Fire ants in palms and pots

[Missi]

Hey all, especially Hawaii and Florida peeps. I have a problem that has been getting steadily worse year after year. I have colonies of little fire ants/electric ants (which are not the same as the larger red imported fire ants that build mounds in the lawn). Scientific name is Wasmannia auropunctata. Their stings leave itchy welts that radiate with electric like pain and can last for weeks. I know they have been a HUGE problem in Hawaii. These little pests live in the nooks and cracks of trees and on plant leaves, under pots and pavers, they even nest in the middle of the potting soil in potted plants and that's how they are transported. They are uber aggressive and will sting them very moment they're interrupted. They make my life miserable. When I'm trimming trees or brush up against a branch, they'll fall on me and sting away, especially after rains. When I trim back dead palm fronds, I find them nesting at the base of where the palm petioles gather together. I can't seem to get them under control. I spray, powder down Sevin Dust, shake around fire ant granule bait. Anyone have experience with these little "effer" ants, as I call them? They need to GO!

[Dypsisdean]

Check this site

http://www.littlefireants.com/index.html

[Pedro 65]

Sorry to hear you have Fire ants Missi, we have plenty of ants in Oz with a painful  sting, heres 1 i n particular below and even a mtr away they follow your everymove and ready to pounce, their sting is "instant" and lethal to some, Ive learnt to live  with them but cautious when weeding. I  will admit that when I find the nest I pour in the white Blitzem that is like thin sand and they are gone in  days..   Pete

 

Myrmecia nigrocincta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myrmecia_nigrocincta ‎   Cached Similar Myrmecia nigrocincta, commonly known as the jumper ant or jumping jack, is an ant of the genus Myrmecia. The species was first described by Frederick Smith ... ‎Distribution - ‎Taxonomy - ‎Description - ‎Behaviour and ecology

[Missi]

1 hour ago, Dypsisdean said:

Check this site

http://www.littlefireants.com/index.html

Thank you sir! I found this website last night. I will be thoroughly studying it! Have you had experience with them yourself?

[Missi]

18 minutes ago, Pedro 65 said:

Sorry to hear you have Fire ants Missi, we have plenty of ants in Oz with a painful  sting, heres 1 i n particular below and even a mtr away they follow your everymove and ready to pounce, their sting is "instant" and lethal to some, Ive learnt to live  with them but cautious when weeding. I  will admit that when I find the nest I pour in the white Blitzem that is like thin sand and they are gone in  days..   Pete

 

Myrmecia nigrocincta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myrmecia_nigrocincta ‎   Cached Similar Myrmecia nigrocincta, commonly known as the jumper ant or jumping jack, is an ant of the genus Myrmecia. The species was first described by Frederick Smith ... ‎Distribution - ‎Taxonomy - ‎Description - ‎Behaviour and ecology

YIKES!! Those look like little monsters! And they jump?!

[Pedro 65]

They "jump" alright, ive seen them jump over a mtr many times, it must be when the queen is looking after the eggs?  Their sting is Very very intense and gets the old heart pumpn thats for sure .      Pete

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Fire ants are impossible to eradicate. Your only hope is to try to control them. 

[DoomsDave]

5 hours ago, Pedro 65 said:

Sorry to hear you have Fire ants Missi, we have plenty of ants in Oz with a painful  sting, heres 1 i n particular below and even a mtr away they follow your everymove and ready to pounce, their sting is "instant" and lethal to some, Ive learnt to live  with them but cautious when weeding. I  will admit that when I find the nest I pour in the white Blitzem that is like thin sand and they are gone in  days..   Pete

 

Myrmecia nigrocincta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myrmecia_nigrocincta ‎   Cached Similar Myrmecia nigrocincta, commonly known as the jumper ant or jumping jack, is an ant of the genus Myrmecia. The species was first described by Frederick Smith ... ‎Distribution - ‎Taxonomy - ‎Description - ‎Behaviour and ecology

Yike!

Bet no one transports in shorts for very long . . .

[DoomsDave]

Those little fire ants are nasty; I remember them from Bill Austin's place in Hawaii.

The RIFAs are even worse, in Texas, 1979. OUCH.

They can wreck hellacious havoc on helpless patients and caged or tethered animals.

If you're in a place that has RIFAs, and you have anyone in a nursing home or plan to board a pet in any kind of boarding facility, inquire aggressively about RIFA control. DON'T accept: "we use the latest methods [chirp chirp chirp]."

If you're really desperate to know, do a few google searches for RIFA lawsuits in Texas, Mississippi, etc. relating to just such cases. Your skin will crawl.

One buffer is that fire ants seem to need a lot of water. Here in the Land of La La Drought, RIFAs got a toehold back in the 1990s or early aughts, and, for the reasons above, caused a bit of a panic. I know a couple of people who decided not to "go pro" with their palm nurseries because of the fire ant killer you had to apply to retain a nursery license here.

Fortunately, the fears were a false alarm. There's no place where RIFAs can hide easily where people with a mind to murder them can't find them. (Though, as Joseph points out, they're out there, somewhere . . . . )

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Somewhere I have a video that we took of fire ants overtaking a scorpion in about 30 seconds. They ultimately killed and consumed the scorpion.  

 

[DoomsDave]

Here's a link to an earlier post that showed RIFAs rafting in South Carolina. Wading, anyone?

 

[Silas_Sancona]

While we lucked out not having any RIFA or little Fire Ant issues where we lived in Bradenton, we did have others that would invade all my potted specimens. Also occasionally had close encounters with Elongate Twig Ants (Pseudomyrmex gracilis) while removing Brazilian pepper along the property line. Id happily get stung by these compared to the scars i have on my Ankles from all the Fire Ant bites id get at work.

Here in Arizona, we have Southern Fire Ants, which sting but aren't nearly as aggressive as RIFA. Sting isn't all that bad or long lasting as well. Much more dangerous is the Maricopa Harvester Ant (Pogonomyrmex maricopa) Big, fast as ..Hockey sticks, and mean, and likely possesses the most potent venom, pound for pound, in the insect world. Thankfully, they stay out in the Desert in Mounds that can rise 3' off the ground and only show up in neighborhoods that are surrounded by open country.

As far as control, last Summer, i had a significant issue with Big Headed Ants which wouldn't stop invading various things in the yard. They also had a knack for moving Mealy bugs around. After trying Baits, Stakes, Neem oil ( for the Mealys) and applying Ditomaceous Earth, i finally gave in and applied Home Defense to a couple things, just to see how well it might work..let alone how the plants might react. Needless to say, Ants and Mealy Bugs were stopped, and never came back. As much as i dislike using anything chemical, sometimes big problems need quick solutions.

[Missi]

18 minutes ago, Silas_Sancona said:

While we lucked out not having any RIFA or little Fire Ant issues where we lived in Bradenton, we did have others that would invade all my potted specimens. Also occasionally had close encounters with Elongate Twig Ants (Pseudomyrmex gracilis) while removing Brazilian pepper along the property line. Id happily get stung by these compared to the scars i have on my Ankles from all the Fire Ant bites id get at work.

Here in Arizona, we have Southern Fire Ants, which sting but aren't nearly as aggressive as RIFA. Sting isn't all that bad or long lasting as well. Much more dangerous is the Maricopa Harvester Ant (Pogonomyrmex maricopa) Big, fast as ..Hockey sticks, and mean, and likely possesses the most potent venom, pound for pound, in the insect world. Thankfully, they stay out in the Desert in Mounds that can rise 3' off the ground and only show up in neighborhoods that are surrounded by open country.

As far as control, last Summer, i had a significant issue with Big Headed Ants which wouldn't stop invading various things in the yard. They also had a knack for moving Mealy bugs around. After trying Baits, Stakes, Neem oil ( for the Mealys) and applying Ditomaceous Earth, i finally gave in and applied Home Defense to a couple things, just to see how well it might work..let alone how the plants might react. Needless to say, Ants and Mealy Bugs were stopped, and never came back. As much as i dislike using anything chemical, sometimes big problems need quick solutions.

Ugh! Twig ants! I welt up twice as bad from them but their welts don't itch/sting as much as LFA. I've also dealt with the big headed ants farming mealies for their honey dew. I am right there with you on disliking using chemicals but certainly using them when there is a big issue.

[Missi]

2 hours ago, DoomsDave said:

Here's a link to an earlier post that showed RIFAs rafting in South Carolina. Wading, anyone?

 

Oh yes, that happens when the cattle fields get flooded here in inland Collier Co. I was out collecting apple snail shells, which are a by-product of hungry snail kites, when - Oops! My shin met a raft of RIFAs. That was no bueno  I'd still take that over LFA stings though. I think I have a sensitivity to LFA venom.

[Missi]

4 hours ago, TexasColdHardyPalms said:

Fire ants are impossible to eradicate. Your only hope is to try to control them. 

Truth! *sprinkle granular baits here, spray permethrin there...*

I have a powderpuff tree they've recently invaded but it has a larval host plant for a native butterfly growing up it. Looks like I'll have to put little granular bait stations around instead of spraying it.

[realarch]

They are nasty little critters, but can be controlled. There are a few local guys who will spray a concoction of pesticide, oil, and peanut butter on the affected areas, or the 

entire yard. It will knock them down for about 3-4 months, but they will slowly come back. You know it's just something you live with, like everything else. I will occasionally

get a bite or two, but working in the yard almost everyday it's really not a big problem. I'm one of those folks who is a magnet for anything that bites and stings, and I find 

hungry mosquitos more of a day to day problem than fire ants. I've always worn long pants, long sleeved shirts, and a big hat while gardening which helps a lot for sun exposure and insect bites. 

Tim

[mike in kurtistown]

Here in east Hawaii Island, my eight acres used to be infested with little fire ants which displaced the big brown (and harmless) crazy ants that used to be everywhere. I used a drench on any potted palms that I planted, potted up, gave away, or sold. Recently, I have been paying money to a local firm that uses Tango with a bait. They started around the house, then included my shadehouses, and now do the whole eight acres. The little fire ants are gone and the other species are returning. I haven't used the drench in a while. As some of the other posters have said, it's not a permanent solution. You have to learn to do the Tango or keep paying the experts, and it's even possible that the critters may become immune after a while. Fortunately, I am not sensitive to fire ant bites, and a bite will just sting a little for about five minutes with no longer lasting effects. I was also nearly immune to the Mexican fire ants when I lived in Florida.

 

[Palmaceae]

Yeah, nasty little insects! I am always battling them in my yard, I switch different pesticides periodically but they just come back up in another part of the yard.

[Dypsisdean]

12 hours ago, Missi said:

Thank you sir! I found this website last night. I will be thoroughly studying it! Have you had experience with them yourself?

It should be noted that there are many types of "fire ants." The one Missi is talking about is known here in Hawaii as the "Little Fire Ant" (LFA). It is different than the more well known Tropical Fire Ant, and all the others. It is a relatively new introduction here in Hawaii.

I had a false alarm last month. I did the peanut butter test and instantly had many tiny ants - but on closer inspection they were not the right color. Many of my acquaintances here in Hawaii have been "infected." So, we examine every plant now, along with soil, etc.

But I am getting up to speed on the new "baits" and equipment because I am sure I (or a neighbor) will be affected some day. And your only hope at eradication is to get them early. The new baits are showing some promise - but it is a lot of work, time, and expense. But fortunately these new baits are not very toxic to humans.

[Cindy Adair]

Wow this sounds quite unpleasant! When I used to just visit PR there were a few mounds in the middle of a sunny path. Just once I applied dawn dishwashing liquid and then water. Clearly that only worked on the one mound but it is the only ant control I ever used and just the one time.

I take caution not to be underneath whatever I am pulling down, especially dead tree fern fronds that have some little ants that certainly sting. 

I do have a bunch of Cecropia trees. Do you think the ants are congregating there and mostly leaving me alone? 

I wear hiking boots and long pants and a hat, but a tank top (except dusk when I will don a long sleeved shirt) and no spray and almost never get a mosquito bite and ant stings are rare. I can not recall the last time I stepped into an ant mound here, but not in the last several years so perhaps I just am more careful without thinking about it. 

I am so sorry about the bad issues many of you are having with ants!

 

[PalmTreeDude]

Uh oh, the fire ants are attacking!

Edited August 16, 2016 by PalmTreeDude

[LJG]

Does anyone know if all these invasive species can live in cohabitation? Here in SoCal, in watered gardens, Argentine Ants are th invasive dominant ant. They will kill all other species. I wonder if the species that gets the foothold first can keep the others away. If this is the case, if your property hasn't been invaded by fire ants yet, quickly go buy Argentine Ants. They dont sting

[Silas_Sancona]

2 hours ago, LJG said:

Does anyone know if all these invasive species can live in cohabitation? Here in SoCal, in watered gardens, Argentine Ants are th invasive dominant ant. They will kill all other species. I wonder if the species that gets the foothold first can keep the others away. If this is the case, if your property hasn't been invaded by fire ants yet, quickly go buy Argentine Ants. They dont sting

Len, this can happen.. Where i was in Bradenton, the Big Headed Ants i had referenced were replacing the local population of RIFA.  In the absence of them, RIFA were the dominant species id deal with at work in Sarasota. While certainly not in all cases, it seems that as new ant species shows up, another is being replaced. RIFA started replacing various native species when they showed up. Now they're being replaced by another.

[Missi]

17 hours ago, realarch said:

They are nasty little critters, but can be controlled. There are a few local guys who will spray a concoction of pesticide, oil, and peanut butter on the affected areas, or the 

entire yard. It will knock them down for about 3-4 months, but they will slowly come back. You know it's just something you live with, like everything else. I will occasionally

get a bite or two, but working in the yard almost everyday it's really not a big problem. I'm one of those folks who is a magnet for anything that bites and stings, and I find 

hungry mosquitos more of a day to day problem than fire ants. I've always worn long pants, long sleeved shirts, and a big hat while gardening which helps a lot for sun exposure and insect bites. 

Tim

I wish I had the same issue. With the Zika alert in FL, they're spraying every other night so there have been very few skeeters in sight. Still, the LFA make my life miserable. I also garden nearly every day and I'm surprised if I don't get at least 2 stings from them (which are enough to irritate me moderately) each time I'm outside. They have an extremely painful (like electric pulses) and extremely itchy effect on me and it lasts for hours then itches for days.

[Missi]

16 hours ago, mike in kurtistown said:

Here in east Hawaii Island, my eight acres used to be infested with little fire ants which displaced the big brown (and harmless) crazy ants that used to be everywhere. I used a drench on any potted palms that I planted, potted up, gave away, or sold. Recently, I have been paying money to a local firm that uses Tango with a bait. They started around the house, then included my shadehouses, and now do the whole eight acres. The little fire ants are gone and the other species are returning. I haven't used the drench in a while. As some of the other posters have said, it's not a permanent solution. You have to learn to do the Tango or keep paying the experts, and it's even possible that the critters may become immune after a while. Fortunately, I am not sensitive to fire ant bites, and a bite will just sting a little for about five minutes with no longer lasting effects. I was also nearly immune to the Mexican fire ants when I lived in Florida.

 

The "Mexican" fire ants that are larger and just leave a small pimple, don't bother me much either. It's these gosh dang Wasmannia buggers.

What chemical did you use for your potted plant drenches?

[Alicehunter2000]

21 hours ago, TexasColdHardyPalms said:

Somewhere I have a video that we took of fire ants overtaking a scorpion in about 30 seconds. They ultimately killed and consumed the scorpion.  

 

Thats the opening scene of the movie "The Wild Ones" ......do you remember seeing a bunch of little kids poking the ant covered scorpion with sticks and squeezing with glee ..... lol

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

1 hour ago, Alicehunter2000 said:

Thats the opening scene of the movie "The Wild Ones" ......do you remember seeing a bunch of little kids poking the ant covered scorpion with sticks and squeezing with glee ..... lol

Are you serious or messing with me? Ive never seen that movie.

[Alicehunter2000]

[Alicehunter2000]

Sorry......."The Wild Bunch"....its a classic

[mike in kurtistown]

Missi,

The drench I was using was Sevin SL (trade name). The main ingredient (43%) is called Carbaryl. I had to wait 24 hours for it to kill everything, and it did - even centipedes and snails. The minimum I could buy was 2.5 gal of concentrate, and it was expensive. There is another chemical used even more often here on the Big Island as a drench, but I don't remember the name.

 

[Brad Mondel]

I have fire ants chewing my hibiscus buds and placing twigs and sticks on the sticky nectar. Not sure what their motive is but it's killing the flowers before they open. I tried soapy water mixed with lemon and garlic and it killed the existing ants. The next day a new army arrived. I'm thinking of putting a sticky bug trap around the base to catch them until they give up. They bite and sting badly, leaving pimples of itchy poison in my skin.