Palm trees dying?

[Kobach]

Hi to all, 

I have four pygmae palms and two of them are dying. 

What can I do? 

[Kobach]

 

[Kobach]

It is in Southern California, Irrigation via racchio. 

[kinzyjr]

@Kobach

Not entirely sure what happened, but they look DOA.  Judging by the spear that was pulled, some kind of infection in the crown... too much irrigation?  You can attempt a save by pouring hydrogen peroxide in the crown, but I think they are too far gone personally.

[Kobach]

Thx, is there any instruction site how to use  hydrogen peroxide? 

So I cut the dead trunk then? 

[kinzyjr]

For the peroxide: Check the palms for spear pull.  It looks like you already did this with one judging by the photographs.  If it pulls, you can just dump peroxide into the gaping hole it leaves when you yank it out.  If it doesn't, you'll have to maneuver  the spear and peroxide bottle around to ensure that you get some peroxide 360^o around the spear.  The peroxide should foam up to the point that some may come out of the hole in the crown.  At that point, you can shave the trunk if you wish.

Cutting the trunk:  This is an area where you have to be careful.  You can see an example of successful trunk cutting on this post in another forum: https://www.houzz.com/discussions/2089915/old-windmill-palm-spear-pull-deep-cut

My attempt at trunk cutting an Archontophoenix alexandrae was a failure because I didn't notice the symptoms of infection too long.  For as common a palm as Phoenix roebelenii, I would personally just get rid of the dead/damaged ones and get new ones.

[redant]

Those are long gone.

[Palm Tree Jim]

Unfortunately those are DOA.

Did you ever confirm that the plants were getting watered and how much?

The good news is that these are easily replaced.

[PalmatierMeg]

Welcome to PalmTalk.

Those palms are crispy dead. Have you tested your irrigation lately?

Pygmy dates are cheap as dirt and twice as common. Replace them and make sure to water them regularly.

[Kobach]

Thanks for the help. 

Here is a picture of the whole palm. As you can see, two trunks dead and two are fine. 

My Irrigation is drip Irrigation with racchio 3. Soil is moist. 

Two new trees with each 4 trunks are about 8oo usd, and they are smaller just 4.5 ft, mine were 6ft.

 

[Kobach]

Here a photo of the palm with 1 dead trunk. Other 3 trunks are green. 

[NOT A TA]

Did you by any chance have the roof power washed a month or two ago?

[Kobach]

No. I had my concrete power washed and sealed with acryl. But nothing should have touched the palm. 

Edited August 22, 2019 by Kobach

[Palm Tree Jim]

If you are so inclined, you can cut the dead trunks and leave the green ones.

In the past, I have done this with no issues.

[NOT A TA]

11 hours ago, Kobach said:

No. I had my concrete power washed and sealed with acryl. But nothing should have touched the palm. 

My guess would be there's your answer. I've seen similar damage on Roebelenii after power wash jobs. Our barrel tile roofs here are made with concrete and some companies use a chemical that causes the issue you've experienced. That's why I asked about the roof. It doesn't take a lot of whatever the chemical is to cause it because I've seen it where gutters catch the runoff and really only the mist lands on the plant. One plant can die while a similar age plant only a few feet away remains perfectly healthy.

Here's a perfect example. I know the only variable was a concrete barrel tile roof power wash job. Note, gutters and healthy Roebelinii foliage in the left foreground only a few feet away. There are several thriving 3-5 trunk Roebelinii clumps to the left of the walk which have all been there 15+ years, planted the same time the dead ones were. The dead one was a double and I'd removed the first trunk that completely died a couple weeks prior to this pic because the homeowner was hoping for a miracle survival of this one which still showed a little life at the time. 

[Jim in Los Altos]

They look badly underwatered. Pygmy Date palms are native to humid Southeast Asia with high rainfall. They like lots of water especially in the dry air of Southern CA. It’s almost impossible to overwater them. Your’s look water starved. 

[Kobach]

How can I find out if they are underwatered or not? We have clay soil so the drip Irrigation is like 3 hours every 3 days controlled by Racchio. 

The soil feels slightly moist. 

I never had palms before,so no huge experience. 

[Jim in Los Altos]

On August 23, 2019 at 9:36 AM, Kobach said:

How can I find out if they are underwatered or not? We have clay soil so the drip Irrigation is like 3 hours every 3 days controlled by Racchio. 

The soil feels slightly moist. 

I never had palms before,so no huge experience. 

They're exibiting the typical symptoms of under watering. Leaves are short and yellowing/browning. Water should be hitting entire root zone, not just a small drip area. Lots of the roots on these are shallow and spread out so emitters that emit a spray pattern covering the entire drip line would be very beneficial. 

[UK_Palms]

Phoenix Roebellenii is native to southeast Asia in regions that experience strong tropical, monsoonal climates and 75+ inches of rain per year. The water table in it's natural habitat would be quite high and it is adapted to deal with prolonged wet, stormy, humid, overcast weather. That probably includes sitting in wet, boggy ground. Southern California on the other hand only gets 10-15 inches of rain and has a very low water table. It is much sunnier, drier and less humid there.

In hot Mediterranean or arid/desert climates, you need to be heavily watering Phoenix Roebellenii, or any Phoenix type for that matter. But especially Roebelleinii. Or they need to be planted on the edge of a water source. In fact it grows along the banks of rivers in its native Vietnam range.

I myself have seen a number of dried out, dead Roebellenii's in the hot, dry summer regions of Spain and Greece. Lots of dead ones in and around Seville, Spain which is very hot and dry during the summer. They seem to do very well in hot, wet, tropical places such as Florida, Texas gulf and east coast of Australia, though.

[GottmitAlex]

39 minutes ago, UK_Palms said:

Phoenix Roebellenii is native to southeast Asia in regions that experience strong tropical, monsoonal climates and 75+ inches of rain per year. The water table in it's natural habitat would be quite high and it is adapted to deal with prolonged wet, stormy, humid, overcast weather. That probably includes sitting in wet, boggy ground. Southern California on the other hand only gets 10-15 inches of rain and has a very low water table. It is much sunnier, drier and less humid there.

 

Good point.

I must add I believe P. roebellinii are the second most prolific and common palm in California right after the Washingtonias.  They thrive and excel in the State. However, since they are small, folks do not notice them from afar.  

But yes, they do love water and just as Washies, Roebellinii seeds germinate wherever they land:

 

 

Edited August 27, 2019 by GottmitAlex

[Kobach]

I bought two new pygmae palms for 350 usd each. 

Problems again. This picture is from last week. Nursery said please use anti fungal spray. 

[Kobach]

Now after 3 days after application, palm looks like this. Does not look healthy. 

I increased crop coefficient in Rachio by 50percent, soil is moist. 

Still underwatered? 

[Merlyn]

That looks like a serious scale infestation, not a fungus.  Check some of the small white dots on the stems, if they are hard shelled little bumps that pop off with your fingernail then you need to treat for the scale insects.  The normal recommendation is to spray down with high hose pressure (not a pressure washer) to wash off the adults, do a soil drench with a systemic insecticide (Imadicloprid or Dinotefuran) and biweekly foliar sprays with a surface insecticide like Malathion, Acephate or similar.