Is this a Royal or Queen?

[Palmfarmer]

Really Hope so that just confirms that bismarckias Are pretty much garanted to work well here and do pretty well 

 

Edited November 21, 2019 by Palmfarmer

[Silas_Sancona]

Royal, nice find.

 

[Palmfarmer]

2 hours ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Royal, nice find.

 

Ah thats awesome i found a neighboorhood with a ton of them, but i thought it was Queens then, but looking back they where royals. Will keep going around the neighboorhoods here in hunt of some rare palms for this climate. This is the only species that kind of surprised me growing on a medium scale in certain neighboorhoods. 

[Silas_Sancona]

9 minutes ago, Palmfarmer said:

Ah thats awesome i found a neighboorhood with a ton of them, but i thought it was Queens then, but looking back they where royals. Will keep going around the neighboorhoods here in hunt of some rare palms for this climate. This is the only species that kind of surprised me growing on a medium scale in certain neighboorhoods. 

Sometime ago while doing a " out of curiosity"  google street view search related to locating Coconuts / other unusual types of palms growing at high elevation,  I took a look around both Torreon and Chihuahua and found more queens growing in both places than I'd imagined. Not necessarily due to potential cold in each location in the winter, but as hot as it gets up here in the US portion of the Sonoran Desert, I can only imagine how hot inland portions of Mexico can get during the summer. Most Queens growing here look awful, esp.  once summer has finished cooking them, esp. If a really hot and dry summer.  Id imagine the further south you go in Mexico, you generally see more rainfall in summer which might help keep queens ( or other non native palms ) looking good in spite of the heat there.  Depending on the year/ strength of..  Northern edge of the summer monsoon belt meanders between southern AZ and central/ northern Utah / Colorado so consistency of decent summer rains to both help supply moisture, and temper the heat / intensity of the summer sun can vary widely each year compared to other spots further south at a similar elevation, or who might have a similar climate. 

Can't remember exactly which area I'd found them but had located a couple Royals and some Bismarckia in either Chihuahua or Torreon also. 

 

[Palmfarmer]

I do the same thing with street view too haha. Yeah i would love to get the cordinates to the Bismarckia. Yeah Chihuahua i think has a very similar Climate to Durango. Torreon is Warmer in Winter Even though its a bit further North but its allmost 900 meters lower in elevation compared to Durango. 

[palmsOrl]

I like it.  Looks like a real survivor.

[Palmfarmer]

On 11/21/2019 at 4:02 PM, Silas_Sancona said:

Sometime ago while doing a " out of curiosity"  google street view search related to locating Coconuts / other unusual types of palms growing at high elevation,  I took a look around both Torreon and Chihuahua and found more queens growing in both places than I'd imagined. Not necessarily due to potential cold in each location in the winter, but as hot as it gets up here in the US portion of the Sonoran Desert, I can only imagine how hot inland portions of Mexico can get during the summer. Most Queens growing here look awful, esp.  once summer has finished cooking them, esp. If a really hot and dry summer.  Id imagine the further south you go in Mexico, you generally see more rainfall in summer which might help keep queens ( or other non native palms ) looking good in spite of the heat there.  Depending on the year/ strength of..  Northern edge of the summer monsoon belt meanders between southern AZ and central/ northern Utah / Colorado so consistency of decent summer rains to both help supply moisture, and temper the heat / intensity of the summer sun can vary widely each year compared to other spots further south at a similar elevation, or who might have a similar climate. 

Can't remember exactly which area I'd found them but had located a couple Royals and some Bismarckia in either Chihuahua or Torreon also. 

 

Torreon got quiete a lot of Royals actually. our Queens dont look the best unless there is extra irrigation added and they are fertilized then they look great here. Some do pretty well by themself as well though. But we got the reverse thing as in AZ. Our Rain season is in Summer, so that probably helps even though its pushing 40c some days. Coconuts Could potenially work in Torreon i Believe And in Monterrey I am allmost 100% that they would grow ok. How does Bismarckias do in your Climate by the way? and what is a typical cold drop you get in winter?

Edited November 26, 2019 by Palmfarmer

[Silas_Sancona]

7 hours ago, Palmfarmer said:

Torreon got quiete a lot of Royals actually. our Queens dont look the best unless there is extra irrigation added and they are fertilized then they look great here. Some do pretty well by themself as well though. But we got the reverse thing as in AZ. Our Rain season is in Summer, so that probably helps even though its pushing 40c some days. Coconuts Could potenially work in Torreon i Believe And in Monterrey I am allmost 100% that they would grow ok. How does Bismarckias do in your Climate by the way? and what is a typical cold drop you get in winter?

Though maybe not as popular, or widely seen as in Florida, Bismarcks do pretty well here in/ around Phoenix. There are also a few  growing in Tucson which is  typically  a few degrees colder, especially during winter.

As far as our winter lows, where I'm at, I am typically a couple degrees cooler than downtown Phoenix. Regardless, lows typically bottom out in the mid/ upper 30s to lower 40s ( 1.1-7.2C ) range thru most of the winter. That said, not uncommon to see a few nights close to freezing ( lows in the lower 30s). While rare, we do see occasional cold spells where lows can dip into the 27-29F range. Think the lowest my side of town has seen is 19 or 20F several years ago in a typically cold and less developed part of town. Areas of mostly open desert are usually the coldest spots in the area.   There are a couple, albeit smaller Royal Poinciana, and some Cassia fistula that have been in the ground several years in my neighborhood, both types of trees are typically good indicators that damaging freezes are very rare.  The larger they're able to grow between any damage they might sustain from a hard frost / freeze, the more frost free your area is..  

[GottmitAlex]

On 11/21/2019 at 11:03 AM, Palmfarmer said:

Really Hope so that just confirms that bismarckias Are pretty much garanted to work well here and do pretty well 

 

Royals can grow in Durango, Mex?  Wonderful!

If that palm can grow there, there is a plethora of tropicals which can grow there as well.

Never thought about your climate as now.

Nice! 

 

[Palmfarmer]

7 hours ago, GottmitAlex said:

Royals can grow in Durango, Mex?  Wonderful!

If that palm can grow there, there is a plethora of tropicals which can grow there as well.

Never thought about your climate as now.

Nice! 

 

Yes it is awesome. I found another Neighboorhood with more of them that was a lot bigger as well, i Try take some photos tomorrow. 

On another note this climate is confusing me a lot. Could the reason for these growing there be the fact that cold dips very rarely last for 12 hours if that. Realtivly speaking daytime is allways warm or mild and there is never contiunous cold periods. Robelinis Are lets say planted here on a large scale many places and they seems to do completly fine, Even though on paper they should be long gone. ONLY reasonable explanation i can come up with for now is this quete from Wikipedia

 

"The climate is temperate in the western part of the city, with the average annual temperature being 15 °C (59 °F) and an average annual rainfall of 1,600 millimetres (63 in). In the eastern part, the average annual temperature is 19 °C (66 °F)" 

Those Royals grow on the eastern part however most Robelinis Are planted near the Center. I Will look through accuwheater for a more accurate location in the east side of the city to check out the Winter lows. When i checked out Winter temps for the Center itself coldest was a night of -5 or -6 last year. 

Anyone have any theories? 

Edited November 27, 2019 by Palmfarmer

[Xerarch]

After a quick study of the climate of Durango I’m surprised any Royals are found there. Looks like freezes are not uncommon and the average January low is not that far above freezing. Surely the saving grace is that temps warm quickly and the January highs are pretty warm, upper 60’s. Surely freezing events are brief, radiational events. 

[Palmfarmer]

Yes, i guess the dry air (IT also never rains in winter) and brief cold snaps makes the temprature of death way higher. 

Would be i interesting to hear from someone living in the "highlands" with a similar Climate or Even better someone from Durango that grows on the edge palm trees. 

[Tom in Tucson]

21 hours ago, Palmfarmer said:

Yes it is awesome. I found another Neighboorhood with more of them that was a lot bigger as well, i Try take some photos tomorrow. 

On another note this climate is confusing me a lot. Could the reason for these growing there be the fact that cold dips very rarely last for 12 hours if that. Realtivly speaking daytime is allways warm or mild and there is never contiunous cold periods. Robelinis Are lets say planted here on a large scale many places and they seems to do completly fine, Even though on paper they should be long gone. ONLY reasonable explanation i can come up with for now is this quete from Wikipedia

 

"The climate is temperate in the western part of the city, with the average annual temperature being 15 °C (59 °F) and an average annual rainfall of 1,600 millimetres (63 in). In the eastern part, the average annual temperature is 19 °C (66 °F)" 

Those Royals grow on the eastern part however most Robelinis Are planted near the Center. I Will look through accuwheater for a more accurate location in the east side of the city to check out the Winter lows. When i checked out Winter temps for the Center itself coldest was a night of -5 or -6 last year. 

Anyone have any theories? 

The data for precipitation in the city of Durango from Wikipedia is wrong. The 63 in. is not for the city, but is probably for the mountains to the west. The correct amount should be 13.05". I went to the city of Durango once and noted that the surrounding area is dominated by xerophytic vegetation (large Yucca sp. and tree size Opuntia sp.). I would compare it to the desert grassland of Arizona and New Mexico.

The data I found states that the temperatures for December and January average 74-75˚ for highs and 37˚ for the lows. I did not find the extreme temperatures listed, I would guess that the lows can dip to freezing on occasion. It would be classed as 9b-10a.

Today's temps. near Tucson: Hi 66˚, Lo 43˚

Edited November 28, 2019 by Tom in Tucson

[Xerarch]

I suspected that 63 inch stat from Wikipedia must be bogus, that’s a huge number, plus I looked at the area on Google Earth and didn’t look that wet at all, but I have no personal experience with the area. 
 

on another note see the chart below showing the growing season for Durango, the bar goes down to zero percent chance for dates in January to be within the growing season on any particular year. That tells me that they expect freezing temps every year. Chart from weatherspark.com
 

[Palmfarmer]

On 11/27/2019 at 11:11 PM, Tom in Tucson said:

The data for precipitation in the city of Durango from Wikipedia is wrong. The 63 in. is not for the city, but is probably for the mountains to the west. The correct amount should be 13.05". I went to the city of Durango once and noted that the surrounding area is dominated by xerophytic vegetation (large Yucca sp. and tree size Opuntia sp.). I would compare it to the desert grassland of Arizona and New Mexico.

The data I found states that the temperatures for December and January average 74-75˚ for highs and 37˚ for the lows. I did not find the extreme temperatures listed, I would guess that the lows can dip to freezing on occasion. It would be classed as 9b-10a.

Today's temps. near Tucson: Hi 66˚, Lo 43˚

Thank you sir you where completly right. I just looked over last years lows in the the part of the city i live in and there was only 1 day with -1c/31. and 20+ for the most time during the day. On the other hand if you just key in Durango you will get mostly nights with 0c and even a severe dip to -6 so it must be in the mountains as you predicted.  This has opened up a whole pleatra of other palms and plants i can grow here  any suggestions? Would my Red Latan do ok here you think in the ground? its currently in a pot but its doing really well and is pushing some new spears. Last question i just ordered a Butia before finding this out will it do good here ?or is it to warm in general, 40s are not uncommen in summer, but it rains a lot. 

[Tom in Tucson]

Latania will be marginal. If you want a more reliable red palm, I suggest Livistona mariae. Most Butia species should do okay.

Hi 60˚, Lo 42˚ - rain showers

[Palmfarmer]

Yes i know its pushing the envelope pretty hard so i will just bank on getting a really huge pot for it in the future. (will probably need 4 guys getting it in a few years from now.) it grows pretty fast here.  

Wow that was a instant hit for me! I will see if i can obtain that one. further along i will try my best efforts to get a Blue Latan or perhaps Yellow since they are more hardy. at least the blue one is. do you know of any palms with Yellow in them outside of the Yellow Latan that works in my climate? 

[GottmitAlex]

Nice climate. I wonder if bottle palms can grow there.  

Have you thought about B. Alfredii, King palm, Dypsis Carlsmithii, Hyorphorbe indica. They may be worth a shot. 

 

[Palmfarmer]

1 hour ago, GottmitAlex said:

Nice climate. I wonder if bottle palms can grow there.  

Have you thought about B. Alfredii, King palm, Dypsis Carlsmithii, Hyorphorbe indica. They may be worth a shot. 

 

They sell them at some nurseries here i will research more about them. Thanks Alex i will check those out. 

[Palmfarmer]

Found another bigger one randomly on another part of town while cruising around with my Motorcycle. I truely am baffled! suppesedly according to locals they had a snap down to -10 last year at night. 

 

[Ben in Norcal]

6 hours ago, Palmfarmer said:

Found another bigger one randomly on another part of town while cruising around with my Motorcycle. I truely am baffled! suppesedly according to locals they had a snap down to -10 last year at night. 

 

Looks like it got torched last winter, but survived.  Still find it hard to believe it took -10.

[Palmfarmer]

2 hours ago, Ben in Norcal said:

Looks like it got torched last winter, but survived.  Still find it hard to believe it took -10.

yes me too I have heard this from 2 sources one said 8 minus and another said 10 minus. Maybe the forecast was way of that day or something like that. 

[Palmfarmer]

Been keeping an eye on it and here is the latest pic, we had a nightly dip to -2c a week ago approximently and it has gotton some minor leaf burn as seen,

 

[Palmfarmer]

Came a cross another one today. it seems slightly burned but otherwise fine. Coldest temp so far has been -3. 

[NOT A TA]

1 hour ago, Palmfarmer said:

Came a cross another one today.

How high is the water table there? The palms in your pics are pretty large to be surrounded by concrete.

[Palmfarmer]

13 minutes ago, NOT A TA said:

How high is the water table there? The palms in your pics are pretty large to be surrounded by concrete.

yes tons of other palms also grow out of a small hole sourrounded by concrete. I dont know. 

[Palmfarmer]

found a few more again

[JLM]

1 hour ago, Palmfarmer said:

found a few more again

(Reference to bottom pic) Any power company in America would be so cruel and cut that thing down. Not even kidding. 

[Palmfarmer]

5 hours ago, JLM said:

(Reference to bottom pic) Any power company in America would be so cruel and cut that thing down. Not even kidding. 

Here i really dont know what they do. i assume they just make the cable fit around the palm by extending it if it snaps haha. 

[GottmitAlex]

20 hours ago, JLM said:

(Reference to bottom pic) Any power company in America would be so cruel and cut that thing down. Not even kidding. 

I dont believe those are power cables. 

Seem like phone/copper/fiber cables flanking the palm. I may be wrong. Of course, the high voltage power cables can be seen overhead. But not directly above...

Edited May 20, 2020 by GottmitAlex