DeFuniak Palm

[Swolte]

PDN is offering this palm and I couldn't resist giving it a try. There's very little information on web on this specific variety so please let me know if you have anything else!

Here's the description from PDN: 
"This is a limited offering of seed grown plants from an odd, but well-known palm in the Florida panhandle town of DeFuniak Springs, spotted for its unusual character by a number of palm fanatics through the years. Thanks to Alabama palm guru, Hayes Jackson for sharing seed. Palm experts agree that the trunk looks like Sabal bermudiana, while the top more closely resembles Sabal minor var. louisiana. Some folks think it may be a Sabal minor x palmetto hybrid. Anyway, if you'd like to try them along with us, here's your chance."

https://www.plantdelights.com/collections/sabal/products/sabal-defuniak

[kinzyjr]

It will be Interesting to see what kind of growth rate and mature appearance the seedlings have.

[PalmatierMeg]

I'm trying one too. It arrived from PDN this past week. Repotted but no photos yet - we're having a raging tropical storm (Sally)

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

That is one thick trunk alot thicker then Palmetto from the pic. Most definitely could be a hybrid 

[Bigfish]

It’s also a VERY slow-growing palm, at least once it reaches a certain height.  It hasn’t grown much since 1994, when Tom McClendon discovered it (pictured).  It sure does remind me of bermudana, but the seed size matches palmetto.  Quite an oddball, indeed!

 

 

[Jtee]

This is awesome, I’d like to see that tree next time I go through Defuniak Springs. I’m only an hour away. It would be cool to get a seedling. 

[Steve in Florida]

I now believe it's most likely a Brazoria palmetto.  The inflorescence on Sabal bermudana are about half that size and contained within the crown, hang downward, and the seeds are significantly larger. 

[Bigfish]

On 11/22/2021 at 12:27 AM, Steve in Florida said:

I now believe it's most likely a Brazoria palmetto.  The inflorescence on Sabal bermudana are about half that size and contained within the crown, hang downward, and the seeds are significantly larger. 

I don’t think it’s quite right for Brazoria.  Besides, a Brazoria with that much trunk in 1994 would have probably been a good 30-50 years old or more, and I don’t think that population has been known about for that long.  I suppose someone could have dug one or started seeds decades ago, but that seems a bit far-fetched.  I know the seeds and inflorescences aren’t quite right for typical bermudana, but that’s not always uniform for every palm.  I have seen minor inflorescences contained entirely within the leaves, as well as palmetto.  There’s lots of variation within the species.

[Collectorpalms]

Here is another oddball in Hempstead,Tx. This one looks closer to Bermudana. It’s leaves are not recurved like the On this thread. I was told by Peckerwood Garden that they were planted in several location across the Deep South like along the train route or something. I am not sure why this one is leaning. My guess is that there was a tree that is no longer there. 

Edited November 28, 2021 by Collectorpalms

[Steve in Florida]

11 hours ago, Bigfish said:

I don’t think it’s quite right for Brazoria.  Besides, a Brazoria with that much trunk in 1994 would have probably been a good 30-50 years old or more, and I don’t think that population has been known about for that long.  I suppose someone could have dug one or started seeds decades ago, but that seems a bit far-fetched.  I know the seeds and inflorescences aren’t quite right for typical bermudana, but that’s not always uniform for every palm.  I have seen minor inflorescences contained entirely within the leaves, as well as palmetto.  There’s lots of variation within the species.

Defuniak Springs, Fl was founded in 1901 so plenty of time to get big.  I've been spotting folks from South Texas in the Panhandle for decades so not far fetched at all.  An early Texan could have brought a Brazoria seedling from Texas not knowing there was any difference between native Texan Sabal palms.  Ive seen a bunch of Phoenix canariensis, likely started from California seed, planted on rural lots next to very old houses.

[Bigfish]

7 hours ago, Steve in Florida said:

Defuniak Springs, Fl was founded in 1901 so plenty of time to get big.  I've been spotting folks from South Texas in the Panhandle for decades so not far fetched at all.  An early Texan could have brought a Brazoria seedling from Texas not knowing there was any difference between native Texan Sabal palms.  Ive seen a bunch of Phoenix canariensis, likely started from California seed, planted on rural lots next to very old houses.

Fair enough.  I suppose it’s possible.  I’m not ruling it completely out, I just feel that it’s more likely to be bermudana or something else.  I don’t get Brazoria vibes, lol.  Here’s a couple of bermudana at Fairchild for reference, followed by a recent picture of the Defuniak Springs Sabal.  The Fairchild bermudana don’t appear to have any infructescences for comparison.

[Bigfish]

Another angle of the Defuniak Springs Sabal.

[Bigfish]

BTW, I don’t think it’s pure bermudana by any means.  The seeds are too small and inflorescences are too long, for sure.  Sabals are not fun trying to get a definitive ID, lol.  I’m satisfied calling it unknown origin/hybrid.

[WSimpson]

I bought one from PDN  but my dog got it and chewed it up . I'll buy another one in the  spring  . Pissed me off . 

Will

 

Edited November 29, 2021 by Will Simpson

[Collectorpalms]

Here is a Sabal Brazoria that I planted over 10 years ago for someone, and picture was taken after the Feb 2021 Texas Freeze. Sabal Brazoria grow with sabal minor. I dont see any hybridizing among the two. I have seen two Brazoria with several feet of trunk out in the open. One is at the office at the San Bernard Wildlife office, and another is at an Apartment complex in the town of Brazoria. I found it by accident after hunting the Brazoria. It should be visible by google maps.... But I cant seem to locate it. Its been too long to recall exactly. They were both kinda untidy looking like the one in my picture. Sabal Bermudana hold its leaves well, and I think they both look somewhat glossy.

Edited November 29, 2021 by Collectorpalms

[Steve in Florida]

Here's a pic saved years ago, of native Sabal bermuda on Bermuda.  Notice the short seed stalks and distinct, wide yellow hastula.  The original post of a seedling shows seven wide strap leaves with no interest in bifurcation.  After many years of growing thousands of almost all Sabal palms, the closest seedling resemblance I have produced is Brazoria palmetto being identical and Sabal minor 'Louisiana' being a close second.

[Bigfish]

On 11/29/2021 at 6:58 PM, Steve in Florida said:

Here's a pic saved years ago, of native Sabal bermuda on Bermuda.  Notice the short seed stalks and distinct, wide yellow hastula.  The original post of a seedling shows seven wide strap leaves with no interest in bifurcation.  After many years of growing thousands of almost all Sabal palms, the closest seedling resemblance I have produced is Brazoria palmetto being identical and Sabal minor 'Louisiana' being a close second.

Steve, you are the Sabal expert, so I shall defer to you!  I will get a comparison photo of the seeds soon.  I have some Brazoria seeds that came from a plant whose parent palm was/is from the original population in Brazoria.  I just need to clean my Defuniak seeds.

 

BTW, nice picture of some S. bermudana in their native land!  

[Swolte]

Snapped another pic today from the same angle for those interested in its growth. This is about a year and 3 months after planting (see the initial pic). 

The palm has been good. After the first week or so, I barely gave it supplemental water and no more than three handfuls of Palmgain (spread out across spring and summer). I will admit it has been a wet summer for College Station (e.g., sprinklers for the lawn weren't on until the end of July). It did get attacked by the Ox beetle in the summer but I was there the day after to flush the critter out. For the rest, as any slow-growing Sabal, its quite unremarkable. The mistflower is drawing monarchs like crazy which keeps me aware of the presence of the Defuniak! 

The amount of fronds have doubled. I now have around 10!

Edited December 5, 2021 by Swolte

[amh]

On 12/5/2021 at 1:32 PM, Swolte said:

Snapped another pic today from the same angle for those interested in its growth. This is about a year and 3 months after planting (see the initial pic). 

The palm has been good. After the first week or so, I barely gave it supplemental water and no more than three handfuls of Palmgain (spread out across spring and summer). I will admit it has been a wet summer for College Station (e.g., sprinklers for the lawn weren't on until the end of July). It did get attacked by the Ox beetle in the summer but I was there the day after to flush the critter out. For the rest, as any slow-growing Sabal, its quite unremarkable. The mistflower is drawing monarchs like crazy which keeps me aware of the presence of the Defuniak! 

The amount of fronds have doubled. I now have around 10!

Any updates?

[Swolte]

On 10/31/2022 at 10:36 PM, amh said:

Any updates?

No growth this year! 

I am still quite pleased with that, though. We had record-breaking drought and heat here in Texas for several months so most of my sabals remained in a quasi-dormant state. I was glad the DeFuniak was one of those plants that could survive without a drop of supplemental water. My garden is unirrigated and 90% of plants should be able to survive (not necessarily thrive!) an average* Central Texas year within any supplemental water once established. My respect for Sabals has grown even more as I only lost one (S Etonia, that was struggling already due to past winter and possible poor placement on my part).

Cheers,

~ S

* I know... what does that even mean these days!

[JohnAndSancho]

So dumb question and back story

 

When I was a kid, our Boy Scout camps were in DeFuniak Springs (Euchee and Jambo). So I'd have an emotional attachment to these. Dumb question - what is PDN? 

 

Just for authenticity purposes... Here was our Euchee song 

 

The biscuits at Camp Euchee

They say they're mighty fine

One rolled off the tables, and killed a friend of mine

Oh ooooh oh wow wow oh oh oh

Oh Mom I wanna go home 

 

 

 

 

[amh]

2 hours ago, Swolte said:

No growth this year! 

I am still quite pleased with that, though. We had record-breaking drought and heat here in Texas for several months so most of my sabals remained in a quasi-dormant state. I was glad the DeFuniak was one of those plants that could survive without a drop of supplemental water. My garden is unirrigated and 90% of plants should be able to survive (not necessarily thrive!) an average* Central Texas year within any supplemental water once established. My respect for Sabals has grown even more as I only lost one (S Etonia, that was struggling already due to past winter and possible poor placement on my part).

Cheers,

~ S

* I know... what does that even mean these days!

Hopefully your palm is just saving its energy for the next growing season. My surviving in ground palms have put out about 1/3 of a leaf each, at best. My landscaping usually requires little to no irrigation, but this year I was watering everything every day. With the welcome rain I have received in the past 2 weeks, my yearly total is now about 6 inches. I usually receive between 35 to 40 inches. Between droughts, freezes and hurricanes, the sabals have earned much respect.

[amh]

2 hours ago, JohnAndSancho said:

When I was a kid, our Boy Scout camps were in DeFuniak Springs (Euchee and Jambo). So I'd have an emotional attachment to these. Dumb question - what is PDN? 

Plant Delights Nursery,

[Jtee]

2nd pic is a regular Sabal palmetto seed and surrounding it are the Defuniak Sabal seeds. The Defuniak seeds appear slightly smaller and darker. 
 
these are current pics of the Sabal Defuniak on December 12, 2022. I had a a little bit of time to kill today and went looking for the famous Sabal palm. 

 

 

 

Edited December 12, 2022 by Jtee

[ShadyDan]

Looking good! I have a bunch of its babies coming up right now. They germinated quite quick, as all Sabals usually do. It will be a looooonnnnnggggg time before I see if the resemble the parent though. 

[GoatLockerGuns]

16 hours ago, Jtee said:

The Defuniak seeds appear slightly smaller and darker. 
 

That is interesting.  How large were the diameters of the two types of Sabal spp. seeds?  I found the exact opposite when I measured them (in mm).  The Sabal palmetto species seeds I measured were approximately 5 1/2 mm in diameter; whereas, the Sabal sp. 'DeFuniak Springs' seeds that I procured from @Bigfish measured approximately 8 mm in diameter.  See this thread (not really about the DeFuniak Sabal) for pictures of the measurements taken (posts 13 and 16 are germane):

 

[GoatLockerGuns]

Current situation.  Pictures taken today (February 2, 2023).

[rarepalmaddict]

On 11/29/2021 at 7:06 AM, Collectorpalms said:

Here is a Sabal Brazoria that I planted over 10 years ago for someone, and picture was taken after the Feb 2021 Texas Freeze. Sabal Brazoria grow with sabal minor. I dont see any hybridizing among the two. I have seen two Brazoria with several feet of trunk out in the open. One is at the office at the San Bernard Wildlife office, and another is at an Apartment complex in the town of Brazoria. I found it by accident after hunting the Brazoria. It should be visible by google maps.... But I cant seem to locate it. Its been too long to recall exactly. They were both kinda untidy looking like the one in my picture. Sabal Bermudana hold its leaves well, and I think they both look somewhat glossy.

Hello, could you get me some seeds ?

Thanks 

[rarepalmaddict]

Would anyone have any DeFuniak Sabal Palm and sabal Brazoria seeds?

Thanks 

[Will]

How is it handling winters? I have read somewhere that it's a 7b palm. Can somebody confirm that?

I recently got a small one, besides a Sabals tamaulipas

[Quasarecho]

DeFuniak palm reminds me of the stature of these that I shared a while back somewhere on the site. These were shot in Ft. Walton Beach. I personally like the more stout trunks

[Will]

DeFuniak seedling has grown quite a lot since end of April seen in the pic above. 

It's gonna grow under light over the winter so it's going to be big enough to be planted outside in spring. 

Anyone any hardiness experience yet?

[Aceraceae]

On 4/28/2023 at 3:32 AM, Will said:

How is it handling winters? I have read somewhere that it's a 7b palm. Can somebody confirm that?

I recently got a small one, besides a Sabals tamaulipas

DeFuniak Springs is one of the sub zero Florida towns along with Crestview and Talahassee but that was 100 years ago. Easily a zone 8 area.