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ExpandRe4lity1

Northern Va Chamaerops Humilis

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ExpandRe4lity1

I planted my Chamaerops on July 11 2018 in Woodbridge Va. It has endured some pretty impressively low temps with no protection thus far. Our lowest temp this winter has been 6 degrees Fahrenheit and numburous days below 15. I will post current pics tomorrow but it has suffered minimal damage despite the winter here so far and has been growing all winter long from what I can tell. Planning on planting another one this spring along with a Trachy

F64A9915-D87E-4124-9C14-BB03ABDA1762.jpeg

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ExpandRe4lity1

First two pics were the day of planting 

8CB03BCD-E0F3-4FE0-B3A8-4FC169203783.jpeg

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NC_Palms

Nice palms and welcome to PalmTalk. I love seeing people grow palms where they aren’t that common in the landscape. 

Good luck with everything. Chamaerops should be almost bulletproof for you. I remember seeing them in front of some musem when I was last in DC.

 

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ExpandRe4lity1
8 hours ago, NC_Palms said:

Nice palms and welcome to PalmTalk. I love seeing people grow palms where they aren’t that common in the landscape. 

Good luck with everything. Chamaerops should be almost bulletproof for you. I remember seeing them in front of some musem when I was last in DC.

 

Yeah if you are talking about the ones in Northeast I believe they are still there

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ExpandRe4lity1

This is today

9F6673CE-0998-4C2E-8B2A-6A11D43845AB.jpeg

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ExpandRe4lity1

This is my first palm in ground I’ve ever raised so any tips are welcome!

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ExpandRe4lity1
8 minutes ago, ExpandRe4lity1 said:

Yeah if you are talking about the ones in Northeast I believe they are still there

Also thanks for the good wishes I’ve been a long time spectator of the site and really like your palms as well sir!

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Josue Diaz

Yikes, I wouldn't call that minimal damage. The fronds all look dead in that last picture. And the central spear looks dead also. Hope it pulls through for you, but it doesn't look promising. 

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Allen

I think the plants delight guy says his dies back at temps under 10F but established ones come back in summer.   Your best palm bests are needle palm, sabal minor then the hardy larger sabals like  brazoria, louisiana, birmingham.   Then Trachycarpus Fortunei and Sabal palmetto.  These last 2 for sure need protecting in winter and the only 2 you can plant and maybe not protect are needle and minor.   brazoria, louisiana, birmingham will only need protecting in 'arctic air' type events like the north just recently saw.

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cm05

I hope it pulls through for you.

I’ve always wondered how hardy they truly are compared to the hardiest Trachycarpus species, some say they’re the same while others say Chamaerops is only hardy to zone 8a.

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PalmTreeDude

I have one down here near Richmond that usually gets completely defoiliated but comes back from the trunks every Spring. We only got down to 10°F so far and some of the lower fronds have died while the spear and newest fronds are still alive. I might remove it this year and replace it with something else, I was thinking Saw Palmetto but I can't get the seeds to germinate! Yours might be dead, but you never know. If I were you, I would plant a pretty hardy ecotype of Sabal minor (Arkansas, McCurtain, North Texas, Cherokee Alabama, or Northeast N.C.) those tend to be bulletproof in most parts of Virginia and get nice big fronds when mature, especially the Northeast N.C. ones. Welcome to the forum! 

Edited by PalmTreeDude
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kinzyjr

@ExpandRe4lity1 A lot of damage.  The weather forecast doesn't look great.  Might want to spray the spear and crown area with copper fungicide at some point during the day.  In the event the palm survives, it will be weak and susceptible to disease.  I agree with @Josue Diaz and @PalmTreeDude... get some minors and some needles.  They'll be around a lot longer than a Chammy.

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NC_Palms

When I said Chamaerops was “almost bulletproof”,  I meant that an established Chamaerops would probably survive but may die back in the winter.

Also @ExpandRe4lity1it is always smart to plant palms in protected spots away from the wind. This is very important when growing palms in cooler regions. 

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Cikas

Your chamaerops looks dead. That is not minimal damage. These temperatures are too cold for chamaerops. Sabal minor would be better palm for your climate. 

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ExpandRe4lity1

Checked the newest frond earlier today and they still hold strong. Will treat with c.fungicide this evening. I have many more pictures with better light but at having a lot of trouble uploading 

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Allen

Yes I wouldn't call it dead yet.  Good luck

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ExpandRe4lity1
40 minutes ago, Allen said:

Yes I wouldn't call it dead yet.  Good luck

Thanks I’ll definitely pick up some s minors as well. The Louisiana variation has always been an interest of mine 

 

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ExpandRe4lity1

image.jpg

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Palm crazy

I'm rooting for your palm but most likely is dead.  without protect at that small size, it is a goner..., dang it!  got so cold the lawn is brown! 

All you can do now is cut back and protect the center and see if it grows back.  Keep trying and you'll find out what works. 

Edited by Palm crazy

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ExpandRe4lity1

I will continue trying to upload I have so many pictures better than the ones I've able to upload so far 

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PalmTreeDude

From what I can see now, it will likely die and the spear will probably pull in the Spring when things warm up. But still don't give up, palms can surprise you sometimes. 

If you are taking these photos from your phone and need a way to compress some in order to post them, if you are on Android, try an app called "Lit Photo" (I believe it might come up as "Photo Compress"). If you are on iPhone I know there are apps for it there as well. 

Edited by PalmTreeDude

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RJ
1 hour ago, Palm crazy said:

I'm rooting for your palm but most likely is dead.  without protect at that small size, it is a goner..., dang it!  got so cold the lawn is brown! 

All you can do now is cut back and protect the center and see if it grows back.  Keep trying and you'll find out what works. 

Warm season grass. As soon as the first frost comes it starts to turn brown. I still can't get used to it, and am not a big fan of it actually. I have seeded my entire back lawn in annual ryegrass to it doesn't look so pathetic.  I can't grow cool season grasses in the summer. They they last till mid June until the heat nukes them, even in partial shade. 

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Palm crazy
2 hours ago, RJ said:

Warm season grass. As soon as the first frost comes it starts to turn brown. I still can't get used to it, and am not a big fan of it actually. I have seeded my entire back lawn in annual ryegrass to it doesn't look so pathetic.  I can't grow cool season grasses in the summer. They they last till mid June until the heat nukes them, even in partial shade. 

Ok, thought that might be the case. Up here in the PNW the grass is greener in winter and dry and brown in summer, it's those Mediterranean summers. 

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Chester B
1 hour ago, Palm crazy said:

Ok, thought that might be the case. Up here in the PNW the grass is greener in winter and dry and brown in summer, it's those Mediterranean summers. 

When you live in the NE your lawns are usually brown both summer and winter!  

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SEVA
29 minutes ago, Chester B said:

When you live in the NE your lawns are usually brown both summer and winter!  

I don't know much about the Northeast, but every time I've visited NY the yards have been very green both summer and winter (when snow was absent).  Everywhere I've lived across the South (VA, NC, MS) the grass is green during the growing season and turns brown after the first hard freeze.  I'm not sure what type of grass is common up there, but Bermuda grass is what I commonly see down here. 

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SEVA
6 hours ago, ExpandRe4lity1 said:

image.jpg

As others have stated the palm might not make it, but only time will tell.  It can take a few weeks for the full damage to become evident (I've seen this happen to Butia after an abnormally cold winter).  I attempted a Chamaerops once and it died after the second winter. I haven't planted one in the ground since then, but I might try again sometime in the future. 

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NC_Palms
1 hour ago, Chester B said:

When you live in the NE your lawns are usually brown both summer and winter!  

When I lived in Pennsylvania, the grass would be green year in the winter but become brown by July/August. 

Here in NC we grow subtropical species of grass, which turn brown whenever we get our first frost but stay green throughout the growing season. 

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ExpandRe4lity1
7 hours ago, PalmTreeDude said:

From what I can see now, it will likely die and the spear will probably pull in the Spring when things warm up. But still don't give up, palms can surprise you sometimes. 

If you are taking these photos from your phone and need a way to compress some in order to post them, if you are on Android, try an app called "Lit Photo" (I believe it might come up as "Photo Compress"). If you are on iPhone I know there are apps for it there as well. 

Thanks I’ll look for one of those apps I’m on IPhone. Also should I have waited to apply c fungicide until the weather gets a little warmer? 

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RJ
4 hours ago, SEVA said:

I don't know much about the Northeast, but every time I've visited NY the yards have been very green both summer and winter (when snow was absent).  Everywhere I've lived across the South (VA, NC, MS) the grass is green during the growing season and turns brown after the first hard freeze.  I'm not sure what type of grass is common up there, but Bermuda grass is what I commonly see down here. 

We used mixes of Fescue/BlueGrass usually. It's an evergreen and even when it snows stays green, Only time it turns brown is from drought and it usually takes awhile to recover. But yes Bermuda, Zozia, Centipede etc all are warm season grasses that go dormant (turn brown) in the winter. It's not until you get into FL that you sea St. Augustine that stay green year round. Being in the transition zone where you lives can be a PITA when it comes to lawns. Too hot for cool season and not warm enough for the year round warm season grasses to stay green. :angry:

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Cikas
20 hours ago, ExpandRe4lity1 said:

image.jpg

Still looks dead. Even if survives this, it will not survive the next winter. More cold hardy palms like Sabal Minor would be much better option. 

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NC_Palms

Lawns are pretty wasteful when you come to think about it. I’d rather grow a palm forest than a field of bermuda grass. 

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Chester B
13 hours ago, NC_Palms said:

When I lived in Pennsylvania, the grass would be green year in the winter but become brown by July/August. 

Yep, same thing in Southern Ontario.  The turfgrasses most commonly used in lawn mixtures are Kentucky bluegrass, fine fescue and perennial ryegrass.  Turns brown from the heat and dry in July/August and usually turns brown from the cold in December.

3 minutes ago, NC_Palms said:

Lawns are pretty wasteful when you come to think about it. I’d rather grow a palm forest than a field of bermuda grass. 

+1

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Fusca
On 2/12/2019 at 7:07 AM, NC_Palms said:

Chamaerops should be almost bulletproof for you.

But I wouldn't take a shotgun to it.  ;)

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PalmTreeDude

Here is what my Mediterranean Fan Palm looks like at the end of every winter in the Richmond area (unprotected). It is still alive, yes, but gets REALLY beat up, a very bad winter would take it out for sure (I am shocked that it did not die last Winter, which was a bad one). I stopped protecting it because I was going to replace it with something else one year and then it just kept coming back from the trunk so I have left it alone since, I only trim the dead fronds off in the Spring. 

20190214_155536.jpg

20190214_155603.jpg

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PalmTreeDude

I would apply the copper fungicide when you get a warm spell with lows above freezing (at least how I used it). Now I use hydrogen peroxide if any of my palms are badly damaged (if the spear gets hurt). 

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ExpandRe4lity1
13 minutes ago, PalmTreeDude said:

I would apply the copper fungicide when you get a warm spell with lows above freezing (at least how I used it). Now I use hydrogen peroxide if any of my palms are badly damaged (if the spear gets hurt). 

I’ve not heard of people applying peroxide until recently. Do you dilute it?

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Josue Diaz
3 hours ago, NC_Palms said:

Lawns are pretty wasteful when you come to think about it. I’d rather grow a palm forest than a field of bermuda 

yup, removing the bermuda lawn was the first thing I did when I bought my place. 

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PalmTreeDude
2 hours ago, ExpandRe4lity1 said:

I’ve not heard of people applying peroxide until recently. Do you dilute it?

I normally buy 3% hydrogen peroxide and pour small amounts down the spear if it is brown while making sure to cover all of it to the center of the crown. A lot of the time you'll hear a fizzing noise. Remeber that when you pour stuff down the spear it will sit in there just like water and can freeze, which is why it is important to make sure it won't freeze for a day or two after. 

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Edited by PalmTreeDude
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AZ RARE PALM ENTHUSIAST

I'm new on here...Don't touch that palm with anything until it warms up...I used to live in Portland, OR now in Phoenix, AZ. I would put a cover over the crown shaft...or in essence over the whole palm. You need that crown shaft dry until it warms up. Then do your treatment

 

 

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ExpandRe4lity1
On 2/14/2019 at 4:08 PM, PalmTreeDude said:
On 2/14/2019 at 8:28 PM, AZ RARE PALM ENTHUSIAST said:

I'm new on here...Don't touch that palm with anything until it warms up...I used to live in Portland, OR now in Phoenix, AZ. I would put a cover over the crown shaft...or in essence over the whole palm. You need that crown shaft dry until it warms up. Then do your treatment

 

 

Thanks man great advice much appreciated will keep everyone update as we move into spring

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