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Concern for Leilani Estates as lava moves eastward underground

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WestCoastGal

Bo, look at the regular walk now as a change of scenery. :lol: You'll have to send photos back and post to this thread when you are able to. BTW was your old property at the end of Kumakahi? When I zoom in to google maps I think I can make out a large piece of land there and wondering if it was the same. Your home and landscaping there was I think my very first photo thread here on PalmTalk that I viewed and of course blown away by it. I hope it remains untouched. 

Good luck Justin. Hope your home didn't sustain any earthquake damage. 

 

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Dypsisdean

Just saw another sobering video on TV. I tried to capture it off the screen.

As Kim and Bo alluded to, it appears to me as if the fissures themselves may become the secondary concern as they merge or expand in and outside of Leilani. Then the danger to property will morph into potential damage from any lava flows that may (or may not) be forthcoming. However, as this video shows, it may already be happening. And these flows could consume much more real estate than fissures have.

IMG_3885.MOV.mov

Edit: Apparently that video may only be playable on a Mac. So here is a screen shot.

 

Screen Shot 2018-05-06 at 11.48.09 AM.png

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WestCoastGal

That's more lava than I've seen anywhere else in the Estates. Fissure 2 from the satellite covered a pretty good area but this would appear many times larger. I wonder which fissure that is but I can see why the home count went up like it did overnight. The viscosity definitely appears changed. Sadly a lot of homes you can see in that general area.

Had hoped Fox News had more of the video report you saw Dypsisdean but not seeing it posted yet. Had hoped for more info. Did find this story with interviews from a few residents. I was surprised that McMillan's cameras were still working because I thought the power has been out maybe since Friday after the big 6.9.

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Dypsisdean
8 minutes ago, WestCoastGal said:

That's more lava than I've seen anywhere else in the Estates. Fissure 2 from the satellite covered a pretty good area but this would appear many times larger. I wonder which fissure that is but I can see why the home count went up like it did overnight. The viscosity definitely appears changed. Sadly a lot of homes you can see in that general area.

Information has gotten spotty and questionable regarding locations, number of fissures, etc. The video/photo I posted above has not been posted anywhere online that I can find. In fact, there are very few new photos and info online today. I do not know where it is.

However, I did hear Ikaika mention in one interview earlier this morning that there were homes being covered in lava "right now." Perhaps the pictured flow is what he was referring to. I am assuming that everyone is busy helping with re-entering upper Leilani will the opportunity exists.

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WestCoastGal

Decided to look for aerial video of Leilani Estates and remembered that Mick Kalber had shot some great footage (Paradise Helicopters). Here's a link to Mick Kalber's Vimeo account. The 180506 HUGE Fissure Eruption looks to be the newest. Great camera work! OMG this is the video with the huge lava flow. Frightening, really frightening.

Here's this specific video but check out his other videos too. 

BTW I like that he gives a lot of description to his videos. Very helpful. You'll need to go to his account page and click on the video to see the description there since the video is embedded here. But quick location for the lava would be fissure above Luana, crossing Leilani and lava poured into homes to the north of it--flowing down towards the Puna Geothermal location then based on his description. Guessing this is where the decent lines come into play.

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Dypsisdean

Wow - that is a very ominous development - hopefully confined to that one fissure.

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Moose

So sad seeing some structures on fire that look to be some unfortunate peoples homes :(

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WestCoastGal

I had trouble visualizing the area so used Apple maps since I could rotate the map image to match the initial screen shot of video above, Marked it up best I could freehand looking at the video image and darkened lava flow. The fissure would be to the far right of the markup.

5aef8c14bb17e_LeilaniEstatesFissureLavaE

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WestCoastGal

Here's the maps rotated back with North at the top of the image. The house with the pool is marked with a purple pin. The flow is traveling right towards it. :crying: For some reason I thought this bad flow was one of the later fissures located closer to the southern border of the Estates. Kudos to all the guys on the helicopter doing this dangerous work. When we flew near Pu'u O'o years ago I still remember how intense the heat was and at that time they had stopped helicopters from flying over it after that accident so we were still a bit off to the side.

5aef91b3502e8_LeilaniMapviewNorthatTop-1

 

5aef91ceea025_LeilaniMapviewNorthatTop2-

 

 

 

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Dypsisdean

Debbie - I could be completely wrong on this. But I think the big flow is connected to fissure #7 - but it happens to be right next to fissure #2. Those numbers may become irrelevent, as I heard that two previous fissures may have merged/combined (or convected, as I thought I heard one person describe it). Maybe that was these two. And really, it seems as if all these could really be viewed as the same fissure.

But again, I am just repeating things I have heard from the explosion of amateur volcanologists this event has spawned.  And I am still sitting on some conflicting information that I can't seem to get straight. Apparently Sundays are a "lazy" day over here regardless of what is going on.

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Dypsisdean

Things are apparently still deteriorating. Reported a few minutes ago - number of homes destroyed climbs to 21 - but this conflicts with a CNN report about the same time.

http://www.staradvertiser.com/2018/05/06/breaking-news/lava-continues-to-destroy-homes-upend-lives-in-lower-puna/

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palmfriend

Jesus Christ!!!

We are just turning back to normal here after the so called "Golden Week" (couple of National Holidays in a row,

means everyone who can effort it is traveling or doing day long outdoor activities, medias showing mostly entertainment)

and after spending almost every minute with our kids and friends outside - meaning never having the time to follow

anything that happened "out there" seriously - and then this tragedy on Hawaii and especially in an area where

some members of our palmtalk community live!

Please stay safe and out of danger - the footage is scaring - rebuilding your gardens can be done later!

I am wishing you all the best and praying for you -

best regards from Okinawa

Lars

 

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peachy
On 04/05/2018, 14:14:11, Kim said:

Bo was down on Kaupili St. taking photos of the rocks flying in the air from the breakout on Mohala St! That didn't last long. The police arrived as he was departing. We were Skyping (he was then home) and the evacuation sirens came on. He will evacuate and pick up his ex-wife Karolyn who is not able to drive. What a night! ...and it is just beginning...

Justin, where are you?

 

So glad that Bo was able to get out and also fetch Karolyn, I have been in a state since Leilani Estate was mentioned by name on our local news

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WestCoastGal

On a personal note, just read about Amber Makuakane, single mom of two and elementary teacher, who was one of the first 5 home owners to lose their home. Fox News reported her house was across from a fissure on Friday and she noticed steam rising from all parts of her yard. Went on to say she received alerts Saturday from her motion sensors throughout the house that they had been triggered. Hmm I now wonder if instead of croqui frogs it could of been people's home alarm/fire alert systems there going off in Ikaika's video last night. The Honolulu Star Advertiser has an article on Amber as well and news about a fundraiser set up for her. She had insurance on her house that only covered it if fire took it first. Her parents also live in Leilani Estates.

The USGS updated their alert (5/6 12:53pm HST). It indicates the lava flow has advanced northward just over 1/2 mile (Dypsisdean this sounds like it's #8 that was near 2 & 7). The summit volcano's lava lake level is still continuing to drop. It has dropped 115 ft in the past 24 hours. No active lava in Pu'u O'o. In this article from KOAT7 that mentioned residents (including Amber) and the prospect of the these fissures, USGS volcanologist Wendy Stovall said that "The openings could eventually consolidate into one powerful vent, as has happened in some previous Hawaii eruptions". 

BigIslandNow.com reported 50 minutes ago that the home count has reached 26. I really hope Civil Defense is able to get more home owners in so they can at least retrieve as much of their property as they can. 

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Pando

I matched a Google Earth view to the latest helicopter video. Bo's old property is at lower right side of the Google Earth image. While the rift seems to just miss it, it is downslope from it, which is very concerning if lava starts pouring out. My thoughts are with all of you who are facing this catastrophe.

 

Heli Video 1.jpg

GE Map 1.jpg

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Dypsisdean

From the best I can gather - some from this new FaceBook page called Lava News https://www.facebook.com/lavanews/

Most of the devastation and loss of homes today was from the large Luana St. fissure lava flow - as the other fissures more or less "went to sleep." As of a few hours ago, the Luana St. fissure also stopped pumping lava, but that there was still hissing and forceful gas jetting out. So we can only watch, but things have apparently taken a turn for the better.

https://www.facebook.com/lavanews/videos/200146467442325/

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Dypsisdean

No sooner had I finished my last post above that the 9 pm local news is leading with another urgent evacuation notice due to an 11th fissure opening up. Some people had been allowed back in, but this emergency message went out stating to "Go Now"

https://twitter.com/MilekaLincoln/status/993368474893217794

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sandgroper

This has been on our local news here in Western Australia every hour, I’ve been listening to the radio all day at work. Terrible for everyone living in the area, let’s hope no lives are lost, bricks and mortar can be rebuilt and gardens regrown but a life lost is gone for good.

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Missi

This is freaking breaking my heart to see but please continue to keep us posted. I'm so glad our members are out of harm's way. I hope all people and animals have fled from the area.

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Matthew92

Here's a very good video of the fissure area from yesterday and last night that really shows the area and where the lava has gone. My family visited the Big Island in 2007 and I loved it- we toured all around the volcanoes national park. This was before Halemaumau crater had anything going on in it and the active lava flows were inaccessible except by helicopter. Sure lot of change since then- I'm sorry to see this happen to people's homes.

 

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WestCoastGal

Have to say it's hard to want to post updates. I read this NYTimes article this morning: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/07/us/hawaii-volcano-kilauea.html  First one I had read about residents who were able to get into the subdivision on Sunday. I can't image the surreal look from ground level trying to find your home. Good luck Justin. Hope you are able to get in and retrieve as much while you are there as you can. Bo and Kim will you try to go back at this point since they are trying to get people in?

I did check USGS's site for updates. As mentioned before Pu'u O'o is still empty but the Summit is still draining, 6.5 ft per hour during the day feeding the lava headed towards Leilani. Since April 30 Pu'u O'o collapse, a drop of 722 feet. The photo of it is kind of jaw dropping. The wide angle camera captures the entire north portion of the overlook.

US Geological Survey photo: 5af05e38bee7e_Summitlavalake220mbelowrim

Here's a link to the updated thermal map USGS has overlaid on Digital Globe's map of the Leilani Estates (yesterday afternoon). The 'a'a flow (whitish areas) can easily be seen spreading northward from Fissure 8. This is the same area as shown on the helicopter video of the lava flow/burning houses around Luana and Leilani posted earlier in this thread. Haven't heard of any of the other fissures producing an 'a'a flow but the concern I've seen expressed would be the lava would also travel northward following decent lines. The Honolulu Star-Advertiser reported that new ground cracks near fissures 8 & 9 have appeared emitting steam and gases but no sputtering observed at that point.

KHON is reporting that 31 structures, 26 of them homes have been claimed now.

This time lapse video shows an 'a'a flow devouring a car parked alongside one of the roads. 

https://www.facebook.com/wxchasing/videos/638667819798185/

 

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bgl

Debbie, thanks for the updates! :) And yes, my old five acre garden is at the extreme southern end of Kumakahi Street. East of that dead-end part of Kumakahi Street immediately south of Malama Street. However, I am still in San Diego but when I fly back to Hilo and the Big Island I do hope to have access to my house of course, but I have zero intention of retrieving much of anything. What's in the house, stays in the house, except for some very minor items (like a check book, and some other items that I can easily carry). I expect to live a very mobile life beginning right about NOW. If I can carry it and have it as carry-on on a plane I'll take it. Anything above and beyond that - IT STAYS! B)

EDIT - and will definitely try to get some photos when I return. :)

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WestCoastGal
7 hours ago, Dypsisdean said:

From the best I can gather - some from this new FaceBook page called Lava News https://www.facebook.com/lavanews/

Most of the devastation and loss of homes today was from the large Luana St. fissure lava flow - as the other fissures more or less "went to sleep." As of a few hours ago, the Luana St. fissure also stopped pumping lava, but that there was still hissing and forceful gas jetting out. So we can only watch, but things have apparently taken a turn for the better.

https://www.facebook.com/lavanews/videos/200146467442325/

The :21 video at the top of their page is very interesting from the standpoint I've never seen blue flame shown in any of the burning videos. 

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WestCoastGal

KNON aired this report Sunday including the pop up field donation center in the area outside of Leilani (1:30). Interview with residents who were returning to Leilani or had just exited out. Lots of Aloha.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iSXaQ6btvI

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Mandrew968

The last video Dean posted is surreal. What I picture Hawaiian gardens as is a tropical heaven-mostly from the pics on palmtalk... That video shows what looks like literal hell opening to eat what I know was heaven to a lot of you-I am sorry for that personal loss...

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WestCoastGal

Seen lots of close ups of lava by now. The aerial videos I hope still keep coming as they give a more comprehensive view of what's happening--again thanks to those guys in the air. If anyone sees any video taken by someone driving into the development and around the streets to their home, please post. It would offer a different perspective.

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Kim

Heard from a neighbor who was able to go into the area yesterday that my house appears to be fine -- no shattered windows, which had been my concern following the earthquake.

I may have said this before, but there is nothing in my house that I would try to pack out. All the furnishings are from Walmart or IKEA and much of the art is my own photography printed on canvas. I don't keep important documents there. It's a comfortable place to sleep and eat when not gardening. :lol:  I have insurance that specifically excludes lava.:wacko: Fat lot of good that will do me if the worst case happens...

Should the house be lost, it is a sentimental and financial loss, but nothing like the devastating losses people are suffering losing their primary homes where they have lived most of their lives, and all their worldly belongings. I have no trouble keeping that in perspective.

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WestCoastGal

Not sure where this was filmed within the development but some of this 'a'a lava is moving rather fast. This video from Levi McKay was on Mileka Lincoln's twitter page. I am surprised to see a number of cars left behind in videos. 

 

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WestCoastGal

During a community meeting held last week (video was linked to on the forum) questions about the pentane stored at the Puna Geothermal plant was asked. The resident who asked it didn't seem too assured by the answers given. If you missed the info on it here's an updated news story from Hawaii News Now on the plant and the pentane still stored there. Not sure if it provides any more info than the meeting other than an explosion would be strong enough to break some windows in the area but unlikely to cause any fires as a result. I'm wondering it's more dangerous to try moving the tanks than hoping they have been stored high enough (no indication where) to avoid them being affected. With lava now moving northward towards the power plant, it's something to be more concerned about.

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Cindy Adair

These videos are mesmerizingly horrific. 

I did have an insurance question related to the reference to the homeowner who had only fire coverage.

Is volcano damage insurance an affordable option in lava zone 1 areas?

In PR I am told most do not have hurricane insurance (and I can see why given the extremely slow response from my private insurance company) who expects injured parties to make all the repairs and then send the receipts and then and only then will customers know what they will reimburse if anything.

I do hope Hawaiian insurance companies are more helpful! I digress.

Please know that the world is following the events on the Big Island and take no chances with your safety.

 

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WestCoastGal

Cindy this CNN article should answer your question. Had just read it a few minutes before you posted :D. I assume people still take out insurance for fire protection from things like a kitchen accident and such.

Anyone seen any info at all on Fissure 11 that broke out last night (and I believe the reason the area south of Leilani was evacuated so quickly of residents who had returned for belongings)? I heard the warning was due to the danger from toxic fumes that would be spewed out but also read somewhere* (thought it came from the Hawaii Volcano Observatory report) that they saw flames as high as 300+ feet but don't think they said where.

*just found on the USGS site under Videos a description of the fountains at the Launa fissure (between Leilani and Malama) had reached around 330 feet.  

Interestingly in this Washington Post story, realtor Jordan Sonner makes the following statement "The way I kind of look at it is, the land doesn't really belong to us. It belongs to Pele. We get to live on it while we can, and if she wants it back, she'll take it. I have good insurance." Maybe she knows something differently?

The WP story also has this quote from USGS volcanologist Wendy Stovall that goes to explain what is occurring:  "As the eruption progresses, there will become a preferred pathway for the magma to go through. Some of the outer vents along the fissure line will start to close up and congeal because the lava is going to essentially harden." And then this was stated "Once that happens, lava fountains from the remaining open vents can shoot even higher – reaching up to 1,000 feet, Stoval said". I can't even imagine something like that and certainly hope we don't see that here.

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Kim

About insurance -- my first home insurance had lava included as a hazard. The next year it was excluded. The year after that the cost went up about 40% and I changed companies. In 2014 we had the lava flow event in Pahoa, and the state of Hawaii, which had been the "backup" insurer for lava, put a moratorium on state-issued insurance. (Edit: in late 2015 the moratorium was lifted, but no lava insurance was offered.) As far as I can tell, there is no lava insurance available, and hurricane insurance is expensive. And if a hurricane is downgraded to a tropical storm as it hits the island (as has been the case for the Big Island), you are out of luck for any damage claims. Apparently if the house catches fire before the lava touches it, which happens all the time, fire insurance may come into play.

State of Hawaii Home Insurance Q&A

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Cindy Adair

Thanks to you both for answering my insurance questions. Does anyone ever read every word of any fine print until the worst happens? I am sad that those most in need with their houses engulfed by lava, might get no financial help, even if they bought the best available insurance.

I guess this is part of taking the bad with the good wherever we live or "growing where we are planted" as the gardener's saying goes.

I hope some of those on this forum who are in harm's way (or harmed by whatever life has thrown your way this year) will be able to forget for awhile and just play in Colombia at the Biennial!

 

 

 

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MattyB

Here's a pretty much up to date graphic.

IMG_4756.JPG

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WestCoastGal

The Honolulu Star-Advertiser just published that Hawaii County Civil Defense indicates that right now no lava is flowing although fumes are still spewing. They also updated the info on the pentane tanks at Puna Geothermal "Meanwhile, Puna Geothermal Venture has 60,000 gallons of flammable pentane gas they need to move but cannot until the necessary containers have been delivered. Once they receive the containers, moving the gas will take several days, a spokeman said. The company had previously moved the gas to higher ground."

A section of roadway on 130 between 132 and Kalapana has been closed for inspection due to an eighth mile long crack described now as 3-4 inches wide. No other activity at this time. This road has been closed and reopened a few times for inspection.

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Justin

Finally got to the house, here’s an update:

• Inside, the only visible damage is some cracked porcelain tiles in two distinct places, more or less in the doorways through the main load-bearing wall. I can only assume that wall moved in the quake (a 6.9 just 10 miles from here), and the tiles had no choice but to break.
• Nothing fell off the walls or shelves, despite there being a TV and a surfboard (and 100 empty rum bottles) that weren’t secured that great
• The water line and gas line both work, and water tasted fine
• Electricity, internet, and cable all work.
• Outside, there are no new cracks in the driveway or on the street. There may be a couple new small cracks around the water tank, but they aren't very big, and the water tank is full.
• The garden looks more or less fine, except that weeds are everywhere since it’s rained an inordinate amount in 2018. Also, one dead tree fell over, but miraculously it doesn’t seem to have hit anything on its way down. It grazed a palm tree and is laying on the ground right next to it.
• I checked the pre-existing giant crack we have in the yard, and it doesn’t appear any different, and it doesn’t smell and no steam or gas appears to be coming out.
• There isn’t any noticeable smell in the air generally, and breathing outside seemed normal. [Then again, I was just walking around, not trying to do any manual labor.]
• All in all, everything is “normal” at the house and yard, despite us being only 5-10 streets away from several active fissures. We’re uphill, and west to northwest of all the flows, and the prevailing winds are mostly west-southwest, so I think we’re getting only a small fraction of the crud in the air.
• In sum, if everything stays how it currently is, I’m cautiously optimistic. The big wildcard will be access – if the highway gets blocked in or around the entrance to the subdivision, then the house may be fine, but it won’t matter because we can’t get in. Compared to many other people in the neighborhood, however, this is a trivial concern.

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redant

I guess the particularly disturbing thing for residents is you lose the use of your land as well as your home. A real double whammy.  Truly sorry for you all, the hidden cost of living in paradise I guess. Good luck everyone. 

 

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