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coops 3214

whos growing oddball palms in Melbourne

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tim_brissy_13

My first ever germinated seed. This Hedyscepe is now 13 years old but has only been in the ground 18 months and is starting to adapt to a fairly sunny spot.

20170102_080124_resized.jpg

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SirOxylon

Sorry for my absence. I forgot my password and cant access my old email. 

Tim that Dypsis leptocheilos is completely unscathed and put on a new frond which is opening now.

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KrisKupsch
On 03/10/2015, 15:20:18, steve99 said:
  • Do palms grow in Melbourne?  I always thought it was way too COLD down there.....  

 

 

of course they do !...some

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tim_brissy_13
52 minutes ago, SirOxylon said:

Sorry for my absence. I forgot my password and cant access my old email. 

Tim that Dypsis leptocheilos is completely unscathed and put on a new frond which is opening now.

Daniel - you inspired me, I actually planted a redneck this spring and it is rocketing along. I might give it some protection this coming winter. For the other Melbournites they are $12 at Big W.

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tim_brissy_13

Here's the D leptocheilos - it won't look like this after this coming winter but it's in a protected spot against the house so I'm hoping it pulls through.

20170102_080255_resized.jpg

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tim_brissy_13

Here's the Ceroxylon ventricosum I mentioned - growing back well after severe sunburn last summer.

20170102_080042_resized.jpg

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tim_brissy_13

This Kentiopsis magnifica has survived a few winters now including the last 2 in the ground. It's stuck in limbo though I only get 1 new frond per year and it never gets any bigger. I might throw a makeshift greenhouse over it this winter to see if I can get some sustained growth.

20170102_080140_resized.jpg

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tim_brissy_13

My Kentiopsis oliviformis went through its first winter last year. Got damaged by strong winds but overall it's going well now starting to push up a spear quickly with the warmer weather.

20170102_075945_resized.jpg

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tim_brissy_13

Beccariophoenix alfredii has been one for me that hasn't had any trouble adapting to the Melbourne climate. Grew like mad last summer and is already doing the same this summer.

20170102_080448_resized.jpg

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coops 3214

Well done tim good to see everything is still growing, i lost my big wattle tree which has exposed 2 of my rhopies and 3 different ceroxylons, rhopies haven't flinched but the amazonican has taken a beating but still growing strong  i think they just take take to adapt, im looking forward to getting my beccariophoenix in the ground to get some growth before winter, 

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Dave-Vero

The list for Melbourne and my town isn't too much different from a reasonable list for Melbourne, Florida, where cold is short and erratic (abrupt outbreaks of frigid air from Siberia or thereabouts, absolutely dry from warming as it crosses the continental mass).  Summers are roughly Brisbane or perhaps Cairns, fairly wet and hot, but rarely much above 33.   Here's some known to be happy here:

Chamaedorea - adscendens, metallica, oblongata, ernesti-augusti, tenalla (the whole genus.  Some seem to suffer from nematodes; othewise bomb-proof)

Burretiokentia hapala (becoming popular)

Rhapis excelsa and multifida (and laosensis)

Cryosophila warscewiczii (a star, down to at least -3 without damage.  Somewhat vulnerable to wind).

Lytocaryum weddellianum (also -3 hardy)

Chambreyonia macrocarpa varieties (becoming popular)

 

I've got Kentiopsis oliviformis, several Archontophoenix, Dypsis carlsmithii, D. decaryi, D. plumosa, D. saintelucei.  D. lutescens thrives in neighbors' yards.  Wodyetia has become a popular mass-market ornamental along with Livistona decora.  

What's bewildering is that Melbourne's climate is so far different with few really good parallels in North America, other than maybe some corners of California, a complex place with its mix of ocean and mountains.

 

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Ben in Norcal
5 hours ago, Dave-Vero said:

The list for Melbourne and my town isn't too much different from a reasonable list for Melbourne, Florida, where cold is short and erratic (abrupt outbreaks of frigid air from Siberia or thereabouts, absolutely dry from warming as it crosses the continental mass).  Summers are roughly Brisbane or perhaps Cairns, fairly wet and hot, but rarely much above 33.   Here's some known to be happy here:

Chamaedorea - adscendens, metallica, oblongata, ernesti-augusti, tenalla (the whole genus.  Some seem to suffer from nematodes; othewise bomb-proof)

Burretiokentia hapala (becoming popular)

Rhapis excelsa and multifida (and laosensis)

Cryosophila warscewiczii (a star, down to at least -3 without damage.  Somewhat vulnerable to wind).

Lytocaryum weddellianum (also -3 hardy)

Chambreyonia macrocarpa varieties (becoming popular)

 

I've got Kentiopsis oliviformis, several Archontophoenix, Dypsis carlsmithii, D. decaryi, D. plumosa, D. saintelucei.  D. lutescens thrives in neighbors' yards.  Wodyetia has become a popular mass-market ornamental along with Livistona decora.  

What's bewildering is that Melbourne's climate is so far different with few really good parallels in North America, other than maybe some corners of California, a complex place with its mix of ocean and mountains.

 

Yes, I think Melbourne isn't drastically different from parts of Norcal here...

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Bennz
6 hours ago, Ben in Norcal said:

Yes, I think Melbourne isn't drastically different from parts of Norcal here...

Nor drastically different, but it is hard to find an accurate comparison between any Southern Australia/NI NZ site with anywhere in the Northern Hemisphere.

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Ben in Norcal
1 minute ago, Bennz said:

Nor drastically different, but it is hard to find an accurate comparison between any Southern Australia/NI NZ site with anywhere in the Northern Hemisphere.

What's missing from some of the Bay Area microclimes?

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SirOxylon

I would think North California would differ from Melbourne mainly in summer. Winter would be quite similar in some areas that don't get those arctic blasts-our really cold weather is around 0C or 32 F. Melboune gets quite hot (over 40 degrees C 104F during the day and stays over 20 C or 70F during the night some times). This allows some of those heat loving species like Sabal to gro well down here. San Francisco gets slightly less rain than most areas of Melbourne.

I think you should protect those young palms Tim. If you can afford it use some polycarbonate twinwall from Bunnings to make a cube to go around them leaving a slot at the top for watering and airflow. It will get over 20C during the day on a sunny winter day and allow your palms to continue to grow through winter. This is what I did for the Redneck.

Melbounites get yourselves to BigW. I have never seen rednecks sold down here.

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Ben in Norcal
1 minute ago, SirOxylon said:

I would think North California would differ from Melbourne mainly in summer. Winter would be quite similar in some areas that don't get those arctic blasts-our really cold weather is around 0C or 32 F. Melboune gets quite hot (over 40 degrees C 104F during the day and stays over 20 C or 70F during the night some times). This allows some of those heat loving species like Sabal to gro well down here. San Francisco gets slightly less rain than most areas of Melbourne.

I think you should protect those young palms Tim. If you can afford it use some polycarbonate twinwall from Bunnings to make a cube to go around them leaving a slot at the top for watering and airflow. It will get over 20C during the day on a sunny winter day and allow your palms to continue to grow through winter. This is what I did for the Redneck.

Melbounites get yourselves to BigW. I have never seen rednecks sold down here.

Parts of the Bay Area get very hot indeed...where I live in the East Bay, for instance, we'll have 90+ degrees F for months and many days above 100 degrees every summer.  I think the thing with the Bay Area is that there are SO many microclimates; 5 miles can make a 20 degree difference in summer, and 10 or 15 miles can make a 40 degree difference.  I'm originally from Chicago and when I first moved here (by way of the UK, as it happens) - the whole Bay Area microclimate thing was the most amazing experience.  I didn't know such huge differences could exist over such small distances.  

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Ben in Norcal
10 minutes ago, SirOxylon said:

I would think North California would differ from Melbourne mainly in summer. Winter would be quite similar in some areas that don't get those arctic blasts-our really cold weather is around 0C or 32 F. Melboune gets quite hot (over 40 degrees C 104F during the day and stays over 20 C or 70F during the night some times). This allows some of those heat loving species like Sabal to gro well down here. San Francisco gets slightly less rain than most areas of Melbourne.

I think you should protect those young palms Tim. If you can afford it use some polycarbonate twinwall from Bunnings to make a cube to go around them leaving a slot at the top for watering and airflow. It will get over 20C during the day on a sunny winter day and allow your palms to continue to grow through winter. This is what I did for the Redneck.

Melbounites get yourselves to BigW. I have never seen rednecks sold down here.

Compare these:

Melbourne: https://www.worldweatheronline.com/melbourne-weather-averages/victoria/au.aspx

Concord, CA: http://www.usclimatedata.com/climate/concord/california/united-states/usca2033/2016/1

Winter highs and lows quite similar.  Concord, CA averages significantly hotter in the height of summer.  I would think that just a little to the west of me, and in spots on the peninsula - where it would be a bit cooler in summer - is about as close an analogue as you might find.  I expect that's why so many southern Australian and NZ plants do well in parts of the Bay Area.

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SirOxylon

That is very interesting. Didn't know it got that hot in some parts there. Concord is definitely very close to the temperatures we experience. I guess being away from the ocean a bit allows it to heats up but its not far away enough and there is enough local topography to maintain moderate temperatures during winter. Melbourne also varies in climate across the city. It gets much colder away from the bay that its on especially in nearby mountains where it snows in winter but on the southeast coast of the bay where it is builtup with suburbs it is slightly warmer at night that those stats you found for Melbourne.

Successfully growing Australian plants in California would be largely influenced by soil (more so than climate in many cases). Australia generally has soils very low in nutrients so highly fertile soils and fertilisers can burn plants. Also there is a wide range of soils here and some plants are very fussy in needing the soil they are familiar with. Many of the spectacular Australian native plants are from southwest Western Australia where the soils are largely well draining acidic sands low in nutrients. Many people in the eastern states can't grow these plants very well because they cannot meet these conditions e.g. most soils around Melbourne are heavier loams or clays.

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tim_brissy_13
3 hours ago, SirOxylon said:

I would think North California would differ from Melbourne mainly in summer. Winter would be quite similar in some areas that don't get those arctic blasts-our really cold weather is around 0C or 32 F. Melboune gets quite hot (over 40 degrees C 104F during the day and stays over 20 C or 70F during the night some times). This allows some of those heat loving species like Sabal to gro well down here. San Francisco gets slightly less rain than most areas of Melbourne.

I think you should protect those young palms Tim. If you can afford it use some polycarbonate twinwall from Bunnings to make a cube to go around them leaving a slot at the top for watering and airflow. It will get over 20C during the day on a sunny winter day and allow your palms to continue to grow through winter. This is what I did for the Redneck.

Melbounites get yourselves to BigW. I have never seen rednecks sold down here.

Thanks Daniel that will be my plan this winter. I'll definitely protect the D leptocheilos and Kentiopsis magnifica and also a Dypsis dark mealybug that keeps defoliating each winter and returning from the dead in spring.

I've always been one to leave them to the elements but you're right if you can get the temps above 20C in a greenhouse cube for the tropicals hopefully the roots can establish and one day they are able to cope with winter without entering the common limbo/hibernation that stalls growth.

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coops 3214

Im going to try those small clear green houses that pop up from rings around some of my slower stuff i think the biggest set back is the wind we suffer here in geelong,  

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coops 3214

These will be my best friend this winter

7 minutes ago, coops 3214 said:

Screenshot_2017-01-03-12-57-26.png

 

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SirOxylon

Those pop up plastic things look good. Quick and easy. You will have to peg them down thoroughly so that they don't fly away in the wind.

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pigafetta
3 hours ago, coops 3214 said:

These will be my best friend this winter

 

Where do you get them from?

Might be worth a go, but Id expect they will just get blow to bits first strong Westerly.

Could also benefit from helping keep my soil a little drier during winter.

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coops 3214

Bunnings sell them and they peg into to ground i think they should be ok deff worth a try, also ebay ive seen them

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tim_brissy_13

A few more Melbourne oddballs:

This is my uncle's garden that I helped design and plant about 3 years ago. Most are starting to establish now, from left to right:

Beccariophoenix alfredii, Ravenea glauca (background), P roebellini, Caryota gigas (background), Dypsis baronii (foreground), Dypsis onilahensis, another B alfredii just behind, Sabal minor and Howea forsteriana. All are in full sun. The D onilahensis is a beauty although this maybe isn't the best picture of it and the C gigas is fast becoming a monster.

@Kennybenjaminall of these are from Palms for Brisbane I believe.

20170104_161404_resized.thumb.jpg.39a2be

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coops 3214

That looks awsome tim good job, im very happy with my dypsis onilahensis also, is the place were u planted the plumosa??

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tim_brissy_13

Yep 2 Dypsis plumosa went into the back of this garden pretty much behind the C gigas and B alfredii. Neither made it, both slowly declined and finally got pulled this winter gone.

 

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tim_brissy_13

The other side of the same garden: A purpurea and D baronii looking great, Chambeyronia macrocarpa and the back not doing so well.

20170104_161419_resized.jpg

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coops 3214

Does this have irrigation setup?? I noticed heaps more growth once i set up all the drippers, my purpurea is quite slow compared to a standard bangie, 

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tim_brissy_13

No I don't think it does but I think it gets plenty of water. I've noticed the same thing though - the drought back in the late 2000s really slowed the growth once all of the irrigation was turned off at the old garden. It's really noticeable with Archontophoenix - bungalows and Alexs look really ragged when they are dried out.

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MOSES JONES

Hi Tim,

 

Great! Yeah I'm getting a few of those they will do well down here.....a nice palm !

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coops 3214

My caryota gigas is finally kicking off now, its taken a while to settle in since being planted but should really take off nowScreenshot_2017-01-18-22-16-15.thumb.png

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Ben in Norcal
3 hours ago, coops 3214 said:

My caryota gigas is finally kicking off now, its taken a while to settle in since being planted but should really take off nowScreenshot_2017-01-18-22-16-15.thumb.png

Are you sure that's gigas?  I'm no expert and hard to tell from the pic, but looks more like my maxima himalaya...

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coops 3214
5 hours ago, Ben in Norcal said:

Are you sure that's gigas?  I'm no expert and hard to tell from the pic, but looks more like my maxima himalaya...

Sorry your right its ochlandra, my gigas is still small

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Ben in Norcal
4 hours ago, coops 3214 said:

Sorry your right its ochlandra, my gigas is still small

That sounds right - don't have ochlandra myself, but sounds like it is similar to urens/maxima.  So I buy that!

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cassowaryhill
On 02/01/2017, 11:48:49, tim_brissy_13 said:

Here's the D leptocheilos - it won't look like this after this coming winter but it's in a protected spot against the house so I'm hoping it pulls through.

20170102_080255_resized.jpg

Hey Hey @tim_brissy_13 which Big W?

 

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tim_brissy_13

Big W Southland (Cheltenham). They had a few left last time I checked around Xmas time.

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cassowaryhill
3 minutes ago, tim_brissy_13 said:

Big W Southland (Cheltenham). They had a few left last time I checked around Xmas time.

Cheers Thanks Mate!

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SirOxylon

Melbourne palm growers there are 2 Dypsis leptocheilos in 300 mm pots for $110 at Coolart Nursery south of Frankston. They are about 3-4 foot tall. They would have quite good resilience at that size I think.

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