Can you grow palms in the Hawaiian Tundra?

[EastCanadaTropicals]

The extreme top of the Hilo mountains is in zone 9a, even though it's located in a tundra climate, just look at the Koppen map. But I wonder, would it be possible to grow palms there if you add good soil? It would be pretty funny to see sabals and trachys growing in Hawaii instead of more tropical palms. Then again, it might be too dry or not have enough oxygen at that elevation. Maybe a little bit lower than the top, in the 9b-10a areas, since there are trees in that part. 

Edited February 20, 2021 by EastCanadaTropicals

[EastCanadaTropicals]

Native Agave at a very, very high elevation in hawaii: 

Edited February 20, 2021 by EastCanadaTropicals

[EastCanadaTropicals]

Basically a tundra at this place:   

This is semi arid, so it's probably even drier at the top.

Edited February 20, 2021 by EastCanadaTropicals

[EastCanadaTropicals]

The extreme top: 

[SEVA]

1 hour ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Native Agave at a very, very high elevation in hawaii: 

I’m not familiar with a majority of Hawaii’s flora, but that looks like mullein to me. Possibly Verbascum thapsus. If it is, I’ve read it’s invasive in Hawaii.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

40 minutes ago, SEVA said:

I’m not familiar with a majority of Hawaii’s flora, but that looks like mullein to me. Possibly Verbascum thapsus. If it is, I’ve read it’s invasive in Hawaii.

They look very similar to agave and the climate in that place seems to be arid, so I assumed it was an Agave.

[Silas_Sancona]

53 minutes ago, SEVA said:

I’m not familiar with a majority of Hawaii’s flora, but that looks like mullein to me. Possibly Verbascum thapsus. If it is, I’ve read it’s invasive in Hawaii.

Good eye..   Agave -of any kind- would be invasive / introduced there as well.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

3 hours ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Native Agave at a very, very high elevation in hawaii: 

Ignore this post.

[amh]

2 minutes ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Ignore this post.

everyone makes mistakes, no worries.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

2 hours ago, amh said:

everyone makes mistakes, no worries.

Ok, thanks.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

2 hours ago, amh said:

everyone makes mistakes, no worries.

They do look a bit like agave, especially from the flowers.

[Kim]

Hmm. I don't see any homes up there. I can tell you it is much easier to grow palms downhill from the "tundra." (Never heard it called that.) But all kidding aside, my impression is the island likes to keep these areas in their natural state, more or less. 

[EastCanadaTropicals]

10 hours ago, Kim said:

Hmm. I don't see any homes up there. I can tell you it is much easier to grow palms downhill from the "tundra." (Never heard it called that.) But all kidding aside, my impression is the island likes to keep these areas in their natural state, more or less. 

But a W. filifera is worth a shot.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

18 hours ago, SEVA said:

I’m not familiar with a majority of Hawaii’s flora, but that looks like mullein to me. Possibly Verbascum thapsus. If it is, I’ve read it’s invasive in Hawaii.

Very cold hardy, nice that it's native at such a high elevation.

Edited February 21, 2021 by EastCanadaTropicals

[John hovancsek]

I live at 1,500ft and I grow iguanura calyptrocalyx and high elevation palms like prestoea Socratea. Some of the Asian palms do great for me but they are a bit slower for me than they might for Kim. I feel like I have the perfect environment for a huge arrangement of palms but would not go any higher. With that said I have seen an amazing palm collection at 2,500 ft elevation 

[EastCanadaTropicals]

16 hours ago, amh said:

everyone makes mistakes, no worries.

From the google camera, they look like agave.

[Silas_Sancona]

4 minutes ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Very cold hardy, nice that it's native at such a high elevation.

Invasive, ..Was introduced/ escaped on the island(s)..  Native to Europe, parts of Asia, and N. Africa..

[palmsOrl]

21 hours ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

The extreme top: 

That is true tundra.  Though that might be (speaking in biomes terminology) be bordering on ice cap territory climate-wise, with no flora whatsoever.

I've been up there, it was dang cold.

[PalmTreeDude]

I never knew what the plant Verbascum thapsus was called before this thread. I see it growing in rocky areas and in the sides of gravel driveways here all the time. I never knew it was invasive! 

[Kim]

1 hour ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

But a W. filifera is worth a shot.

I admit, I don't get it.  In Hawaii where tropical species from around the world can be grown outdoors with relative ease from sea level to the cloud forest at 3,000 ft., unusual palms that won't flourish in most of the world, and you'd like to plant a common Washingtonia on top of a volcano at 6,000 ft. where nobody lives? The logic escapes me. And it could turn out to be highly invasive, as it is in Southern California. In this case, I'd say "Try this at home." 

[Silas_Sancona]

7 minutes ago, PalmTreeDude said:

I never knew what the plant Verbascum thapsus was called before this thread. I see it growing in rocky areas and in the sides of gravel driveways here all the time. I never knew it was invasive! 

Aside from this sp., there's several Verbascum sp that have escaped in the U.S. but are native to Europe/ the Mediterranean. All are moderately/highly invasive.. " Moth Mullen " Verbascum blattaria, is probably the prettiest (  believe it has several cultivars -in Europe- ) but will also colonize gravely disturbed spots... crowding out natives if not controlled. Try to  pull any i see when hiking, if i can get to them.  Were once used as Fish Poison due to the plants containing high levels of Rotenone. Seed can be very long lived in the soil as well.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

3 hours ago, Kim said:

I admit, I don't get it.  In Hawaii where tropical species from around the world can be grown outdoors with relative ease from sea level to the cloud forest at 3,000 ft., unusual palms that won't flourish in most of the world, and you'd like to plant a common Washingtonia on top of a volcano at 6,000 ft. where nobody lives? The logic escapes me. And it could turn out to be highly invasive, as it is in Southern California. In this case, I'd say "Try this at home." 

I am just saying, as it would be interesting, as the common, hardy palms are the only thing you can plant at the extreme highest elevations I'm talking about.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

3 hours ago, palmsOrl said:

That is true tundra.  Though that might be (speaking in biomes terminology) be bordering on ice cap territory climate-wise, with no flora whatsoever.

I've been up there, it was dang cold.

There is flora, you just have to look, but it's mostly just desert shrubs.

[amh]

On 2/20/2021 at 7:46 PM, EastCanadaTropicals said:

They do look a bit like agave, especially from the flowers.

Don't feel bad, I had recently mistaken a pistachio for a persimmon. Pictures are not always easy to interpret.

[amh]

8 hours ago, PalmTreeDude said:

I never knew what the plant Verbascum thapsus was called before this thread. I see it growing in rocky areas and in the sides of gravel driveways here all the time. I never knew it was invasive! 

It really grows everywhere, bu the biggest one I have ever seen was growing at enchanted rock.

Edited February 22, 2021 by amh

[palmsOrl]

12 hours ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

There is flora, you just have to look, but it's mostly just desert shrubs.

Right at and near the top?  I sure didn't see any, but then, I was looking from a van.

-Michael

[EastCanadaTropicals]

20 hours ago, amh said:

Don't feel bad, I had recently mistaken a pistachio for a persimmon. Pictures are not always easy to interpret.

Nah, it's fine. Thanks.

[EastCanadaTropicals]

13 hours ago, palmsOrl said:

Right at and near the top?  I sure didn't see any, but then, I was looking from a van.

-Michael

I saw a shrub, but it was probably cultivated.