Looking for Dwarf Butia's

[Alicehunter2000]

Looking for Dwarf Butia species (not bonetii) in ship-able size.

[Brad Mondel]

Me too. No one seems to sell these anymore. 

[Laaz]

I have a butia that is about 25 years old that was given to me by a old woman. It was dug from here yard & plant in my yard about 10 years ago. Not sure of the variety but much smaller than all the other butias of that age in my area. It has developing seeds now. You're welcome to some seeds if you want to try them. I'll get a photo of the tree later today.

[Brad Mondel]

That would be incredible Laaz. I should be able to tell which species from a photo of the plant and the seeds. 

[Laaz]

Here's a few quick shots.

 

[Brad Mondel]

That's gorgeous! I would love some seed! 

It might be a true Butia capitata but I'm not entirely sure until I can see the clean seed. 

Have you tasted the fruit? What color was the spathe when it appeared? Thank you! 

[Laaz]

The blooms are orange / yellow. Never tasted the fruit. It has been blooming for years & the the fruit always hangs on the ground...

 

[Brad Mondel]

Well when they're ripe and ready I'd love to pay you for some seeds! 

[Laaz]

No charge, just send me your address & you clean the seeds...

[Brad Mondel]

Pm sent 

[Alicehunter2000]

Will be interesting to see the seeds after they have been cleaned...very round looking like B. odorata but the tree does look different from most B. odorata that we see around here. Maybe some experts can chime in.

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Cant tell anything until the fruit is removed.

[Brad Mondel]

I will post pics of clean seed when I get some so we can determine what it is. 

[Laaz]

Fruit are just starting to ripen. The seed are quite small compared to the fruit size. Egg shaped.

 

[Brad Mondel]

Seed and fruit seems to be consistent with odorata. If it was capitata it would have yellow fruit and an elongated seed. 

Did the developing spathe have tomentum on it? If so, what color was it? 

[Laaz]

They always have a white-ish tomentum  on the spathe. I would think if it was Odorata  it would be much larger @ 25 years old.

[Laaz]

I'll have to get some photo's of the different butia's around my neighborhood...

[Brad Mondel]

Please do! I would love to see them. 

Would you mind to post a photo shot of the entire Butia in question? Thank you. 

[Laaz]

I'll have to start a thread tomorrow with all the local forms of butia in my area. Just a quick few from just now. Notice the largest butia has the smallest seed. Just picked these fruit up under the giant. Also another cool form is the mushroom look...

Mushroom look.

 

Giant, at least 30 ft tall.

 

 

Then we have a few that hold a unbelievable about of fronds...

 

[Laaz]

Here's seed for comparison...My small butia left, Giant butia center & normal butia right.

 

[Laaz]

[Laaz]

Just to get a idea how small the "giant" butia seeds are...

 

[Brad Mondel]

Very variable species. The "giant" Butia looks like it has some yatay in it. The form of the fronds, the large size, and the rugby shaped seeds. Very interesting. I'm sure most are hybrids because their range overlaps in South America. I'm not an expert however and Alberto would be the proper authority to give advice. 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

10 hours ago, Laaz said:

Fruit are just starting to ripen. The seed are quite small compared to the fruit size. Egg shaped.

 

These aren't odorata seed. They look just like catarinensis to me. 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Butia seed from the same tree will vary in size even in the same year. Unless irrigated and fertilized regularly the second batch is usually the biggest, while the last batch is the smallest. However the shape never really changes. 

[Laaz]

This tree is down by the street, sitting in a flood zone. It has 4 seed stalks hanging right now & all the fruit are about the same size. This tree I never have to water...

[Brad Mondel]

 Catarinesis seeds should be more pointed at the ends. 

I'm not saying that it's not Catarinensis, but the seed doesn't match exactly. 

[Laaz]

Full shot of my midget 25 year old butia... Plus some saw palmettos, cordylines, needle palms & livistona chinensis.

 

[Brad Mondel]

Beautiful specimen. It has the strictor variant look to it with the upright fronds. 

[Laaz]

Yep. Nice small little palm.

[Brad Mondel]

Here is the seeds from the dwarf Butia. They're circled in blue. The red circled seed is odorata. 

They're more pointy than a typical odorata. Perhaps it is a catarinensis or hybrid of catarinensis. Any ideas? 

[Laaz]

Plenty more seeds if anyone wants some.

 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

I still stand behind my initial statement; those are catarinensis as are the overwhelming majority of florida butia from what i have seen.  I have a few mature florida butia left and ill take a picture of a catarinensis next to an odorata to illustrate the difference.  There seems to be a shift from catarinensis to odorata once you get to Louisiana and once in texas most butia are Odorata due to the seed stock used with RGV growers. 

[Alicehunter2000]

So you are saying all the huge butia in these parts are catarinensis? .... I thought catarinensis are supposed to be small?