Dypsis decipiens - tips from the pros?

[Jdiaz31089]

Hello, this is my first time posting here. I have spent quite a few years in the shadows just lurking around though, gawking at all of your palms and drawing from your experiences with them. I am growing palms at my home in Fresno. Most of what I have would be considered pretty common by Southern California standards, but probably rare by palm standards north of Los Angeles (Syagrus romanzoffiana, Archontophoenix sp., Beccariophenix alfredii, Phoenix reclinata and Phoenix rupicola among others.) 

 

My most recent addition has been a pair of Dypsis decipiens (1 gallon specimens, though they seem a bit overgrown for that size container), of which I've killed more than one in the past. This is my first time planting these at my home in Fresno though, which has really fast-draining, sandy soil - Fresno sits atop a massive alluvial fan of the San Joaquin River so the soil here is deep, rich with minerals from centuries of runoff from the Sierra Nevada and very sandy. In the past, the decipiens I've killed have all died during the early spring when we get the majority of our rain. I've read from many places that a primary concern when growing decipiens is to keep cold water from pooling at the heel of the palm as that could cause rot to set in and kill the palm. I'm very optimistic with these though, being that they are in fast-draining soil. Are there any other things I should be looking out for to make sure I give these the best chance at survival? I'm already watering heavily and fertilizing lightly with a generic fertilizer formulated for palms. Both of them seem to be actively growing despite having been recently planted.

 

Thanks in advance for any tips!

[Tracy]

24 minutes ago, Jdiaz31089 said:

In the past, the decipiens I've killed have all died during the early spring when we get the majority of our rain. I've read from many places that a primary concern when growing decipiens is to keep cold water from pooling at the heel of the palm as that could cause rot to set in and kill the palm.

If this appears to be the problem in the past, then one additional thought is to plant it in a high spot, or create an artificial mound, to assist with good drainage, even though your soil is sandy.  You get plenty of heat which the D decipiens will appreciate during summer, but how low do you get in winter, and is it sustained or primarily just during the early hours after a long cold winter night?

[Chris Chance]

One of the most Important things I've found with planting decipiens is planting on a mound. They tend to pull themselves down so a high mound planting will improve your chances for success. Personally I've killed way too many and I'm sad to say i just lost another last week. 

 

Welcome aboard by the way!

[Ben in Norcal]

Well-draining soil and LOTS of irrigation in the summer.  I kept mine too dry the first couple of years, and they exploded when I put them on drip.

[Josh-O]

Hi Josue (Joshua) which is my name

welcome to palmtalk! Glad to have you here on the best palm forum in on the web.

Dypsis decipiens can be a tough little Bas#&%* sometimes IMO. If you have sandy alluvial fan soil I would also encourage you to mound plant this at lest 1-2' above the soil line.

I have 2 growing at very fast rates at my "Vista garden" They are planted on a hillside so there was no need to mound plant them. The water drains away very quickly. If you are on flat ground(which I suspect) I would encourage you to mound plant them. This helps keep any water pooling at the base causing fungus to occur. In habitat they grow in rocky soil that is fast draining and they receive little rain. Si9nce they grow in rocky soil my guess is they don't pull them selves down as deep as if they were growing in soft sandy soil. Growing them in cultivation can sometimes mean we over water them. If your soil is fast draining than it will be hard to over water but if your soil holds lots of moisture for extended periods of time that can do them in pretty quickly. Especially in the wintertime when the weather is cool and damp and the soil does not dry out quickly.

 

how cold do you get in the winter time and for what duration? This could also be a big factor with the poor success you have experienced.

 

Like Ben, I water mine a lot and they really respond in terms of growth rate. But I have very fast draining soil.

post pictures when you plant them out.

cheers and happy growing Josue!

cheers,

Josh-O

 

[Jdiaz31089]

Thank you all for the replies! and let me apologize for taking so long to get back on this thread.  

 

Our winters ate usually pretty mild. We do dip into the mid and low 30s, and then "warm up" to around 60. If we get a wet winter, we almost undoubtedly spend several weeks shrouded in thick tule fog so even between rainstorms all of the plants are dripping with moisture in the morning. 

 

these are the two decipiens! It's hard to tell but the bed is raised about 6 inches from the sidewalk level.  

[Tracy]

On 9/7/2016, 6:49:45, Jdiaz31089 said:

 

Our winters ate usually pretty mild. We do dip into the mid and low 30s, and then "warm up" to around 60. If we get a wet winter, we almost undoubtedly spend several weeks shrouded in thick tule fog so even between rainstorms all of the plants are dripping with moisture in the morning. 

Your periods of tule fog can be rough, since it never really warms up during those periods, just a consistent cool.  Looks like you did some mounding, but if you lose one of these, you can mound even higher if you have to try again. Others in the string have mentioned going as high as 1' to 2' mound to maximize drainage during your "tule fog" periods.  None of us thought to mention it before, but you also want at least 1/3 of that "tillering heel" planted above the grade, maybe even more, since it will pull down over time.  One of the learning experiences everyone on this forum can share, is that we all have killed some palms (just some more than others if I must confess).  Good luck with these two!

[Jdiaz31089]

Hmm, perhaps I'll raise the bed higher and mound them even more this weekend. They were planted no more than a week ago so they'll be easy to take out while I mound the soil. What type of soil amendments would you recommend? "Regular potting soil" seems like too obvious of an option right? 

[Jdiaz31089]

I raised them up to about a foot above the sidewalk this last weekend. I mounded with commercial "garden soil" and mixed in two bags of perlite and native sandy soil to help with drainage, then covered with a layer of mulch. I've been hand watering them pretty much daily and gave them a tiny bit of fertilizer. So far they seem to be actively growing. When I pulled them up i noticed the roots had already begun growing and they had only been in the ground for about a week and a half! Maybe our 90 to 100 degree heat hit the "grow button" on these because i picked them up from a nursery in Berkeley near the SF bay where they probably rarely saw temperatures above 80 degrees. 

[Palm Tree Jim]

Lots of great advice above.....not much I can add. Glad to see you mounded them, as that should help. 

As we roll into the cooler months, I would be careful with the amount of water you provide. As for mother nature (rain), your soil mixture and mounding should help!

[DoomsDave]

Weclome aboard, and if you want, check out the offers for free seeds in the Freebies section, which include Brahea monsters . . .

[Jdiaz31089]

I've been keeping an eye on these and they are growing quicker, or at least seem to be growing quicker, than other decipiens I've had. My experience with these is that they sulk and eventually decline. so far, each of the two have finished pushing out a new spear and the larger one has opened a new frond. 

 

New center spear starting to split on the smaller one.  

And a newly opened frond on the larger one. 

[Mohsen]

I am thinking to grow one here and get it from Ben @Kennybenjamin,,,

anyone knows could they thrive in our climate ?

http://weather.mla.com.au/climate-history/nsw/thornleigh

[Ben in Norcal]

3 hours ago, Mohsen said:

I am thinking to grow one here and get it from Ben @Kennybenjamin,,,

anyone knows could they thrive in our climate ?

http://weather.mla.com.au/climate-history/nsw/thornleigh

They do great here, and I think you are a bit warmer than us, so should do well.

[Danilopez89]

9 hours ago, Jdiaz31089 said:

I've been keeping an eye on these and they are growing quicker, or at least seem to be growing quicker, than other decipiens I've had. My experience with these is that they sulk and eventually decline. so far, each of the two have finished pushing out a new spear and the larger one has opened a new frond. 

 

New center spear starting to split on the smaller one.  

And a newly opened frond on the larger one. 

Looks like they are liking their new home. 

Good luck! Hopefully one day you'll have a bitchin d.d., like Jeff in Modesto has.

[Tyrone]

12 hours ago, Mohsen said:

I am thinking to grow one here and get it from Ben @Kennybenjamin,,,

anyone knows could they thrive in our climate ?

http://weather.mla.com.au/climate-history/nsw/thornleigh

Yes, Sydney should be fine for this species. Plant in full sun with a bit of a raised mound and you should be fine. I think Sydney BG has one or two if my memory serves me correct.

Also I just had a look at your climate stats, and in winter our temps seem almost identical. In summer the max's are about the same except on a summer night I'm about 2 or 3C cooler at night. You have a summer peak in rainfall (good for decipiens) and I have a winter peak, but in rainfall so far this year you've had about 980mm of rain and I've had 930mm of rain. I'm growing decipiens here on raised mounds on a raised hill as this place gets really boggy in winter. During winter they just slow way down, but spring to life again in October for me. In the wild decipiens grows just inside the tropics between 1600-2000m elevation in Madagascar. In winter it can get cold up at 2000m and reportedly frost isn't unusual. Still even in winter it can get foggy and wet from the air's humidity even though it may not rain much in winter officially. During summer rainfall is driven by the tropical monsoon season with frequent storms and the odd cyclone which collides with the mountains. Some have mistakenly thought this species should grown like a succulent which is wrong. They do need water, but mainly in the warmer weather. Summer max's at altitude don't get much above 30C, and nights are in the mid teens and probably rainy. Perfect for your climate I think.

[Jdiaz31089]

On 9/24/2016, 9:15:13, Danilopez89 said:

Looks like they are liking their new home. 

Good luck! Hopefully one day you'll have a bitchin d.d., like Jeff in Modesto has.

I've seen that decipiens! Freaking amazing tree. It's what got me thinking I should grow one here!

[JEFF IN MODESTO]

On 9/2/2016, 1:58:01, Jdiaz31089 said:

Hello, this is my first time posting here. I have spent quite a few years in the shadows just lurking around though, gawking at all of your palms and drawing from your experiences with them. I am growing palms at my home in Fresno. Most of what I have would be considered pretty common by Southern California standards, but probably rare by palm standards north of Los Angeles (Syagrus romanzoffiana, Archontophoenix sp., Beccariophenix alfredii, Phoenix reclinata and Phoenix rupicola among others.) 

 

My most recent addition has been a pair of Dypsis decipiens (1 gallon specimens, though they seem a bit overgrown for that size container), of which I've killed more than one in the past. This is my first time planting these at my home in Fresno though, which has really fast-draining, sandy soil - Fresno sits atop a massive alluvial fan of the San Joaquin River so the soil here is deep, rich with minerals from centuries of runoff from the Sierra Nevada and very sandy. In the past, the decipiens I've killed have all died during the early spring when we get the majority of our rain. I've read from many places that a primary concern when growing decipiens is to keep cold water from pooling at the heel of the palm as that could cause rot to set in and kill the palm. I'm very optimistic with these though, being that they are in fast-draining soil. Are there any other things I should be looking out for to make sure I give these the best chance at survival? I'm already watering heavily and fertilizing lightly with a generic fertilizer formulated for palms. Both of them seem to be actively growing despite having been recently planted.

 

Thanks in advance for any tips!

Here's my d decipiens in Modesto.

They do fine in Modesto they should do fine in Fresno !

[Alicehunter2000]

Jeff it's been fun watching that palm grow the last 10 years.....wow time flies.

[Mohsen]

On 9/27/2016, 10:22:10, JEFF IN MODESTO said:

Here's my d decipiens in Modesto.

They do fine in Modesto they should do fine in Fresno !

It is very beautify Jeff

How close it is to the building and window? how did it go before passing up the roof? was it touching the windows?

I might want to plant one small one and it is near to the building like yours .

 

[Josh-O]

On 9/26/2016, 5:22:10, JEFF IN MODESTO said:

Here's my d decipiens in Modesto.

They do fine in Modesto they should do fine in Fresno !

it never gets old looking at that palm Jeff

[Jdiaz31089]

On 9/26/2016, 5:22:10, JEFF IN MODESTO said:

Here's my d decipiens in Modesto.

They do fine in Modesto they should do fine in Fresno !

Jeff that is an amazing tree! I'm jealous of it! Big time!

These are my seedlings today. I've been watching them pump out these new leaves for almost two months. They seem fairly decent in terms of speed. 

 

[Jdiaz31089]

Well, I'm happy to report that the mounding paid off. We just came out of a really wet winter and, though i thought I'd lost one, both of the decipiens have active spears. In my past attempts, i would lose them right around this time after the winter rains as the summer heat started up. Yesterday we hit 100 degrees F for the first time and these little guys seem to love it. The spears are moving fast.

 

This is the one which i thought had died - until this spear poked out over the last two or three days

 

[DoomsDave]

BOOOYAH!

 

[Tracy]

10 hours ago, Jdiaz31089 said:

This is the one which i thought had died - until this spear poked out over the last two or three days

Hooray... and this was a tough winter for plants that don't like soggy feet.  I would have to imagine that the more mature they get the more likely they are to continue to survive your winters.

[Jdiaz31089]

It's crazy how when you see your plants every day you don't recognize how much they grow over the course of a year. Here's the larger one in Sept 2016 and October 2017 (today actually).

[Missi]

On 10/20/2017, 10:31:12, Jdiaz31089 said:

It's crazy how when you see your plants every day you don't recognize how much they grow over the course of a year.

Right?! That's why I always take pics! It's like Christmas looking back and seeing how much they've flourished!

[Phoenikakias]

I am really, really happy for you, and besides your example motivates me to try again this devil. If only it could be found more readily in the european market...

[Josue Diaz]

I don't realize how much it grows until I go to upload a new photo! Here it is today. (Its sickly sibling finally gave up the ghost.)

[Tracy]

1 hour ago, Josue Diaz said:

I don't realize how much it grows until I go to upload a new photo!

It is amazing when you go back and look at photos from a year earlier with some of these palms.  Looks like its well established now, and should enjoy much more growth this summer!

[yeye]

Any update of yours Dypsis decipiens Josue ?

 

[Josue Diaz]

On 10/20/2019 at 12:16 PM, yeye said:

Any update of yours Dypsis decipiens Josue ?

 

yes, both are dead. both lost in late summer. Sudden decline both times. 

[Fusca]

1 hour ago, Josue Diaz said:

yes, both are dead. both lost in late summer. Sudden decline both times. 

Wow Josue - sorry to hear this.

[Palm Tree Jim]

Sorry to hear.

Will you try again?

[GottmitAlex]

14 minutes ago, Palm Tree Jim said:

Sorry to hear.

Will you try again?

This.

[Josue Diaz]

2 hours ago, Palm Tree Jim said:

Sorry to hear.

Will you try again?

 

1 hour ago, GottmitAlex said:

This.

yep,  already got in touch with Perry in Grover Beach for a replacement

[GottmitAlex]

11 minutes ago, Josue Diaz said:

 

yep,  already got in touch with Perry in Grover Beach for a replacement

That's the ticket!

[Palm Tree Jim]

27 minutes ago, Josue Diaz said:

 

yep,  already got in touch with Perry in Grover Beach for a replacement

Way to go. Will it be a larger plant?

[Meangreen94z]

Has anyone had success with these in a wet climate? Maybe transplanting a larger size from a container ?

[Josue Diaz]

4 hours ago, Palm Tree Jim said:

Way to go. Will it be a larger plant?

as big as my pockets are deep  really though,  gonna go w the biggest possible