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tank

Cycads in zone 9a/8b

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Umbrae

I have some stangeria that have held up quite well under the last few nasty cold events i am solid zone 9

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edbrown_III

I have had a few in the ground --- for atleast a decade even if you lose the leaves a 5 gallon bucket will cover any plant --- in habitat you rarely see them with more than one leaf anyway

Best regards

Ed

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tank

Ended up being a zone 9a winter for me. I think my lowest temp was 28F. Maybe the warmest winter for Gainesville in a decade. 3 hours to the west saw up to 10F degrees colder. Atlanta's extreme winter low was ~20F lower than hours. Strange stuff.

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tank

Bowenia will handle our winters as well, although will often get defoliated. Their are a few planted out at the local botanical garden.

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mnorell

I can add from my own experience at my "northern" garden, in Natchez, Mississippi, which is a 9a location but with long-duration freezes. Twice in the last decade temps have gone down to 18F (2010 and 2014) with three continuous days of below-freezing temps. I just returned from tending to my landscape there in prep for spring, and here are my experiences with cycads for this past bad winter as well as for the more normal ones:

Cycas revoluta browns out partially to totally in low 20s and this year defoliated across the city. Note that in Baton Rouge, 75 miles south and just a couple of degrees warmer in general, plants were only slightly damaged for the most part, some totally undamaged (many under live oaks, and these observations made in the urban heat-island areas). The other Cycas I grow that defoliate every year are C. clivicola, C. taitungensis and what if I remember correctly is a taitungensis hybrid. Note that C. panzhihuaensis, which is touted as very cold-hardy, defoliated completely under evergreen canopy of cherry-laurels. I didn't expect that! On the plus-side, it started flushing a week or so ago, while C. revoluta is still very much asleep except for the odd individual.

The only Zamia that doesn't defoliate every year (usually 23F or so is the minimum) is Z. floridana. This year it completely defoliated (as it did in 2010). Zamia furfuracea always defoliates under canopy for me around 26F and returns late, usually in May. But it doesn't kick the bucket. I have another species (I think Z. polymorpha) that defoliates every year but comes back.

Ceratozamia hildae is usually evergreen but defoliated this year except for one leaf. C. mexicana defoliated. The one "champ" in this genus that I have is C. latifolia. All of my plants stayed up and evergreen except for a couple of leaves on an exposed plant and one leaf that suffered some spots of cold-damage because it was caught while tender, just after a fall flush, and that specimen is in a courtyard under a live oak; but another specimen did fine in a slightly more exposed area without canopy, though near the house. This is a spectacular cycad and I am so shocked that it is this cold-hardy.

Dioon edule is the only other of my cycads other than C. latifolia that stayed up and evergreen this year. So I would say that if you want some really tough evergreen cycads, stick with those two species, plus any others you or others have tested. Particularly the Ceratozamia since it grows at a good speed for a cycad and it has a really exotic, prehistoric look with lots of landscaping "oomph.". D. edule is terribly slow. But on the other hand if you mass it and don't expect it to become huge anytime soon, you won't be disappointed in the least.

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virtualpalm

Michael, thanks for sharing your experiences. Your post above is the makings of an interesting illustrated article for the Cycad Newsletter. If you are interested, please contact me privately at jody@cycadconservation.org.

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tank

Cycas revoluta x debaoensis put out a new flush. Leaves are about 7' long, about 1.5' longer than the last flush. Anyone know how long the leaves will eventually get?

This thing flushes twice a year and has proven to be a fast grower.

Seemingly a great plant for 9a/8b garden.

post-526-0-54198100-1404407564_thumb.jpg

post-526-0-39194200-1404407745_thumb.jpg

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Alicehunter2000

Tank...you got any pups for sale?

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Alicehunter2000

Bump

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tank

No pups David. Lots of folks have these for sale though. Tom Broome at Cycad Jungle has these listed on his site.

http://cycadjungle.8m.com/cycadjungle/cycad%20seedlings.html

Also, I'd like to know if there is a difference between hybrids who's mother was debaoensis vs revoluta. I think mine has a revoluta mother.

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Alicehunter2000

Wow! That thing is a big beauty! ..... finally saw it at work with big screen....little handheld doesn't do it justice.

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rprimbs

Cycas revoluta x debaoensis put out a new flush. Leaves are about 7' long, about 1.5' longer than the last flush. Anyone know how long the leaves will eventually get?

This thing flushes twice a year and has proven to be a fast grower.

Seemingly a great plant for 9a/8b garden.

attachicon.gifcrevolutaxdebaoensis.JPG

attachicon.gifcrevolutaxdebaoensis2.JPG

Mine are similar to yours. I have been wondering the same thing about how big they get. They are definitely a larger scale cycad than revoluta -- but not at all "pokey". You can brush by them without a worry. I am wondering if they are going to form a trunk.

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zootropical

I have read on Dave's Garden that Cycas circinalis may be more cold hardy than expected. Somebody from NC rate it for zone 8. Look like much more optimistic. Right?

Sincerely.

Jean-Michel

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edbrown_III

theres a few C circinalis aka queen sago here in Jax at the beach and a big one down town in St Augustine --- its pretty hard to believe that these would survive much up the coast. E. lehmanii E natalensis E. paucidentalus, E ferox E villosus do reasonably well here . Cycas species I have C. dianaenensis C. hainanensis and the other chinese ones plus a bunch of hybrids with C. taitugensis & revoluta crossed with C. diananensis these are really robust and grow here in the FLorida heat and extreme 9a cold.

I will post a few pictures when I rezize them reaonably

Best regards

Ed

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edbrown_III

pics of some of the plants

post-562-0-94054800-1421900186_thumb.jpg

post-562-0-06362700-1421900503_thumb.jpg

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post-562-0-18313600-1421900976_thumb.jpg

post-562-0-75989100-1421900978_thumb.jpg

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edbrown_III

& a few others

post-562-0-27293800-1421902862_thumb.jpg

post-562-0-50929200-1421902865_thumb.jpg

post-562-0-43712400-1421902869_thumb.jpg

post-562-0-02176200-1421902907_thumb.jpg

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zootropical

Thank you Ed,

Last picture : Stangeria?

About your blue encephalartos does it grown in shade?

Any frost leaves damage with chinese cycad sp.?

Yes it may be unrealistic to grown C. circinalis in NC. Maybe with winter box?

Sincerely.

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tank

There are one or two C. circinalis here in Gainesville, FL (that I know of). They defoliate pretty much every year but always throw up a new flush. I see one on my drive to work everyday. I'd say it has been in the ground for at least 6 yrs. Its planted under canopy and looks great right up until the first hard freeze.....then it takes on this beautiful bronze color :winkie: . This one has about a foot of trunk on it.

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edbrown_III

Tank

if you got them growing where you live that sorta means they will survive a tad bit further up the coast but not alot NC is 450 kms north of us --- heres some photos that I took of the st augustine C. circinalis aka C. rumphi --- these have survived atleast 30 years that I know of --- and seen the 10F of the 80s ---

post-562-0-68510200-1421977159_thumb.jpg

post-562-0-15061500-1421977163_thumb.jpg

post-562-0-10590900-1421977197_thumb.jpg

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Palm crazy

Cycas taitungensis x guizhouensis has been the hardiest cycad for me in cool 8a. Starts growing here late May and in warmer climates 8-9 it will flush three times a year. Has endure 12F with some protection and still flush the following spring.

http://plantlust.com/plants/cycas-taitungensis-x-guizhouensis/

DSC00023-2.jpg

DSC00016_zpsc62d2adb.jpg

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tank

Ed,

I'll have to see if I can track a nice C. rumphii down next time I'm down south.

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zootropical

Thk you tank. Do you have any idea about the lowest temperature windstand by the gainesville circinalis?

JM

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edbrown_III

Ed,

I'll have to see if I can track a nice C. rumphii down next time I'm down south.

I thinks they are synonymous with C. circinalis --- just one of the revisions that occured the last dozen years or so.

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edbrown_III

Ed,

I'll have to see if I can track a nice C. rumphii down next time I'm down south.

Thank you Ed,

Last picture : Stangeria?

About your blue encephalartos does it grown in shade?

Any frost leaves damage with chinese cycad sp.?

Yes it may be unrealistic to grown C. circinalis in NC. Maybe with winter box?

Sincerely.

yes its a Stangeria they take alot of cold --- relative to the blue E. lehmanii --- I planted it out about 24 years ago so it was in sorta more sun but the mule palm and the P. reclinata grew up and shaded it out. the china species are pretty cold hardy --- the mother C. diananensis I have up against the house but is has tolerated 20 F or so. at time it has had leaf burn but usually not. They have also C. taitugensis and C. revoluta blood in them so this must help a bit --- at least take it down into the teens or make the leafs a bit more frost hardy. the photo plant below has been out all winter to maybe 25 or so

post-562-0-72457200-1422155245_thumb.jpg

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Kailua_Krish

Any experiences with Zamia other than the coontie & cardboard in North Florida?

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tank

Thk you tank. Do you have any idea about the lowest temperature windstand by the gainesville circinalis?

JM

JM,

I would assume close to 20F and possibly lower. It is under some canopy so that probably helps.

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zootropical

Many thanks Tank,

General question : I would like to know you experience with cycads exposed to north (I mean in northern hemisphere). Does "green leaves" Encephalartos like such exposition?

I am working on a garden project with a north slope. Plants will be protected during winter with a kind of roof (in PVC so light won't be stop), maybe with tissue or PVC on sides to create a greenhouse for the winter. I would lie to plant here Macrozamia, Cycas and green Encephalartos. Frost isn't the first issue. Hope the opposite slope (south facing) will protect from the wind.

Jean-Michel

Edited by zootropical

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edbrown_III

Any experiences with Zamia other than the coontie & cardboard in North Florida?

I have grown Z. vascquei inermis standleyi ambliphyllidia, pumila out of doors here ----

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Kailua_Krish

Any experiences with Zamia other than the coontie & cardboard in North Florida?

I have grown Z. vascquei inermis standleyi ambliphyllidia, pumila out of doors here ----

Any special considerations wen growing them?

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dekaoxtoyra

hello

is not only the cold

it also important humid light wind

so experience lot of differences

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edbrown_III

mostly raised beeds and as understory but I am in an old cypress swamp --- Stangeria does pretty good here I have it as understory and in the open.

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Kailua_Krish

mostly raised beeds and as understory but I am in an old cypress swamp --- Stangeria does pretty good here I have it as understory and in the open.

Im assuming during the worst of our cold they just freeze to the ground and come back in spring? Thanks for the advice!

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zootropical

Dear all members.

I would like to have your experiences with cycad stem hardiness. Do you think any green Encephalartos can take in the 10's? I mean a exceptionnal frost for few hours.

Sincerely.

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GeneAZ
2 hours ago, zootropical said:

Dear all members.

I would like to have your experiences with cycad stem hardiness. Do you think any green Encephalartos can take in the 10's? I mean a exceptionnal frost for few hours.

Sincerely.

I would say the list is short and only E. ghellinckii and Frederici.

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redbeard917
2 hours ago, GeneAZ said:

I would say the list is short and only E. ghellinckii and Frederici.

What about E. ferox? I am not growing it, but thought I'd heard it was one of the hardiest.

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edbrown_III

it grows real good here( in Jacksonville )  as well as E villosus E natalensis and E. senticosus   ----   I have even had cones   but yu need to grow them as understories and cover to save the leaves

 

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cycadjungle
  • You can have stem death at 15f for several hours.

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zootropical

Here few pictures taken at Villa Thuret, a botanical garden located at Antibes, 100 km from here on the coast too but that enjoy a milder climate. All the plants cross the XX century and three major cold events. The lowest temperature has been 14°F. Here probably down 10°F...

I will try to work on winter mini-greenhouses to protect my future plantations.

Encephalartos longifolius

encephalartos-longifolium2.jpg

Encephalartos lehmannii

encephalartos-lehmannii2.jpg

Encephalartos horridus

encephalartos-horridus.jpg

Ceratozamia mexicana (?)

Ceratozamia-mexicana.jpg

Edited by zootropical

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zootropical
14 hours ago, cycadjungle said:
  • You can have stem death at 15f for several hours.

Do you think stem hardiness for Encephalartos longifolius, E. natalensis, E. lebomboensis are similar?

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cycadjungle

Those three should be very close. Altensteinii seems to be a couple of degrees more cold hardy, on average. The fire and ice plants can take some cold, but in many locations, are harder to grow. We have problems here and I won't even try them any more.

Other things can make your stems more cold hardy. Lay off the high nitrogen and just grow them slower. The corraloid roots are good enough to grow cycads, if that is what you want to do. Giving the plants something like triple super phosphate in the winter time doesn't make them grow, but it does increase the salt levels in the plant. Since salt water freezes at a higher temperature, the plant will be more cold hardy. There are lots of little tricks when you have to deal with cold temperatures most years. I'm in Florida but had 15f four winters ago. We had 13 days in the teens that season.  Tom

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