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Florida Freeze Watch - December 2020

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NickJames
11 minutes ago, JLM said:

Hard Freeze Warning in effect here, temp is about 29F. Forecasted low is 24, i fear it could go lower. Freezing temps started about an hour ago, and im still expected to have atleast 10-12 more freezing hours.

Update 10:25pm CST: NWS Mobile forecast discussion notes that temps could drop to around 20-22F in my area. Scary night ahead of a lot of us.

Ugh!!

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kinzyjr
7 minutes ago, NickJames said:

Not the outermost ones. I’m not so much worried about that, particularly on a fast growing palm. The radiant heat from the propane heater helps them out a bit though since they’re hanging low. 

If you have some fronds tied up around the growth point, you'll probably get more leaf damage on the fronds but the growing point is safe.  I think you're going to be fine with any kind of cover in this event.  I had coconuts just leaving the strap leaf stage get through Jan. 2018 at 28F with ~10 hours below freezing and 10-15MPH wind all night with no more than their fronds tied up around the growth point and wrapped in a beach towel.  The fronds were beat up a little by the end of winter, but the growing point was untouched and refilled the crown with healthy fronds pretty fast.

During the same event, one of the growers up the road didn't protect at all, had almost 100% freeze burn on the fronds, lost one of their two coconuts, and had the other recover completely over the summer.  There are some folks here who don't cover at all for anything and still have them... but why take risks ;)

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NickJames
11 minutes ago, kinzyjr said:

If you have some fronds tied up around the growth point, you'll probably get more leaf damage on the fronds but the growing point is safe.  I think you're going to be fine with any kind of cover in this event.  I had coconuts just leaving the strap leaf stage get through Jan. 2018 at 28F with ~10 hours below freezing and 10-15MPH wind all night with no more than their fronds tied up around the growth point and wrapped in a beach towel.  The fronds were beat up a little by the end of winter, but the growing point was untouched and refilled the crown with healthy fronds pretty fast.

During the same event, one of the growers up the road didn't protect at all, had almost 100% freeze burn on the fronds, lost one of their two coconuts, and had the other recover completely over the summer.  There are some folks here who don't cover at all for anything and still have them... but why take risks ;)

So I have this heavy duty emergency blanket around it, covering a strand of incandescent lights. The heat from the lights is reflecting upward off the reflective side of blanket. 

Closer to freezing, I’ll kick on the propane heater which will heat the trunk and rocks surrounding it. I know this helps because it has allowed the blue plumbago around the coconut to suffer zero damage despite heavy frost the other day. In fact, the blue plumbago is in full bloom now 

730A10A9-62EC-4D49-B2BA-F943FBD2AFF7.jpeg

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Estlander
42 minutes ago, JLM said:

Hard Freeze Warning in effect here, temp is about 29F. Forecasted low is 24, i fear it could go lower. Freezing temps started about an hour ago, and im still expected to have atleast 10-12 more freezing hours.

Update 10:25pm CST: NWS Mobile forecast discussion notes that temps could drop to around 20-22F in my area. Scary night ahead for a lot of us.

Wow, below freezing already! :0 Oh man, that’s sucks. 
I’m at 37F currently. 
Do you have a thermometer that records temperatures to see how low your yard actually drops?
 

Edited by Estlander
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JLM
14 minutes ago, Estlander said:

Wow, below freezing already! :0 Oh man, that’s sucks. 
I’m at 37F currently. 
Do you have a thermometer that records temperatures to see how low your yard actually drops?
 

I have a thermometer that i have to go outside and check manually. Not sure i want to even think about stepping outside in the low 20s lol
I may try to stay up as late as i possibly can so i can record temperatures tonight. I also have plenty of stations in the area that streams info to wunderground, so that will give me a general idea of what the temp is.

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Estlander
6 minutes ago, JLM said:

I have a thermometer that i have to go outside and check manually. Not sure i want to even think about stepping outside in the low 20s lol
I may try to stay up as late as i possibly can so i can record temperatures tonight. I also have plenty of stations in the area that streams info to wunderground, so that will give me a general idea of what the temp is.

I don’t think you’ll drop down to low 20’s. Crestview, yes, but not where you are. No way. 
28F is your predicted low. Let’s say that the forecast is wrong and you’ll actually go a couple of degrees lower. 26F is not bad. Your Queens will laugh at that. 

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JLM
2 minutes ago, Estlander said:

I don’t think you’ll drop down to low 20’s. Crestview, yes, but not where you are. No way. 
28F is your predicted low. Let’s say that the forecast is wrong and you’ll actually go a couple of degrees lower. 26F is not bad. Your Queens will laugh at that. 

The Queens might make a hesitant laugh at this, but if it does drop into the 20-23 range, they may not be laughing very much. I really hope January is not worse than this. Cant wait for Spring!

frcst3.PNG

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JLM

Although luckily once temps rise above freezing it will get pretty warm.

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RedRabbit
1 minute ago, JLM said:

The Queens might make a hesitant laugh at this, but if it does drop into the 20-23 range, they may not be laughing very much. I really hope January is not worse than this. Cant wait for Spring!

frcst3.PNG

I’m curious if you could spray queens with water to form a protective layer of ice like some farmers do on cold nights. This wouldn’t work on something tropical, but it might with a queen.

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JLM
5 minutes ago, RedRabbit said:

I’m curious if you could spray queens with water to form a protective layer of ice like some farmers do on cold nights. This wouldn’t work on something tropical, but it might with a queen.

If i was to do something like this i would do it on the one that still has the 1 yr warranty lol

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Estlander
14 minutes ago, JLM said:

The Queens might make a hesitant laugh at this, but if it does drop into the 20-23 range, they may not be laughing very much. I really hope January is not worse than this. Cant wait for Spring!

frcst3.PNG

If I understand it correctly, that forecast is for 4 miles NNW from Pace. I hope you’re somewhere closer to Escambia Bay?

Pensacola Beach and Gulf Breeze have a great microclimates. Quite a difference in temperatures. 

51A7C885-4F2E-4044-94C4-D8C9682811DC.jpeg

Edited by Estlander
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JLM
6 minutes ago, Estlander said:

If I understand it correctly, that forecast is for 4 miles NNW from Pace. I take it you’re somewhere closer to Escambia Bay?

Pensacola Beach and Gulf Breeze have a great microclimates. Quite a difference in temperatures. 

51A7C885-4F2E-4044-94C4-D8C9682811DC.jpeg

Im in the pink circle. Would love to be living in Gulf Breeze! Although, before the night is over even areas down to Gulf Breeze will be below freezing, but not the the magnitude of areas north of Hwy 90. I was actually surprised to find a nearly trunking Queen closer to Milton back in October, i wonder how that thing will look after this. Fronds were high enough to rub against the shingles on their roof!

4nnwp.PNG

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RedRabbit

If anyone is up for Wunderground screenshots around 7am it could be useful for the future. I’ll take them if I’m up, but it’s unlikely. haha

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Estlander
2 minutes ago, JLM said:

Im in the pink circle. Would love to be living in Gulf Breeze! Although, before the night is over even areas down to Gulf Breeze will be below freezing, but not the the magnitude of areas north of Hwy 90. I was actually surprised to find a nearly trunking Queen closer to Milton back in October, i wonder how that thing will look after this. Fronds were high enough to rub against the shingles on their roof!

4nnwp.PNG

Ok, you’re quite a bit north from the bay and that’s not good.  I’m seeing temperatures between 25-31F in Pace. What does your thermometer actually say right now?

In the second freeze of January 2018, the first night we had 27 degrees with icy rain, followed by another night at 23F. Couldn’t see any damage on my then very young Queen. 

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JLM
3 minutes ago, Estlander said:

Ok, you’re quite a bit north from the bay and that’s not good.  I’m seeing temperatures between 25-31F in Pace. What does your thermometer actually say right now?

In the second freeze of January 2018, the first night we had 27 degrees with icy rain, followed by another night at 23F. Couldn’t see any damage on my then very young Queen. 

About 28, give or take a degree up or down. Its not the best thermometer in the world lol
That gives me hope that these queens will come through without damage. 
Looks like we are in for a pretty heavy frost, wind isnt blowing, and skies are 100% clear.

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Estlander
34 minutes ago, JLM said:

Would love to be living in Gulf Breeze! Although, before the night is over even areas down to Gulf Breeze will be below freezing,

I’m not too sure about that. The predicted low for both locations is 36F. I just don’t see them getting the forecast wrong by that much. 
 

Edited by Estlander
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JLM

Yeah, that is right. I havent been looking at the forecast for the Gulf Breeze area, i just figured it would be. Really loving the microclimate they have down there, super jealous that its just across the bay!

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NickJames
32 minutes ago, RedRabbit said:

If anyone is up for Wunderground screenshots around 7am it could be useful for the future. I’ll take them if I’m up, but it’s unlikely. haha

I’m not sure if it’s just on the administrator end, but it gives me a table of the minimums for the day and also a line graph for my station. You know I’ll post mine. ;)

I’ll be up at 8am to safe up the propane heater and kill the Christmas lights. 

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NickJames

Well, much to my horror, we hit 32 in my backyard at 2:09 a.m.

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Matthew92

This is around 6:10am central time. The locations in the peninsula had already gone up anywhere from 1-3 degrees at this point. For example, right before this, I had seen multiple stations in Lakeland at 32 degrees, and in Winter Springs (a suburb to the northeast of Orlando) a 32 degree reading as well.

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Edited by Matthew92
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JJPalmer

As of ~7:10AM. Looks like @matthew92 and I may have some overlap. Ignore the icons in the screenshots - in order to get the most stations in view I couldn’t crop them out. 

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Edited by JJPalmer
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NickJames

Well, I’m pretty happy. 
 

ultimate low of 30.9 briefly - BUT LOOK!

winds kicked up and my temps actually ROSE. 
 

there is moderate frost. 

30A0CCA7-866C-4C20-9B83-D507B22981ED.jpeg

DFA0AFF0-62BF-491B-8716-831360A83175.jpeg

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Mikelzz

39 degrees here in Sarasota this morning.. 

sunny

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Walt
5 hours ago, NickJames said:

 

Why didn't take another step and wrap the stem (over the mini lights) with a heavy blanket, mover's quilt, quilted mattress cover, etc., as most of the little heat these lights provide will just travel away from the palm's stem and into the colder ambient air? If you want to keep your coconut palm alive long term, I suggest you buy a heating cable (I use EZ Heat cables: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Easy-Heat-AHB130-Heating-Cable-For-Water-Pipe/21178720?athcpid=21178720&athpgid=athenaItemPage&athcgid=null&athznid=PWVUB&athieid=v0&athstid=CS004&athguid=7b9093bc-007-1769f199ee3395&athancid=null&athena=true) along with appropriate insulative wraps. I've kept my green Malayan dwarf coconut palm alive now for 17 years (since planted as a 10 gallon size), even during my all-time lowest freeze temperature of 20.7 degrees F in December of 2010. With heating cables (that just run warm at 7 watts per lineal feet), they can still burn foliage and petioles, so you need to wrap a towel or other suitable cloth between the petiole and cable. But directly wrapping the cable to the trunk is okay. Note in photo #1 a digital thermometer sensor. After I wrapped over it with a mattress quilt, it never dropped below 55 degrees F, even when the ambient air temperature dropped to 20.8 degrees F. Today my green Malayan dwarf coconut is thriving, producing all the nuts I can handle (or at least that I want to eat). In the above photos you can see a 30K BTU kerosene forced air heater. No way near enough to protect the fronds. I also have a 12.5K infra red heater like yours. Forget about it. Not near enough radiate heat. You will have to forget about trying to protect the fronds and just concentrate on protecting the trunk/stem and meristem. Do that and the palm will re grown a new crown. It may take two years for a full crown, but only one season for a decent crown.  It's the price one has to pay if one wants to grow a 10b palm in a 9b location. And if you get lucky (like I have for the last six winters) you may not have to protect your palm at all.

Cocos nucifera with heating cables.jpg

Coconut palm trunk wrap 12-07-10.jpg

Post freeze 12-29-10.jpg

20.7 degrees 12-28-10.jpg

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NickJames
12 minutes ago, Walt said:

Why didn't take another step and wrap the stem (over the mini lights) with a heavy blanket, mover's quilt, quilted mattress cover, etc., as most of the little heat these lights provide will just travel away from the palm's stem and into the colder ambient air? If you want to keep your coconut palm alive long term, I suggest you buy a heating cable (I use EZ Heat cables: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Easy-Heat-AHB130-Heating-Cable-For-Water-Pipe/21178720?athcpid=21178720&athpgid=athenaItemPage&athcgid=null&athznid=PWVUB&athieid=v0&athstid=CS004&athguid=7b9093bc-007-1769f199ee3395&athancid=null&athena=true) along with appropriate insulative wraps. I've kept my green Malayan dwarf coconut palm alive now for 17 years (since planted as a 10 gallon size), even during my all-time lowest freeze temperature of 20.7 degrees F in December of 2010. With heating cables (that just run warm at 7 watts per lineal feet), they can still burn foliage and petioles, so you need to wrap a towel or other suitable cloth between the petiole and cable. But directly wrapping the cable to the trunk is okay. Note in photo #1 a digital thermometer sensor. After I wrapped over it with a mattress quilt, it never dropped below 55 degrees F, even when the ambient air temperature dropped to 20.8 degrees F. Today my green Malayan dwarf coconut is thriving, producing all the nuts I can handle (or at least that I want to eat). In the above photos you can see a 30K BTU kerosene forced air heater. No way near enough to protect the fronds. I also have a 12.5K infra red heater like yours. Forget about it. Not near enough radiate heat. You will have to forget about trying to protect the fronds and just concentrate on protecting the trunk/stem and meristem. Do that and the palm will re grown a new crown. It may take two years for a full crown, but only one season for a decent crown.  It's the price one has to pay if one wants to grow a 10b palm in a 9b location. And if you get lucky (like I have for the last six winters) you may not have to protect your palm at all.

Cocos nucifera with heating cables.jpg

Coconut palm trunk wrap 12-07-10.jpg

Post freeze 12-29-10.jpg

20.7 degrees 12-28-10.jpg

Thanks. The lights that you see turned off in the photo are LED. I do have a heating cable that was on my bottle palm. Very good info. I thought about getting the forced air heater as I could simply fill it with diesel at the service station (the model my Lowe’s sells can do diesel/kerosene/etc.)

I will continue to do more and more protection methods :) 

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Jimbean

37F this morning for a low.  I expect a little burn on the coconut palms and bananas. 

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Reeverse

36 here last night in  SE Port Orange. Feel like we dodged a bullet. Wind must've changed to a lil Easterly over night. We were forecasted to be 32 

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RedRabbit

Thanks a lot for the screenshots @Matthew92 and @JJPalmer:greenthumb:

Low temps came in above forecast in this area. We had a little frost on the roofs here in Westchase, but not as much as the last cold event a few weeks ago.

Westchase - 35.8f

St. Petersburg - ~38f

Nokomis - ~39f

 

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kinzyjr

@Matthew92 + @JJPalmer Thanks for taking those screenshots!

Here are some numbers from my neck of the woods:

My yard: 34F-37F (multiple sensors)

SugarCane Station: 38.1F

image.png.443d586f7476d05c994660446ecd18be.png

Lakeland Linder (KLAL):

34F (NOAA)

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34F (WeatherUnderground)

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Weather.com and AccuWeather will have 41F as the low for Christmas in the books.  Their records for tomorrow's low temperature will tell the tale.

@Reeverse I noticed the temperature bouncing up and down a bit last night.  Went outside and noticed clouds rolling through the area.  It was still over 40F at midnight, so I had a feeling we would be spared the worst of the radiational cooling.

@NickJames Great advice from @Walt!  His coconut survived what would have nearly tied our all-time record low here. 

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NickJames

I would say I came in “above forecast” for my microclimate. I only went below freezing for a few minutes, twice. I’m wondering if I even got below freezing close to the house! Anyways, I’m ecstatic. 
 

I think I’ll get heavier frost tonight so I’m keeping stuff covered. 

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ruskinPalms

It went down to 38F here. Right about what they forecasted. Tonight is forecasted to hit 38F again. 

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JLM

A weather station neaby briefly hit 23.9, after the temps hit its lowest they began to rise fairly quickly. This low temp was hit at 7am, it is now 8am and now its 33.4F. Hopefully everything is okay, i will be unwrapping today. This is lower than forecasted by 0.1 degree, they did a decent job with this forecast.
I am pretty sure this is the coldest these Queens have ever experienced.

Edited by JLM
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PalmatierMeg

Low was 43.5F - was predicted to be 41F. Tonight's predicted low = 42F. I am relieved about the stuff still outdoors. Did the wind change direction or is our canal still doing its job of moderation? I don't know.

Current temp is 47.7F with a bitter wind. Predicted high = 58F. High yesterday was 59.7F (predicted 61F).

I'm sure the coconuts are out of sorts. They don't photosynthesize when temps fall below 50F and stay miserable even when temps are 50s & 60s. Fortunately a warmup to the 70s is on the horizon. What will the new year bring?

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Estlander
2 hours ago, JLM said:

A weather station neaby briefly hit 23.9, after the temps hit its lowest they began to rise fairly quickly. This low temp was hit at 7am, it is now 8am and now its 33.4F. Hopefully everything is okay, i will be unwrapping today. This is lower than forecasted by 0.1 degree, they did a decent job with this forecast.
I am pretty sure this is the coldest these Queens have ever experienced.

Temperatures for your area at 5.15am

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Estlander

And since Florida has been covered, some out of state cities at 6.30EST

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Estlander

Nola at 5.25am

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chinandega81

I notice several Weather Underground stations in the interior of the Yucatan Peninsula in Mexico (think inland of Cancun and even Belieze) bottomed out in the 50s this AM and I even found a few upper 40s. The Gulf modified the low temps at the coast to the upper 60s though but still...the cold made it well inland even that far south. Maybe since this is such a sprawling artic high that the cold is less concentrated and more diluted, kind of how hurricane winds weaken as the windfield grows and expands?

 

I noticed we hit out low in the mid 40s in Miami early in the night. It seems like a breeze picked up and mixed things up. If it hadn't been for that we probably would have been colder. I think tonight will be a repeat of last night's temperature for most of us. They alway over forecast the temps on night 2 after a strong front, over anticpating a rebound or warming by a day or so.

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Merlyn

I downloaded the data files from my Acurite after I switching it to USB mode 3. 32F for 3 hours, then 29F for 1.5 hours and then 28F for 1.75 hours, then a sharp jump to 33F over about 10 minutes at 5AM.  I had a medium coat of frost that dissipated by about 9AM.

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