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Jake

Should I move to Houston, as a palm lover?

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Jake

So, I live in Missouri and I’m ready to get out. I can’t stand the cold, and I HATE the snow. I’ve wanted to move away for a long time, and I’m pretty dead set on doing it soon. I originally wanted to move to northern Florida, but I started to lean more towards SE Texas because of the cost of living. I’m a paramedic, and most jobs in Houston start around $60k. The majority of jobs in Florida start around $45k, and the price for homes/rent is generally higher than Texas. This could change, or I could go into nursing and make more money.. but the principle is the same. Florida = Less money and higher rent, Texas =more money and lower rent.

With this current freeze, I’m starting to rethink moving to Texas. Houston doesn’t have a huge amount of palms as it is, and I’ve heard that this freeze probably killed a good portion of the mature palms throughout the metro. If you live in the area: How true is this? Is there a massive amount of death? 
 
I found myself very disinterested with the northern areas of the metro (Cypress, The Woodlands, Humble, etc.) because of the lack of palms compared to Pearland, Sugar Land, and League City. Palms are very important to me, and I really would lose all interest in moving somewhere without a large concentration of them. My favorite palms are of the more northern variety. CIDP’s, Sylvestris, Robustas, Trachys, Sabals, and my favorites are Roebellinis and Euro fan palms. If these can’t survive, then I can’t say that I’m very interested in Texas anymore. 

Jacksonville Florida is also 9A, but they have a HELL of a lot more palms and way less cold compared to Houston. The landscape seems to be much prettier as well with a large amount of open greenspace; broken up by forests of large pines. Seems like a great place for palm growing! Granted, it does not have all of the amenities of the Houston metro.

Suggestions?

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Xerarch

Jacksonville Florida has basically the same climate as Houston, for real. They didn't get hit by this system but they might get hit by the next one, and Jacksonville has recorded single digit temps in the past.  So don't move to Jacksonville thinking you can grow all kinds of stuff that you can't in Houston.  I will say that Jax seems more palmy, Sabal palmetto is native and is all over the place, plus culturally they plant lots of other stuff, phoenix palms etc.  On the bright side the palms that you seem to like are well suited for the most part to either Houston or Jacksonville, I am not in Houston but I am pretty confident saying that no Sabal palms will be lost in the city of Houston, even in this event, they are fine, north of there however, like in Dallas, they are toast. CIDP's are probably burned there but can actually come back from quite a bit of damage and be fine in the long run, queens and bismarks got blasted but they aren't on your list.  As far as pines Houston has a lot of them too, that's the native forest there.  Remember Houston is a huge city, some places feel more palmy than others like you have suggested, south end of town etc.  The Woodlands doesn't feel very palmy at all and gets a little colder.  If you want Texas cost of living but don't think Houston is warm enough there is still a lot of Texas further south of Houston that you can look into, but for the palms you say you like, Houston in fine.  Although the roebeleniis might be goners for now.  There were a lot of those a couple weeks ago.

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JohnAndSancho

Houston is an awesome city. It's so culturally diverse. Lots of awesome food. 

 

Traffic is a nightmare. Summers are brutal. Traffic is a nightmare. Winters are normally nothing like last week. Traffic is a nightmare. 

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RedRabbit

If palms are a major factor I think you’re really going to want to be somewhere 10a or better. You have pretty modest wants for palm species, but when you live somewhere that doesn’t freeze your options become much more extensive and well worth it.

Edited by RedRabbit
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Sabal_Louisiana

Well, we could do the following comparison between Jacksonville Beach and Galveston for 2000-2001:

Average Annual Minimum Temperature was 28 at Jacksonville Beach, 32 at Galveston.

Absolute Minimum Temperature was 22 at Jacksonville Beach (2003) and 20 at Galveston (2021).

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Jake
48 minutes ago, Xerarch said:

Jacksonville Florida has basically the same climate as Houston, for real. They didn't get hit by this system but they might get hit by the next one, and Jacksonville has recorded single digit temps in the past.  So don't move to Jacksonville thinking you can grow all kinds of stuff that you can't in Houston.  I will say that Jax seems more palmy, Sabal palmetto is native and is all over the place, plus culturally they plant lots of other stuff, phoenix palms etc.  On the bright side the palms that you seem to like are well suited for the most part to either Houston or Jacksonville, I am not in Houston but I am pretty confident saying that no Sabal palms will be lost in the city of Houston, even in this event, they are fine, north of there however, like in Dallas, they are toast. CIDP's are probably burned there but can actually come back from quite a bit of damage and be fine in the long run, queens and bismarks got blasted but they aren't on your list.  As far as pines Houston has a lot of them too, that's the native forest there.  Remember Houston is a huge city, some places feel more palmy than others like you have suggested, south end of town etc.  The Woodlands doesn't feel very palmy at all and gets a little colder.  If you want Texas cost of living but don't think Houston is warm enough there is still a lot of Texas further south of Houston that you can look into, but for the palms you say you like, Houston in fine.  Although the roebeleniis might be goners for now.  There were a lot of those a couple weeks ago.

Yeah, I figured the pygmys would be trickier. Granted, they are small so they can be potted for winter; or they can just be replaced all together. They are small, and not super expensive.

Do you know what areas of Houston are the most palmy? The new Lago Mar neighborhood in Texas City looks pretty full of sabals and fans, so that’s something!

Edited by Jake

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Jake
44 minutes ago, RedRabbit said:

If palms are a major factor I think you’re really going to want to be somewhere 10a or better. You have pretty modest wants for palm species, but when you live somewhere that doesn’t freeze your options become much more extensive and well worth it.

I’ve considered Wesley Chapel, which is near Tampa. It’s 9b, but pretty close to 10a. Anything south of that gets really expensive and kinda swampy.

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Xerarch
21 minutes ago, Jake said:

Yeah, I figured the pygmys would be trickier. Granted, they are small so they can be potted for winter; or they can just be replaced all together. They are small, and not super expensive.

Do you know what areas of Houston are the most palmy? The new Lago Mar neighborhood in Texas City looks pretty full of sabals and fans, so that’s something!

I’ve been in and around a lot of Houston but I’m far from the best at knowing the town, of course Galveston is the most palmy, other areas around the water around Texas city like Tiki Island and stuff.  You might just explore around or maybe someone else will chime in. Of course you know there is more 9b/10a+ real estate in Florida than there is in Texas, and not all of it is expensive, can’t speak for wages. But if you choose Texas, Houston is great, San Antonio is actually really nice, I was very impressed with it when I visited for the first time a few years ago. I am personally in the process of trying to move my family to Corpus Christi, it is far more palmy than either Houston or San Antonio and you can’t beat the cost of living for such a coastal lifestyle. And of course the best palm growing in Texas is found in the Rio Grande Valley area. But moving involves many factors and even for me, palm growing isn’t the end all be all consideration. 

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RedRabbit
32 minutes ago, Jake said:

I’ve considered Wesley Chapel, which is near Tampa. It’s 9b, but pretty close to 10a. Anything south of that gets really expensive and kinda swampy.

It’s not all uniformly expensive, I could suggest a few spots if interested.

I’d be cautious about Houston. Some of the warmer spots have quite a bit of pollution from their petroleum exports... Something to consider at least.

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JohnAndSancho

I've spent a lot of time in both Houston and the Tampa Bay area (Polk County), but I can't really attest to the palminess because I didn't get into palms until last year. I have a few pics - somewhere - from when I worked down in Clear Lake for a couple weeks. Clear Lake didn't feel like Houston at all, it felt super coastal to me. Maybe that's a spot to consider. 

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Jake
6 minutes ago, RedRabbit said:

It’s not all uniformly expensive, I could suggest a few spots if interested.

I’d be cautious about Houston. Some of the warmer spots have quite a bit of pollution from their petroleum exports... Something to consider at least.

Sure, I’m open to new possibilities. 

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Jake
18 minutes ago, Xerarch said:

I’ve been in and around a lot of Houston but I’m far from the best at knowing the town, of course Galveston is the most palmy, other areas around the water around Texas city like Tiki Island and stuff.  You might just explore around or maybe someone else will chime in. Of course you know there is more 9b/10a+ real estate in Florida than there is in Texas, and not all of it is expensive, can’t speak for wages. But if you choose Texas, Houston is great, San Antonio is actually really nice, I was very impressed with it when I visited for the first time a few years ago. I am personally in the process of trying to move my family to Corpus Christi, it is far more palmy than either Houston or San Antonio and you can’t beat the cost of living for such a coastal lifestyle. And of course the best palm growing in Texas is found in the Rio Grande Valley area. But moving involves many factors and even for me, palm growing isn’t the end all be all consideration. 

I had heard that Corpus was ghetto as shit, but I could look into there if they have something to offer

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AnTonY

@Xerarch is spot on regarding the climatological and ecological analysis between Houston and Jacksonville.

But, ultimately, your decision will depend on how interested you are regarding palm cultivation, and whether that overrides the potential differences in earnings. Ultimately, I'd look more into the advice posted by @RedRabbit and try to find a place with warmer, zone 10+ hardiness zones that also offers decent pay for your given field of employment as well as reasonable enough COL - if you're staying in the continental US, then you're only looking at peninsular Florida (I-4 and southwards), southern Arizona (lowland deserts), and coastal California as options, so start from there.

Edited by AnTonY
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DCA_Palm_Fan
1 hour ago, Jake said:

I’ve considered Wesley Chapel, which is near Tampa. It’s 9b, but pretty close to 10a. Anything south of that gets really expensive and kinda swampy.

I wouldn't say that Wesley Chapel is close to 10A.  Geographically its not terribly far, about an hours drive.  Temp wise it is a solid 9B. It Still has frosts / freezes and still can hit mid 20's.  Granted its usually just an over night thing for a few hours though.    If you are coming this far south you might as well move to south Tampa or Saint Petersburg.  You'll be happier and it will pay off in spades with what you can grow.   South Tampa is borderline 10A, that is saved a bit by being a peninsula.  Saint Pete is more solid of a 10A as is much of southern Pinellas County.  Lots of tall, mature and fruiting coconut palms in St. Pete / Southern Pinellas county. 

 I've been to Wesley Chapel several times. Its ok. Its far flung from beaches and the big cities in the area and there's not a whole lot there.    I'm also not sure what you mean by swampy.  I can't say that I've experienced that as there are loads of them in Wesley chapel too and almost none in Saint Pete / Tampa.   That said, lots of FL is swampy.   

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Jake
10 minutes ago, DCA_Palm_Fan said:

I wouldn't say that Wesley Chapel is close to 10A.  Geographically its not terribly far, about an hours drive.  Temp wise it is a solid 9B. It Still has frosts / freezes and still can hit mid 20's.  Granted its usually just an over night thing for a few hours though.    If you are coming this far south you might as well move to south Tampa or Saint Petersburg.  You'll be happier and it will pay off in spades with what you can grow.   South Tampa is borderline 10A, that is saved a bit by being a peninsula.  Saint Pete is more solid of a 10A as is much of southern Pinellas County.  Lots of tall, mature and fruiting coconut palms in St. Pete / Southern Pinellas county. 

 I've been to Wesley Chapel several times. Its ok. Its far flung from beaches and the big cities in the area and there's not a whole lot there.    I'm also not sure what you mean by swampy.  I can't say that I've experienced that as there are loads of them in Wesley chapel too and almost none in Saint Pete / Tampa.   That said, lots of FL is swampy.   

Yeah, I like Wesley Chapel because of the open fields and lots of trees. It looks cozy, and peaceful. I don’t like the city, I prefer the quiet of the suburbs. Pinellas sounds great, but it looks REALLY crowded. Anna Maria Island looks amazing, but you have to be a millionaire to afford a home there. Lakewood Ranch seems nice, but probably still 9B.

I started looking into Estero, and Bonita Springs for fun today. Seems nice and warm, lol.

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NBTX11
2 hours ago, Jake said:

With this current freeze, I’m starting to rethink moving to Texas. Houston doesn’t have a huge amount of palms as it is, and I’ve heard that this freeze probably killed a good portion of the mature palms throughout the metro. If you live in the area: How true is this? Is there a massive amount of death? 

 

I hope you're not making a decision on a one time 50 year cold event.  Houston is really, really mild a vast, vast majority of the time.  In fact, it is a BETTER palm growing area than any area in the Florida Panhandle, and is on par with Jacksonville.  Really, no joke. 

Look up the 1985 freeze that hit north Florida.  Jacksonville dropped to 9 degrees, I believe, while inland southern Georgia dropped to zero.  A couple of locations dropped to -1 or -2.  Houston didn't get anywhere near 9 degrees, even in this brutal event.  I think the low in Houston was around 13-16 depending on where you were at.   By the way in the 1985 freeze where Jacksonville dropped to 9, Houston only dropped to 20.

As far as the idea that Houston doesn't have a huge numbers of palms, have you ever been to Houston.  Parts of Houston have HUGE amounts of palms.  On the north side or town, I would slightly agree with you, in the fact that there are just so many pine trees, you can't hardly see anything other than pines.  But other areas more south have thousands of palms.  Houston is a very palmy city.

In short, don't make any judgement off a 30-50 year freeze.  That same freeze could head to the Florida panhandle or the SE US next time (like it did in 1985).  

Edited by NBTX11
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NBTX11
40 minutes ago, Jake said:

I had heard that Corpus was ghetto as shit, but I could look into there if they have something to offer

There are very nice areas around Corpus.  Depends on where you are at.

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DCA_Palm_Fan
6 minutes ago, Jake said:

Yeah, I like Wesley Chapel because of the open fields and lots of trees. It looks cozy, and peaceful. I don’t like the city, I prefer the quiet of the suburbs. Pinellas sounds great, but it looks REALLY crowded. Anna Maria Island looks amazing, but you have to be a millionaire to afford a home there. Lakewood Ranch seems nice, but probably still 9B.

I started looking into Estero, and Bonita Springs for fun today. Seems nice and warm, lol.

Not too much "open space' etc in areas zone 10 and up in FL.     I'm a city guy.  I like convenience, beaches, lots of great things to do and outdoor things to do, etc.  this area offers it all, without having to drive 1,2, or more hours to get to most of it.    There are places in Manatee county that are zone 10 that are not as populated, might be worth a look there.   Once your away from the coast though zone 9B goes pretty far down the peninsula.    You may be able to find suitable places with somewhat warmer climates near the lakes on the southern parts of the center of the state.  There is one poster here who lives on one of those lakes and he grows a couple of coconut palms and there are some in the area. I think the lake is "Lake June in Winter" .   Its also much less populated in that area as well.     Another thing to consider is that Wesley Chapel / New Tampa are very rapidly growing areas. It won't be too long before they become large population centers themselves either.  

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NickJames
3 hours ago, Jake said:

So, I live in Missouri and I’m ready to get out. I can’t stand the cold, and I HATE the snow. I’ve wanted to move away for a long time, and I’m pretty dead set on doing it soon. I originally wanted to move to northern Florida, but I started to lean more towards SE Texas because of the cost of living. I’m a paramedic, and most jobs in Houston start around $60k. The majority of jobs in Florida start around $45k, and the price for homes/rent is generally higher than Texas. This could change, or I could go into nursing and make more money.. but the principle is the same. Florida = Less money and higher rent, Texas =more money and lower rent.

With this current freeze, I’m starting to rethink moving to Texas. Houston doesn’t have a huge amount of palms as it is, and I’ve heard that this freeze probably killed a good portion of the mature palms throughout the metro. If you live in the area: How true is this? Is there a massive amount of death? 
 
I found myself very disinterested with the northern areas of the metro (Cypress, The Woodlands, Humble, etc.) because of the lack of palms compared to Pearland, Sugar Land, and League City. Palms are very important to me, and I really would lose all interest in moving somewhere without a large concentration of them. My favorite palms are of the more northern variety. CIDP’s, Sylvestris, Robustas, Trachys, Sabals, and my favorites are Roebellinis and Euro fan palms. If these can’t survive, then I can’t say that I’m very interested in Texas anymore. 

Jacksonville Florida is also 9A, but they have a HELL of a lot more palms and way less cold compared to Houston. The landscape seems to be much prettier as well with a large amount of open greenspace; broken up by forests of large pines. Seems like a great place for palm growing! Granted, it does not have all of the amenities of the Houston metro.

Suggestions?

PM me

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RedRabbit
1 hour ago, Jake said:

Sure, I’m open to new possibilities. 

Here are a few places that I would live, relatively affordable, and should be great for palms.

- Northwest Bradenton

- Laurel

- Osprey

I think Palm Harbor/Ozona and South Venice also deserve honorable mentions. Palm Harbor is a great area and by the water is zone 10, but go a few blocks inland and you’re back to zone 9. South Venice is great for palms, but I’m not certain I’d want to live there. I’m not a huge fan of places south of Sarasota County on the west coast. 

I’m less familiar with the east coast. I like Boca, Jupiter, and Coral Gables, but they’re not going to meet your affordability criteria.

Edited by RedRabbit
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NBTX11
3 hours ago, Jake said:

My favorite palms are of the more northern variety. CIDP’s, Sylvestris, Robustas, Trachys, Sabals, and my favorites are Roebellinis and Euro fan palms. If these can’t survive, then I can’t say that I’m very interested in Texas anymore. 

Jacksonville Florida is also 9A, but they have a HELL of a lot more palms and way less cold compared to Houston.

Also, forgot to point out.

1.  All of the palms you listed are hardy for Houston.  The Roebellini's may have taken a hit in this freeze (probably deaths), however everything else on your list probably lived through this freeze.

2.  Jacksonville, FL is not "way less cold".  That is a myth.  Take a look at the stats in the 1985 freeze, and also record lows.  in 1985, Jax dropped to 9.  Houston dropped to "only"20.  Jax has dropped into the teens, many, many times over the years.  Some of those lower teens.  This is a fact.  Houston and Jacksonville's record lows are about the same.

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NBTX11
1 hour ago, AnTonY said:

try to find a place with warmer, zone 10+ hardiness zones that also offers decent pay for your given field of employment as well as reasonable enough COL - if you're staying in the continental US, then you're only looking at peninsular Florida (I-4 and southwards), southern Arizona (lowland deserts), and coastal California as options, so start from there.

And far south Texas.

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Jake
48 minutes ago, NBTX11 said:

I hope you're not making a decision on a one time 50 year cold event.  Houston is really, really mild a vast, vast majority of the time.  In fact, it is a BETTER palm growing area than any area in the Florida Panhandle, and is on par with Jacksonville.  Really, no joke. 

Look up the 1985 freeze that hit north Florida.  Jacksonville dropped to 9 degrees, I believe, while inland southern Georgia dropped to zero.  A couple of locations dropped to -1 or -2.  Houston didn't get anywhere near 9 degrees, even in this brutal event.  I think the low in Houston was around 13-16 depending on where you were at.   By the way in the 1985 freeze where Jacksonville dropped to 9, Houston only dropped to 20.

As far as the idea that Houston doesn't have a huge numbers of palms, have you ever been to Houston.  Parts of Houston have HUGE amounts of palms.  On the north side or town, I would slightly agree with you, in the fact that there are just so many pine trees, you can't hardly see anything other than pines.  But other areas more south have thousands of palms.  Houston is a very palmy city.

In short, don't make any judgement off a 30-50 year freeze.  That same freeze could head to the Florida panhandle or the SE US next time (like it did in 1985).  

What areas are the most palmy, in your opinion? I keep hearing about clear creek, so I should probably check that out.

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Jake
41 minutes ago, DCA_Palm_Fan said:

Not too much "open space' etc in areas zone 10 and up in FL.     I'm a city guy.  I like convenience, beaches, lots of great things to do and outdoor things to do, etc.  this area offers it all, without having to drive 1,2, or more hours to get to most of it.    There are places in Manatee county that are zone 10 that are not as populated, might be worth a look there.   Once your away from the coast though zone 9B goes pretty far down the peninsula.    You may be able to find suitable places with somewhat warmer climates near the lakes on the southern parts of the center of the state.  There is one poster here who lives on one of those lakes and he grows a couple of coconut palms and there are some in the area. I think the lake is "Lake June in Winter" .   Its also much less populated in that area as well.     Another thing to consider is that Wesley Chapel / New Tampa are very rapidly growing areas. It won't be too long before they become large population centers themselves either.  

For reference, I live in St. Charles County, Missouri. The population density in O’Fallon (city I live in has 3000 people per square mile) It’s really not that bad, but it’s starting to feel a little crowded. So I’m not saying I need to live in the middle of a field, I just don’t want to be living somewhere like Miami Lakes where the population density is 5500 people per square mile

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Xenon

Sure, things are up in air with some of the less cold hardy palms after last week's fiasco but Houston is a very palmy city...the comparison you made with Jacksonville is definitely an exaggeration and not true in some respects. Have you been to Houston? Just take a drive along any of the interstates and highways that cross the city and you will see many palms along the road in both commercial and residential settings.  Washingtonia is king here; Sabal is present but rarely found in abundance beyond some commercial spaces. There are many palm-lined roads like Nasa Rd 1, sections of Interstate 10, the Gulf Freeway (I-45 S), sections of TX-225, sections of Airport Blvd, Westheimer Rd etc. Most of the shopping malls and plazas here are very palmy too, some examples are Highland Village, Gulfgate Mall, Baybrook Mall, Memorial City Mall, City Centre, and River Oaks Mall. Almost all of the car dealerships use palm as their greenery of choice. In short, there is no shortage of palms in Houston. 

As far as Houston being "so cold"...well that isn't true at all. This was the coldest winter since 1989 in this area and palms as a whole are not going anywhere. I think the size and health of these queen palms are worth a thousand words. All of these shots are taken within a few miles of downtown. See more here: 

 

20210212_160517.jpg.8bd468c18525ebd9741e2df13e75dfbd.jpg

20210213_104930.jpg.e8cf45d7902a9d52c73a0c4ab36655e2.jpg

20210213_103234.jpg.dc458cf6a7d6429fad114fb68bebdf46.jpg

20210212_161215.jpg.8e6aebf01ad3d2b462158bb5d11f25e8.jpg

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Jake
19 minutes ago, RedRabbit said:

Here are a few places that I would live, relatively affordable, and should be great for palms.

- Northwest Bradenton

- Laurel

- Osprey

I think Palm Harbor/Ozona and South Venice also deserve honorable mentions. Palm Harbor is a great area and by the water is zone 10, but go a few blocks inland and you’re back to zone 9. South Venice is great for palms, but I’m not certain I’d want to live there. I’m not a huge fan of places south of Sarasota County on the west coast. 

I’m less familiar with the east coast. I like Boca, Jupiter, and Coral Gables, but they’re not going to meet your affordability criteria.

Yeah, southeast Florida is way too much like the northeast. Way too crowded, and way too stuffy.

Manatee County looks great, but the pay is terrible though. 45k starting salary, and every apartment there is pretty much above $1000 a month. I’d probably need to go back to school for nursing lol

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Jake
4 minutes ago, Xenon said:

Sure, things are up in air with some of the less cold hardy palms after last week's fiasco but Houston is a very palmy city...the comparison you made with Jacksonville is definitely an exaggeration and not true in some respects. Have you been to Houston? Just take a drive along any of the interstates and highways that cross the city and you will see many palms along the road in both commercial and residential settings.  Washingtonia is king here; Sabal is present but rarely found in abundance beyond some commercial spaces. There are many palm-lined roads like Nasa Rd 1, sections of Interstate 10, the Gulf Freeway (I-45 S), sections of TX-225, sections of Airport Blvd, Westheimer Rd etc. Most of the shopping malls and plazas here are very palmy too, some examples are Highland Village, Gulfgate Mall, Baybrook Mall, Memorial City Mall, City Centre, and River Oaks Mall. Almost all of the car dealerships use palm as their greenery of choice. In short, there is no shortage of palms in Houston. 

As far as Houston being "so cold"...well that isn't true at all. This was the coldest winter since 1989 in this area and palms as a whole are not going anywhere. I think the size and health of these queen palms are worth a thousand words. All of these shots are taken within a few miles of downtown. See more here: 

 

20210212_160517.jpg.8bd468c18525ebd9741e2df13e75dfbd.jpg

20210213_104930.jpg.e8cf45d7902a9d52c73a0c4ab36655e2.jpg

20210213_103234.jpg.dc458cf6a7d6429fad114fb68bebdf46.jpg

20210212_161215.jpg.8e6aebf01ad3d2b462158bb5d11f25e8.jpg

Those look incredible!

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Xenon

The average annual minimum at Hobby Airport for the last 32 winters is 28F (yes that includes last week). And Hobby is neither the warmest nor the coldest station in the Houston Area; I would say it represents a median, excluding far fringe suburbs. 

And to illustrate the data, there were 15 year old foxtail palms growing here at one point in time:

FT1.jpg.06c06b694ad6750809e533b5d9fdcbd8.jpg

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JohnAndSancho

Personally, I think the fish tacos and cantaloupe juice at El Rey Taquiera are reason enough to move to Houston. 

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RedRabbit
25 minutes ago, Jake said:

Yeah, southeast Florida is way too much like the northeast. Way too crowded, and way too stuffy.

Manatee County looks great, but the pay is terrible though. 45k starting salary, and every apartment there is pretty much above $1000 a month. I’d probably need to go back to school for nursing lol

I can’t say I’m surprised by Manatee. Is Sarasota any better?

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Xenon

As far as where you want to live based on the palms (and only palms haha), here's a rough sketch:

894991207_houstonpalmzones.thumb.jpg.92555880d47725ca4095032ce0822554.jpg

 

I'm not basing this on last week (that's just brutal) but rather the preceding 20-30 years with the benchmarks being the 2010, 2011, and 2018 freezes. Based on real observation by me and others; confidence level is lower away from the nucleus and coastal I-45 corridor. 

Blue = queen palms
Red = pygmy dates
Purple = majesty palm
Green = Norfolk pine
Orange = royal and foxtail palms 

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Xenon
42 minutes ago, JohnAndSancho said:

Personally, I think the fish tacos and cantaloupe juice at El Rey Taquiera are reason enough to move to Houston. 

Yes, the Mexican food is bomb. One of the most diverse, biggest and best (imo) Asian food scenes in the US as well. To make it palm related...Chinatown/Bellaire is home to many palm trees as well. Most of the plazas use Washingtonia or queen palms. 

This is Dun Huang Plaza

Image result for chinatown houston

 

A bit more upscale is Highland Village 

Image result for highland village houston

Edited by Xenon
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JohnAndSancho

The little hole in the wall Vietnamese restaurants are legit too. My favorite is on 1960, a mile or so from Carribean Hot Pot - the jerk chicken there is a life changing experience. 

 

I need to move back to Houston lol 

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Jake
1 hour ago, RedRabbit said:

I can’t say I’m surprised by Manatee. Is Sarasota any better?

A bit, but not a huge amount more. I haven’t been to Florida or Texas in quite a while, so it’s hard to say which one is best without seeing both places side to side.

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Jake
1 hour ago, Xenon said:

As far as where you want to live based on the palms (and only palms haha), here's a rough sketch:

894991207_houstonpalmzones.thumb.jpg.92555880d47725ca4095032ce0822554.jpg

 

I'm not basing this on last week (that's just brutal) but rather the preceding 20-30 years with the benchmarks being the 2010, 2011, and 2018 freezes. Based on real observation by me and others; confidence level is lower away from the nucleus and coastal I-45 corridor. 

Blue = queen palms
Red = pygmy dates
Purple = majesty palm
Green = Norfolk pine
Orange = royal and foxtail palms 

Thank you, this helps TREMENDOUSLY.

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Xenon
5 hours ago, Jake said:

CIDP’s, Sylvestris, Robustas, Trachys, Sabals, and my favorites are Roebellinis and Euro fan palms. If these can’t survive, then I can’t say that I’m very interested in Texas anymore. 

All of these are common landscape plants in the area, even the cold northern suburbs. The roebellini, which were 20+ years old in some parts of town, probably got crushed by last week's freeze.  But no worries, they will be back again in a few years. They sell like hotcakes as accent plants. Trachycarpus is not that common and frankly doesn't look its best here, probably too hot and humid. 

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palmsOrl

Regarding the climate of Houston, TX versus Jacksonville, FL, the two climates are similar. 

Jacksonville, FL Monthly Temp. Averages:

Screenshot_20210222-041619.thumb.png.5c550209c4a03bf398a46dc4981bb584.png

 

Houston, TX Monthly Temp. Averages:

Screenshot_20210222-041742.thumb.png.ba394883a9227806e4e90a37888f9167.png

Both cities receive similar amounts of annual rainfall and the winter averages are similar.  That said, Houston's summers are significantly hotter than those of Jacksonville.

-Michael

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palmsOrl
3 hours ago, Jake said:

Those look incredible!

Sadly, I suspect that scene might look a bit different now.

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Ed in Houston
5 hours ago, Xenon said:

As far as where you want to live based on the palms (and only palms haha), here's a rough sketch:

894991207_houstonpalmzones.thumb.jpg.92555880d47725ca4095032ce0822554.jpg

 

I'm not basing this on last week (that's just brutal) but rather the preceding 20-30 years with the benchmarks being the 2010, 2011, and 2018 freezes. Based on real observation by me and others; confidence level is lower away from the nucleus and coastal I-45 corridor. 

Blue = queen palms
Red = pygmy dates
Purple = majesty palm
Green = Norfolk pine
Orange = royal and foxtail palms 

This is excellent Xenon. I have lived in Houston for 40 years and believe that this is very representative of Houston's climate.

Ed in Houston

 

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chinandega81

Based on what seems most important to you, N Florida vs. SE TX is similar palm wise. Texas pays more. That makes your decision easy. Pick an area near Houston (probably towards Galveston) that will be conducive to palm growing long term compared to cooler areas north of the city.

 

If you can overcome the pay issue, I would recommend SW Florida. Pine Island, Bokeelia, Cape Coral, Lehigh Acreas are places where you can get property at reasonable levels some day. Maybe not today, but as you grow profesionaly and earn more, that might be a consideration for long term.  But based on economics right now, Texas should do well. You could be one of the pioneers to re-palmify Houston. Remember, this really was a freak and unusual event and probably you won't see anything like this again in your life time.

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