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smithgn

Butia x Parajubaea Cocoides

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buffy

Who knows. Mine's been in the ground 3-4 years. I've heard that, but I'll have to see it to believe it.

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8B palms

Hi Buffy, what butia is the mother in your cross is it Butia odorata or Butia paraguayensis, as if it's the latter I would imagine it's less cold hardy than Odorata.

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Tom in Tucson

Just for the record Patric sold me a BXPJ sunkha in Oct. - a small liner. I will post pics of it's growth progression this spring.

Casas Adobes, AZ
Hi 64, Lo 40

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buffy

It's B. odorata, but again, the point is variability. If you're buying one of these and expecting a certain set of characteristics, then you may be disappointed. It's a mixed bag.

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Alberto

Three different B x P I´m growing here. Last pic : new opened inflorescence and a few fruits forming on an older infructescence

post-465-0-39805100-1419536068_thumb.jpg

post-465-0-76536300-1419536107_thumb.jpg

post-465-0-39709100-1419536156_thumb.jpg

post-465-0-79739100-1419536235_thumb.jpg

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Alberto

Some slower palm companions and BxP

Three BxP . Finally nice weather after heavy rains for two days !

post-465-0-72702700-1419536399_thumb.jpg

post-465-0-83876700-1419536465_thumb.jpg

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8B palms

Hi Alberto, first off merry Christmas. What exactly are your B x P crosses, which Butia species and parajubaea's. Also where are you located, which zone? and what lows have these crosses seen and what damage have they suffered.

Edited by 8B palms

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Alberto

Also a merry Christmas ! Mine BxP came from Patric Schaffer as seeds. I´m not sure which Butia was used (Butia odorata / paraguayensis) and the pollen came from a Parajubaea cocoides. They didn´t saw extreme cold until now. Coldest was plus minus -5,5ºC and they did not suffer any damage .

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Ben in Norcal

When did yours go in the ground, Alberto? How old are they?

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8B palms

Thanks Alberto, so like others have said there is variation even with the same cross. So -5.5 is approx 21oF. So are you a zone 9a or 8b?

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Alberto

Most of the years 9b, some years 9a and a "century freeze" 8b, if that makes sense.

This BxP were planted in 2008 and in october 2008 the little palms show the first pinate mature leaves:

http://www.palmsociety.org.uk/forum/topic.asp?boardid=1&show=31&page=0&topicid=1983&topicpage=1

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8B palms

See I am a solid 8b, so I am nervous long term what's the potential. I know Patric has Butia odorata x Parajubaea cocoides and I here maybe Butia eriospatha x Parajubaea sunkha in the spring. Wondering what the ultimate cold hardiness of these 2 hybrids might be. I know initially they might suffer burn or spear pull, but when they get some size I wonder how cold hardy, any thoughts anyone?

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Alberto

P. sunkha is a lot cold hardier then P. cocoides for sure!

B. eriospatha grows wild in Santa Catarina also in higher places where queen palms are absent, So it is pprobably one of the cold hardiest butias; Are you sure it is Butia erio x P. sunkha Patric is producing now?

I tried to hybridize my B. erio with sunkha pollen from my palms, but without succes until now. I´ll try again with VERY fresh pollen .....

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Zeeth

Thanks for the pics Alberto! Yours definitely seem to have more characteristics of the Butia parent than the Parajubaea. I wonder what this hybrid will look like when it gets big! They seem to grow very fast for you, so I would imagine that it wouldn't take too long. Are your Beccariophoenix still okay after the -5.5 degree C weather?

B. erio x P. sunkha would probably be the best combination for this hybrid in Florida. P. sunhka seems to perform moderately well in north Florida from the posts I've seen, so it seems like it would be a good choice for this hybrid.

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8B palms

Smithgn said he had this cross one first page of this thread on November 26th I believe. Maybe this is not true, maybe Snithgn can confirm this.

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8B palms

Smithgn said he had this cross one first page of this thread on November 26th I believe. Maybe this is not true, maybe Snithgn can confirm this.

Josh76 stated that this is the cross on page 2 if this thread, so maybe he can confirm

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smithgn

The hybrid Patric sent me was a Butia capitata (Odorata) x P. Cocoides. After looking back at the e-mail, Patric did say he would have PJ Sunkha available "at some later date". I mistakenly thought he said it'd be available in the spring. Anyway, just to make it official, here's what he said in response to an e-mail I sent him:

Dear N. Smith
The plant has been in a unheated GH 50/100 full light .
Butia parent is a capitara type , pollen parent is PJ Cocoides
I will have PJ Sunkha at some later date
PATRIC

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8B palms

Hi Smithgn, thanks for clarifying that.

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Josh76

Yep - he emailed me a few days ago saying that he had one-leaf Butia capitata (i.e. odorata) x Parajubaea sunkha... but they are too small to sell at the moment.

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tank

My B x PJ. Been in the ground for about 3 years. Still gets spear damage during heavy frost but older leaves show no damage. Spear damage is usually minor and plant quickly grows out of it in the spring. Kinda getting to the size where these hybrids dramatically increase their growth rates. Already noticeably picking up speed this spring. Little P. sunkha is peeking in from the left on the lower planter.

post-526-0-25756300-1425310427_thumb.jpg

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Tropicdoc

Looking good Tank. Mine are going in the ground in 3 weeks. I'll post pics. I've noticed that these are rather wispy at a young age, but the leaflets seem to get denser as they mature. I hope ours follow suit.

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Tropicdoc

I have also noticed variability in the length of the petiole. I'm hoping for flatter fronds, short petiole, and dense leaflets. I get that with hybrids its kind of a crap shoot, though.

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Mandrew968

My B x PJ. Been in the ground for about 3 years. Still gets spear damage during heavy frost but older leaves show no damage. Spear damage is usually minor and plant quickly grows out of it in the spring. Kinda getting to the size where these hybrids dramatically increase their growth rates. Already noticeably picking up speed this spring. Little P. sunkha is peeking in from the left on the lower planter.

attachicon.gifbutiaXparaj1.JPG

That's a sweet spot and a great choice for such a location. Hope it grows out of the spear pull--that always makes me nervous...

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tank

My B x PJ. Been in the ground for about 3 years. Still gets spear damage during heavy frost but older leaves show no damage. Spear damage is usually minor and plant quickly grows out of it in the spring. Kinda getting to the size where these hybrids dramatically increase their growth rates. Already noticeably picking up speed this spring. Little P. sunkha is peeking in from the left on the lower planter.

attachicon.gifbutiaXparaj1.JPG

That's a sweet spot and a great choice for such a location. Hope it grows out of the spear pull--that always makes me nervous...

Thanks Andrew,

Its not really a spear pull, just kinda junked up right at the point where it emerges from the base. Usually results in half of that leaf looking torched. Pretty common for these hybrids. Mules usually stop losing their spears at about this size so I hope this one follows suit. A little bummed because my low was right around what I see every year, around 26F.

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Tropicdoc

Tank, I don't think its the cold. One of mine spent the winter in a GH that was heated on freezing nights. It has the same spear issue. I can't remember if it is the one that had the same thing when I got it.

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tank

Tank, I don't think its the cold. One of mine spent the winter in a GH that was heated on freezing nights. It has the same spear issue. I can't remember if it is the one that had the same thing when I got it.

Not sure what else it would be. Any ideas?

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Kailua_Krish

No idea. I thought it was cold/damp as mine had this same problem!

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Tropicdoc

Maybe cool and damp, but like I said, one of mine had it when I got it, and I have not let these palms see below 35 F. Maybe humid, stagnant air?

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Tropicdoc

Hey, Alberto, why don't you try to pollinate one of those butia x parajub with syagrus pollen. :hmm: In my imagination, that would create an absolutely beautiful palm. Then, since it was my idea, you can send me some seeds. :mrlooney:

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JasonD

Some slower palm companions and BxP

Three BxP . Finally nice weather after heavy rains for two days !

What is the palm in the right front of the photo, with the stiff, plumose leaves?

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Ben in Norcal

Syagrus comosa?

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Josh-O

Jason, the leaves appear to be pinnate. My guess is ravenea xerophila

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County Ag Agent

Dear Guy's, I love the palm talk.  I live in New Mexico and have over 250 palms in the ground.  I see you have a friend who has unusual hybrids.  Would you mind sharing his name and address so that I may have the opportunity to purchase some of his hybrids?  I promise not to buy him out, first off I don't have enough money and second my space is becoming limited.  I love the Butia x Parajubaea hybrids.  I have Parajubaea torallyi and it has been down to 5F.  foliage was burned off, but it came back strong in the spring.  that was in 2011, since then it has not frozen back.  I appreciate your help as fellow palm enthusiasts.  Jeff

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Tom in Tucson

Patric(k) Schafer basically runs a one man operation - no web site. His e-mail address is  coolhybrids@wildblue.net.

Great information on your Parajubaea tor. tor..

Tom Birt - Casas Adobes, AZ

Hi 79, Lo 58 (10-7)

 

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Tropicdoc

That's incredible that p torallyi can survive 5 F!

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Alicehunter2000

P. sunkha looking good but growing ..... sloooow...in 9a N. Florida. Hot summer part shade location does not appear to bother it.

2016-07-17 11.45.13.jpg

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Tropicdoc

IMG_1489.thumb.JPG.2d9f963d1d485fd4d18e2a good thing to come out of our recent deep freeze.... the dwarf ginger surrounding my hybrids froze and needed to be cut down. Now I can see my palms... and they look great! 25 degrees and wet with no damage! Love it!

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Tropicdoc

And here's a pic of my other one (both are butia x pjc from Patrick)

IMG_1486.JPG

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Tropicdoc

So, no obvious cold damage to my 2 hybrids, but the most recently opened fronds on both of them collapsed. In other words, the whole frond is green and open, but the petiole buckled and turned brown. I guess that is the "spear funk" yall have been talking about? I don't see a new spear! I'm getting a little worried. I'm not sure if its cold damage or wind damage now that the palm is not surrounded/ supported by all of that ginger.

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Sandy Loam

Tropicdoc, what was the extreme low temperature that you experienced this winter?

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