Central OK update

[Dave_OK]

Quick update from my garden in Central Oklahoma. My Sabal minors continue to thrive and my largest minor gets bigger each summer. It produced three large seed stalks this year. I believe this is a "Louisiana" variety, but I'm not 100% certain as I bought it nearly 10 years ago at a local nursery. I've potted up numerous seedlings to give to friends and transplanted to other areas of the garden. It's quite a plant!

My Windmill Palm is in a very protected micro climate and you can see it's growth rate below. I've wrapped it up anytime we see temps drop below 10 or so, which is fairly rare, maybe once or twice a winter. Other than that, I just pile up leaves around it and she's been good to go. It undoubtedly wouldn't perform as well out in the open, but it's really taken off in this location. Thanks! 

Potted up minor seedlings

Largest Sabal minor

Windmill palm - 2016

Windmill palm - 2019

Edited November 13, 2019 by Dave_OK

[pin38]

Looks like you have some nice window walls to work with. Those plants next to them will keep looking neater with age. Your windmill looks healthy as well. Looking good!

[Meangreen94z]

Nice, it’s always great when you can make something work in a colder climate than it should. 

[Ben OK]

Everything is looking great Dave. Your windmill is getting really big. I am hoping my needles and waggies don't spear pull after this ridiculous early cold snap this week. (It's their first winter in the ground) We went from 71F last Sunday to rain Monday morning and sleet by Monday afternoon, mid-teens by Tuesday morning. 

Warm followed by wet, followed by deep freeze is a bad combination. Best of luck to you and your palms this winter. I miss fall already...it was a really great week, then winter hit.

[mdsonofthesouth]

Yeah we had low 70s no too long before this freeze too! What zone are you cause that windmill looks good! Wish we had some sort of stability in our weather because going from above average to WAY bellow average for January to normal back to January etc... is not only bad for plants but terrible for people getting sick too. Would be nice to have a steady year for a change.

[Dave_OK]

10 hours ago, Ben OK said:

Everything is looking great Dave. Your windmill is getting really big. I am hoping my needles and waggies don't spear pull after this ridiculous early cold snap this week. (It's their first winter in the ground) We went from 71F last Sunday to rain Monday morning and sleet by Monday afternoon, mid-teens by Tuesday morning. 

Warm followed by wet, followed by deep freeze is a bad combination. Best of luck to you and your palms this winter. I miss fall already...it was a really great week, then winter hit.

Thanks Ben! Yeah it's been a weird start to winter for sure. It kind of snuck up on me and I hadn't mulched anything when the last snap hit...hopefully nothing got damaged too bad. I think I'm good but we'll see. Best of luck with your plants! Been wanting to try a Needle for a while, good luck!

Edited November 14, 2019 by Dave_OK

[Dave_OK]

1 hour ago, mdsonofthesouth said:

Yeah we had low 70s no too long before this freeze too! What zone are you cause that windmill looks good! Wish we had some sort of stability in our weather because going from above average to WAY bellow average for January to normal back to January etc... is not only bad for plants but terrible for people getting sick too. Would be nice to have a steady year for a change.

Thank you! I'm in 7A. My Windmill is perfectly micro-climated with no exposure to the north and west...and I've babied it a bit the first few years. So without all that extra help, it probably wouldn't have made it. But I'm very pleased with it to this point.  Sabal minors are a piece of cake around here. Oklahoma State Univ. even listed them as an "Oklahoma Proven" plant for all the success people have had with them around here. Still fun to have them and never get tired of their swampy, Southern look. They're easily my favorite palm. 

Weather stability would definitely be nice. Our September was like Summer with heat and humidity, then we had an extremely early freeze in October...and we've already seen lows drop to the low teens here in November.  Definitely a challenge with palms. Our saving grace is our extreme Summer heat and the fact that our worst cold of the winter usually hits and is gone very quickly. Just never know what you'll get!

[mdsonofthesouth]

3 minutes ago, Dave_OK said:

Thank you! I'm in 7A. My Windmill is perfectly micro-climated with no exposure to the north and west...and I've babied it a bit the first few years. So without all that extra help, it probably wouldn't have made it. But I'm very pleased with it to this point.  Sabal minors are a piece of cake around here. Oklahoma State Univ. even listed them as an "Oklahoma Proven" plant for all the success people have had with them around here. Still fun to have them and never get tired of their swampy, Southern look. They're easily my favorite palm. 

Weather stability would definitely be nice. Our September was like Summer with heat and humidity, then we had an extremely early freeze in October...and we've already seen lows drop to the low teens here in November.  Definitely a challenge with palms. Our saving grace is our extreme Summer heat and the fact that our worst cold of the winter usually hits and is gone very quickly. Just never know what you'll get!

 

Very cool! Yeah I too like sabal minor... I like all sabal species lol! September is usually still summer here for us, but October was pretty chilly but didn't get our first frost til the 2nd of November thankfully (last couple years have been early in mid October). Our ultimate low so far was 24.9F but with such an early dip I expect it to be pretty bad this year. I have 1 windmill left and its a 7g+ that looks amazing and I will be planning on protecting it for the first few years. It has a eastern nearly full sun exposure but can catch a little of the northern if I'm not too careful! Id like to plant a natural wall to protect it but couldn't this year sadly, but I can say that the area I planted it usually is 55F+ on FREEZING days due to our amazingly warm sun even in winter. I too am in z7a and desperately want a trunking palm to be successful here. 

 

What did you do to protect yours? I have in the past used a tent for bad nights, but the temperature swings can go from frosty to sweltering(for winter) fast! Essentially at this point I'm looking at building a wall to block the north and retain our wonderful sun as a nice heater. This morning was 32F at the local weather station, my sensor in the "palm garden" read 37F while the ultimate low last night should have been 25 we were bottomed at 31F. Most times I get lucky at my house compared to the area around me but there are times where I don't...thankfully its a small minority.  Anyways wonderful palms you have! I hope to add a good mess of sabal minors and more rhapidophyllums to my collection in the spring $$$ and new job willing!

[Dave_OK]

15 minutes ago, mdsonofthesouth said:

 

Very cool! Yeah I too like sabal minor... I like all sabal species lol! September is usually still summer here for us, but October was pretty chilly but didn't get our first frost til the 2nd of November thankfully (last couple years have been early in mid October). Our ultimate low so far was 24.9F but with such an early dip I expect it to be pretty bad this year. I have 1 windmill left and its a 7g+ that looks amazing and I will be planning on protecting it for the first few years. It has a eastern nearly full sun exposure but can catch a little of the northern if I'm not too careful! Id like to plant a natural wall to protect it but couldn't this year sadly, but I can say that the area I planted it usually is 55F+ on FREEZING days due to our amazingly warm sun even in winter. I too am in z7a and desperately want a trunking palm to be successful here. 

 

What did you do to protect yours? I have in the past used a tent for bad nights, but the temperature swings can go from frosty to sweltering(for winter) fast! Essentially at this point I'm looking at building a wall to block the north and retain our wonderful sun as a nice heater. This morning was 32F at the local weather station, my sensor in the "palm garden" read 37F while the ultimate low last night should have been 25 we were bottomed at 31F. Most times I get lucky at my house compared to the area around me but there are times where I don't...thankfully its a small minority.  Anyways wonderful palms you have! I hope to add a good mess of sabal minors and more rhapidophyllums to my collection in the spring $$$ and new job willing!

Sounds like you've got a good setup! Good luck! I'm guessing MD and OK are fairly similar climate wise, with MD getting significantly more rain and OK probably getting higher summer temps (with less humidity). 

For protection of my Windmill, in November i pile up dried leaves around the base (usually about 3/4 of the way up the trunk). Nothing scientific! Then if we get a major cold snap where temps go into the single digits, I bungee-cord the fronds together, wrap the entire palm (trunk, fronds) with some blankets using bungees to keep them in place, then bungee a tarp around the outside of the blankets to keep moisture out. Hope that make sense. Basically I just wrap it up with blankets and tarps and hope for the best. The longest I've left this protection on is probably about a week and then we'll get back to our normal 40s and 50s for winter highs and I remove the protection. Has worked great to this point!

Edited November 14, 2019 by Dave_OK

[mdsonofthesouth]

Yeah we are humid all year with the only breaks when its REALLY windy in the winter and then it becomes desiccating almost but thats mostly on the rarer side. Ill give that a try and see where it goes. Do you still wrap it at that size? But yeah I reckon our extremes are rather similar with yours being slightly warmer or cooler. Anything under 5f is extremely rare like once every several years normally and anything over 109F is unheard of here really. But a 94F day can have a heat index in the 120-130f range if the conditions are right lol!

 

Edited November 14, 2019 by mdsonofthesouth

[Dave_OK]

1 hour ago, mdsonofthesouth said:

Yeah we are humid all year with the only breaks when its REALLY windy in the winter and then it becomes desiccating almost but thats mostly on the rarer side. Ill give that a try and see where it goes. Do you still wrap it at that size? But yeah I reckon our extremes are rather similar with yours being slightly warmer or cooler. Anything under 5f is extremely rare like once every several years normally and anything over 109F is unheard of here really. But a 94F day can have a heat index in the 120-130f range if the conditions are right lol!

 

Sounds very similar! I'll probably go out and wrap it up if we see a long stretch of lows under 10. If not, I'll probably just let it go and see what happens now that the palm is so well established and healthy. We can easily go through the winter without dropping below 10, so hopefully I won't have to mess with it!

[SailorBold]

Looks great!  I really want to add some trachycarpus to my collection next year.  The crown looks great.  May I ask which directions it faces?  I have an area on the north side of my house Im thinking of trying them..  wonder if they will take winter in the north side shade. Very nice!

 

[SailorBold]

Here is a Trachy in abq.. saw this last week on my way to work. Generally they all look like this.. kind of stunted in my climate.. if I can find out the real reason they look stunted here I'd like to try a few.  They look great in shade!

[Dave_OK]

19 minutes ago, SailorBold said:

Here is a Trachy in abq.. saw this last week on my way to work. Generally they all look like this.. kind of stunted in my climate.. if I can find out the real reason they look stunted here I'd like to try a few.  They look great in shade!

Interesting! I've seen some Trachys in Midland/Odessa that look pretty decent. A little different climate than ABQ probably, but still very dry. Mine face Southeast and have really exploded with fronds. I put down some bloodmeal fertilizer last year and a bit of old fashioned miracle grow this year around the base...but that's it. Have tried not to over fertilize. OKC is really a marginal zone for Trachys and if I didn't have mine micro-climated, they definitely wouldn't do as well through our winters. Sabal minors thrive here though. 

[SailorBold]

On 11/15/2019 at 8:45 AM, Dave_OK said:

Interesting! I've seen some Trachys in Midland/Odessa that look pretty decent. A little different climate than ABQ probably, but still very dry. Mine face Southeast and have really exploded with fronds. I put down some bloodmeal fertilizer last year and a bit of old fashioned miracle grow this year around the base...but that's it. Have tried not to over fertilize. OKC is really a marginal zone for Trachys and if I didn't have mine micro-climated, they definitely wouldn't do as well through our winters. Sabal minors thrive here though. 

I'm thinking it might be the rainfall that Midland/Odessa gets.  My tap water is from an aquifer and very alkaline.. but maybe part of it is they arent watered well to begin with... or fertilized regularly. I'm starting to collect rainwater in some rainbarrels.. a new project I started this summer. The planting area isnt prepped yet but Im planning on running drippers from the rain barrels to each of the trachys I have planned for the area... This way.. when we have our brief rains.. they will be watered for days after each storm passes.

What does bloodmeal do exactly?  I am in pure sand perhaps a slight loam.. I wonder if it would help their roots. i can amend but Im not sure how much I want to dig out.

 

 

[SailorBold]

Some more abq trachys

[PalmTreeDude]

I have some Sabal minor 'Dallas' in the ground. They are still strap leaf seedlings, but the leaf's are very stiff already. I was looking at some Sabal minor in Virginia Beach and was surprised at how stiff the fronds were. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by PalmTreeDude

[Desert DAC]

On 11/15/2019 at 9:21 AM, SailorBold said:

Here is a Trachy in abq.. saw this last week on my way to work. Generally they all look like this.. kind of stunted in my climate.. if I can find out the real reason they look stunted here I'd like to try a few.  They look great in shade!

Having lived in ABQ and now in Las Cruces, Trachys are more stunted there to El Paso but with exceptions. They are mesic palms and native to moist areas in montane areas with fog and cloud cover - so, foreign to 3500-6000 ft elevation in intense year-round desert sun. 

Cold is much less likely a reason for stunting of Trachycarpus than is too hot or sunny of an exposure, too little and too shallow of irrigation, and perhaps too lean of soils. Ones in more favorable moisture and sunlight grow well in ABQ and south; our region simply doesn't have the crazy up-down temperature extremes as does the southern plains or prairies, but it is much drier. The best Trachy palms I've seen are in the Pacific NW! So, don't treat Trachy like a Washy, Ocotillo, Apache Plume, or Creosote Bush.

Mimic what seems evident on the most vigorous Trachys in our region...east exposure, part or afternoon shade, amended soil, mesic companion plantings (not lawn or just gravel), and deep / soaking irrigation. Good luck!

Edited November 22, 2019 by Desert DAC
Pic unnecessary

[Dave_OK]

12 hours ago, SailorBold said:

I'm thinking it might be the rainfall that Midland/Odessa gets.  My tap water is from an aquifer and very alkaline.. but maybe part of it is they arent watered well to begin with... or fertilized regularly. I'm starting to collect rainwater in some rainbarrels.. a new project I started this summer. The planting area isnt prepped yet but Im planning on running drippers from the rain barrels to each of the trachys I have planned for the area... This way.. when we have our brief rains.. they will be watered for days after each storm passes.

What does bloodmeal do exactly?  I am in pure sand perhaps a slight loam.. I wonder if it would help their roots. i can amend but Im not sure how much I want to dig out.

 

 

Interesting...bloodmeal is just an organic nitrogen fertilizer. I honestly don't know if it's a "good" palm fertilizer or not, but I know it's not very harsh. My Minors and Trachys seem to respond fairly well to it, but I can't say one way or the other whether it has had any major affect. 

[SailorBold]

On 11/21/2019 at 7:14 PM, Desert DAC said:

Having lived in ABQ and now in Las Cruces, Trachys are more stunted there to El Paso but with exceptions. They are mesic palms and native to moist areas in montane areas with fog and cloud cover - so, foreign to 3500-6000 ft elevation in intense year-round desert sun. 

Cold is much less likely a reason for stunting of Trachycarpus than is too hot or sunny of an exposure, too little and too shallow of irrigation, and perhaps too lean of soils. Ones in more favorable moisture and sunlight grow well in ABQ and south; our region simply doesn't have the crazy up-down temperature extremes as does the southern plains or prairies, but it is much drier. The best Trachy palms I've seen are in the Pacific NW! So, don't treat Trachy like a Washy, Ocotillo, Apache Plume, or Creosote Bush.

Mimic what seems evident on the most vigorous Trachys in our region...east exposure, part or afternoon shade, amended soil, mesic companion plantings (not lawn or just gravel), and deep / soaking irrigation. Good luck!

Im going to be planting around a covered patio on the north side of my house.. should be in shade a good part of the year but benefit from the rain gutters etc..  Hopefully it will be a good spot.. and not too cold. Generally its not too bad there but snow can stay for days..I'm hoping that is similar to their natural habitat?