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Tracy

About 2 years ago, I acquired a 1 gallon Pritchardia labeled as  martii at one of the So Cal Palm Society meetings.  I planted it late last summer, and while its making decent progress growing, I'm wondering if it should be showing signs of the coppery undersides characteristic of the species yet.  I'm not seeing any sign of coppery undersides, as you can see in the photos.  Is it still too young to determine, or am I growing something different than martii?  Sorry about my messy marks, the pen slipped as I wrote the date 3/23 above my growth mark a couple of days before this photo (yes, it is growing!!!).

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quaman58

Tracey, 

 

Mine has shown some of the gold color since very early on. My first thought was that at the size yours is, it should probably be showing a bit of that coloration on the leaf undersides. Speaking from lots of experience, Pritchardias are notoriously mislabeled. Getting them straight from Floribunda seems to be the safest bet if there is a particular one you want.

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richnorm

Too young.  Martii is especially variable too....

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Josh-O
8 hours ago, richnorm said:

Too young.  Martii is especially variable too....

I agree 100%

this species is sooooo variable. Some show color at an early age and some don't for a long time.

 

 

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Josh-O

Tracy, yours looks like the classi juvinile martii IMO

The leaf structure looks just like all the 5 gals I have for sale that were germinated off a true martii tree here in Ca.

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MattyB

I agree that it's to young to tell for sure, but at this stage you should be seeing some flecking on the leaf underside.  Your photo is too far away.  You'll have to look very close.  Not all martii are bronze, some are silver.  Highly variable palm.  Also, I've found martii to be one of the least fiberous palms with only a triangular ligule flap at the base of the petole as opposed to the fiber mess you see a lot with Pritchardia.

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MattyB

I would give my left palm nut to have one like the ones at Ventura College.  Unfortunately all of my martii have come out with wavy leaves.  No where near as pretty as this one.

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LJG

Matt, that plant is the same as Mardy Darian had as "Martiodes". It is an oddball Pritchardia in that it stays stumpy and flowers way before it has trunk. Keeps the flat leaf and is very scalely underneath - showing more gold coloration that other Martii types. its also slow growing. Do you think these Venture plants came from Sullivan? Bet so as Mardy and her use to trade often.

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neoflora

Matt, I have this palm in my garden. I grew a lot of them. The seed came from a tree on the island of Lanai. I sold them as P. lanaiianensis. I still have a few left at my growning grounds. They show this typical form and heavy silver gold under leaves. Hodel lump them into Martii. John Tallman probably got this palm from me years ago. He was one of my customers many years ago.

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Darold Petty

Yes, John Tallman was responsible for the palms at Ventura College.

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MattyB
10 hours ago, LJG said:

Matt, that plant is the same as Mardy Darian had as "Martiodes". It is an oddball Pritchardia in that it stays stumpy and flowers way before it has trunk. Keeps the flat leaf and is very scalely underneath - showing more gold coloration that other Martii types. its also slow growing. Do you think these Venture plants came from Sullivan? Bet so as Mardy and her use to trade often.

Yes, these Ventura plants look like Mardy's "martiodes".  If I remember correctly they were labled on the Ventura College key plan as Rockiana.....another name lumped into martii.

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MattyB

Tracy,

Here's what you should see on the underside of your young plant.  The pic is of one of my small ones, grown from seed, which is about the same age as yours.

IMG_1029.JPG

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MattyB

Here's my largest P. martii.  It's got some wave to the frond, undersides are more silver than bronze.  You can see the triangular ligule at the base of the petiole.  Notice that it's not particularly fiberous and notice the yellow stripe on the petiole, which several Pritchardia have but this type of martii always seems to have it.

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Tracy

Thanks all for the input!  It seems it is responding well to getting out of the pot and into the ground, pushing new leaves last autumn and through the winter, so I'll keep an eye on it and update my post when anything changes.  The original label from when I purchased it is below regarding the source.  I ran outside to double check and mine shows no flecking like the small one you show.  I saw the very round flat leaves on one at Wailea Falls garden on Oahu a few years back, and it was one of the primary reasons I bought this one at the PSSC auction.

20160325-104A1219.jpg

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colin Peters

Beautiful P. marti, with cool color, Matt.  The Ventura college pritchardia shows how tough these palms can be. Their habitat is up in the wet, cooler elevation, and that one

looks pretty good considering it is surrounded by asphalt, that probably gets pretty hot on a sunny day.   I agree P. marti can be so variable, and hard to figure 

out. Tracy,you might have to wait a while to get a positive ID., beautiful palm either way.

aloha

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neoflora

Different to what i have!

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neoflora

Mine looks like the one at ventura college. More compact!

 

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Josh-O
8 hours ago, MattyB said:

Here's my largest P. martii.  It's got some wave to the frond, undersides are more silver than bronze.  You can see the triangular ligule at the base of the petiole.  Notice that it's not particularly fiberous and notice the yellow stripe on the petiole, which several Pritchardia have but this type of martii always seems to have it.

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Tracy, yours looks like the classi juvinile martii IMO

The leaf structure looks just like all the 5 gals I have for sale that were germinated off a true martii tree here in Ca.

 

Matty, 

great looking Martii!!!! when I was at your garden the other day I didn't remember it being so dam silver!! looks killer!!

are you gonna surf Friday?

 

are you surfing this Friday?

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Josh-O
9 hours ago, MattyB said:

Tracy,

Here's what you should see on the underside of your young plant.  The pic is of one of my small ones, grown from seed, which is about the same age as yours.

IMG_1029.JPG

that's what all me 5 gals I have for sale look like. Lots of flecking soon to be a nice silvery color I HOPE.

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Josh-O
19 hours ago, LJG said:

Matt, that plant is the same as Mardy Darian had as "Martiodes". It is an oddball Pritchardia in that it stays stumpy and flowers way before it has trunk. Keeps the flat leaf and is very scalely underneath - showing more gold coloration that other Martii types. its also slow growing. Do you think these Venture plants came from Sullivan? Bet so as Mardy and her use to trade often.

I would say your correct Len.

Did Mardy find this plant first and gave/traded Pauleen seed or was it the other way around.

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mike in kurtistown

Like Matty B, my largest martii has surprised with a flower at the plant's still rather small size. Here it is at its location in full sun on the crest of a hill:

martii_MLM_032916.thumb.JPG.445d941d23a8

Here is the flower in closeup:

martii_flower_MLM_032916.thumb.JPG.7124a

I have three Pritchardia species that have just started flowering, two for the first time. Last year's flowering was also in spring with more into summer, then it halted, and the fruits hung green on the tree until now, when the fruits are ripening and dropping as new flowering is starting.

 

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colin Peters

P. Marti in habitat  ,Niu Valley Ridge, Honolulu  Oahu. less silver than Matt's palm. quite wavy, but cool to see in their natural environment.

 

 

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Tracy
On 3/28/2016, 10:44:56, MattyB said:

You can see the triangular ligule at the base of the petiole.  Notice that it's not particularly fiberous and notice the yellow stripe on the petiole, which several Pritchardia have but this type of martii always seems to have it.

IMG_1023.JPG

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On 3/29/2016, 5:54:56, colin Peters said:

natural environment.

 

 

IMG_3284.jpg

Seeing all the cool habitat photos Colin has been posting of Prtichardias, prompted me to go out and examine my "maybe martii".  It is still quite young, but I've noticed a few changes.  I'm not sure if that is a ligule flap at the bottom of the petiole or not.  I'm still wanting to get closer to an id... I know I'm being impatient and should just let it get more mature, but that is hard.

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Josh-O
5 minutes ago, Tracy said:

 

 

Seeing all the cool habitat photos Colin has been posting of Prtichardias, prompted me to go out and examine my "maybe martii".  It is still quite young, but I've noticed a few changes.  I'm not sure if that is a ligule flap at the bottom of the petiole or not.  I'm still wanting to get closer to an id... I know I'm being impatient and should just let it get more mature, but that is hard.

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nice Martii Tracy.

I love that plant

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Tracy
On 3/28/2016, 10:42:15, MattyB said:

Tracy,

Here's what you should see on the underside of your young plant.  The pic is of one of my small ones, grown from seed, which is about the same age as yours.

IMG_1029.JPG

Still waiting to see much of this and my Pritchardia is getting bigger.  While it's not heavily matted around the leaf bases (fibrous, not a pejorative use of the term "matty" as I actually like the guy!), I would have expected to see significant flecking or scale on the leaf undersides by now.  I'm wondering what other potential candidates for species this could be?

20180525-104A9409.jpg

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Tracy
On 3/28/2016 at 10:42 AM, MattyB said:

Tracy,

Here's what you should see on the underside of your young plant.  The pic is of one of my small ones, grown from seed, which is about the same age as yours.

IMG_1029.JPG

I'm just not feeling Pritchardia martii at this point with mine.  Curious what your little guy looks like 2 years later Matt (the one pictured above for the leaf underside).  Can anyone match it with a different Pritcharida species?

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quaman58

Sorry Tracy,

I have to agree, probably not martii. But it's got the nice big circular flat leaves, which is cool. It is a knock off of a Jungle Music "lanaiensis" that I'm growing. So, assuming that it was correctly labeled when I bought it (always a precarious assumption with Pritchardia), if you follow that bread crumb trail through Don Hodel's book, it would be glabrata. I know, that's a lot of assumptions...

 

Bret

 

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-2 brian

It looks very similar to my Pritchardia that I originally bought labeled "lanaiianensis" but what I know understand is Martii. My new fronds have a bit of coppery color underside as you can see by the photo's I just took. I can't recall from memory but based on the earlier picture below I believe the coppery underside color has come later on as the palm has aged. I believe when it was younger it emerged with a more green underside. 

 6/5/19

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6/5/19

IMG_0852.thumb.jpg.434f9124780c65a579be5fef16254278.jpg\

6/5/19

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6/5/19

IMG_0854.thumb.jpg.523848573acd0832e6d55933784b9218.jpg

 

The photo below was taken in 2011 and as you can see the underside of the most recent opened frond looks to be more green then coppery. 

 

DSC_0109.thumb.JPG.c0b53e07de0fbb92c9ffba572b12e04f.JPG

Hopefully these photos will help you. 

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realarch

Beautiful Brian!

Tim 

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Tracy
1 hour ago, -2 brian said:

I can't recall from memory but based on the earlier picture below I believe the coppery underside color has come later on as the palm has aged. I believe when it was younger it emerged with a more green underside. 

Yes, if you read through the string, I have some saying their's showed flecking as a very small specimen, like the leaf that Matty showed, and then others (Josh) who have said theirs have showed minimal flecking until they grew larger.  When it was smaller, I was more willing to believe it might pick up the coppery underside as it grew but at this point of development would be surprised if it ever gets the coppery underside.  At least I have another Pritchardia, acquired as flynnii, which has a lot of flecking on the underside.  The P flynnii has shown the flecking since I got it as a 1 gallon plant.   You have a very nice looking P martii by the way!  I'll probably post this Pritchardia again in a couple more years after seeing if anything changes in the leaves appearance.

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The Gerg
On ‎3‎/‎27‎/‎2016 at 11:32 PM, MattyB said:

I would give my left palm nut to have one like the ones at Ventura College.  Unfortunately all of my martii have come out with wavy leaves.  No where near as pretty as this one.

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Here is an update of the Ventura College tree. Took these pics today. Not much sun so pics not great.

1348064442_PMVCClose.jpg.fe9a290e96e33f90b38d8668847dc157.jpg1794501631_PMVCWide.jpg.e454f9b4ca33ecccaa56a1d3f99d6b2f.jpg1496606547_PMVCAnother.jpg.ecba689eb3e6c4fda6790fcfd05b6585.jpg1878078104_PMVCLeaf.jpg.9fa08dcb1cbca2b30f2e3a6a80cc242b.jpg

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Matt in OC

So, ummm...how long until those flowers produce mature seed? :D

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Briank
On 3/27/2016 at 11:32 PM, MattyB said:

I would give my left palm nut to have one like the ones at Ventura College.  Unfortunately all of my martii have come out with wavy leaves.  No where near as pretty as this one.

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5-21-11- 103.jpg

That is Awesome.  Won’t hold my Breath that mine comes out like that.   Best pic I’ve seen of one! Wonder what kind of Donation I can make to the college for that thing ! Lol

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Briank
On 3/28/2016 at 7:38 AM, neoflora said:

Matt, I have this palm in my garden. I grew a lot of them. The seed came from a tree on the island of Lanai. I sold them as P. lanaiianensis. I still have a few left at my growning grounds. They show this typical form and heavy silver gold under leaves. Hodel lump them into Martii. John Tallman probably got this palm from me years ago. He was one of my customers many years ago.

Do you have any of these Pritchardias left ? 

Edited by Briank

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colin Peters

Really nice, 

Matt, flowers to ripe, black seed in the wild is about a year and a half. or more for P. bakeri, marti., Might be 

a bit faster in a warmer situation. but up on the mountain here it is constantly wet, very wet.

aloha

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quaman58
10 hours ago, Briank said:

Do you have any of these Pritchardias left ? 

Ron has some gems. Well worth sending him a PM. I bought one from him 3 years ago that may be this palm. He couldn't remember whether it was this version of martii or arecina. Either way, it's one of the most unique Pritchardias I have.

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Briank
1 hour ago, quaman58 said:

Ron has some gems. Well worth sending him a PM. I bought one from him 3 years ago that may be this palm. He couldn't remember whether it was this version of martii or arecina. Either way, it's one of the most unique Pritchardias I have.

Bought one from him last yr.   does know his PritchArdias.   I will do send him a msg 

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realarch

I've posted these in-situ photos before of P. martii, several times, and they never get old. Taken on a windward Oahu hike several years ago with a few intrepid palmophiles. (That a word?). Beyond fabulous in any case. 

Some of them were quite impressive, much larger than some reference material might describe. These were located in or adjacent to gulches which suggest the seed was 

washed down and distributed from higher elevations. 

Tim

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realarch

A few more.......

Tim

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krishnaraoji88

Interesting how varied these look. We have a few at the hospital that are super flat and tight growing even with tall trunks. 

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