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That's weird!


Jubaea_James760

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My butia was growing great & still is but I looked at it closely the other day & relized 1 spear was all dryed up & brown? I pulled it & it came out but the other spears are still growing, so am cutting back my watering & I pour peroxide & sprayed the center with insecticide.

Note: this palm was well taken care of, fertilized, watered 2-3 times a week heavily so am a bit confused? Maybe to much water? It's in well drained soil, clay/ a little sandy. & it just started to flower this year!

Any thoughts?

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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Welcome,

Sounds like too much water. Butias are known to be drought tolerant. Keep up with the peroxide a few more times, no overhead watering & skip the insecticide. Mark the remaining spears with a Sharpie to assure you it's still growing. Good luck.

-Randy

"If you need me, I'll be outside" -Randy Wiesner Palm Beach County, Florida Zone 10Bish

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Agreed too much water.....Water deeply about once every two weeks.

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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Thank you! I've been lurking for quite awhile I just recently made a profile.

That has to be it because I don't over head water any of my palms besides some Sabal's & my Rhapidophyllum hystrix on occasion.

Plus am watering heavy also with the palms next to it so I'll do just that,

Thanks guys! Here's a pic of my pindo:

<a href="http://s683.photobucket.com/user/james760/media/IMG_4618_zps4b0d5abf.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i683.photobucket.com/albums/vv197/james760/IMG_4618_zps4b0d5abf.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_4618_zps4b0d5abf.jpg"/></a>

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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Oopps how come the pic didn't pop up? I'll try again

http://i683.photobucket.com/albums/vv197/james760/IMG_4618_zps4b0d5abf.jpg

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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Nope idk then

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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1 more time! Sorry am practicing lol,

IMG_4618_zps4b0d5abf.jpg

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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I have never heard of a butia getting spear pull from too much water on the roots without any overhead watering, that makes no sense to me. It's only possible to get spear rot if overhead water goes into the spear. However, it is possible to get spear rot from a drought stressed palm. I've had spear pull on palms that I thought I was watering heavily but meanwhile the rootball had dried up. Butia are both drought tolerant and tolerant of a whole lot of overwatering.

How long has this palm been in the ground? Could it be possible that your rootball is dry and it not wetting properly? How do you water?

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I have never heard of a butia getting spear pull from too much water on the roots without any overhead watering, that makes no sense to me. It's only possible to get spear rot if overhead water goes into the spear. However, it is possible to get spear rot from a drought stressed palm. I've had spear pull on palms that I thought I was watering heavily but meanwhile the rootball had dried up. Butia are both drought tolerant and tolerant of a whole lot of overwatering.

How long has this palm been in the ground? Could it be possible that your rootball is dry and it not wetting properly? How do you water?

EXCELLENT questions Axel. I lost a droopy form D. onilahensis for possibly the very same reason.
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It makes no sense to me either! It's been in the ground about 3 years now & if anything I increased the watering on this palm not much but definetly more water this summer.

I water everything by hand & I have basins around my palms & I fill it up 1 or 2 times per watering & with most of my palms it'll be empty within minutes especially my pindo, it'll take me 3-4 minutes till the basin overflows & it barely has one. & I checked the soil & everything is still very moist & I haven't watered in 4 days! So I highly doubt it's not enough water.

What about over fertilized? That's the only other explanation I could come up with. I fertilized everything the same & nothing else had this happened...

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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A water basin that drains away in minutes is a tell tale sign that your swale is no longer effective. It means there is a gopher hole or something else where the water drains away and the palm isn't getting watered properly. For swale water basin watering to work, you have to redo them at least every six months and make sure you eliminate gopher or mole holes. When you water, the water should stagnate for a little while, especially if you have clay.

Best way to check the water issue is to actually dig down near the trunk base with a small hand shovel and see if the soil is wet around the root ball. The fix is to try to drip irrigate with slightly loose hose sprayer that lets water drip out the end. Put that next to the base and let it drip for a few hours. Alternatively, use a water bag.

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I have thousands of butia and have never had any up and die from overwatering in drained soil. I did have a few small (2-3') ones die from sitting in standing water for months at a time but those deaths took 2 months to see the visual effects and died with all the fronds and spear browning at the same time. I did have a gopher burrowing under some windmills and it stunted their growth until I filled soil back around the root ball so that sounds like a more likely situation. I do not believe it is overfertilizing as I dump pounds of fertilizer on similar sizes to yours. I was once told by an older nurseryman that you will have a hard time killing a pindo by trying to overfertilize it.

Question: was this spear that pulled likely one that was exposed during the winter? As big as that pindo is, you very rarely experience spear pull in that size unless it's in a very frigid zone and with the others still growing I wouldn't worry with it honestly.

Edited by bbrantley
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Water drains here in under a minute, even with swales.... no problem with Butia's. Hmmm maybe its a pest issue?

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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Water drains here in under a minute, even with swales.... no problem with Butia's. Hmmm maybe its a pest issue?

Wow, even my sandiest soil doesn't drain that fast if the swale is fresh. You must have pure beach sand.

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I check the dirt around it with a little shovel but it's hard because the feeder roots are all around, the dirt was still moist though. I also dug around for holes or pockets in the soil & I didn't find anything. A lot of areas in my yard drain fast then some not fast, I amended some of the holes before I planted my palms that has to do a lot with it I guess.

No Brantley it grew a ton since winter & it hasn't been cold here since March, that was are last freeze.

Thanks for all the advice! I'll spray some more insecticide in the crown and just let it be, it's sill growing so that's a good sign...

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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Would peroxide kill a pest if there was one in the crown?

Hesperia,Southern CA (High Desert area). Zone 8b

Elevation; about 3600 ft.

Lowest temp. I can expect each year 19/20*f lowest since I've been growing palms *13(2007) Hottest temp. Each year *106

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I have never heard of a butia getting spear pull from too much water on the roots without any overhead watering, that makes no sense to me. It's only possible to get spear rot if overhead water goes into the spear. However, it is possible to get spear rot from a drought stressed palm. I've had spear pull on palms that I thought I was watering heavily but meanwhile the rootball had dried up. Butia are both drought tolerant and tolerant of a whole lot of overwatering.

How long has this palm been in the ground? Could it be possible that your rootball is dry and it not wetting properly? How do you water?

I lost a couple this way. No problem after establishment, but seems to be an issue here with our clay soils, abundant rain and shallow water table.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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Palms in general can dry up a new leaf from time to time for some reason. When I find a dried up spear that has no "mushy" stuff or bad smell I don't worry. It seems to be a natural way for the palm to limit its use of water by limiting the number of leaves but I may be wrong. I never see it in older palms but that does not mean it does not happen. If there is no "mushy" stuff don't worry about the peroxide either...it will be fine.

I DIG PALMS

Call me anytime to chat about transplanting palms.

305-345-8918

https://www.facebook...KenJohnsonPalms

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Ken, that's a great insight. I had a similar issue with some livistona fulva this Summer. I transplanted them into bigger pots and I didn't water properly. In response to the drought stress, a couple of the livistona simply had each have one leaf turn brown but the spear was healthy. It was the second newest leaf. The spear and first new leaf stayed ok.

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