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Please help me rescue my newly adopted Dwarf Date Palm, "Gimli"


m92

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Hi everyone,

Glad to be accepted into the forum :-). My recent adoption of a dwarf date palm tree has led me here, to reach out for your help.

Originally the tree was planted on the ground before I received it, which now lives in an outdoor pot in my small backyard. The guy who supplied the tree surprised me that he could drop it off quickly on the day and was caught half-prepared. He had dropped it off without a soil bag and unfortunately had to stay like that overnight as my backyard is just concrete (with fake grass). I did as much as I could to quickly pot it on the next day with a mixture of peat, good quality soil & sand along with a 15cm/6" base of scoria for drainage hoping for the best. Unfortunately, it isn't doing too well and would like to ask for your help/advice to quickly save it from potentially dying. The fronds are shrivelling and browning at the tips :-(.

I will purchase some items soon (e.g. ph soil tester kit), but thought to reach out here should there be any additional items that I need to purchase (e.g. fertiliser, tonic, etc). I've read that they're prone to a few deficiencies but am having a hard time identifying if my tree's problem is just that, or a potential fungal infection that I'm not aware of yet.  Below is a link of one of Australia's main hardware stores for these items:

https://www.bunnings.com.au/search/products?page=1&q=fertiliser&sort=BoostOrder&pageSize=60

If it's a potential deficiency in something particular, would someone be able to advise me to find the right fertiliser please?

If it's something else, I desperately would like to hear from you in regards to turning this thing around and saving my dwarf date, Gimli.

If there's any info that I've missed, please let me know.

Thank you very much in advance.

kind regards,

Alex

 

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Edited by m92
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It's stressing and in shock because it was pulled out of the soil and potted. Must put it in shade, no fertilizer, just water as needed. And...probably it suffered some root damage...it looks like so. Both pot and soil must have good drainage. Must be patient and give it time to acclimatize and recover. Cut the fronds only when completly dry...and be patient, it it will probably look worst before you can see some improving...or not.

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Greetings, Luís

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Thank you very much lzorrito for the assessment & advice :-). I really appreciate it!

The pot itself is in the shade as the fence blocks the sun during winter & spring. It has been raining regularly and the winds have been atrocious even though I've put it in the most guarded spot for wind in my backyard. The soil was bought and is a mixture of peat, good potting soil & sand. It seems to drain fairly well but the regular rain every 3 days or so makes it hard to figure out if it retains too much moisture? I'll try to be patient and hope that the warmer seasons coming will help. Summer for us starts in December. When you advise to cut the fronds, do you mean just the affected ones or all of the fronds?

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You're welcome! It's not only the pot that needs to be in the shade, but all the fronds also. For what I see and read from you it seems like it the palm isn't also dealing so well with those strong winds, which is normal dureto its actual condition A more wind sheltered spot is adviced. Just by looking to the potting soil surface on the picture it looks dump and compact (it looks...you must test that yourself), which means that roots aren't getting enough aeriation, and that can become a serious issue, just like too much moisture retation, it's also important you check that. It should be wet but not dump and muddy. I if it'so, you should move it to a drier spot where you can monitor watering and moisture levels. Too much moisture may lead to root rot. Cut the affected leaves but only when completly dry, because the palm will recycle its nutrients in order to directed them towards the healty ones . Remember that the palm is in shock...so you must be patient, very patient, and a certain amount of dedication, but it will be rewarding.

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Greetings, Luís

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It probably wont start looking better, or pushing out any new fronds for that matter, until it gets its roots established. It will likely be focusing on root development instead of new fronds for the time being. Once it gets better established it will begin to push out new fronds and redevelop its crown. Better protected area and water as said above. 

Palms - 4 S. romanzoffiana, 1 W. bifurcata, 2 W. robusta, 1 R. rivularis, 1 B. odorata, 1 B. nobilis, 2 S. palmetto, 1 A. merillii, 1 P. canariensis, 1 BxJ, 1 BxJxBxS, 1 BxS, 3 P. roebelenii, 1 H. lagenicaulis, 1 H. verschaffeltii, 9 T. fortunei, 1 C. humilis, 2 C. macrocarpa, 1 L. chinensis, 1 R. excelsa

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Thank you lzorrito, jimmyt & JLM for your collective advice so far :-)! I really appreciate it.

Ok, so it looks like there's quite a bit of work ahead of me... If the plan is to move the entire pot & tree in the shade, I will have to:

* dig out all of the soil mixture first

* take the tree out

* move the pot under the alfresco (no sun though)

* maybe blend more potting mix for better aeration in the pot (no fertiliser needed)

* put tree back in the pot under the shade

* when tree & soil are fairly dry, cut the affected fronds/leaves but leave healthy looking ones on.

Does that sound right?

I guess it depends on how much the tree is in shock, but recovery-wise, should I do all the steps above somewhat soon, what do you think is my ballpark for recovery time here? 3 months? 6 months? 1 year? I ask because once it's recuperated & starting to develop new fronds, I'd like to take it back out in the sun - which sadly means I'll have to dig it up again & repot :-(...

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Take a look elsewhere in this subforum, there are a lot of posts on the recipes for good potting mix.  Pygmy dates are pretty forgiving compared to some primadonna palms, but they still want a good potting mix.  It needs to provide aeration to the roots and be quick draining so they don't water-log and rot.  

As said above by others, the palm is stressed out.  Protection from wind and only indirect sun until it gets over this hump.  it'll look worse before it looks better.

Side note.  I hope that's the last pot it ever lives in.  Because with that shape (with the lip curved in at the top edge) you'll have to shatter the pot to get it out if you ever re-pot it later.  It's going to make a rootball that is likely to be too big to lift out of that spherical shape pot.  Digging/cutting the roots to remove it without damaging the pot is just going to put you right back here again with an injured and stressed palm.

Good luck!

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"Ph'nglui mglw'napalma Funkthulhu R'Lincolnea wgah'palm fhtagn"
"In his house at Lincoln, dread Funkthulhu plants palm trees."

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Now only time will tell...be gentle handling the roots and don't let the soil dry completly. Fingers crossed!

Greetings, Luís

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Will have a look at the subforums, Funkthulhu, thanks! And yes, I'm working out a plan in my head based on my logistics. I'll have the weekend to do it, as my 9-5 job doesn't leave a lot of time in the morning nor evenings sadly. And on the rootball topic, yes, that will probably be the last pot for it and am planning a spot for it on our driveway for the future. The tree is apparently about 15 years old - how much bigger does the rootball (& upper half) of a dwarf date palm grow?

 

Thanks lzorrito, I will try to do my best!

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@m92  

Regardless of size, you're putting a tree in a pot.  It will eventually push its roots to the edge of that vessel.  It's not that it can't have a smaller root ball, it's that you'll damage the roots it does grows should you ever try to cut it out of that container.  It's not an insta-kill, but it will stress the tree a lot.  Best to avoid it if possible with a straight or tapered-side pot that allows easy extraction.  Or at least acknowledge it'll be better for the tree if someday you break that pot rather than break the plant when you need to re-pot.

But as you say, that's a pretty big pot and possibly the last one for that palm.  With good soil it may never need to be re-potted again.

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"Ph'nglui mglw'napalma Funkthulhu R'Lincolnea wgah'palm fhtagn"
"In his house at Lincoln, dread Funkthulhu plants palm trees."

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Sorry Funkthulhu, I guess I worded that kinda funny. Yes, so I meant that that will be the last pot for it and when the time comes that it has outgrown it, I'll have to break it and move the tree to a spot near our driveway. I hope that clarifies that bit :-).

Thanks once again though!

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Sorry guys, just been inundated with work. NOT A TA, I'll look into the hand truck idea this weekend. My neighbours might have one. Thank you for the idea :-)!

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 9/18/2020 at 8:51 PM, m92 said:

Sorry guys, just been inundated with work. NOT A TA, I'll look into the hand truck idea this weekend. My neighbours might have one. Thank you for the idea :-)!

Def best if you can just move the whole pot Taking it all apart again will further stress the plant. 

 

I have one in a pot that has now been there for 3 years.  It had about 6-8" of trunk on one when I got it and one smaller one next to it. I removed the small one for aesthetics and so the larger one would not have to compete.   The soil mix I use is  a 5-1-1 mix.  5 parts pine bark fines (  orchid bark will do just fine) and 1 part pearlite and 1 part peat moss.  At times I will up the later two components to make a 5-2-1 or 5-2-2 mix. I have had great success with this mix.    You will need to fertilize when making your own mix however, and I have had great success with using Espoma "Grow".  There are also some good palm specific fertilizers out there as well, just keep in mind that you will need to likely down the dose of those  according to your pot size. 

 

For now I would not do any repotting to it for a while. Get it in full or mostly full shade and keep it watered well but do not over water.   It should begin pushing out new growth for you, and if you're lucky some of the existing fronds may improve as well.   Please keep us posted as to how it does!  Progress pics are always great!   Good luck with it! I hope you are able to save your beautiful new palm! 

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Hey DCA_Palm_Fan, thanks for chiming in and especially for sharing your experience and soil mixture! I will definitely keep that as a reference :-) - really appreciate it!

So the story so far... it's like the weather knows what I'm wanting to do, but every weekend so far has been absolutely pouring down (even hail on Sunday/Monday) but when it's a weekday, it's nice. And as soon as I finish work, it's dark.. bah... :-(

Over the weekdays, I do see it early in the morning and am thinking that the tree is actually slowly adjusting to it's new home. Whilst I have a few lost fronds, 70% that are left have lost a lot of speed/momentum in browning. It doesn't look fantastic but perhaps the nice days in between the weekends are helping.

I assessed the soil and found that it's actually not bad at all. There's moisture in it, but not wet like a drenched towel. It can clump up in a ball but falls apart quite easily :-). The peat, compost & sand mixture can easily be dug by sand - so it's not heavily compacted. Oh, and I don't water it at all due to the fairly regular rain that comes.

I asked my neighbours if they had a hand truck (or similar) but none were big enough to handle the sheer weight & volume of the pot. So, I definitely don't want to redig and repot and redig again when it has recovered. A few of you have mentioned that it'll be not-so-pretty during the recovery, and I'm hoping that's where it's at at the moment - slowly adjusting & recovering :-)

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As far as light levels while you are attempting to nurse your palm back to health, based on previous experience with P. roebelenii, I wouldn't keep it in deep shade, but rather partial sun, or dappled sunlight.  I had a couple potted roebelenii that were stuck in deep shade last fall and winter and were also kept almost bone dry during most of this time and they barely survived.  Once I got with the program, I immediately started watering them generously in the Spring and put them in part sun for a couple months, then as they gradually perked up, I moved them to full sun and kept on watering almost daily until the rains arrived.  They are both really healthy now.

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Will do lzorrito, will do :greenthumb:.

Thanks for sharing palmsOrl! It's nice to hear that both of them have bounced back :)!

It's currently spring down here so that's why we're getting nature's last few tantrums (strong winds, hail & rain) lol. There's a couple more months of it, so here's hoping it tames down a bit. Luckily the tree gets a bit of a rest throughout the week though with easy-going cloudy & sunny days. The pot position is a mixture of both sun & shade - whilst the pot itself (with bottom half of the trunk) is generally in the shade, the top half receives sun. I'm not expecting any new fronds given the dire circumstance, but just for the tree to get used to it's new spot :-).

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