Jump to content
Mohsen

My germination projects

Recommended Posts

Mohsen

It seems I am having my first sprout :)

I just put these Phoenix canariensis seeds in zip bag with wet paper towel and today I checked and as you see I can see some roots …

Please let me know, should I move them to pot right now or wait for the green shoot appears too ?

IMG_2798.JPG

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Small palm

Hey, that's funny I just got my first palm seeds to sprout too. They are Phoenix canariensis, 4 out of 5 sprouted while soaking in water. I took mine out and planted them into 4 inch pots. 

The roots were shorter than yours. I'm not sure if this was the right timing, but time will tell. 

I'm curious to see what other growers say. Good luck with your seeds.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Hey, that's funny I just got my first palm seeds to sprout too. They are Phoenix canariensis, 4 out of 5 sprouted while soaking in water. I took mine out and planted them into 4 inch pots. 

The roots were shorter than yours. I'm not sure if this was the right timing, but time will tell. 

I'm curious to see what other growers say. Good luck with your seeds.

That's interesting we have the same type of seeds and same timing , I guess we could compare them in future ...I think I 'd better wait till see the green shoot before put in pot but it would be great if we have other experienced member's ideas / suggestions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
awkonradi

I suggest pot them now.  Soil is a germinating seeds natural habitat.  Paper towels are alien.  The main reason for separate germination is just so you can see germination.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

I suggest pot them now.  Soil is a germinating seeds natural habitat.  Paper towels are alien.  The main reason for separate germination is just so you can see germination.

thanks, I will do that shortly...is it better to put them in separate small pots or in one big...I am not sure it would be easy or not to separate them in future if use 1 big pot ?

also I might put them in basement which is not very bright ...id there any problem with this?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

i put few in very small pot we had ...

also I noticed my Persian Date palm ( Mozafati) seeds our sprouting too ...

de2.jpg

de.jpg

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TexasColdHardyPalms

Cidp can go straight to 1g. They grow fast enough to skip liners. 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
DoomsDave

shoot me a PM Mohsen, if you want free seed

(or anyone else wants some, seed, that is)

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sabal Steve

These are probably the easiest seeds that I've ever germinated.  They can go right into 1 gallon pots with even tiny roots, some may die, but most will survive.  Keep them damp and in the shade.  Probably would do better outside in Sydney, than in the basement.

 

The elongated ones look like Phoenix reclinata seeds, which take the same care.

Edited by Sabal Steve
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pip

It is rather unusual for houses in Australia to have basements.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

It is rather unusual for houses in Australia to have basements.

It's actually an under ground storage as the property land has slope...

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

These are probably the easiest seeds that I've ever germinated.  They can go right into 1 gallon pots with even tiny roots, some may die, but most will survive.  Keep them damp and in the shade.  Probably would do better outside in Sydney, than in the basement.

 

The elongated ones look like Phoenix reclinata seeds, which take the same care.

the date seeds ((elongated)) are Mazafati Date  special to Iran in Bam city see below picture and link :

http://www.datecoop.com/mazafati-dates/

scsds.jpg

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

When I bought the Bismarkia , I asked and picked few Kentia palm seeds which seemed ripe and red...how easy they will germinate? anyone has any experiences? what is the best method?

FullSizeRender.jpg

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

 

 

IMG_2798.JPG

You should be careful to avoid that the cotyledonary sheath and the ligule (first plumule) do not grow straight. That’s the reason why I don’t like the bag method and prefer containers (photo below). – Here an example of a straight growing seedling:

5613b0f8eb26a_Lytocaryum_insigne_N1403.t

Germinating_Lyto_insigne_2014-02-08.thum

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jamesasb

 

 

 

You should be careful to avoid that the cotyledonary sheath and the ligule (first plumule) do not grow straight. That’s the reason why I don’t like the bag method and prefer containers (photo below). – Here an example of a straight growing seedling:

5613b0f8eb26a_Lytocaryum_insigne_N1403.t

 

What is the reason that you dont like it to grow straight please?

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

 

You should be careful to avoid that the cotyledonary sheath and the ligule (first plumule) do not grow straight. That’s the reason why I don’t like the bag method and prefer containers (photo below). – Here an example of a straight growing seedling:

What is the reason that you dont like it to grow straight please?

??? I wrote: "… careful to AVOID that the … do NOT grow straight." I think this means: careful to let them grow straight. Or what else? :bemused:

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

 

 

 

You should be careful to avoid that the cotyledonary sheath and the ligule (first plumule) do not grow straight. That’s the reason why I don’t like the bag method and prefer containers (photo below). – Here an example of a straight growing seedling:

5613b0f8eb26a_Lytocaryum_insigne_N1403.t

 

What is the reason that you dont like it to grow straight please?

 

Thanks Pal

For the rest of my seeds I used the germination tray with perlite/ peat moss/ sand ( originally for vegetables I guess) and also in small pots ...

I also soaked them for 48 hours , is this a must ? the problem is after I soaked all seeds together , I was not sure for 100% which one was which :(

FullSizeRender(1).jpg

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

When I bought the Bismarkia , I asked and picked few Kentia palm seeds which seemed ripe and red...how easy they will germinate? anyone has any experiences? what is the best method?

FullSizeRender.jpg

anyone has any advice on Kentia seeds?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Remove the pulp, wash them clean so that they don’t get mouldy. It’s not necessary to soak them because they are fresh. Then put them in your medium. The season (spring on your side of our planet) is ideal, so you have also the ideal temps. And then be patient, you have to wait. Perhaps the first seeds will germinate after 2 weeks, perhaps the last after one year (or even later). I guess (or hope) that ca. 30% will germinate within 2 months. Good luck! :greenthumb:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Maybe in one year your "Kentia" = Howea seedlings look like these ones (H. belmoreana, 10-11 months old):

Howea_belmoreana_2007-09-26.thumb.jpg.35

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JubaeaMan138

This year I got into germinating my own palms. In the short time I've managed to germinate canary Bismark caryota gigas and mitis foxtail several other Phoenix species butia jubaea and royals and so far the easiest and fastest germinating for me was canary and caryotas and the slowest were the royals seems like I waited like 8 months for any little sign of germination on the roystonea regia. Once the started they took off though and have actually have passed everything else up. What I'm wondering now with winter approaching they have all been in liners in a shaded planter bed under my giant bird of paradise wondering if I need to move them indoors with artificial lighting during winter?? Any ideas? We get a few days of mid 30 degree weather in riverside California 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

so far from my all seeds only Phoenix ones germinated ( after 5 weeks) , is there any hope ?:(

 

pm.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Remove the pulp, wash them clean so that they don’t get mouldy. It’s not necessary to soak them because they are fresh. Then put them in your medium. The season (spring on your side of our planet) is ideal, so you have also the ideal temps. And then be patient, you have to wait. Perhaps the first seeds will germinate after 2 weeks, perhaps the last after one year (or even later). I guess (or hope) that ca. 30% will germinate within 2 months. Good luck! :greenthumb:

Pal

I tried to remove the pulp, almost impossible task :( even using knife and still was not possible, soaked in hot water for hours and still not possible...doe it show they are not mature? they are very reddish...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Remove the pulp, wash them clean so that they don’t get mouldy. It’s not necessary to soak them because they are fresh. Then put them in your medium. The season (spring on your side of our planet) is ideal, so you have also the ideal temps. And then be patient, you have to wait. Perhaps the first seeds will germinate after 2 weeks, perhaps the last after one year (or even later). I guess (or hope) that ca. 30% will germinate within 2 months. Good luck! :greenthumb:

Pal

I tried to remove the pulp, almost impossible task :( even using knife and still was not possible, soaked in hot water for hours and still not possible...doe it show they are not mature? they are very reddish...

So the fruits are definitely not ripe. "Lytocaryum" is dirived from Greek luton "loose" and karuon "nut" which means "loose nut". Normally the seeds expose themselves through the pulp so that they get loose. You can find nice photos showing this phenomenon on Palmpedia: http://www.palmpedia.net/wiki/Lytocaryum_weddellianum

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Remove the pulp, wash them clean so that they don’t get mouldy. It’s not necessary to soak them because they are fresh. Then put them in your medium. The season (spring on your side of our planet) is ideal, so you have also the ideal temps. And then be patient, you have to wait. Perhaps the first seeds will germinate after 2 weeks, perhaps the last after one year (or even later). I guess (or hope) that ca. 30% will germinate within 2 months. Good luck! :greenthumb:

Pal

I tried to remove the pulp, almost impossible task :( even using knife and still was not possible, soaked in hot water for hours and still not possible...doe it show they are not mature? they are very reddish...

So the fruits are definitely not ripe. "Lytocaryum" is dirived from Greek luton "loose" and karuon "nut" which means "loose nut". Normally the seeds expose themselves through the pulp so that they get loose. You can find nice photos showing this phenomenon on Palmpedia: http://www.palmpedia.net/wiki/Lytocaryum_weddellianum

Thanks Pal

I was referring to Kentia pal seeds that I got from nursury 2 weks ago ....are they the same as "Lytocaryum"? the "Lytocaryum" had green pulp at first but after few days they turned to darker and easily removed the pulp...but Kentia ones were impossible to remove the pulp even with knife

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Remove the pulp, wash them clean so that they don’t get mouldy. It’s not necessary to soak them because they are fresh. Then put them in your medium. The season (spring on your side of our planet) is ideal, so you have also the ideal temps. And then be patient, you have to wait. Perhaps the first seeds will germinate after 2 weeks, perhaps the last after one year (or even later). I guess (or hope) that ca. 30% will germinate within 2 months. Good luck! :greenthumb:

Pal

I tried to remove the pulp, almost impossible task :( even using knife and still was not possible, soaked in hot water for hours and still not possible...doe it show they are not mature? they are very reddish...

So the fruits are definitely not ripe. "Lytocaryum" is dirived from Greek luton "loose" and karuon "nut" which means "loose nut". Normally the seeds expose themselves through the pulp so that they get loose. You can find nice photos showing this phenomenon on Palmpedia: http://www.palmpedia.net/wiki/Lytocaryum_weddellianum

Thanks Pal

I was referring to Kentia pal seeds that I got from nursury 2 weks ago ....are they the same as "Lytocaryum"? the "Lytocaryum" had green pulp at first but after few days they turned to darker and easily removed the pulp...but Kentia ones were impossible to remove the pulp even with knife

Oh, sorry, I’m always thinking only on Lytos:huh: – I don’t have any experience with really fresh, not dried Howea seeds. If it would be better to dry them a while or to "plant" them immediately I don’t know, but as you have so many seeds try one half now and let dry the other and "plant" it later.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Thanks Pal

How about "Chamaedorea oblongata" , do you know how easy they could germinate? and best practice? , I took around 30 seeds from Royal Botanic Gardens...they look fresh and ripe ...

ss15.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Thanks Pal

How about "Chamaedorea oblongata" , do you know how easy they could germinate? and best practice? , I took around 30 seeds from Royal Botanic Gardens...they look fresh and ripe ...

I have only experience with other Chamaedorea species, but since yours are fresh the only problem might be that they get mouldy. So it would be best to wash off all the pulp cleanly. Germination can be irregular, I think the first may sprout after one month or so.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Thanks Pal

How about "Chamaedorea oblongata" , do you know how easy they could germinate? and best practice? , I took around 30 seeds from Royal Botanic Gardens...they look fresh and ripe ...

I have only experience with other Chamaedorea species, but since yours are fresh the only problem might be that they get mouldy. So it would be best to wash off all the pulp cleanly. Germination can be irregular, I think the first may sprout after one month or so.

thanks Pal

a general question ? when we say sprout or germination after 1 month , it is when we see the first sign of roots or the green shoot...as I had some Phoenix canariensis and some Phoenix dactylifera seeds  rooted 2 weeks ago ( one Phoenix canariensis seed had at least 10 cm long root) and when I put them in pot and still no sign of any green shot :(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Thanks Pal

How about "Chamaedorea oblongata" , do you know how easy they could germinate? and best practice? , I took around 30 seeds from Royal Botanic Gardens...they look fresh and ripe ...

I have only experience with other Chamaedorea species, but since yours are fresh the only problem might be that they get mouldy. So it would be best to wash off all the pulp cleanly. Germination can be irregular, I think the first may sprout after one month or so.

thanks Pal

a general question ? when we say sprout or germination after 1 month , it is when we see the first sign of roots or the green shoot...as I had some Phoenix canariensis and some Phoenix dactylifera seeds  rooted 2 weeks ago ( one Phoenix canariensis seed had at least 10 cm long root) and when I put them in pot and still no sign of any green shot :(

This is a good question, but I can’t give a good answer: Even in my case it was different: Last century the "germination" was for me the day when I could see the plumule sprouting out of the surface of the soil (pic #1 showing the plumule of Phoenix canariensis). But since 2001 I was controlling my seeds regularly so that I counted the germination from the day on when the first seed petiole became visible (pic #2 Syagrus insignis).

Phoenix_canariensis_Seedling_1977-06.thu

Syagrus_insignis_1401_2014-02-14.thumb.j

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Thanks Pal

I am waiting for the first shoot...

Now I have another question...as I heard many times that most palms roots should not left to free air for more than few moment ( when we re potting for example) but it seems the just germinated seeds' roots are not that sensitive ( as you are showing the petiole contol it and then bring it back to its media without any harm) , am I right about this ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Thanks Pal

I am waiting for the first shoot...

Now I have another question...as I heard many times that most palms roots should not left to free air for more than few moment ( when we re potting for example) but it seems the just germinated seeds' roots are not that sensitive ( as you are showing the petiole contol it and then bring it back to its media without any harm) , am I right about this ?

It is correct "that the roots should not left to free air for more than FEW moment", so did I too. If there was a longer transplantation procedure I always moistened the bare roots. But there are also differences between palm genera and species: E.g. Lytocaryum weddellianum’s roots must not get dry even for a moment, but e.g. Chamaerops’ roots are much tougher and don’t mind.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

It seems I am having my first ever green shot coming out of soil ...it is a CIDP... :)

IMG_3004.JPG

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Pal, I need your help...almost all my palm seeds which I  bought over Ebay ( from QLD) got mould and only Phoenix dactylifera abd CIDP had roots ( Which I picked them myself from a Cemetery under a big CIDP) ,,,

I used Sphagnum Peat Moss...any way this project was a complete failure :(

The other half of seeds I put them in "the germination tray" which I think meant for vegetables

some of the seeds were : Licuala ramsayi, Hyophorbe lagenicaulis, Licuala spinosa, GAUSSIA MAYA, Trachycarpus wagnerianus, Chamaerops humilis, Rhopaloblaste ceramica, Chamaedorea Seifrizii...

FullSizeRender(1).thumb.jpg.7a02107ad02f89edc32364763fc07f0f.jpg

pm.thumb.jpg.f63b0d36121e301ca3d01ed6518e3fa7.jpg

Edited by Mohsen
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Pal, I need your help...almost all my palm seeds which I  bought over Ebay ( from QLD) got mould and only Phoenix dactylifera abd CIDP had roots ( Which I picked them myself from a Cemetery under a big CIDP) ,,,

I used Sphagnum Peat Moss...any way this project was a complete failure :(

The other half of seeds I put them in "the germination tray" which I think meant for vegetables

some of the seeds were : Licuala ramsayi, Hyophorbe lagenicaulis, Licuala spinosa, GAUSSIA MAYA, Trachycarpus wagnerianus, Chamaerops humilis, Rhopaloblaste ceramica, Chamaedorea Seifrizii...

Hello Mohsen, mould is one of the major problems which I too had with seeds that I didn’t collect myself.

At first I would sort out all seeds which already germinated and plant them separately in peat moss or soil mix. Then I would wash all remaining seeds in look warm water (20-30°C), then wash the peat moss with plenty of water, press out the water, and place the seeds back, except the seeds of Trachycarpus (and maybe one half of the Chamaedoreas) which should be placed separately. The germination temps of most of the seeds may be something between 25 and 30°C, but the Trachys (and maybe one half of the Chamaedoreas) should be hold below 25°C (around 20°C).

Mould likes humidity and temps below ca. 20°C, but dislikes wetness (wet moisture) and direkt sun or light. But wetness prevents on the other hand in most cases germination. So remains only regular control of the seeds, the temps, the moisture, the smell (moldy?), maybe some sunshine or other light, and good luck … :greenthumb:

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Thanks Pal

so my media is OK? ( Sphagnum Peat Moss)...also the box I am using?

I am not sure what will happen to the other half I put in Perlite/peat moss in germination tray ...I guess just waiting...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Thanks Pal

so my media is OK? ( Sphagnum Peat Moss)...also the box I am using?

I am not sure what will happen to the other half I put in Perlite/peat moss in germination tray ...I guess just waiting...

The medium is okay, but you have to control it regularly (you would have similar problems also with other media). Another possibility is using paper towl as medium for some seeds, I am using it at present for my Chamaedorea tuerckheimii seeds because they were also mouldy from the beginning. And with this medium it is very easy to control the progress (or problems) of germination. – With your other seeds in the trays I would recommend to control some of them very carefully and look if they are mouldy too.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Thanks Pal

I rinsed them in lukewarm water and this time I used Paper towel...problem is only few I could recognize their types :(

I am not sure if the fruit has been removed or not ( even if they are dried) for example these Wodyetia bifurcata and Black palm Normanbya normanbyi have very tough shell ...cant imagine how long will it take to break the shell and see any sprout ?

 

IMG_3094.JPG

IMG_3093(1).JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pal Meir

Thanks Pal

I rinsed them in lukewarm water and this time I used Paper towel...problem is only few I could recognize their types :(

I am not sure if the fruit has been removed or not ( even if they are dried) for example these Wodyetia bifurcata and Black palm Normanbya normanbyi have very tough shell ...cant imagine how long will it take to break the shell and see any sprout ?

I would place the Normanbya seeds as they are in seperate pots and place them so that the embryo shows to the middle of the pot; on the site of DavesGarden you can find informative photos of seeds and seedling, so you can imagine the further development: http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/showimage/269498/

Normanbya_Seeds_IMG_3093(1).thumb.jpg.14

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mohsen

Thanks Pal

I rinsed them in lukewarm water and this time I used Paper towel...problem is only few I could recognize their types :(

I am not sure if the fruit has been removed or not ( even if they are dried) for example these Wodyetia bifurcata and Black palm Normanbya normanbyi have very tough shell ...cant imagine how long will it take to break the shell and see any sprout ?

I would place the Normanbya seeds as they are in seperate pots and place them so that the embryo shows to the middle of the pot; on the site of DavesGarden you can find informative photos of seeds and seedling, so you can imagine the further development: http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/showimage/269498/

Normanbya_Seeds_IMG_3093(1).thumb.jpg.14

Thanks Pal

 

From what I bought the pictures above should belong to Wodyetia bifurcata not Normanbya unless they sold me the wrong one...

they are very big one with very hard shell...I though I need to break the shell to help germination...it is around 8 weeks since I put them in sponge peat moss and some in pot and still no sign of sprout...from the photo in DavesGarden , it seems they are very similar to each other...also from below picture it seems they  cover only half of the seed in media ( your favorite method :) ) and also position it horizontally ?

Juvenile_foxtail_palm.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...