Jump to content
Pal Meir

Lytocaryum weddellianum as Bonsai

Recommended Posts

Pal Meir

My 10 Lytocaryum weddellianum grown up from seed in 2013 were more and more getting too tall :huh: for my desktop, except one (N°1306c) which I had kept quite small by very brutal :crying: root pruning. (But even the other pruned palm N°1306a is growing too tall …)

Now I am intending to keep my 3 one year young L batavum as small bonsai palms. First, I will keep them as long as possible in their tiny Ø8xH9cm clay pots. Second, I will expose them also to direct sunlight, but watching that they don’t get burned. B)

@Jamesasb , you have mentioned (and posted a pic) one year ago that you are making one of your L weddellianum to a bonsai. Are there already visible and positive results? 

Here the desktop-sized N°1306c:

5b521f1576eb4_N1306c2018-07-20P1040770.t

And here the 3 new bonsai candidates:

5b521f1e7cad3_N1701-032018-07-20P1040771

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

As N°1306a is already much too tall for a desktop bonsai I intend to separate both palms and make only the small N°1306c to a bonsai. Do you think it is possible to separate the palms without killing one or even both?

N°1306a too tall:

5b64ed2723c1d_N1306ac2018-06-06P1040628.

I’ll separate N°1306c:

5b64ed30cffb0_N1306c2018-08-02P1040807.t

Inside the tiny Ø12cm H10cm pot:

5b64ed381cefe_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040816.

Can I separate the roots without killing the palms?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alcibiades

I would not try to separate the palms. I always avoid to interfere the roots by any means. Risking such a beautiful palm is just not worth it. The concept of growing palms in a bonsai form is not what I would do. Many small understorey palms are available especially from the genus dypsis. Although I have to admit that I try to grow dwarf dypsis now unsuccessfully for several years. D. bonsai, d. thyriana, d. poivreana a. s. o.. They all died in bunches. I will now use your Seramis mix to try this again. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir
50 minutes ago, Alcibiades said:

I would not try to separate the palms. I always avoid to interfere the roots by any means. Risking such a beautiful palm is just not worth it. The concept of growing palms in a bonsai form is not what I would do. Many small understorey palms are available especially from the genus dypsis. Although I have to admit that I try to grow dwarf dypsis now unsuccessfully for several years. D. bonsai, d. thyriana, d. poivreana a. s. o.. They all died in bunches. I will now use your Seramis mix to try this again. 

Thank you for your answer, but it is already too late … Yes, if I didn’t have so many L weddellianum I wouldn’t try separating them, but I have problems with space. Almost all of my L weddell are becoming too tall for the desk in my home office. So I decided (1) all three L batavum shall always stay dwarfs, (2) N°1306c shall become a small compact palm. As I don’t have so much space here I don’t know what exactly to do … :unsure:

And here the result: pics #1 to 4 separating the 2 palms; pic #5: separated; pic #6: the bonsai mix PalMeirA™; pic #7: the two palms N°1306c and N°1306a repotted; pic #8: the future bonsai N°1306c (pushing its 18th leaf).

5b6590dc9cc65_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040818.

5b6590e25a0d4_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040820.

5b6590e9c2e43_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040821.

5b6590f1b231b_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040824.

Separated!

5b6590f927075_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040825.

 

Bonsa mix «PalMeirA«™:

5b659142dc36e_BonsaiSoil2018-08-04P10408

5b6590ffa5341_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040828.

5b65910813a74_N1306c2018-08-04P1040830.t

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alcibiades

@Pal Meir

Do you always remove the old soil completely when repotting or was it only done to separate the two palms? I'm just asking because I bought Seramis today and now I think about completely removing my old mix. 

Edited by Alcibiades

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir
1 minute ago, Alcibiades said:

@Pal Meir

Do you always remove the old soil completely when repotting or was it only done to separate the two palms? I'm just asking because I bought Seramis today and now I think about completely removing my old mix. 

Nonono, of course I don’t, it was in that case the only way to separate the densely tangled roots of the two palms. Esp. in case of L weddellianum you should never disturb the roots.

5b65f9f9e2762_N1306ac2018-08-04P1040815.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

I hope it will survive ………… :unsure:

5b65fde063fb6_N1306c2018-08-04P1040833.t

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir
29 minutes ago, Alcibiades said:

@Pal Meir

That pot is way to small... :P

But compared to these two it is almost huge: :lol:

5b6609436f368_N06022011-01-92IMG_5395.th

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Since N°1701 and N°1702 are exposed to direct (!) sunlight the leaves grow more compact (cf. leaves #04); N°1703 was still too weak for that treatment.

5b9517d06830c_N1701022018-09-09IMG_9498.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Having lost four (!) fronds since the brutal :crying: separation on August 4 bonsai N°1306c has grown 2 mm since 2 days: :greenthumb::rolleyes:

5bc09a8ee1f3b_N1306c2018-10-12P1040919.t

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
piping plovers

That growth progress is encouraging.  I think the black marking and monitoring of the growth is one of the best things you can do after a risky repotting.  It's so visual and objective.   Otherwise, your mind may play tricks on you as you assume the worst and may over-react with other care measures. After I bought my first Johannesteijsmannia altifrons, I feared repotting because of their notorious reputation for failing after root disturbance.  It was potted in a heavy peat-only mix and I knew I had to change the mix. Removing it from pot went horribly wrong, all the peat fell to the table and I had a saturated bare root Joey palm in my hand---panic!   I thought for sure it would die.  Anyhow, I transplanted into the fast draining potting mix that you and others have recommended in numerous posts, and I black marked the new emerging growth.  I was so relieved that the growth mark kept rising in that week and following weeks.  This encouraged me that all was okay and I just continued with the present care routine rather than panicking and 2nd guessing myself by over or under-watering. Those are beautiful potted palms, so delicate in appearance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Update of the 3 L batavum bonsais, which were exposed to direct sun for over 2 months:

The leaf 2-03 and the upper half of leaf 3-04 got burnt by the sunlight. Palm N°1701 has leaves with saturated green colour without any harm by the sun, while the weaker N°1702 got a bit yellowish. N°1701 and N°1702 have spears of their 6th leaf, N°1703 of its 5th. The older shade grown leaves 1-03 and 3-03 are much wider than the newer ones.

5bc26e33dc395_N1701-032018-10-13P1040924

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

The very compact 5th leaf of Lytocaryum batavum N°1701 grown under full sun:

5bd5be11398ce_N17012018-10-28P1040939.th

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

N°1306c survived the brutal root pruning and is growing healthily since one month: ;)

5be4291152b78_N1306c2018-11-08P1040955.t

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
abdalav

What's a Lytocaryum batavum?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir
21 minutes ago, abdalav said:

What's a Lytocaryum batavum?

L batavum is a subspecies of L weddellianum, endemic to the Netherlands from a tree grown up by  @Kai :rolleyes:

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
abdalav

Pal Meir, unfortunately, my weddelliana is drying up. I don't know if it will survive...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir
4 minutes ago, abdalav said:

Pal Meir, unfortunately, my weddelliana is drying up. I don't know if it will survive...

Oh, that’s sad news. :(

Please open a new thread with as many photos of your sick palm as needed.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
abdalav

I've created a new thread, Pal... 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

The babies (*2017) didn’t like the hard winter sun here; their leaves got some heavy sunburn … :bemused:

973527385_N17012019-03-21P1050084.thumb.jpg.28f250553fc7e76c22453196d57522ce.jpg

 

And I hope that the fronds of the almost 6 years old N°1306c will become much mor compact:

1306212411_N1306c17012019-03-21P1050090.thumb.jpg.c1e010e0473f9bfaa62cac9ee9143fcf.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Even the smallest babies have to get acquainted with direct sun; leaves #5 and #6 got already burnt by the winter sun:

1283242858_17012019-04-07P1050108.thumb.jpg.7425a50bcc9d8c58e811cf73140f302f.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

The 6 year old N°1306c is pushing the 2nd leaf (= leaf #20) since the separation from N°1306a:

1013436503_1306c2019-04-26IMG_9621.thumb.jpg.ba3c7d1a1ff017fcd59d25795cd005dd.jpg

I hope the newly growing leaves will become more compact than the older fronds because they are exposed to almost full sun from noon to sunset.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Howeadypsis
On 8/4/2018 at 12:45 PM, Pal Meir said:

Thank you for your answer, but it is already too late … Yes, if I didn’t have so many L weddellianum I wouldn’t try separating them, but I have problems with space. 

 

I wish I had space for one, I would take one off your hands! Gorgeous palms.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Similar Content

    • kinzyjr
      By kinzyjr
      The 2019 Holiday meet-up started at Heathcote Botanical Gardens in Ft. Pierce, Florida.  The gardens are roughly 5 acres and have a densely planted palm and cycad walk as well as a reflection garden full of Bonsai plants.  Our tour guide for the day was none other than @Dave-Vero.  Currently, the gardens are set up with Christmas lights and a train set under a tree as part of their Garden of Lights event.  For more information on the gardens, please visit: https://www.heathcotebotanicalgardens.org/
      On with the show:
      Next 3 photos: The parking lot has pretty standard views for coastal central Florida; with Livistona and Roystonea in fruit, and some yuccas to stop you from parking in the mulch.



      Next 4 photos: The entrance has some more old favorites.  From there you can see some of the canopy palms in the gardens.




      Once inside, a Satakentia liukiuensis all decked out with lights.

      A look down the path shows that all of the palms are under canopy for protection.  A Dypsis decaryi is present on the right fork.

      There are bromeliads and other plants mixed in with the palms as you would expect.  What's that on the left?

      Next 2 photos: If you guessed Howea forsteriana, you are correct.  This palm seemed to attract most of the attention at the start of the tour.  There is a close-up in the second photo.


      The famed 3-headed Sabal makes an appearance in an open spot off the main path.

    • Pal Meir
      By Pal Meir
      According to the palm literature Lytocaryum weddellianum grows at altitudes between 50 and 800 m and Lytocaryum insigne from 1000 to 1800 m (Noblick 2017). But those limitations seem to be not correct. Below four habitat photos showing L insigne at c. 500 m and L weddellianum at c. 900 m (and 1200 m imo):



      This palm is imo also L weddellianum, but I am not sure:

    • Pal Meir
      By Pal Meir
      Not a Lodoicea, but only two L weddellianum potted together, today 6 years old:

      And 2 years ago:

      And when they were still younger:

      And 4 months after birth, er, germination:

       
    • Pal Meir
      By Pal Meir
      Trachycarpus wagnerianus seems to be another ideal bonsai palm.
      Here an 8 years old palm which got transplanted into ground in 2014:

       
      And onother one 12 years old in a Ø12cm x H10cm plastic pot:

       
      The latest leaf of that now 16 years old palm:

       
    • Pal Meir
      By Pal Meir
      This is the story of the weakest of ten Lytocaryum weddellianum seedlings.
      In 2013 all other seeds germinated between April 01 and 26, only one small seed germinated much later on May 8 after 49 days (cf. pic #1).  And this seedling N°1308 would not grow like its siblings and stayed small though it was the only single seedling which was planted since the beginning in a large Ø12xH12 cm clay pot (cf. pic #2).  (The other five singles N°1301 to N°1305 had only tiny Ø8xH9cm clay pots.) So I checked the roots and was very worried (pic #3).  The soil mix could not be the the reason because the other Lyto weddells were planted in the same mix.  So I guessed it might be that the draining hole of the pot was closed by something too tight. I placed another piece of a clay pot over the hole and repotted the palm with the same soil into the same pot.  And it became looking happier (pic #4)  and is a happy little bonsai palm until now, pushing its 18th leaf (pic #5), with very strong and healthy roots (pic #6). 
      So we can see that even an ideal soil mix may cause problems when the pot is too large or the drainage not optimal.
      #1

      #2

      #3

      #4

      #5

      #6

×