Encephalartos Middelburgensis ID

[Meangreen94z]

I purchased this Encephalartos sight unseen with a group of other cycads from a grower. All other cycads line up, but the leaf form(spines/teeth) doesn’t line up with any Middelburgensis photos I can find. It’s also a little greener than I had hoped but I can wait to see. Can anyone confirm this to be a form?

[Tracy]

27 minutes ago, Meangreen94z said:

Can anyone confirm this to be a form?

That doesn't look like any Encephalartos middelburgensis  I have ever seen.  Leaf structure, leaf insertion on the rachis and leaf color are all wrong.  Looks like some much more common form of big green Encephalartos.... gratus perhaps?  My still very young Encephalartos middelburgensis has always shown color even as a two leaf seedling, and leaf insertion started going keeled very early.

[BS Man about Palms]

I agree. Not a middleburg... But I don't think gratus either... tegulanus or villosus? (I am weak on cycad IDs)

 

[Palm Tree Jim]

As Tracy and Bill have stated....definitely not middleburg.

 

[GeneAZ]

E. msinganus, probably.  If so, the spiny form is the preferred form.

[Tracy]

1 hour ago, GeneAZ said:

E. msinganus, probably.  If so, the spiny form is the preferred form.

Gene, correct me if I'm wrong, because I have never shopped for an Encephalartos msinganus, but I would expect there would be a significant price difference between a 4"-6" caudex middelburgensis and msinganus of the same size.  Encephalartos middelburgensis being the more expensive plant.  I have to say I would feel a little burned if I thought I was buying a middelburgensis and received a msinganus.

[JubaeaMan138]

Looking at

my msinganus  it does look the same . And isn’t msinganus a little more uncommon then middleburg ? I never see msinganus for sale 

[Meangreen94z]

Thanks everyone. I bought the Middelburgensis as a seedling but his product always shows up larger than advertised, especially if you buy several items. I bought several cycads, and there was a much smaller frondless caudex packaged with this one. I contacted him a couple weeks after the order, about a week after I received them, he acknowledged sending a bonus, but at that point couldn’t remember what he threw in. The smaller frondless “caudex” is much closer to a seedling, and hopefully the Middelburgensis. I’ll wait to see what it flushes. Everything else I’ve ever ordered from his was spot on.

Edited May 28, 2019 by Meangreen94z

[Meangreen94z]

Here is the potential caudex, appears ready to flush

[5150cycad]

1 hour ago, Meangreen94z said:

Here is the potential caudex, appears ready to flush

If I was to guess I would say this might be the middelburgensis. This one looks a lot like one of my  middelburgensis, at least the caudex does. I have one about the same size that recently pushed some leaves but were unfortunately trampled by our new puppy. Can’t really ID by caudex but this caudex looks almost identical to mine. At least there is hope. Good luck. 

[Meangreen94z]

Thanks.

[GeneAZ]

22 hours ago, Tracy said:

Gene, correct me if I'm wrong, because I have never shopped for an Encephalartos msinganus, but I would expect there would be a significant price difference between a 4"-6" caudex middelburgensis and msinganus of the same size.  Encephalartos middelburgensis being the more expensive plant.  I have to say I would feel a little burned if I thought I was buying a middelburgensis and received a msinganus.

Sure, I'd feel burned too!  I do like Msinga very much and it is super rare in habitat;  but middelburgensis is far rarer and, of course, blue which always commands a premium.

It does look like the leafless caudex you have could easily prove to be middelburgensis.

[TropiLocal]

I'll throw my guess in at the bonus and say E. ituriensis.  Looks very much like mine.  Hard to tell if it's a more upright growth pattern, but the spiny, boat/cup shaped leaves resemble the species.  

[Tracy]

3 hours ago, TropiLocal said:

E. ituriensis.  Looks very much like mine.  Hard to tell if it's a more upright growth pattern, but the spiny, boat/cup shaped leaves resemble the species.  

The angle of the leaves being more pendent in the photo of the plant in question and the leaflets don't look quite right, although they are barbed.  A couple of different E. ituriensis to compare with the plant posted above.  Meangreen94z will have to post a photo of the completed flush when available in order to get a better idea.

[TropiLocal]

Yeah, I see what you mean. Hope mine is actually E. ituriensis 

[Meangreen94z]

Sorry it’s been raining the last 2 days when I get off from work. I’ll take a picture in the morning hopefully.

[Meangreen94z]

Here are the photos

[Meangreen94z]

The caudex in question is flushing. I’ll have a pretty good idea soon.