themselves, are extremely helpful in this location.  Our atmosphere is essentially a vacuum that allows heat to escape, but inversely,  this is also very conducive to heat transfer.  Especially heat transfer by radiation.  Lower elevations would be much less efficient, but conductive heat transfer would be easily accomplished by conduction(touch).  

Sorry, back to palms.  A palm not so much seen here is Mediterranean palm.  Hmmm......a handful? Maybe.

There was a time when a theory going around was that frozen palms don't like strong sun when frozen.  So I had it to try in my head on the north side of my house in my courtyard. 

I sourced seed out of Las Cruces in about 2000?

We saw -10f in 2/2011.  The palm completely defoliated and lost 1 8"high trunk.  It recovered to this. Pic from 12/4/2011

Then it saw this 2 days later. (Ten months from the -10f).  

It defoliated again. I decided growth was too slow after back to back total defoliation and moved the palm to my south wall. I used large rocks also. 

 

As the plant gained mass and expanded, I removed the rocks, the palms only "protection".v

I never protected, even 2011. Here it is 6/2017 on the southside.

 

Today:Here are 3 pix from  yesterday.  Tallest trunk is over 3'.  It did suffer about 20% defoliation in 2022's 7f.  Leaves are about 6' high. 

Salud from New Mexican and my mass rantings!

More to come.....

 

Edited May 10, 2023 by jwitt
Word crarification

[jwitt]

Palms can and do defoliate here.  At least mine have. Every year?  No.  

 

3/7/2009

5/6/2010

9/29/2012(second growing season after -10f-2/2011)

Today

 

[Quasarecho]

On 5/10/2023 at 11:50 AM, jwitt said:

I believe mass, whether it be rocks, earth, or the plants themselves, are extremely helpful in this location.  Our atmosphere is essentially a vacuum that allows heat to escape, but inversely,  this is also very conducive to heat transfer.  Especially heat transfer by radiation.  Lower elevations would be much less efficient, but conductive heat transfer would be easily accomplished by conduction(touch).  

Sorry, back to palms.  A palm not so much seen here is Mediterranean palm.  Hmmm......a handful? Maybe.

There was a time when a theory going around was that frozen palms don't like strong sun when frozen.  So I had it to try in my head on the north side of my house in my courtyard. 

I sourced seed out of Las Cruces in about 2000?

We saw -10f in 2/2011.  The palm completely defoliated and lost 1 8"high trunk.  It recovered to this. Pic from 12/4/2011

Then it saw this 2 days later. (Ten months from the -10f).  

It defoliated again. I decided growth was too slow after back to back total defoliation and moved the palm to my south wall. I used large rocks also. 

 

As the plant gained mass and expanded, I removed the rocks, the palms only "protection".v

I never protected, even 2011. Here it is 6/2017 on the southside.

 

Today:Here are 3 pix from  yesterday.  Tallest trunk is over 3'.  It did suffer about 20% defoliation in 2022's 7f.  Leaves are about 6' high. 

Salud from New Mexican and my mass rantings!

More to come.....

What kind of Cactus? That's amazing!

 

[jwitt]

Claret cup. The cactus is about 2-3' high

[jwitt]

Here is the cacti a week later, winding down. 

Others are winding up as I type. 

 

[jwitt]

Closeup of a "healthy" filifera leaf

[jwitt]

I have attempted many palms over the years and have more failures than successes. That said,  many of my past palms have been sourced out of Phoenix, Az.  Went to school there in the early 80's and visit quite regularly to this day. 

Thru the "failures", I learned by success/failure that plant sourcing was very important.  Meaning, most all of my Phoenix sourced palms lacked hardiness to survive my colder climate.  I just attributed it to Phoenix fact that it is a zone 10 climate. Kind of like sourcing cold hardy palms out of Florida. 

So this is probably was a big reason for my drive to source hardy filifera from much colder climates. 

On a side note, some of the local  Albuquerque washingtonia were brought in from Phoenix as trunked specimens.  They may or may not be "local" Phoenix palms, but have proven hardy here. 

Come to find out, Phoenix's original palm(and the apparent ancestor of many Phoenix Washingtonia), was a hybrid sourced out of Hawaii!  I find this info incredible.

Maybe another reason for lack of hardiness?

Phoenix first palm

 

 

Edited May 19, 2023 by jwitt
Word cleanup

[MSX]

On 5/17/2023 at 3:23 AM, jwitt said:

Here is the cacti a week later, winding down. 

Others are winding up as I type. 

 

Nice. Is this a Yucca linearifolia?

[jwitt]

I believe it is yucca elata.  Although it could be Yucca linearifolia. 

The bloom is appearing and right on time for local elata to start sending up bloom stalks.  The bloom will be the tell. 

[DreaminAboutPalms]

8 hours ago, jwitt said:

I have attempted many palms over the years and have more failures than successes. That said,  many of my past palms have been sourced out of Phoenix, Az.  Went to school there in the early 80's and visit quite regularly to this day. 

Thru the "failures", I learned by success/failure that plant sourcing was very important.  Meaning, most all of my Phoenix sourced palms lacked hardiness to survive my colder climate.  I just attributed it to Phoenix fact that it is a zone 10 climate. Kind of like sourcing cold hardy palms out of Florida. 

So this is probably was a big reason for my drive to source hardy filifera from much colder climates. 

On a side note, some of the local  Albuquerque washingtonia were brought in from Phoenix as trunked specimens.  They may or may not be "local" Phoenix palms, but have proven hardy here. 

Come to find out, Phoenix's original palm(and the apparent ancestor of many Phoenix Washingtonia), was a hybrid sourced out of Hawaii!  I find this info incredible.

Maybe another reason for lack of hardiness?

Phoenix first palm

 

 

It’s becoming harder and harder to source true 100% Filifera. I’m praying that these seeds I collected from an ancient Dallas Filifera will turn out pure, cause probably 2/3 of Washingtonia survivors here are clear hybrids 

[jwitt]

1 hour ago, DreaminAboutPalms said:

It’s becoming harder and harder to source true 100% Filifera. I’m praying that these seeds I collected from an ancient Dallas Filifera will turn out pure, cause probably 2/3 of Washingtonia survivors here are clear hybrids 

This is the mother of my current filifera(s). I picked the seeds in 12/2013 after all robusta were killed in the area in 2011.  It was chopped down some time after due to it being under the power lines.  

Pic-Cleburne Tx   12/2013

[DreaminAboutPalms]

One weeks growth + pic of parent tree, no red yet, fingers crossed. Roots already at bottom of cup. 
 

i have another seedling next to it from a different parent tree that has turned purple and i have grow light right on top of both. We’ll see

[jwitt]

9 minutes ago, DreaminAboutPalms said:

One weeks growth + pic of parent tree, no red yet, fingers crossed. Roots already at bottom of cup. 
 

i have another seedling next to it from a different parent tree that has turned purple and i have grow light right on top of both. We’ll see

That future water pumper is already stout! A good sign.

[DreaminAboutPalms]

8 hours ago, jwitt said:

That future water pumper is already stout! A good sign.

Trying to expedite the process with Heat mat + water tray 

[jwitt]

27 minutes ago, DreaminAboutPalms said:

Trying to expedite the process with Heat mat + water tray 

Texas lime and sunshine is hard to beat for filifera growth......I wish you nothing but the best.  

Ultimately this post I started, is about my experience with this palm, my local conditions, and learnings.  To the point, I am trying to document my "root damage" , it's cause, it's effect, and how to avoid it. It's a realtime post that quite lengthy time wise.  I throw in other "local" stuff of interest. 

So my experiment continues, it will be a bit longer.

Next up is going to be some local eucalyptus(palms too) and what I believe to be some unheard of conditions that they endured.  And thrived thru......

Just apologizing for the time length of this post, but I believe it will be useful in the end for others beginning and currently enduring their "disease".  

In the present, it has been raining here(even flooding nearby) and that means johnny palmseed needs to get into action.  Big shout-out to @Ltapiafor the local washy seeds! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ltapia]

Any time good seeds there 

[jwitt]

19 minutes ago, Ltapia said:

Any time good seeds there 

Had the seeds soaking. Palm seeded the local "watering" hole. My yard tomorrow! Thank you so much!

[Ltapia]

Nice is that we’re your planting them?

[jwitt]

7 minutes ago, Ltapia said:

Nice is that we’re your planting them?

Several dozen potential palms. We'll see.

Most will be planted in my yard.

Edited May 20, 2023 by jwitt
Addition

[Ltapia]

Nice good spot looks good for wind protection and water 💪

[jwitt]

Lizards out and about late January.

There is datura, vitex, and Caesalpinia gilliesii naturalized. 

Wind essentially blocked on all sides

Halfway up the escarpment between Corrales and Rio Rancho.

And a weather station at one of the houses on top. 

And maybe most important, intermittent water.

Sunport

Corrales Heights

Edited May 21, 2023 by jwitt
Added sunport for comparison

[Ltapia]

It couldn’t get any better palm oasis !

[jwitt]

Leading into my next post, the latest streetview of the infamous San Mateo filifera(at least for ABQ) looked quite worrisome. This palm was seeded in place about 1990, as legend would have it. 

Streetview from last spring. Any thoughts?

[jwitt]

Albuquerque's first palm tree fire?

Nice recovery none the less!

Pic- 5/28/23

Looks like it bloomed last year.

Edited May 28, 2023 by jwitt

[jwitt]

Is somebody warranting robusta with date palms in zone 7(a)?

[jwitt]

My curved palms are picking up speed, the trunks are expanding. Coming out of the root damage

Know a guy who said he could hear his filifera growing............

5/29/23

[jwitt]

Wonder if "that" guy ever figured what he was hearing from his filifera? 

Maybe this....

Splitting of the leaf bases as the trunk expands.

Edited May 30, 2023 by jwitt

[jwitt]

On 5/16/2023 at 12:23 PM, jwitt said:

Here is the cacti a week later, winding down. 

Others are winding up as I type. 

 

Yep, yucca elata @MSX.  It is growing in near round shade as there is a 5 story directly south(100'?).  Explains the curve in the bloom stalk as the sun was reflecting from the south window directly behind the yucca

[SailorBold]

On 5/30/2023 at 10:49 AM, jwitt said:

Wonder if "that" guy ever figured what he was hearing from his filifera? 

Maybe this....

Splitting of the leaf bases as the trunk expands.

Yep.. thats it.. snap crackle pop... been doing it for the last month or so too..  I think the question this year is going to be...  to skin or not to skin... that is the question..

[jwitt]

Yuge!

Those are massive!

Edited June 3, 2023 by jwitt