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Palms on fire

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madagascarbob

(osideterry @ Oct. 23 2007,17:42)

QUOTE
Everything is bathed in a dirty orange here. Air quality terrible, probably from the Palomar fire.

Terry I shared some of your pictures on my Mini forum they really dug them ,hope you dont mind . How close is the fire to you ?

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osideterry

Thanks mb. The closest fires are the 2 on Camp Pendleton and the Fallbrook fire, but never anything coming our direction. Here's a good map.

post-662-1193323501_thumb.jpg

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MattyB

(Al in Kona @ Oct. 24 2007,15:34)

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Our prayers go out to all you in SoCal that you will be safe and the fires will now subside.  It's good news to know that almost everyone here on this forum appear to be safe and escaped damage and destruction from these fires.  

Seems there are few if any areas on this planet that escape some terrible disaster or catastrophe sometime or another.  Just in your lifetime think of all the areas you've heard about (or even experienced) where some calamity took place.  There are natural ones such as fires, hurricanes (cyclones), floods, earthquakes, tsunamis, tornadoes, mudslides, volcanic eruptions, avalanches, hailstorms, extreme blizzards, etcetera.   Then there are all those caused by man himself, too numerous to mention.  I guess what I'm trying to say is that none of us are exempt from having something terrible from happening to us sometime in our life.  We really shouldn't feel so secure that we feel it will never happen where"I live".  I guess we need only to be prudent and be psychologically ready for whatever might come our way.  So for every beautiful day I give thanks to God for my family and home, our beautiful climate, peaceful surroundings and all the palms!

Good points Al.  Not to belittle the fact that we all value our property imensly, but if you put too much value in "stuff" and the things of this world, then you will always be dissapointed someday.  The things of this world will come to pass, so build you foundation on the eternal; God & love.  Having said that, I was scarred sh!tless that I was gonna lose my house and "stuff" when I saw those flames coming towards us.  It's natural to feel that way, but a good gut check afterwards is always healthy too.  None of us are in control of any of these calamities that could happen to us.  It's just something that's a part of life here.  Good luck to all who are still in harms way, we're praying for you.

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BS Man about Palms

As things start to clear up around here, I want to really thank everyone who humoured me by letting me post with abandon re: the fires.  It was kinda a therapy for me, like volunteering for relief help after a disaster.  At this point thats hard for me to do, so this was my way to help.  I guess.

Anyway, heres a pic of what I had on my deck yesterday with the closest fire still 20 miles from me.

misctvr-fire016.jpg

I know you will see much worse, but it gives you a taste.

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BS Man about Palms

I also snapped these pics on the way home yesterday, the smoke in the air gave the sun a brillant glow.

misctvr-fire019.jpg

misctvr-fire021.jpg

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happ

Tragically beautiful photos Bill  :D

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osideterry

That's a familiar view Bill. It looks like you pulled over instead of pulling a Dave.

I took this one when the earlier tonight. Kind of the flip side to the earlier one.

post-662-1193370218_thumb.jpg

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DoomsDave

Bill:

Been there, done that, back in 2003, when the fires burned then, ashes all over me and my dive . . .

dave

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madagascarbob

Terry I shared your new picture . I also Yahoo searched your name for the heck of it  I did'nt know you were so famous .This changes everything . :D

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BS Man about Palms

I was glad to notice a slight drizzle today in many areas of Southern California that will help to control these fires.  (I suspect many of you don't know that several of these fires are still less than 50% contained)

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PalmGuyWC

Yesterday when the wind died down and changed direction, the news people made is sound like everything was OK. Sounds like some of the fires are still rageing and more homes threatned, so the fat lady hasn't sung yet.

The SF Bay area got "brushed" by what was called a "subtropical" air mass this morning.....It went to the northeast of the Bay Area, just a few high clouds. It's getting very dry up here, but nice foliage colors with the draught and chilly nights, but I'll take green over orange any time.

Dick

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happ

Dick

The subtropical air is due to a cut-off low sitting well off San Diego, tapping the tropics [remnants of Kiko]

No rain down here but air quality is improving  :D

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PalmGuyWC

Happ,

I wanted you to know we all appreciate you sharing your knowledge and wisdom, on the weather and climate. You sure called the Santana correctly. As an X pilot and a palm nut, I'm always keenly interested in the weather.

While you guys have been subjected to a blow torch down there this past week, we in N. Calif. have had balmey, warm days and cool nights, about normal for this time of the year.

Dick

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Dave-Vero

Richard Halsey has sent this email (I left out an attached WSJ news story) http://www.californiachaparral.org/.  He has very definite opinions, and I don't know enough about chaparral to provide a critique.  Chaparral fire science has an interesting history--here's a summary from 1999:  http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1317

Dear Fellow Botanist,

There are so many questions and so much sadness to deal with the past week it is difficult to see it ending any time soon. But I wanted to send you a few thoughts as to my situation and what has generally happened because of the fires in San Diego County. Please consider this Issue #3 of The Chaparralian. I doubt I will have time to put out another full issue until the end of the year.

I first want to remind everyone to reserve a few quiet moments some time this afternoon or this evening to send beautiful and helpful thoughts to the families of the five USFS firefighters who where killed in the Esperanza fire in Riverside County one year ago today. I can’t even begin to imagine the loss. You might want to consider donating to the Wildland Firefighter Foundation. It’s a great group. http://www.wffoundation.org/

------

Our Home

The Witch fire came within about ¼ mile of our home in Escondido. Along with several neighbors, we ignored the mandatory evacuation order. We were prepared to defend our homes from the flames. Although I am grateful our families and homes are now safe, I feel both guilty and heart broken that I could not leave and help defend other homes nearby that were eventually taken by the flames Monday morning.

Rupert Murdoch Media

If you saw the article about me on the front page of yesterday’s Wall Street Journal (pasted below), being the “self promoting gadfly” that I proudly am, I just want you to know that the reporter did everything he could to make me say that I had finally seen the light: chaparral is evil and needs to be eliminated. Nope, I didn’t bite. I repeatedly mentioned that there are three basic components to the fire risk reduction equation: location, building design, and proper defensible space in that order of importance. So he took a few quotes out of context and tried to make it sound like I had regrets about loving the natural environment. And no, I am not going to add some kind of disclaimer on my website about chaparral being a high fire risk. The warning has been front and center for a very long time. I do think, however, I will write a song about, “the thrill that’ll getcha when you get your name on the cover of the WSJ” (with apologies to Dr. Hook): Listen to the tune here.

During several interviews I gave on Fox TV News last night and again on the radio today I have learned first hand how completely idiotic conservative hate media really is. I have endeavored in the past to avoid political labels and discussing issues beyond my basic focus, but damn it, these people are really fanatics. Facts are irrelevant. All that matters is the entertainment value of the segment. Ironically, I did have a chance to meet Roger Hedgecock on the way out of the studio. I shook his hand, said my name loud and clear and went on my way. He can now put my smile to my name. Maybe I should call his show today and say hi for the San Diego Fire Department. If you really want to read more about my take on the guy, please see the Talk Radio page on our website.

Misinformation

UC geography professor Richard Minnich and timber industry advocate Tom Bonnicksen are all over the media this week blaming the USFS, environmentalists, and failed fire suppression policies for the fires. I’m not sure how these guys reconcile the fact that 2/3rds of San Diego County’s Paradise fire scar and nearly a 1/4th of the Cedar fire scar was reburned in the Witch fire and about 1/2 of the Otay fire scar was re-burned in the Harris fire this week, but I’m sure they are in complete denial.

I have attached a map stitched together by Scott Fleury on Wednesday that shows the fire overlaps. The fires have obviously spread since so the perimeters are larger. The re-burned areas are now set up for an ecological disaster because it is likely the obligate seeding species seedlings are now dead. No seeds are available to replace them since it takes at least ten years for the shrubs to mature enough to being restoring the seed bank. The re-sprouters have been stressed by yet another fire in addition to the drought. Their mortality will probably be significant. These areas are now likely to become permanent weed lots.

I wrote a long, passionate letter to Warren Olney, host to a public radio show in Los Angeles, several months after his guest Richard Minnich said (after the Griffith Park fire) that drought conditions really didn’t have much impact on fires and that it was all about old vegetation. A number of folks who saw the letter told me I was out of line to attack Dr. Minnich in the way I did. Well, I admit I may have been a bit too intense, but everything I wrote was carefully researched and based on facts. If you would like to read the toned down version, you can request a copy from me or read it on Wildlandfire.com.  http://www.wildlandfire.com/docs/2007/halsey-on-minnich.htmThere is also a detailed analysis of what is wrong with what Dr. Bonnicksen tells the media on our website’s Industry Advocate page.  http://www.californiachaparral.org/firepolitics.html

For those of you who still think I am wrong about singling out these two guys, there comes a time when a viewpoint becomes so disconnected from the accepted body of scientific knowledge that it distracts from constructive dialogue. It then becomes important to discuss the messenger. I hope to see the day when those who deny the impact of frequent fires and vilify firefighters, chaparral, and those who care deeply about nature, are no longer taken seriously. A similar fate has befallen members of the flat earth society during NASA briefings.

On a More Positive Note

Government leaders really did an excellent job this time around carrying out evacuations, setting up evacuation centers, communicating information, and trying to get the story right. We’ve learned a lot since the 2003 fires. The kindness and love many of you have expressed has been overwhelming. Thank you.

Please feel free to use any of this material to help educate friends or any reporters you may know. We need to continue educating our local media reps and political leaders that wildland fire is not so much about vegetation, but about appropriate land planning. I’ll detail much of this in two different editorials the Sunday, one in the San Diego Union Tribune and the other in the North County Times.

Please Stay Safe,

Gadfly Rick

P.S. Here are a few good articles that are helping to spread the truth and dispel the hate mongering. Please spread them around if you feel it appropriate:

An AP story on “Frequent Fires Imperil Native Plants”

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iacPXW1...Wr1LoHErAcfwHZA

Jeff Brady did a good job discussing the Shelter in Place concept on NPR’s Morning edition today.  http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.p...toryId=15655337

For your reading pleasure I have pasted the WSJ mentioned earlier below as well as a few of the emails I have received after the story came out. [deleted to save space]

The California Chaparral Institute

...the voice of the chaparral

www.californiachaparral.org

P.O. Box 545

Escondido, CA  92033

760-822-0029

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BS Man about Palms

Just a brief update Garys power was turned on yesterday, so he spent his first night in the main house since the evacuation.  No phone service yet. All palms now on irrigation, Avocados.....not for a while.

Jerry Hunter should get power at his place tomorrow.  Been staying with a generator though.

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