Sabal repotting 15g -> 25g

[RJ]

Picked up these 2 15g sabals in need of repotting over the weekend. Keeping the top of saxophone heal above the ground surface is what’s important correct? 

 

Also so what happens to that heal with mature palms? I’ve never noticed it on mature trees. 

[Allen]

Can't you plant those out where you are?

[RJ]

28 minutes ago, Allen said:

Can't you plant those out where you are?

For sure, however I'm in the process of building a house and am in a rental until it's done. So they will have to wait probably until next spring to be planted out. 

 

 

[PalmatierMeg]

The heel is the rope-y looking bump on the right side of the stem in the photo. The heel naturally disappears as the palm grows larger. I would repot each palm with the top of the soil at the same location on the trunk as photo currently shows. Don't plant any deeper and never bury the heel beneath the soil. BTW, heeled palms should never be planted too deep.

[Allen]

OK that explains it.  they are nice size.  What kind of sabals are they?  

[RJ]

42 minutes ago, Allen said:

OK that explains it.  they are nice size.  What kind of sabals are they?  

The very best variety.... Sabal mysterio 

 

 

[RaleighNC]

3 hours ago, PalmatierMeg said:

The heel is the rope-y looking bump on the right side of the stem in the photo. The heel naturally disappears as the palm grows larger. I would repot each palm with the top of the soil at the same location on the trunk as photo currently shows. Don't plant any deeper and never bury the heel beneath the soil. BTW, heeled palms should never be planted too deep.

Why shouldn't that part of the heel be below ground? When they grow from seed without transplanting, that part of the heel never comes above ground.  I have never planted such a large one, but I would have assumed that all of those roots should be completely buried. 

[Rickybobby]

35 minutes ago, RaleighNC said:

Why shouldn't that part of the heel be below ground? When they grow from seed without transplanting, that part of the heel never comes above ground.  I have never planted such a large one, but I would have assumed that all of those roots should be completely buried. 

My sabal has the same size heal and it is not wise to bury it and that area of palm

[Steve in Florida]

A heel like that forms when the potting mix in the bottom of the pot stays consistently too wet.  Often, the higher the heel the wetter the soil.  I've almost never seen a heel like that on Sabals that have matured in habitat.  Once I saw a young palmetto trying to grow in a shallow muck bottom stream with a slight heel.

If you change the soil to a drier mix you can replant those with the heel 1/2-3/4 submerged.  If planted in well drained potting mix or the ground the heel will dry out and crumble after the Sabal has established itself.

[RaleighNC]

9 hours ago, Rickybobby said:

My sabal has the same size heal and it is not wise to bury it and that area of palm

But what happens if it is buried? 

It seems logical that the upper part of the heel emerges from the soil only in some cases. For example as the hook of the "saxophone" pushes deeper into the soil, if it reaches resistance that it cannot overcome (such as the bottom of the pot), the oldest part of the heel gets pushed upwards. If there is no such impediment, the downward expansion is possible, so the oldest part of the heel doesn't get pushed upward. All those roots should anchor it pretty well. There may be conditions in nature that allow the oldest part of the heel to be pushed upwards, such as sandy soils (or continually wet soils like Steve in Florida mentions) where the top part of the saxophone is not as solidly anchored. Of course this is all speculation, but considering the way in which the saxophone develops, it seems to make sense.

Even if this is correct, it could still be damaging to fully bury a heel if it has been exposed for a long period of time. But does anyone know of cases where this has been done with disastrous outcomes? I suspect Sabal palmetto and S. minor would handle this without problems.

 

[RJ]

Decided to repot these guys today. I dropped them a smidge lower in the new pots. I usually use pine bark nuggets , pine bark soil conditioner, and some mushroom compost. I prefer the sand form. This time I had some perlite around do I through some of that in. 

 

I fill the bottom of the pot with nuggets to cover the drain holes for drainage also to keep the finer medium in the pot.

[RJ]

I the start the mix add some palm fertilizer and in this case some perlite

[RJ]

Add mushroom compost, mix well then, adjust the height of the palm in the new pot. I often use a straight edge to be sure 

[RJ]

 

Piece of wood used to check the palm depth. 

Edited February 27, 2019 by RJ

[RJ]

Add the magic juju juice . A cap full helps the medicine go down ...

Water to your hearts content. 

[RJ]

Finished round one and... 

Repeat 

[Brad Mondel]

Did you get these in Columbia? 

[Steve in Florida]

10 hours ago, RaleighNC said:

Even if this is correct, it could still be damaging to fully bury a heel if it has been exposed for a long period of time. But does anyone know of cases where this has been done with disastrous outcomes? I suspect Sabal palmetto and S. minor would handle this without problems.

 

I've never had any problems burying most of the heel but you don't want to plant it so deeply that the growth point is covered with soil.  Since modifying my soil mixes years ago I very rarely see heels forming on any of my Sabal palms.   

[Allen]

Repot looks great!

[RJ]

23 minutes ago, Allen said:

Repot looks great!

Thanks. Decided to tackle a couple  Butia eriospatha I received today as well. Into 15’s they went to put on some growth for the summer. 

[RJ]

46 minutes ago, Steve in Florida said:

I've never had any problems burying most of the heel but you don't want to plant it so deeply that the growth point is covered with soil.  Since modifying my soil mixes years ago I very rarely see heels forming on any of my Sabal palms.   

Steve, do you just use a very well draining soil mixture to keep the heal at bay?

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

17 hours ago, Steve in Florida said:

A heel like that forms when the potting mix in the bottom of the pot stays consistently too wet.  Often, the higher the heel the wetter the soil.  I've almost never seen a heel like that on Sabals that have matured in habitat.  Once I saw a young palmetto trying to grow in a shallow muck bottom stream with a slight heel.

If you change the soil to a drier mix you can replant those with the heel 1/2-3/4 submerged.  If planted in well drained potting mix or the ground the heel will dry out and crumble after the Sabal has established itself.

Or when the bottom of the heel touches the bottom of the pot and pushes the plant up which I believe has happened with these.  

[GaDawg]

Odd, I’ve seen plenty of Sabals growing in freshwater swamps and saltwater/freshwater marshes here in Georgia but have never observed a heel. Does it only do this in waterlogged pots? 

[GaDawg]

5 hours ago, RJ said:

Add the magic juju juice . A cap full helps the medicine go down ...

Water to your hearts content. 

Does Superthrive really work? I’ve heard some skeptics about this stuff. 

[RJ]

2 minutes ago, GaDawg said:

Does Superthrive really work? I’ve heard some skeptics about this stuff. 

I like to think it does.  I've used it for years with deciduous trees and always liked the results. I haven't been into palms long enough to give it a definitive thumbs up or down. I'm not all that interested in running a control either to see one way or the other, so I just use it. 

[Steve in Florida]

7 hours ago, RJ said:

Steve, do you just use a very well draining soil mixture to keep the heal at bay?

I would say that a natural mix that is both free draining and maintains pore space is key.  You don't want to use composts that quickly break down and lead to anaerobic conditions.  I learned this when i first tried to grow palms with composted manure and peat moss with bark.  The first year showed great growth but thereafter pore space decreased average plant health with an increase in heel occurrences.

[trachyman]

Hey RJ any updates on those two? Also I don't think I caught which subspecies those are?

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

They wont show a heel unless they're in a pot. 

[teddytn]

@RJ any update on the potted Sabal mysterio’s?

[RJ]

1 hour ago, teddytn said:

@RJ any update on the potted Sabal mysterio’s?

They're still in their pots. They should be going into the ground next spring/summer when the new house is finished. Fingers crossed