Lucuala Mattanensis Mapu at last

[ruskinPalms]

I am usually not a fan of varigated palms but I really like this one. Of course I could not afford one right now but maybe in the future when more people have them producing seed.

[Gbarce]

Yeah.  Its still very pricey over here in Manila - if you can ever even find one to begin with.  

I would love to have a big grouping of Mapus in the garden but I guess I have to become good at locating, germinating and growing seeds.  And at their slow growth rate that can really take years.

[Palm Guy]

Hi Guys,

I'm no expert at this but just to get an idea for those of you wishing to grow Mapu from seed, I ordered 10 seeds about 2 months ago. I placed them in heat (85F) n plastic bags and 2 had germinated within 1 month. Another has germinated after 2 months. Dont know if I'll get anymore out of this batch as the seeds were not fresh but I'll hold onto them all for about 1 -2 years. They only need the heat to germinate...I've heard that these guys actually do better when temperatures are slightly cooler (75-80). So far, one of them has a spear coming up which is about 3/4 of an inch long.

Considering how rare and how hard, how slow, and not to mention how expensive the seeds are (I paid 40$ USD for only 10 seeds), I'd say prices are somewhat reasonable. In the rare event that I get all 10 to grow I would have to charge at least $4.00 to cover the costs of the seeds alone. To pay a person minimum wage to take care of these palms each day, and to have half or a quarter of them die before selling age, and add the time it takes to reach selling age, you will have to pay a pretty penny to get your hands on one of these. I'd say just grow them from seed if you can.  

Mike

[Gbarce]

wow you are lucky on the germination.  There has been no activity in my batch so far.  

Did you ever have any problems with fungus?  I hear that they are particularly susceptible to that .

[Palmarum]

Many great ideas for how to germinate the seed, I am still waiting for my L. mapu to just bear some seed so I can try germinating them.

Ryan

[Palm Guy]

Gene,

So far, none have had fungal problems. I used a fast draining soil with lots of bark and peat. If you do the baggie method just make sure you put them in full darkness to avoid algae. Also...lay the seeds on their sides. The germination point is somewhere in the middle of the seed.  

Mike

[Gbarce]

Mike,

yup they are laying on their sides buried in cocopeat beside the condensing unit of our airconditioner.

So far I.ve had no problem with algae with my other seed batches but I have not had them enclosed longer than a month.  I may have to replace the cocopeat every month just to avoid that problem.

Did you apply heat to your seeds of just leave them out in the sun?

[Palm Guy]

At first I left the seeds in room temperature conditions...about 80F...no added heat and two of them had germinated. I then put the ungerminated seeds in an oven...in the off position...another had germinated after 2 months.

Good luck with your seeds,

Mike

[Gbarce]

I decided to "upgrade" the container of my mapu seeds to a much deeper container. Their old container was like the one on the right.  Now its the one in the center.  

The containers on the right are seeds being soaked for a second round.  I potted up their prothers and sisters already and these late bloomers will be re bagged and hopefully they germinate later on.

[Gbarce]

another angle.  i hope they germinate soon--- a lot of them.

I changed to a taller container after observing the germination method of others-  particularly will's(pious Palms).  The extra depths allows you to wait for a spear to come out before the roots get too entangled.  I hope this works for the Mapu

[Gbarce]

I finally got the book from Amazon - Encyclopedia of cultivated palm and its great. I ordered it over a  month ago and the book never arrived so I complained and they sent me a replacement.

It says that if ever the seeds completely dry out -rehydrating them to germinate again could take longer.  To begin with the germination is really sporadic and can take as much as 3 years.  

I guess that success is really dependent on having freshly picked seeds.

I just ordered some seeds again and  I instructed them to put some moist moss in the envelope to prevent them from completely drying out.

[www.dadluvsu.com]

(Palmarum @ Jul. 13 2007,20:44)

QUOTE

I am still waiting for my L. mapu to just bear some seed so I can try germinating them.

How about a photo of that elderly palm?  

[Utopia Palms]

(Utopia Palms @ Jul. 12 2007,05:57)

QUOTE

I must say I never get tired looking at L mattensis var. mapu, and all the photos look Fantastic! As a few have mentioned these like a wet spot or do not like to dry out also they grow best in a high humitidy area that does not change much that stays consent! Although they will handel some colder and tuff conditions you still have to pick your spots when planting or gorwing these. The other thing is not to use too much fert and be very careful with chemicals around them as this can kill them, along with many of the borneo species i have found! I can see there are some very patient and good growers out there that are growing some very nice plants but I bet all have killed a few ?I’m guilty of this a few times before working out the problems and how to grow them!  As it’s not the easiest of palms to grow especially for those that have a subtropical or colder climate.

For those who cannot grow this species and would like to grow one of the mottled licualas there is Licuala radula which will grow much easier in colder climates, it’s just as mottled although not quite as stunning, you will find some plants have more mottling than others so make sure you pick the ones that have the best mottling from a small size, these will hold that mottling and might even get better with age, they also grow quite fast, very fast compared to Licuala mapu and will grow to about 2m tall. Jeff Marcus should have these for sale for those in the US so give him a try, I’m sure you will be very happy with Licuala radula as well.  

Here is a photo of licuala radula, they are much easier to grow and will take the cold much better than Licuala mapu, these photos were taken today and these plants have been through the very cold weather we have had with out even a mark, to me the they look just as nice as Licuala mapu, these Licuala radula have some great mottling.

[Gbarce]

Yup that sure looks nice.

Where can you get seeds of that ?  I have been surfing all the seed sites for that one.  Seems actually harder to find than the mapu based on my experience.

[Gbarce]

Just an update- new leaf.  I plan to post the next leaf on this thread too just to see how long it takes between leaves.

I've always heard that its a slow grower -- lets get actual time measurements.

[Gbarce]

was a closed spear for quite a while then it suddenly upened up.

But its still not fully open though.

[Gbarce]

another shot

[wendisplantation]

These pics are making me drool!!!My one that has germinated now has a spear, and I am very eagerly awaiting its opening. The spear is under 1 inch tall, so I suspect it is going to take a while to get it opened up.....aaaahhhhhhhh, irritating, waiting. None of the others have popped yet. I too shall lookfor and try the Licuala radula that Clayton has mentioned, if I can find it.

Clayton, have you seeds of this for sale?

Great Thread!!

Thanks everyone for the terrific pics and cultural requirements!!!

[Gbarce]

Yeah that spear remains closed for a really long time and you cant help but take a look at it every hour or so  to check for any sign of movement --- for several weeks!!!

Then suddenly it opens !!!  

But it appears it also is taking its time to fully spread out its leaves.

Its good if you can find other things to take your mind off of the plant.

[ellidro]

Here's a pic of mine it was germinated by Kapoho Palms in March of 02 so its about five and a half Hawaiin years old.  BS Man came by and looked at my loot and said it was his favorite palm from my collection.  Unfortunately it will live a life confined to a container as I will grow it outdoors in the summer and bring it in for the winter months.

[Jeff Searle]

Nick,

     Grown in a pot or grown in the ground. Who cares. Your's is SWEET!

Jeff

[ellidro]

Thanks Jeff!

[www.dadluvsu.com]

Does anyone have one of these palms that has trunk????  I would love to see a photo...

This photo was on PASCOA's website...  A simply stunning specimen!

[Gbarce]

WOW!! didn't imagine they got that tall.  Its a shame that the  lower part of the trunk had no more leaves.

If your mother plants set seed you should really plan to plant the offspring beside her to keep the bushy look.

[Gbarce]

Licuala Mattanensis Mapu SEEDS at last.  Got them August 7 and I soaked them for 3 days.  Added some powdered fungicide in the water for protection.  Hope i got a very light covering.

[Gbarce]

And planted them in cocpeat.  Now how many years do I have to wait!!??

[Gbarce]

Just an update on the leaf opening.  I think that with this picture today the leaf is fully open.  

I will count off from today and see how many weeks (or months) before the next leaf is full open again and post it on this thread again.

Then we can have a theoretical "growth rate"

[Gbarce]

Another shot.

Will update on the spear probably every 2 weeks

[HellJ]

(Gbarce @ Aug. 09 2007,11:02)

QUOTE

And planted them in cocpeat.  Now how many years do I have to wait!!??

Any sign of germination yet? I've had my seeds the same amount of time, and still nothing. Guess I need to be more patient ... but it's difficult!

[Gbarce]

Hi Hellen.

Nope no movement on my seeds yet.  I checked.

People on this forum have said that the earllist germination they hav had is at around 3 months and the rest was sporadically popping after that.  The book says a maximum of 3 years.

They do seem to be swelling a bit though.

I had an even earlier batch that I planted on June 25 and even those have not shown any sign of movement yet.

I just check for fungus every  now and again.  If I suspect anything (any small speck) I take the whole batch out and bath then in water with powedred fungicide.  Getting them wet I imagine helps them absorb more water and rehydrates them.  Then its back to the slightly moist cocopeat.

Its important that the cocopeat is not wet at all because if the seeds will stay there for half a year or so they could easily rot.

I even had a set of seeds that I put in chsrcoaled rice husks which is definitely freedraining and I am just relying on the ambient moisture in the container.

I will share my experience as to what method works best.

So far I have no results either way/

This mapu will really teach you the virtues of patience I guess.  It'll be worth it in the end I think.

[bgl]

Here's a quick update on my germination attempts. Put 9 mapu seeds in this plastic container on 17 Jan 2007. They're beginning to germinate now. Two are easily visible in the center, and there are 2 or 3 more (tiny ones) that I can just barely feel when I run my finger over the surface.

[Al in Kona]

Here are three of my Licuala 'Mapu' - all in containers placed under 50% shade cloth and between the house and carport so they only get filtered sunlight during the late morning and early part of the afternoon.  

This is my largest one.  It flowered and gave me a few seeds earlier this year.

[Al in Kona]

Another slightly smaller one with somewhat sharper mottling . . .

[Al in Kona]

The smallest one . . .

[Gbarce]

Bo- OUCH!!! 8 months to germinate?!?I guess congratulations are in order.  This little palm is really a challenge.  Please  describe your germination method for this a little more. What problems did you encounter?  Did you have fungus problems?  

What medium did you use - that doesn't look like the usual cocopeat.

Al - Wow those are huge.  How old are they?  Did you start them from seed?

[Al in Kona]

Gene, no, I didn't grow them from seed.  I got them as much smaller plants.  They do grow well here but slow as everyone knows.  I want to plant several directly in the ground but from what some say, they don't seem to like transplanting or even repotting very well.  I would like to know more about where they grow in habitat: soil type and PH, lighting, elevation, rainfall or anything else which might be helpful for those of us that are growing them.  I have sprinkled lightly Nutricote 360 fertilizer for them as I feel quite safe using that type since it doesn't burn.  That's all I've done.

Has anyone out there had luck planting Licuala 'Mapu' directly into the ground from a container plant?  Please tell us about it.  Thanks.

[Gileno Machado]

Wow...they're all beautiful...

Well, this second picture from Al in Kona shows palm perfection, doesn't it?

I have 4 seedlings here, grown indoors from seed and they're still in the third leaf stage. I've used two types of soil mix and the fastest growing specimen is potted in pure decomposited organic matter, old leaves basically.

The mottled characteristic of the species is not very apparent yet.

[Gbarce]

I just wanted to update this post to try to determine the leaf production rate of a Lucuala Mapu.  We know its slow -- but just how slow exactly.

History of the pitures in this Thread:

July 5 - There is just a closed spear on the plant.

July 30 - The spear has burst open but not fully yet

August 11 - The leaf is fully open

October 4  - New leaf is still just a spear but is still pushing itself out.  This sucker is still tight and shows no signs of opening yet.

[Gbarce]

Here's a shot of the whole spear.  I'll post another update when it opens and then when it fully opens.

I'm guessing 3 months between fully open leaves?????

[Kris]

Dear Al  

those palms of yours are preety fentastic and gene thanks for starting such a lovely topic..

thanks & love,

Kris