0000 - Cold Hardiness Observation Master Data

[kinzyjr]

This update corrects some location information using information reported by some observers.

 

202210292330_ColdHardinessMasterData.xlsx

[kinzyjr]

Description change per @Fusca - https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/67130-the-palms-of-the-oblate-school-of-theology/?do=findComment&comment=1084552

 

202210312330_ColdHardinessMasterData.xlsx

[ZPalms]

On 10/31/2022 at 6:44 PM, kinzyjr said:

Description change per @Fusca - https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/67130-the-palms-of-the-oblate-school-of-theology/?do=findComment&comment=1084552

 

202210312330_ColdHardinessMasterData.xlsx 990.09 kB · 17 downloads

I had no idea this existed, awesome data for zoning pushing 😍

[kinzyjr]

@RedRabbit + @Merlyn + @PalmJuan + @Brian M + @TampaPalms + @D Palm + @D. Morrowii + @Bkue

Thank you for all of your reports from the January 2022 Freeze.  They are now included in the new spreadsheet.  This version adds three new palm species and 12 new events.  Saint Johns Botantical Garden and Nature Preserve contributed over 200 reports, some for species that did not previously have a single observation.  If any corrections need to be made, let me know.

Some relevant statistics:

• Total Reports: 4902
• Distinct Species/Varieties: 711
• Top Contributors:

202211131830_ColdHardinessMasterData.xlsx

[D. Morrowii]

Thanks for this @kinzyjr! I’m sure there is a lot of work involved keeping this updated and I know I appreciate it. I’ve been using since I heard about it a little over a year ago and its helped this newby quite a bit. Thanks to everyone who has contributed as well!

[D Palm]

@kinzyjr Thank you for all the time and work you put into this! I have used this spreadsheet many times personally.

[Brian M]

@kinzyjr Thanks for all the hard work continuing to update this. Here's to hoping for a warm winter this year!

[Foxpalms]

@kinzyjr Thank you, this was extremely helpful and gave me a better insight to what palms stand a chance here and where I should plant a few (in a protected spot or not). Such as the Archontophoenix Alexandrae, Archontophoenix myolensis, Archontophoenix purperea, beccariophoenix Alfredii. ravenea glauca. cyphophoenix sp, Chambeyronia macrocarpa and a few more!

[jwitt]

Is there a way to add or someone to contact?

I can give multiple species of palms that survived temperatures in the open during a 2011 event here in NM/El Paso area.  Rewrites known extremes for Washingtonia, date palms, trachy survival.  Some are actually covered on palmtalk.

I am talking double digit below zero cold on back to back nights kind of stuff.

Edited November 17, 2022 by jwitt
Cleared up sentence

[Foxpalms]

@kinzyjr I can also provide some data. Last winters coldest temperature -0.9c/30.38f, Archontophoenix cunninghamiana in ground no damage, Archontophoenix alexandrae in a pot no damage (the only damage so far this year its sustained is sunburn from the UV was increasing in March and its only about 2-3ft tall), Syagrus romanzoffiana no damage, Chrysalidocarpus onilahensis no damage. The temperature these palms saw though was slightly higher than that though because they are in a microclimate.

Edited November 17, 2022 by Foxpalms

[kinzyjr]

22 hours ago, jwitt said:

Is there a way to add or someone to contact?

I can give multiple species of palms that survived temperatures in the open during a 2011 event here in NM/El Paso area.  Rewrites known extremes for Washingtonia, date palms, trachy survival.  Some are actually covered on palmtalk.

I am talking double digit below zero cold on back to back nights kind of stuff.

If you post them here or links to the other threads and comments you are referring to on PalmTalk, I'll gladly add them when I get a chance.

That area is known to get desert palms through some insanely low temperatures.  None of those would ever survive those temperatures here.

22 hours ago, Foxpalms said:

@kinzyjr I can also provide some data. Last winters coldest temperature -0.9c/30.38f, Archontophoenix cunninghamiana in ground no damage, Archontophoenix alexandrae in a pot no damage (the only damage so far this year its sustained is sunburn from the UV was increasing in March and its only about 2-3ft tall), Syagrus romanzoffiana no damage, Chrysalidocarpus onilahensis no damage. The temperature these palms saw though was slightly higher than that though because they are in a microclimate.

A few questions:

• Is this directly in London?
• Do you happen to have a few more days weather records on hand? 

Just some highs and lows help everyone see how cool tolerant the palms are as well as the ultimate lows.

Thank you for contributing!

[jwitt]

22 minutes ago, kinzyjr said:

That area is known to get desert palms through some insanely low temperatures.  None of those would ever survive those temperatures here

Rain, freezing rain, snow, and -5f wind event.  2/2011. Total defoliation.  

as Cruces, NM 

5 years later

 

[Foxpalms]

1 hour ago, kinzyjr said:

A few questions:

• Is this directly in London?
• Do you happen to have a few more days weather records on hand? 

Just some highs and lows help everyone see how cool tolerant the palms are as well as the ultimate lows.

Thank you for contributing!

Yes in central London.  Jan average high 9c/48f with a low of 5c/41f. Last winter though we had an abnormal amount of nights with clear skies in January.  In February it was 11c with a low of 5.5c.  You can also add howea forsteriana and Rhopalostylis sapida if you want as no damage.  If you can find the temperature data for la morran gardens and the tresco abbey gardens you could also add in the parajubaea cocoides, archontophoenix cunninghamiana, Rhopalostylis sapida, and phoenix roebelenii there and the archontophoenix Alexandrae, multiple archontophoenix cunninghamiana and howea forsteriana at Tresco. The Scilly isles have an average high of 10c with a low of 7c in the winter. I didn't have the weather station back then but the coldest the queen palm has seen Is -2.9c in February 2021 bare in mind that thermometer that recorded that was in the coldest part of the garden not where the queen palm is though so probably closer to to -2c. This will be the archontophoenix cunninghamiana's second winter. 

Edited November 18, 2022 by Foxpalms

[kinzyjr]

@jwitt + @Foxpalms

Thank you for the information.  These observations are now added to the database.

202211271020_ColdHardinessMasterData.xlsx

[jwitt]

[kinzyjr]

1 hour ago, jwitt said:

 

Are these Washingtonia filifera?  robusta?  filibusta?

[jwitt]

Robusta.

 

[jwitt]

5 hours ago, jwitt said:

Robusta.

 

Some more Alamogordo robusta survivors

[fr8train]

On 11/17/2022 at 10:20 PM, jwitt said:

Rain, freezing rain, snow, and -5f wind event.  2/2011. Total defoliation.  

 

as Cruces, NM 

5 years later

 

I stayed here once years ago. I didn't notice the Phoenix, it's pretty cool that's able to survive there. 

[jwitt]

15 minutes ago, fr8train said:

I stayed here once years ago. I didn't notice the Phoenix, it's pretty cool that's able to survive there. 

Not uncommon in Las Cruces. Both dates and CIDP. 

Some are even being attempted in ABQ.  

[fr8train]

2 minutes ago, jwitt said:

Not uncommon in Las Cruces. Both dates and CIDP. 

Some are even being attempted in ABQ.  

Is that photo from Albuquerque? I spent a week out there last year and I remembered seeing a house that had them. I was wondering how they did in winter. I don't really think Phoenix can make it where I am, other than CIDP, so that's impressive. It being so dry helps I suppose, from what I've read on here. 

Edited May 30 by fr8train

[jwitt]

Yes, ABQ

Third winter I believe.  The roots are surely in water(water table).  

Add a degree or two 

This winter

Previous winter

 

Edited May 30 by jwitt

[RFun]

That area of Southern New Mexico has seen some very cold weather (at times).  Subzero temps have been seen, yet most of the palms always seem to bounce back from any brief cold periods.

[jwf1983]

I'm probably just missing this information somewhere, so I apologize.  I have 5 Cycas revoluta, Trachy f., Sabal m., Beaucarnea recurvata, Psidium cattleyanum in Washington, DC.  I'd love to contribute to the hardiness data, as I think my location pushes the limits on many of these.  I also have a weather station, and I keep accurate data on a daily basis.

Where can I add to the hardiness data being collected?

 

[D. Morrowii]

3 hours ago, jwf1983 said:

I'm probably just missing this information somewhere, so I apologize.  I have 5 Cycas revoluta, Trachy f., Sabal m., Beaucarnea recurvata, Psidium cattleyanum in Washington, DC.  I'd love to contribute to the hardiness data, as I think my location pushes the limits on many of these.  I also have a weather station, and I keep accurate data on a daily basis.

Where can I add to the hardiness data being collected?

 

@jwf1983 The Freeze Damage Data forum  sorts alphabetically I believe. The best thing to do is look for an existing thread for the palm you’d like to add data for and post detailed info there. If you find there is not an existing thread for a given species then create a new thread for it. @kinzyjr curates this thing so he may have a better answer for you. 

[kinzyjr]

6 hours ago, jwf1983 said:

I'm probably just missing this information somewhere, so I apologize.  I have 5 Cycas revoluta, Trachy f., Sabal m., Beaucarnea recurvata, Psidium cattleyanum in Washington, DC.  I'd love to contribute to the hardiness data, as I think my location pushes the limits on many of these.  I also have a weather station, and I keep accurate data on a daily basis.

Where can I add to the hardiness data being collected?

 

Thank you @jwf1983 and @D. Morrowii for the offer and advice, respectively.  If anyone would like to expedite their observations being added to this sheet, please feel free to utilize the attached template: 20231005_PalmObservationsTemplate.xls.  A few hints to help out when using the template:

1. Please don't concern yourself with the Observation ID.  This column's value is auto-generated in the database.
2. The format of the PalmObs and CycadObs sheets is identical.  Both are included for easy separation of observations.
3. The Palm_ID and Cycad_ID can be determined by using the Cycads_tbl and/or Palms_tbl sheets.  Lookup the species and use the ID given.
4. Can't find your species in the Palms_tbl or Cycads_tbl sheets?  Check the Synonyms_tbl sheet.
5. Still can't find it?  Type the species name in the Description area inside of square brackets [Genus species 'variety'].  It may have to be added to the list and given an ID.
6. Use the Damage_tbl to assess what value to report in the Damage column.
7. Did your report come from an event already listed?  Check the Events_tbl.  If not, an Event can be added.  Just add a description in your post.

20231005_PalmObservationsTemplate.xlsx