North Central FL Coconuts

[Matthew92]

On 5/16/2018, 11:30:07, Jason-Palm king said:

I was at volcano bay 2 weeks ago and asked a person in maintenance there about the coconuts and the foxtails and they said when it got down to the 30’s a few times in January they put heaters under them at night and covered them in frost blankets ..,,,those trees will never die there as they have the money to maintain them 

Yep, I just heard the same thing from a Universal/Volcano Bay landscape manager in one of my horticulture classes at Valencia College. He said they had a heater under each coconut on the freezing nights, and someone at each one all night to be a "fire watch."

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Keeth,

That Green petiole Hawaiian Tall has green rings at the top of the trunk!  I am not familiar with that characteristic in Coconut Palms, and it looks like your Maypan has them too at the top of the woody part of the trunk!

John

[Zeeth]

4 hours ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Keeth,

That Green petiole Hawaiian Tall has green rings at the top of the trunk!  I am not familiar with that characteristic in Coconut Palms, and it looks like your Maypan has them too at the top of the woody part of the trunk!

John

That's just because they lost a lot of leaves very quickly. They'll be brown by this time next year. 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Keeth,

What caused them to lose their leaves so fast?

John

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Keeth, 

Also, do you have any theories on why some Coconut Palms, especially ones grown in semi arid climates (like mine here) and arid climates, like the ones grown in Southern California retain a lot more of their old leaf bases at the top of their trunks, than ones grown in Florida and elsewhere do?  I think it is the palms' means of retaining more moisture in the trunk in the drier climates, but that's just my 2 cents worth.  What do you think?

John

[Zeeth]

They lost their leaves fast due to the winter. All of my palms basically lost their entire crown after this past winter when we hit 27˚, so all the leaves you see are new growth. The Hawaiian tall just had so many leaves before that it "gained" about 8 feet of trunk from this.

I've definitely also noticed the coconuts retaining leaf bases in arid climates. I'm pretty sure it's just because the connection to the trunk can't rot off from the heat and humidity like it does here. My coconuts that get watered directly at the roots without any overspray from the sprinklers tend to hold the leaf bases longer than the ones that get the sprinkler spray. Look at the picture of my orange petiole Hawaiian tall as an example. 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Thanks for the explanation, Keith.

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Keith,

I just looked again at your Golden Hawaiian Tall, and yes, there are a lot of old leaf bases clinging to the trunk all the way to the ground.  By the way, I thought you had a Fiji Dwarf too, but no photo of it?

John

P.S.  My Green Malayan Dwarf has really recovered from the 6 freezes (3 in the upper 20'sF) that we had this past winter with only minor protection, and is now growing like a weed, putting out the biggest, fullest leaves since I planted it.  It is now about 14ft. tall in overall height with about 2ft. of woody trunk.  I am hoping we will have a mild winter this year, or at least a normal winter.  Normally my place wouldn't get down below 32F or 33F on the coldest morning of the winter.

[Zeeth]

Look at the picture with the green Hawaiian tall and you'll see the Fiji Dwarf to the right. It's just too close to everything else to get a good picture of it straight-on.

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Keith, 

Isn't it further out in the yard than the others, away from any real protection afforded by the wall of your house?  If so, how has it fared in the upper 20'sF freezes you have had?  I have one that was sent to me from the Pine Island area of Florida, and it is now about 4ft. tall.  I want to put it in the ground here when it is about 8ft. tall.

John

[Cocoa Beach Jason]

I was in Jacksonville Beach visiting some family last weekend and saw a coconut growing in a backyard.  Just off 11th Ave. I did a double then triple take. I am 100% sure it was. It was growing so that I could see about 8 feet of leaf over the back of the house. I didnt see the trunk but I suspect it was not yet trunking. I would have stopped to take a picture to prove it but I was following someone. I can’t imagine  that tree living much longer up there as it gets cold in Jax. 

[Zeeth]

6 hours ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Keith, 

Isn't it further out in the yard than the others, away from any real protection afforded by the wall of your house?  If so, how has it fared in the upper 20'sF freezes you have had?  I have one that was sent to me from the Pine Island area of Florida, and it is now about 4ft. tall.  I want to put it in the ground here when it is about 8ft. tall.

John

It's out in the yard, but it still benefits from the canopy of the other coconut palms, so it's hard to make a judgement yet. It did okay during the freezes. Here's what it looked like right after

[GottmitAlex]

3 minutes ago, Zeeth said:

It's out in the yard, but it still benefits from the canopy of the other coconut palms, so it's hard to make a judgement yet. It did okay during the freezes. Here's what it looked like right after

What low temps did it partake in?

 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Keith,

It sure looks really good considering the temps it experienced and it's relatively young age.  How old is it?

John

[Zeeth]

8 hours ago, GottmitAlex said:

What low temps did it partake in?

27˚ F

7 hours ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Keith,

It sure looks really good considering the temps it experienced and it's relatively young age.  How old is it?

John

I think I sprouted it back in 2013. It's quite a bit slower than my tall type coconuts.

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Okay, Keith, how long has it been in the ground?  My Fiji Dwarf is in a 10 gal. pot and is really slow too, for a Coconut Palm.  I think slow growth is a characteristic of them, along with the really BIG leaves for such a small palm, and of course the BIG swollen base of the trunk.

John

[GottmitAlex]

16 minutes ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Okay, Keith, how long has it been in the ground?  My Fiji Dwarf is in a 10 gal. pot and is really slow too, for a Coconut Palm.  I think slow growth is a characteristic of them, along with the really BIG leaves for such a small palm, and of course the BIG swollen base of the trunk.

John

Not to sidetrack the issue at hand, I say this is the precise reason I suggest to the Brits and other indoor growers to use the Fiji dwarf. It's a true dwarf. They may get to 20m... but in 50 years....

But im.pretty sure that indoors they can produce fruit without their tallest fronds hitting the second story ceiling.  (Open Living room area, etc)

Usually they buy talls (and/or semi-dwarfs)... last 2, 3  years and they replace them. However, they grow them beautifully. Limited head space (10-20ft) is the real problem for these coconuts. But not for the Fiji dwarf.

 

Edited October 28, 2018 by GottmitAlex

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Alex, 

I have never heard of a Coconut Palm fruiting indoors!  That would be interesting to see.

John

[Zeeth]

18 minutes ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Okay, Keith, how long has it been in the ground?  My Fiji Dwarf is in a 10 gal. pot and is really slow too, for a Coconut Palm.  I think slow growth is a characteristic of them, along with the really BIG leaves for such a small palm, and of course the BIG swollen base of the trunk.

John

I planted it in spring of 2016. Here's a pic of it right when I planted it:

Here's a picture of it today (sorry for the blurry photo):

 

Here are pictures of the parent palm to my tree:

Here's pictures from a grove of Fiji Dwarf coconuts in Miami:

[Zeeth]

I would definitely not say that the Fiji Dwarf has long leaves. In fact, I would say that the leaves are quite short, but robust. They have leaflets that overlap, so they produce a lot of shade, but they're much shorter than the long and gracile leaves of the Tahiti red dwarf or the Red Spicata dwarf. The trunk also stays much shorter than the other two mentioned dwarves. I'd say that both the Fiji Dwarf and the Tahiti red dwarf would do well as a conservatory plant under the right circumstances though. 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Thanks, Keith.  Beautiful palm, even now after the bad winter!  It looks like your family added a small fence since you planted it?  So, it has been in the ground for 2.5 years!  Where is the parent palm located at?

John

[Zeeth]

1 hour ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Thanks, Keith.  Beautiful palm, even now after the bad winter!  It looks like your family added a small fence since you planted it?  So, it has been in the ground for 2.5 years!  Where is the parent palm located at?

John

The parent palm belongs to William Chang in Hana, Hawaii. The Hawaiian variety of Fiji dwarf is slightly different from the variety that we have in Florida, so my plan is to eventually donate a sprout from my tree to Kopsick garden in St. Pete, where I've also donated some sprouted from the tree that I posted a photo of in Miami. 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Oh, okay.  Thanks for the info.  I am curious, how do the Hawaiian variety of Fiji Dwarfs differ from the ones growing in South Florida?

John

[Zeeth]

20 hours ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Oh, okay.  Thanks for the info.  I am curious, how do the Hawaiian variety of Fiji Dwarfs differ from the ones growing in South Florida?

John

The Hawaiian version (locally referred to as the Samoan dwarf) is a little less variable, and produces fewer "off-type" offspring. It also has a little neater crown with more leaves in the crown. The coconuts are also much larger, with average coconuts containing 1-2 liters of liquid, compared to 1/2-1 liter for the Florida variant. I think that the Hawaiian variety is superior to the Florida variety personally, but I'd like to see them growing side-by-side to get the ideal comparison. 

[pj_orlando_z9b]

Heading into December, how is everyone's coconut doing. 10 months after the freeze, the crown has mostly recovered. Great growth this summer with a good trunk emerging. Very pleased and hoping for a tame winter. 

[Matthew92]

On 10/21/2018, 2:47:02, pj_orlando_z9b said:

Yes, plz do

Here it is today. When I first saw it in July, it still was about half brown. The 3 newest fronds came out in the last 4-5 months. I find it sort of ironic to see a coconut

succeeding there -considering that neighborhood was built on an old orange grove that froze in the early 80's.

[kinzyjr]

Mine are moving slowly:

 

[pj_orlando_z9b]

1 hour ago, Opal92 said:

Here it is today. When I first saw it in July, it still was about half brown. The 3 newest fronds came out in the last 4-5 months. I find it sort of ironic to see a coconut

succeeding there -considering that neighborhood was built on an old orange grove that froze in the early 80's.

Nice! I cleaned up several dead boots today as they were barely hanging on. Over 2 feet of clear trunk now. Solid recovery after a miserable Jan 2018.

[pj_orlando_z9b]

This is the Orlando I-Drive coconut in early December. Some of the coconuts are maturing. 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Matt, 

Is that the Coconut Palm in Jacksonville you were referring to?  Where is it in Jacksonville, close to the water, or in a perfect microclimate?

John

[GottmitAlex]

On 12/14/2018, 6:27:18, pj_orlando_z9b said:

Nice! I cleaned up several dead boots today as they were barely hanging on. Over 2 feet of clear trunk now. Solid recovery after a miserable Jan 2018.

Wonderful! It's looking excellent! Question, how did you clean the dead boots? Just yanked them out? Or is there a technique?

Thank you in advance

[Jimbean]

On 4/23/2017, 9:05:06, ck_in_fla said:

Not far from this location, I saw some large Roystonea that were installed in the parking lot at what I think is an RV dealership.  This dealership is visible from the northbound lanes of Interstate 4 just before you cross Lake Monroe and cross from Seminole into Volusia County.

Does anyone know if those are still there?  I'm guessing they are as the sight is almost right on the southern edge of Lake Monroe.

yes they are

[Jason-Palm king]

34 minutes ago, Jimbean said:

yes they are

 

34 minutes ago, Jimbean said:

yes they are

I live 5 min from these royals . They are there and doing great ! They had some damage last January from the few freezes we had but they all recovered by May . 

[Jimbean]

I think they will be a good field test for hardiness.

[Jason-Palm king]

7 hours ago, Jimbean said:

I think they will be a good field test for hardiness.

There Royals have been here a few years already with ZERO protection ....

[pj_orlando_z9b]

On 12/18/2018, 10:12:17, GottmitAlex said:

Wonderful! It's looking excellent! Question, how did you clean the dead boots? Just yanked them out? Or is there a technique?

Thank you in advance

Thanks. The boots were essentially falling off. These were the affected ones from the Jan 2018 freeze so not sure if that contributed to it. Personally I like a coconut tree with some boots and the rough look. Pics are before and after. 

Edited December 21, 2018 by pj_orlando_z9b

[GottmitAlex]

5 hours ago, pj_orlando_z9b said:

Thanks. The boots were essentially falling off. These were the affected ones from the Jan 2018 freeze so not sure if that contributed to it. Personally I like a coconut tree with some boots and the rough look. Pics are before and after. 

Danke! "Falling off" Love it! One does not see that with washies or queens around here. It's always human intervention which cleans their trunks. I love the cocos.

[Bill H2DB]

  So , this morning I cruised by the old Cocos on Dahlia in Port orange . Last time that I saw it , was after the mild freeze in

the Winter of 2017 / 2018 , and as noted , it was hanging on but needing help.

  So , there's  been a Summer , and the quite mild Winter of 2018 / 2019 since .   It is coming along.......

The person renting the house has moved , but today , the owner himself was there doing some refurb. .

  I told him of my previous visit , and he said that the previous renter had mentioned it .

   Anyway , he says that he will get some fertilizer and water on the old girl .   Attitude seemed good .

[pj_orlando_z9b]

Awesome.  He should definitely get some fertilizer.  Might be some boron deficiency as the fronds don't seem to be opening fully. But overall, nice rebound.