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(Steve @ Dec. 06 2006,14:17)

QUOTE
The forcast looks bleak for Atlanta.  We already had a low temp of 28F earlier this week.  Weather.com is predicting overnight lows of 21F for my part of town tomorrow night, and 23F on Friday night.  The low for all of last year was 24F.  That was rare though.  On Friday the wind chill could get into the single digits.  How much of an effect does wind chill have on palms.  I have a t. fortunei outside.  I'll probably cover the base of the tree with a blanket, and wrap a towel around the spear with some aluminum foil over that to be safe.  But I'd be interested to hear any insight you all may have.

21F wont hurt T. Forunei any.  I probably wouldn't even bother wrapping it.  Maybe if you just planted and wanted to be safe, you could.  Otherwise, I wouldn't waste my time.  Either way, even if it burned a little, it will recover in the spring.  My belief is that wind chill does not affect palms, it is the actual temperature and duration of actual temp.  If you're actual temp was to go below 10F, then I might be worried.

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The forcast looks bleak for Atlanta.  We already had a low temp of 28F earlier this week.  Weather.com is predicting overnight lows of 21F for my part of town tomorrow night, and 23F on Friday night.  The low for all of last year was 24F.  That was rare though.  On Friday the wind chill could get into the single digits.  How much of an effect does wind chill have on palms.  I have a t. fortunei outside.  I'll probably cover the base of the tree with a blanket, and wrap a towel around the spear with some aluminum foil over that to be safe.  But I'd be interested to hear any insight you all may have.

WOW Steve, I can't believe you're getting that cold..... our coldest so far has been 26f this morning. We're supposed to dip to a low of 25f on thursday & friday night and then we're supposed to get back to the high 30'sf for a low for the foreseeable future.  Did I already mention that I HATE this cold...

Bobby

Long Island, New York  Zone 7a (where most of the southern Floridians are originally from)

AVERAGE TEMPS

Summer Highs  : 85-90f/day,  68-75f / night

Winter Lows     : 38-45f/day,   25-35f / night

Extreme Low    : 10-20f/day,    0-10f / night   but VERY RARE

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Steve,

I just looked up your forecast on Weather.com..... Am I seeing correct??

Atlanta will go down to 19f tomorrow night... that's just ridiculous...

Tonight

Dec 6  Partly Cloudy

N/A/35° 10%  

Thu

Dec 7  Mostly Sunny

50°/19° 10%  

 50°F

Fri

Dec 8  Sunny

43°/21° 0%  

 43°F

Sat

Dec 9  Sunny

52°/26° 10

Bobby

Long Island, New York  Zone 7a (where most of the southern Floridians are originally from)

AVERAGE TEMPS

Summer Highs  : 85-90f/day,  68-75f / night

Winter Lows     : 38-45f/day,   25-35f / night

Extreme Low    : 10-20f/day,    0-10f / night   but VERY RARE

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Still holding my breath down here on the Gulf Coast. It hasn't froze this year yet, 35 F. being the lowest temp. However, this weekend we are supposed to be seeing temps in the upper 20's. Yikes........I hate this crap, can't wait till spring.

David

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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(Alicehunter2000 @ Dec. 06 2006,18:50)

QUOTE
Still holding my breath down here on the Gulf Coast. It hasn't froze this year yet, 35 F. being the lowest temp. However, this weekend we are supposed to be seeing temps in the upper 20's. Yikes........I hate this crap, can't wait till spring.

David

Yes...not looking very good right now for later this week  :(

I think we will be spared down here...fingers crossed...still a few days to go.

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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(gsn @ Dec. 06 2006,12:48)

QUOTE
Pretty much a newbie here,but some of my observations,at least in central floridas climate are...

It seems that some palms(foxtails royals,cayota,adonias,dypsis lutesens, veitchi sp, and probably many more),are much more suseptable to frost damage than actual cold temps,to a point!

Naturally 24- 26 F degress is worse for most plams than a marginal freeze of say 30 to 32F degrees.

And as Larry said,we can get frost here(humidity, no wind)  in the mid to high 30's F. While at say 33-38F and NO frost,  most palms wouldn't show any damage at all. Where as 24 -26 F might actually kill the palm! So there is a point where cold temps are worse that higher temps with FROST! Maybe the frost damage is only cosmetic to the leaves, and not damaging to crown shaft, or growing point, but it still takes a long time for most palms that don't like frost to look decent again!

I guess that is why us florida guys start getting nervous about a forecast under 40 degrees!

The forcast looks bleak for Atlanta.  We already had a low temp of 28F earlier this week.  Weather.com is predicting overnight lows of 21F for my part of town tomorrow night, and 23F on Friday night.  The low for all of last year was 24F.  That was rare though.  On Friday the wind chill could get into the single digits.  How much of an effect does wind chill have on palms.  I have a t. fortunei outside.  I'll probably cover the base of the tree with a blanket, and wrap a towel around the spear with some aluminum foil over that to be safe.  But I'd be interested to hear any insight you all may have.

Thanks for the input, Scott & it poses the question :

What is more damaging: frost or 32F/0C?   ???

Me thinks Florida bros mistake heavy dew for frost   :D

Hang in there Don/Steve. Next week will be more to your liking  :D  

LA : 81/53

Los Angeles/Pasadena

34° 10' N   118° 18' W

Elevation: 910'/278m

January Average Hi/Lo: 69F/50F

July Average Hi/Lo: 88F/66F

Average Rainfall: 19"/48cm

USDA 11/Sunset 23

http://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/queryF?MTW

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(happ @ Dec. 06 2006,21:25)

QUOTE
Me thinks Florida bros mistake heavy dew for frost   :D

Oh boy do I wish that was true Happ!

When its not dripping off and 2 days later the leaves look like someone took a blowtorch to them, it is confirmed that the H2O took on a non-liquid form :D

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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(happ @ Dec. 06 2006,21:25)

QUOTE
Thanks for the input, Scott & it poses the question :

What is more damaging: frost or 32F/0C?   ???

I would take a gentle breeze and/or a dry 32F over a wet 35F and frost anyday.

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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(spockvr6 @ Dec. 06 2006,21:29)

QUOTE

(happ @ Dec. 06 2006,21:25)

QUOTE
Thanks for the input, Scott & it poses the question :

What is more damaging: frost or 32F/0C?   ???

I would take a gentle breeze and/or a dry 32F over a wet 35F and frost anyday.

Too bad we have to deal with forecasts and cold fronts but we are entering WINTER whether we like it or not   :(

Even downtown LA/San Diego bay are already & regularly recording 40's since humidity is still quite low.

Someone/can't recall who commented on how tender  plants [e.g..heliconia] turn yellow after endless nights in the 40's.  

California palms are starting to go into typical winter hibernation.  Florida palms should still be in growth mode with interruptions of brief cold air.  How long does it take for plants to recover from frost in Florida?

Experienced first leaf drop on a large plumeria this morning  :o

Los Angeles/Pasadena

34° 10' N   118° 18' W

Elevation: 910'/278m

January Average Hi/Lo: 69F/50F

July Average Hi/Lo: 88F/66F

Average Rainfall: 19"/48cm

USDA 11/Sunset 23

http://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/queryF?MTW

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(Alicehunter2000 @ Dec. 06 2006,18:50)

QUOTE
Still holding my breath down here on the Gulf Coast. It hasn't froze this year yet, 35 F. being the lowest temp. However, this weekend we are supposed to be seeing temps in the upper 20's. Yikes........I hate this crap, can't wait till spring.

David

I got down to 29F last week.  Now it's time for you to get yours.  :laugh:

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(syersj @ Dec. 06 2006,22:36)

QUOTE
I got down to 29F last week.  Now it's time for you to get yours.  :laugh:

{{{very politely}}}  No thank you, we don't care for that.

Just checked Friday night's forecast low - it's bounced back up to 47.  Wow, they're all over the place - do they have a handle on this cold snap... but here's the other (winter) boot dropping:  Friday's high will only be 58, a mere 9F higher than Thursday night's low.  sounds cold.

St. Pete

Zone - a wacked-out place between 9b & 10

Elevation = 44' - not that it does any good

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(syersj @ Dec. 06 2006,10:51)

QUOTE
next year I am going to push my luck and plant some truly marginal stuff.  Do you have any ideas for palms that are marginally hardy to around 24-25F that I can expiriment with.  I was thinking of planting some king palms.

Hm.  Problem with kings is - what do you do when they get big?  Gets kind of hard to do protection.  Here's my suggestion for a "marginal" palm that may succeed - thrinax morrisii (if you can find it!) - it has green fronds with silvery undersides, it's quite beautiful.   And a couple have survived 22F.

Dave Witt's cold-hardiness database mentions an Areca triandra that has survived up in Daytona.   Because it was an established clump, it regrew from the roots following a bad cold snap. But they like water and humidity.  

I think Dypsis decipiens might be another good option for you.

St. Pete

Zone - a wacked-out place between 9b & 10

Elevation = 44' - not that it does any good

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(SunnyFl @ Dec. 06 2006,23:37)

QUOTE

(syersj @ Dec. 06 2006,10:51)

QUOTE
next year I am going to push my luck and plant some truly marginal stuff.  Do you have any ideas for palms that are marginally hardy to around 24-25F that I can expiriment with.  I was thinking of planting some king palms.

Hm.  Problem with kings is - what do you do when they get big?  Gets kind of hard to do protection.  Here's my suggestion for a "marginal" palm that may succeed - thrinax morrisii (if you can find it!) - it has green fronds with silvery undersides, it's quite beautiful.   And a couple have survived 22F.

Dave Witt's cold-hardiness database mentions an Areca triandra that has survived up in Daytona.   Because it was an established clump, it regrew from the roots following a bad cold snap. But they like water and humidity.  

I think Dypsis decipiens might be another good option for you.

Hmm, thanks for the suggestions.  As to what to do when they get big, I'm not sure.  I'll figure that out if/when they get big.  Most zone 9b and up palms are probably going to die eventually around here anyway, so I don't know if I could make them permanent.  I would just expiriment and make them last as long as possible.  I've got all the usual 8b/9a cold hardy suspects in my yard.  Now I am going to work on infilling with some marginals.  Like to make them somewhat permanent, but if they die, they die.  I've got plenty of hardy palms that aren't going anywhere.

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(SunnyFl @ Dec. 06 2006,23:17)

QUOTE
Just checked Friday night's forecast low - it's bounced back up to 47.  Wow, they're all over the place - do they have a handle on this cold snap... but here's the other (winter) boot dropping:  Friday's high will only be 58, a mere 9F higher than Thursday night's low.  sounds cold.

Yes...I see that NWS has raised the mins.

But, have your read this weather blog? I follow Thomas Giella all the time and he has been quite accurate.

See his site here---

http://www.kn4lf.com/flwx1.htm

Heres a snippet----

"152 Published Wednesday December 6, 2006 at 8:00 pm EST

This next incoming airmass is of Arctic origin with a very strong 1045 mb high pressure system at it's center. It will race into the state shallow enough in thickness so as to not reflect at 850 mb (~5000 feet.) but still bring subfreezing air into the state. That is what happened during the surprise Christmas 1983 super freeze. I do suspect that all of the forecast models are underestimating the coldness of this airmass a bit.

In any event the associated strong cold front will scream through the Florida region tomorrow December 7, 2006 bringing a hard freeze to the north and around freezing central on Saturday morning December 9, 2006. It's a tough call at the moment as to whether the early Saturday morning temperature regime will be advective (windy) or radiative (calm wind).

A calm wind would bring a significant freeze into the inland rural south central peninsula, one of those so called surprise freezes. It does appear that this airmass will break some minimum temperature records across the north early Saturday morning!"

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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(SunnyFl @ Dec. 06 2006,23:17)

QUOTE
 Wow, they're all over the place - do they have a handle on this cold snap...

Now I really understand that the forecasters are scratching their heads on this one.....even just a few hours out!

Weather.com says the high today will be 79F, while NWS says 67F!  

For tonight, weather.com says 44F and NWS 46F.

For Friday, weather.com is forecasting 60F with a 40F low, while NWS says 58F with a 45F low.

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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(spockvr6 @ Dec. 07 2006,08:37)

QUOTE

(SunnyFl @ Dec. 06 2006,23:17)

QUOTE
 Wow, they're all over the place - do they have a handle on this cold snap...

Now I really understand that the forecasters are scratching their heads on this one.....even just a few hours out!

Weather.com says the high today will be 79F, while NWS says 67F!  

For tonight, weather.com says 44F and NWS 46F.

For Friday, weather.com is forecasting 60F with a 40F low, while NWS says 58F with a 45F low.

That, according to weather.com is going to bypass us and affect the western half of the state. They are predicting both Friday and Saturday lows at 46ºF.

Frank

 

Zone 9b pine flatlands

humid/hot summers; dry/cool winters

with yearly freezes

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I am soooo not looking forward to this approaching cold front.... It's supposed to send our lows into the low 20's with a 30-40mph wind... that will feel like 5f.

Bobby

Long Island, New York  Zone 7a (where most of the southern Floridians are originally from)

AVERAGE TEMPS

Summer Highs  : 85-90f/day,  68-75f / night

Winter Lows     : 38-45f/day,   25-35f / night

Extreme Low    : 10-20f/day,    0-10f / night   but VERY RARE

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(Trópico @ Dec. 07 2006,09:02)

QUOTE
That, according to weather.com is going to bypass us and affect the western half of the state. They are predicting both Friday and Saturday lows at 46ºF.

I wouldnt trust any of these forecasts just yet!  NWS says 44 and 42F for Orlando, or pretty much the same boat as everywhere else in central FL.

If theres going to be a north wind, as some forecasts say, then there will be little differential in east to west temps.  If the wind has a NE component, then the east will fare better and vice versa for a NW component.  

If its dead calm......then by the water is where I would like to be (or should I say wish I was?)

Its 70.5F at my house now at 915AM...so I suspect that the 67F predicted high for today is a bit off  ???

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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Good Lawd Tropico...I just checked weatherunderground.com and they are showing upper 30's for many areas in central FL and into the upper 20's for the northern part of the central peninsula :(

I guess we shall see how this pans out...I am looking forward to watching things unfold!

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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(spockvr6 @ Dec. 07 2006,09:21)

QUOTE
Good Lawd Tropico...I just checked weatherunderground.com and they are showing upper 30's for many areas in central FL and into the upper 20's for the northern part of the central peninsula :(

I guess we shall see how this pans out...I am looking forward to watching things unfold!

Yah, temp forecasts are changing like gas prices before election day.

Frank

 

Zone 9b pine flatlands

humid/hot summers; dry/cool winters

with yearly freezes

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They're predicting low 20's for Gainesville! This means in my area the forecast definitely will only go down.  :(

Frank

 

Zone 9b pine flatlands

humid/hot summers; dry/cool winters

with yearly freezes

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(spockvr6 @ Dec. 07 2006,08:37)

QUOTE
[

Weather.com says the high today will be 79F, while NWS says 67F!  

For tonight, weather.com says 44F and NWS 46F.

For Friday, weather.com is forecasting 60F with a 40F low, while NWS says 58F with a 45F low.

Weather.com is cheating awful early :D

They just dropped their forecast high for today from 79F to 74F :D

And, they changed the overnight lows for the next two nights to 46F and 42F from 44F and 40F.  

I love watching this jockeying.....as long as they dont jockey downward (which seems to be the normal end result when the front is upon us)  :(

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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They're predicting low 20's for Gainesville! This means in my area the forecast definitely will only go down.  

Wow, frank.. that's crazy... that's what they're posting for here... Not happy

Bobby

Long Island, New York  Zone 7a (where most of the southern Floridians are originally from)

AVERAGE TEMPS

Summer Highs  : 85-90f/day,  68-75f / night

Winter Lows     : 38-45f/day,   25-35f / night

Extreme Low    : 10-20f/day,    0-10f / night   but VERY RARE

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Looks like yall are finally going to cool off to a reasonable winter temp :)

heres to hoping yall stay out of the thirties...  Cause if yall dont stay out of the 30's I probably wont either with this front...  around here they are playing this one off as being a "moderate" front compared with the ones we had earlier the season.

Allen

Galveston Island Tx

9a/9b

8' Elevation

Sandy Soil

Jan Avgs 50/62

Jul Avgs 80/89

Average Annual Rainfall 43.5"

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I just looked up your forecast on Weather.com..... Am I seeing correct??

Atlanta will go down to 19f tomorrow night... that's just ridiculous...

Yes you're seeing correctly Bobby.  The forcast hasn't gotten any better since yesterday.  Weather.com is saying we'll get down to 20F in my city.  That will be accompanied by a pleasant 20-25 mph breeze with significantly stronger gusts.  Time to put on some shorts and dust off the lawn chairs huh?  LOL

Steve Johnson

Northeast of Atlanta, GA  

Zone 7b

Perfect weather for humans, borderline for palms

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Unfortunately the bottom line is weather forecasting is not an accurate science even in this day and age with satelites,radar,computer models and all the other tools, at a meterologists disposal.

As you can see from all the different bottom line lows forecasted for central florida,they don't really have a clue? They are making educated guesses Somebody is going to be right and somebody is going to be wrong!

Bottom line is mother nature is going to do what she wants, when she wants, and we haven't perfected how to predict that as of yet.

It's like if a butterfly flies SOUTH across the equator instead of NORTH across the equator it could change everything!! :laugh:

I mean look at hurricane predictions this year...way OFF!!!

Plus they really have no certain idea where a hurricane will end up going. The only thing they do know ,because of satellites is exactly where it is RIGHT NOW,as opposed to relying on shipping information!!

I sure hope that this is one of those times that Thomas Giella is WRONG. He seems pretty far apart from most other forcasters on this one.

Anyway in my next life I am coming back as a METEROLOGIST, they never have to be right, and the ones on TV make a lot of money!!! :laugh:

Scott

Titusville, FL

1/2 mile from the Indian River

USDA Zone COLD

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(galveston1602 @ Dec. 07 2006,11:01)

QUOTE
Looks like yall are finally going to cool off to a reasonable winter temp :)

heres to hoping yall stay out of the thirties...  Cause if yall dont stay out of the 30's I probably wont either with this front...  around here they are playing this one off as being a "moderate" front compared with the ones we had earlier the season.

I am continuing to stick my head in the sand and assume it will stay in the 40's :D

By tonight, the forecasts will, hopefully, converge on a solid number.  Even then....maybe well get a surprise on Saturday monring :D

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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Forecast goes stages: Wishful thinking forecast early in the week (by a palmaholic?) followed by an "OK, release the hounds" forecast a couple of hours before the cold airmass moves in.

Frank

 

Zone 9b pine flatlands

humid/hot summers; dry/cool winters

with yearly freezes

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I just went out and bought another heater for the palmscraper - just in case ....If we get down in the low 20's with a 30mph wind, I'm gonna really need to crank up some btu's in there.... It's only plastic.

Bobby

Long Island, New York  Zone 7a (where most of the southern Floridians are originally from)

AVERAGE TEMPS

Summer Highs  : 85-90f/day,  68-75f / night

Winter Lows     : 38-45f/day,   25-35f / night

Extreme Low    : 10-20f/day,    0-10f / night   but VERY RARE

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I think we're in for it......

post-57-1165524173_thumb.jpg

Bobby

Long Island, New York  Zone 7a (where most of the southern Floridians are originally from)

AVERAGE TEMPS

Summer Highs  : 85-90f/day,  68-75f / night

Winter Lows     : 38-45f/day,   25-35f / night

Extreme Low    : 10-20f/day,    0-10f / night   but VERY RARE

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(BobbyinNY @ Dec. 07 2006,15:42)

QUOTE
I think we're in for it......

I very much dislike that northeasterly flow suggested by that map  :angry:

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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Heres the update from one of the weather forecasters for FL(Thomas Giella) which I follow closely.

His commentary is at---

http://www.kn4lf.com/flwx1.htm

Heres the commentary as of 5PM today----

As of 5:00 pm EST the polar cold front is located across the south central peninsula, with the arctic cold front in the deep south on a line from near Houston to Atlanta. The arctic cold front has moved from the Canadian border to the deep south in only one day!

It appears that the trajectory of the arctic high pressure system may be north and then east of Dallas, TX, then eastward to the Atlantic coast north of the state line. This would mean that there would be an early moderating NE component to the low level wind direction and no prolonged period with a calm wind on the central and south peninsula regions.

For early Friday morning December 8, 2006 subfreezing minimum temperatures (26-32 deg.) should be limited to the panhandle north, non peninsula NE and north peninsula regions. However near freezing wind chill temperatures could dip into the central peninsula region. During the day maximum temperatures will struggle into the 40's north, 50's central and 60's south. The east coast from Jacksonville to Cape Canaveral may see gale force winds.

For early Saturday morning December 9, 2006, with a calm wind a very hard freeze (16-20 deg.) will occur in the panhandle north and non peninsula NE regions of the state, with a hard freeze (22-26 deg.) in the north peninsula region. With a light wind with periods of calm a light freeze (28-32 deg.) will occur into the north central peninsula north of approximately S.R. 50. With a light wind near freezing (31-33 deg.) temperatures will occur down to approximately I-4 and west of U.S. 27. Minimum temperatures could also be near freezing in wind sheltered areas of the inland south peninsula region.

However if the current weak surface low pressure system in the eastern Gulf Of Mexico along the polar cold front (that none of the models forecasted) strengthens more than expected (thanks to the strong incoming mid level shortwave trough) once it cross the Florida peninsula, it could force colder air further south into the peninsula than currently expected. I still think that all of the forecast models are underestimating the coldness and penetration of this arctic airmass. At the moment the confidence in my minimum temperature forecast is not very high.

Either way you cut it this will be the coldest weather of the season so far for the state. Some new low maximum temperature records may occur on Friday December 8, 2006, with some new record low minimum temperature records occurring across all of the state on Saturday morning December 9, 2006.

After a cold to cool early Sunday morning December 10, 2006 a steady warming trend back to near normal temperature will begin and last into the new week.

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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Larry,

"With a light wind with periods of calm a light freeze (28-32 deg.) will occur into the north central peninsula north of approximately S.R. 50. With a light wind near freezing (31-33 deg.) temperatures will occur down to approximately I-4 and west of U.S. 27. Minimum temperatures could also be near freezing in wind sheltered areas of the inland south peninsula region."

Just curious as to how this guy is forecasting  28-32 degrees just north of state road 50,when absolutely no one else is anywhere near that forecast.At least in the forecasts I have looked at NWS,Weather Undergound, Accuweather? Highway 50 cuts right across the center state  through Orlando,Titusville.

They seem to be somewhere around the mid to high 40'sfor both nights with Saturday being a little colder.

The farthest south I could find a  freezing  forecast was Ocala and Summerfield.

However I do find it strange that Ocala is forecast for a hard freeze,and the forecast  according to the MWS for Orlando and Kissimmee,respectively is 47, 43  tonight and43,41 friday night.

And here in Titusville where I am 3 miles north of highway 50 the forecast is 49 tonight and 48 friday night.

I do find it strange that the MWS freeze forecast  line basically stops around Ocala.That is a big differental only about 60 or 70 miles south to orlando which is inland and isn't buffered by any bodies of large water?Is every other forecast expecting this front to stall or fizzle out,before reaching central Florida??

Scott

Titusville, FL

1/2 mile from the Indian River

USDA Zone COLD

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Scott-

If you read down his page a bit, youll see that he thinks that the models are underestimating the front.  he also states that, due to all these variations, "At the moment the confidence in my minimum temperature forecast is not very high."

At this point.....I am not sure what to expect!  I guess we shall have to wait and see :D

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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(gsn @ Dec. 07 2006,21:41)

QUOTE
That is a big differental only about 60 or 70 miles south to orlando which is inland and isn't buffered by any bodies of large water?

Orlando's only hope at avoiding bad freezes when the not so good ones hit is elevation (if the air is calm) or favorable winds.  Without water nearby and a lack of latitude, theres nothing left to rely on.

A quick drive due east of Orlando to the coast reveals a dramatic change in landscape....plants go from Zone 9 to 10 at the coast.  

The same thing applies over here on the west coast.  

If one doesnt have latitude, they need water nearby to have the best shot at keeping stuff alive.  Ive driven up and down the west side of the state and this applies almost without exception.

Larry 

Palm Harbor, FL 10a / Ft Myers, FL 10b

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Larry,

I guess what I don't see is, Ocala is also inland and not very far to the north of Orlando,but there is a big difference in the forecasted temps.

All of the forecasts I mentioned it's like they are expecting the front to  fizzle, or stall south of Ocala, Leesburg and Tavares. At least as far as the low temps are concerned.

I know that Orlando is farther south in latitude ,but not that much..

Just seems strange to me, and a little disconcerting!

Scott

Titusville, FL

1/2 mile from the Indian River

USDA Zone COLD

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WOW  :o

Computer models under-estimated this event.  Next week will be warmer nationwide.

Wish you palm gardeners come thru this w/o damage   :)

Los Angeles/Pasadena

34° 10' N   118° 18' W

Elevation: 910'/278m

January Average Hi/Lo: 69F/50F

July Average Hi/Lo: 88F/66F

Average Rainfall: 19"/48cm

USDA 11/Sunset 23

http://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/queryF?MTW

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We're dropping here fast..... It was 58f at 5:00pm, now It's 28f....uggh....

Bobby

Long Island, New York  Zone 7a (where most of the southern Floridians are originally from)

AVERAGE TEMPS

Summer Highs  : 85-90f/day,  68-75f / night

Winter Lows     : 38-45f/day,   25-35f / night

Extreme Low    : 10-20f/day,    0-10f / night   but VERY RARE

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(spockvr6 @ Dec. 07 2006,21:59)

QUOTE

(gsn @ Dec. 07 2006,21:41)

QUOTE
That is a big differental only about 60 or 70 miles south to orlando which is inland and isn't buffered by any bodies of large water?

Orlando's only hope at avoiding bad freezes when the not so good ones hit is elevation (if the air is calm) or favorable winds.  Without water nearby and a lack of latitude, theres nothing left to rely on.

A quick drive due east of Orlando to the coast reveals a dramatic change in landscape....plants go from Zone 9 to 10 at the coast.  

The same thing applies over here on the west coast.  

If one doesnt have latitude, they need water nearby to have the best shot at keeping stuff alive.  Ive driven up and down the west side of the state and this applies almost without exception.

Well.........Orlando's average winter highs/lows, and record lows are almost IDENTICAL to Tampa's.  So I wonder how much being near the coast helps.  I mean, obviously, if your right on the coast, for example, Tarpon Springs, or St. Pete, it helps big time.  But 10-15 miles inland, not very much at all.  It just seems there is diminishing returns not very far inland.

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Maybe the warming effects of a large body of water can be described with a physics equation that closely resembles gravity. The benefits of a body of water may be inversely proportional to the sqaure of the distance one is from the water. Isn't that how these sorts of natural forces tend to work? And the size of the body of water would be important as well as a coefficient of magnitude of the effect of the body of water. Sorry, I only had Physics with calculus 1 and 2 and no further....Plus I was not that good at it. I am only saying this so someone more intelligent can correct me and come up with a proper hypothesis.

Parrish, FL

Zone 9B

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