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GoatLockerGuns

The Palms of the Oblate School of Theology

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GoatLockerGuns

On the recommendation of @Fusca, I decided to take a drive over to the Oblate School of Theology on this foggy day here in San Antonio.  Man, that place did not disappoint.  In terms of sheer volume, as well as presentation, it rivals the Riverwalk and Botanical Gardens with its palm specimens (it is open to the public by the way).  It is a sprawling complex, and I doubt that I captured all of the specimens on the compound.  There is a lot of stuff growing here that I have seen no where else in San Antonio.  I can't believe some of this stuff is even growing here.  I know that some discussion has been had previously about this place on threads like Cold Hardy Palms in San Antonio Riverwalk and Old Man look at my palm, but I thought it deserved its own thread.  I would like to come back here some other sunny day, and get some more aesthetic shots with my DSLR camera.  If any of you have pictures of this place, please post them here as well.  I think I know what many of these species are, but I am stumped on many as well.  If anyone can definitively identify any of these palms, please feel free to post those identifications here.  I would love to get your unbiased take on what you think they are.

Palm #1

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Palm #2

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Palms #3, #4, #5 (Numbered Left to Right)

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Palm #3

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Palm #6

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Palms #7 and #8 (Numbered Left to Right)

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Palm #8

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Palms #9 and #10 (Numbered Left to Right)

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Palm #11

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Palm #12 (Didn't Make It)

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Palm #13

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Palm #14

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Palm #15

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Palms #16, #17, and #18 (Numbered Left to Right)

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Palms #16 and #17 (Numbered Left to Right)

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Palm 17

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Palm #18

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Palm #19 (Back)

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Palm #20

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Palm #21

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Palm #22

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Palm #23

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Palm #24 (Front)

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Palm #25

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Palm #26

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Palm #27

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Palm #28

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Palm #29

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Palm #30

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Palm #31

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Palm #32

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Palm #33

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Palm #34

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Palm #35

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Palm #36

Palimage.thumb.png.820ef31736567f3d39b1ba2d98ec47e4.pngm #37

Palm #37

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Palm #38

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Palm #39

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Palm #40

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Palm #41

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Palm #42

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Palm #43

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Just a shot of a couple of big Eucalyptus sp. trees.  Don't see many of these around here!

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JohnAndSancho

#8 is an absolute unit! 

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amh

Great photos, those are some nice specimens. I'll have to add this to my planned destinations into San Antonio.

Has anyone been to the Mcnay grounds in recent years?

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LouisvillePalmer

I really like #7. What is that?

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GoatLockerGuns
29 minutes ago, LouisvillePalmer said:

I really like #7. What is that?

Palm #7 looks like a Washingtonia filifera to me.

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NBTX11

Nice palms, can anyone identify all of them.

If memory serves me correctly, they had some royal palms there at one time.  I wish someone would try royal palms on the riverwalk.

 

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Chester B

Thanks for the post.  Some nice palms there for sure.

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Fusca
1 hour ago, NBTX11 said:

Nice palms, can anyone identify all of them

I think I can ID most of them from the pics but a bit easier in person.

#1 Serenoa repens, #2 Trachycarpus fortunei, #3 Phoenix reclinata, #4 Arenga engleri, #5 Trithrinax acanthacoma (?), #6 and #43 Brahea armata, #7 Washingtonia filifera

#8 Sabal causiarum, #9 Rhapidophyllum hystrix, #10 Acoelorraphe wrightii, #11 Livistona chinensis,  #13 #14 #16 and #36 Brahea sp., #17 Coccothrinax crinita

#18 Copernicia alba, #19 Rhapis excelsa, #20 and #31 Bismarckia nobilis, #25 Jubaea chilensis, #26 Livistona decora (?), #27-30 and #35 Butia x Syagrus (standard mules),

#38 Phoenix rupicola, #39 Hyphaene sp., #42 Allagoptera arenara

Edited by Fusca
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Xenon

1. Sereona repens

2. Trachycarpus sp.

3. Phoenix sp., P. reclinata (?) or maybe a hybrid with P. rupicola (?)

4. Arenga engleri

5. Trachycarpus sp. (?)

6. Brahea armata

7. Washingtonia

8. Sabal casuarium (?)

9. Sereona repens

10. Acoelorrhaphe wrightii

11. Livistona chinensis

12. ? Phoenix dactyfilera (?)

13. Brahea clara (?)

14. Livistona sp.

15. Chamaedorea radicalis (?)

16. Nannorhops ritchiana (?)

17. Coccothrinax crinita

18. Livistona sp.   *agree with Fusca, Copernicia alba

19. Rhapis excelsa

20. Bismarckia nobilis 

21. Sabal minor (?) 

22. Sabal mauritiformis 

23. ??? Allagoptera? Syagrus? 

24. Trachycarpus sp. (?)

25. Butia x Jubaea (?)

26. Livistona saribus 

27-30. Mule palms

31. Bismarckia

32. Sabal uresana (?)

33. ?? Livistona sp. (?)

34. Butia sp.

35. Mule

36. Livistona muelleri (?)

37. ?? Butia? Hybrid?

38. Phoenix rupicola

39. Hyphaene (?)

40.  Livistona saribus

41. Sabal mauritiformis

42. Allagoptera arenaria

43. Brahea sp. (B. armata?)

Edited by Xenon
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GoatLockerGuns
1 hour ago, NBTX11 said:

If memory serves me correctly, they had some royal palms there at one time.

I didn't see any in the courtyard or the immediate vicinity.  It is a sprawling complex though.  There are all kinds cool flora species all over the place.  Some are out in the open; however, others are tucked away, and you have to go searching for them.

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GoatLockerGuns
8 minutes ago, Xenon said:

Allagoptera arenaria

 

16 minutes ago, Fusca said:

Allagoptera arenara

Both of you had Allagoptera arenara for Palm #42.  I had never even heard of that one until you guys posted it!

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Xenon
1 minute ago, GoatLockerGuns said:

I didn't see any in the courtyard or the immediate vicinity.  It is a sprawling complex though.  There are all kinds cool flora species all over the place.  Some are out in the open; however, others are tucked away, and you have to go searching for them.

The royal palms and a lot of other zone pushes were there in the 2000s. Probably taken out in 2010 and/or 2011. You can find some old pics somewhere on the Palm Society of South Texas webpage. 

The school has a bunch of really cool subtropical/tropical trees too. Like a "cold hardy" Tabebuia and Pseudobombax elipticum. 

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GoatLockerGuns

Trying to make a consolidated list of what we are thinking so far.  If anyone else wants to jump in with some IDs, please feel free.  If there is concurrence on ones marked "Confident," then I will edit the labels accordingly.  The list so far:

1. Sereona repens (Confident)

2. Trachycarpus sp. (Most likely Trachycarpus fortune)

3. Phoenix sp. (Possibly Phoenix reclinata)

4. Arenga engleri (Confident)

5. Still Unknown (Possibly Trithrinax acanthacoma)

6. Brahea armata (Confident)

7. Washingtonia sp. (Possibly Washingtonia filifera or hybrid)

8. Sabal casuarium (Most Likely)

9. Sereona repens (Confident)

10. Acoelorrhaphe wrightii (Confident)

11. Livistona chinensis (Confident)

12. Still Unknown (Hard to tell from just the trunk, but possibly Phoenix sp.)

13. Brahea sp. (Possibly Brahea clara)

14. Brahea sp. (Most Likely)

15. Chamaedorea sp. (Possibly Chamaedorea radicalis)

16. Brahea sp. (Most Likely)

17. Coccothrinax crinite (Confident)

18. Copernicia alba (Confident)

19. Rhapis excelsa (Confident)

20. Bismarckia nobilis (Confident)

21. Still Unknown (Possible Sabal sp.)

22. Still Unknown (Possible Sabal sp.)

23. Still Unknown (Leaning toward Syagrus sp.)

24. Trachycarpus sp. (Possible Trachycarpus fortune)

25. Jubaea chilensis (Most Likely)

26. Livistona sp. (Possibly Livistona decora or Livistona saribus)

27. × Butyagrus nabonnandii (Confident)

28. × Butyagrus nabonnandii (Confident)

29. × Butyagrus nabonnandii (Confident)

30. × Butyagrus nabonnandii (Confident)

31. Bismarckia nobilis (Confident)

32. Sabal sp. (Possibly Sabal uresana)

33. Still Unknown (Possible Livistona sp.)

34. Butia sp. (Possible Butia odorata)

35. × Butyagrus nabonnandii (Confident)

36. Livistona sp. (Possibly Livistona muelleri)

37. Butia sp. (Possible Hybrid)

38. Phoenix rupicola (Confident)

39. Still Unknown (Possible Hyphaene sp.)

40. Livistona sp. (Possible Livistona saribus)

41. Sabal mauritiformis (Most Likely)

42. Allagoptera arenaria (Confident)

43. Brahea armata (Most Likely)

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jimmyt

Very nice post and pictures Rich!  I also have visited the Oblate School grounds last year and was amazed at the number and variety of palms and tropicals on display there!  Fusca was kind enough to take me for a personal tour.  Fusca and Xenon,  thanks for the definitive palm ID’s too!  :D

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Fusca

@Xenon 

Jonathan, I think you and I were typing our lists at the same time!  :lol:  Impossible to see from the photo, but #5 has needles around the trunk so I think it's either Trithrinax acanthacoma or brasiliensis as I've seen it flowering.  Seems to me that there are also needles on #24 if it's the palm I am thinking it is.  Thought maybe Guihaia argyrata but it doesn't match photos I've seen of it.  #8 has some papery ligules so Sabal causiarum seems correct.

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GoatLockerGuns
1 hour ago, jimmyt said:

Very nice post and pictures Rich!  I also have visited the Oblate School grounds last year and was amazed at the number and variety of palms and tropicals on display there!  Fusca was kind enough to take me for a personal tour.  Fusca and Xenon,  thanks for the definitive palm ID’s too!  :D

Thanks!  It truly is a special place.  I wish I could find more info on the history of this place and, more specifically, find out who the person was (or persons were as the case may be) that had the foresight to plant these palms here.  I mean, it looks like some of them have been around for ages.  Was it just some some dude who though, "this looks like a good place to plant some exotics?"  Was it some ecclesiastical grounds committee that made the call?  Its not like they advertise the floral diversity found on the grounds.  The Coccothrinax crinite planted outside just blew me away.  Not only is it surviving in that courtyard micro-climate, it appears to be thriving with some solid trunk.  The size on the Bismarckia nobilis and Jubaea chilensis were impressive too.  I know the Jubaea chilensis is relatively small; however, they are such slow growers that its current size probably represents years of growth.  The Allagoptera arenaria and Hyphaene sp. (we are leaning toward Hyphaene coriacea I think) were treats to see there as well.  Really exotic stuff for this locale.  According to @Fusca, the Allagoptera arenaria I took a picture of was different than the one he is familiar with there (i.e., there are at least two Allagoptera arenaria growing on the grounds).  As an enduring pessimist, this place gives me a small measure optimism that my own zone pushing experiments may just bear fruit.

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Xenon
28 minutes ago, GoatLockerGuns said:

Thanks!  It truly is a special place.  I wish I could find more info on the history of this place and, more specifically, find out who the person was (or persons were as the case may be) that had the foresight to plant these palms here.  I mean, it looks like some of them have been around for ages.  Was it just some some dude who though, "this looks like a good place to plant some exotics?"  Was it some ecclesiastical grounds committee that made the call?  Its not like they advertise the floral diversity found on the grounds.  

Here's a little write-up from 2008: http://www.palmsocietysouthtexas.org/meetings/PSST_Jul08.html. Sadly the photos are gone 

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NBTX11

How long have the mule palms been there.  I'd like to get my hands on a mule.

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Fusca
3 hours ago, Xenon said:

Here's a little write-up from 2008: http://www.palmsocietysouthtexas.org/meetings/PSST_Jul08.html. Sadly the photos are gone 

I wonder if the palm they referred to as 'Acrocomia mexicana' was actually A. aculeata.  Too bad the pics are gone.  :(  Maybe @iamjv would be able to shed some light on this subject.

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Fusca
1 hour ago, NBTX11 said:

How long have the mule palms been there.  I'd like to get my hands on a mule.

Lowe's here in SA started selling 7-gallon mules this past spring.  They had no trouble getting rid of them so I'm sure they will be available again this spring.  I can let you know if/when I see them again.

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ChrisA

Thanks for posting this. It inspired me to go for my lunchtime walk there yesterday. The OST has a wonderful grounds and is very peaceful, it’s very nice of them to allow folks to walk there! Besides a gorgeous selection of palms there were a number of other interesting plants noted: Eucalyptus microtheca (Coolibah), Dahlbergia sissoo (Sissoo tree), Pinus roxburghii (Chir Pine) and others! 

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howfam
On 1/25/2021 at 5:03 PM, Xenon said:

1. Sereona repens

2. Trachycarpus sp.

3. Phoenix sp., P. reclinata (?) or maybe a hybrid with P. rupicola (?)

4. Arenga engleri

5. Trachycarpus sp. (?)

6. Brahea armata

7. Washingtonia

8. Sabal casuarium (?)

9. Sereona repens

10. Acoelorrhaphe wrightii

11. Livistona chinensis

12. ? Phoenix dactyfilera (?)

13. Brahea clara (?)

14. Livistona sp.

15. Chamaedorea radicalis (?)

16. Nannorhops ritchiana (?)

17. Coccothrinax crinita

18. Livistona sp.   *agree with Fusca, Copernicia alba

19. Rhapis excelsa

20. Bismarckia nobilis 

21. Sabal minor (?) 

22. Sabal mauritiformis 

23. ??? Allagoptera? Syagrus? 

24. Trachycarpus sp. (?)

25. Butia x Jubaea (?)

26. Livistona saribus 

27-30. Mule palms

31. Bismarckia

32. Sabal uresana (?)

33. ?? Livistona sp. (?)

34. Butia sp.

35. Mule

36. Livistona muelleri (?)

37. ?? Butia? Hybrid?

38. Phoenix rupicola

39. Hyphaene (?)

40.  Livistona saribus

41. Sabal mauritiformis

42. Allagoptera arenaria

43. Brahea sp. (B. armata?)

I think # 8 is more Sabal mexicana than causiarum because of how leaf bases look. Not as wide as causiarum.  Just a thought.

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NBTX11

Their mule palms are going to get nuked.  This will be a good test case on mule palm hardiness for San Antonio.  I feel like some might recover in time. 

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Justin31703

Can anyone update on this collection after the freeze? The freeze probably killed many of the marginal and even hardy palms. Can’t imagine a Coccothrinax crinita handling 10 degrees. 

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NBTX11

These palms are toast

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