Jump to content
Cikas

Bismarckia nobilis ( Dubrovnik )

Recommended Posts

Explorer

Cicas, this is the kind of data that has me much more convinced. This French map of the subtropical zones in the Mediterranean does have your city right in the middle of one.

547163ZoneSubtroppalarctiqueocc.jpg

This is the most anti-scientific map ever. Look at how the author uses the actual boundaries of the Koeppen Desert Climate to show the "subtropical" boundaries. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Koppen_World_Map_BWh.png

All of the Mediterranean coastal regions are subtropical (either Mediterranean type or humid)Whatever can be grown in Southern California - can be grown in a good portion of the Mediterranean. And that list easily includes Bismarckias. Landscaping around hotels in the Antalya area of Turkey from Kemer to Belek (not even marked as an enclave on the map) often includes Dypsis lutescens and Ravenea rivularis, which thrive there with ample irrigation. I've even seen Roystoneas on pictures from there. Does that not qualify as subtropics?

Subtropics also include most of the Black Sea shores and even some inland European areas. Yalta in Ukraine is zone 8b and Sochi in Russia is zone 9a. Batumi in Georgia is zone 9b with more rainfall than anywhere in Florida. And Trachycarpus fortunei is becoming invasive near Lake Geneva in Switzerland.

Europe is much more palm-friendly than one would think.

Well the Black Sea area I would say is more warm temperate then realy subtropical! Yalta can get pretty cold sometimes with -22 C in cold winters, and Sochi sometimes get snow. So no Bismarckias there or other near troipical palms like Roystonea. Trachycarpus fortunei is not a subtropical palm, they grow even pretty well in the Netherlands, certainly in my are in the West of the country they are able to survive the odd nasty cold winters here. And they have survived here in the country in areas with -18 to -20 C and even colder. T. fortunei like T. takil is probably from a mountain origin where snow and frost are not uncommon in winter. And if you say the sort of habitat where T. takil grows, its a mixture of broadleave and laurophyllos trees and some coniferous species.

Alexander

Alexander, where is your information coming from? All time record low in Yalta is -12.3C, recorded at a weather station at 250m elevation in 1950. Down at the sea level it's never been below -10C and the average yearly low is around -5C, making the immediate shore area of Yalta zone 9a. And there are warmer places in the Greater Yalta than Yalta proper, like Simeiz, Alupka, Foros. I lived in another Yalta suburb - Gurzuf at some point, so I'm very familiar with the climate there. Areas below 300m elevation in Yalta have true Mediterranean climate, albeit not as warm some other Mediterranean place. I posted pictures a while ago http://www.palmtalk.org/forum/index.php?/topic/29766-palms-in-ukraine/?p=482209 which were taken during one of the coldest stretches in the current Century. On the second photo you can see how the snow does not exist near the sea.

Sochi has a true humid subtropical climate. Snow is not a good way to measure subtropicalness. It has snowed in Tampa after all - http://fcit.usf.edu/florida/photos/envirmnt/weather/0627.htm

Well in Januari 24, 2010 it was a particulair cold winter in the Jalta aerea. With minus 20 C that night. Well one problem when I look at wetteronline.de is that they seem to messure temperatures for both Yalta or Sevastopol at Simferopol. Maybe there it went wrong. But looking at pictures of Yalta I see only Trachycarpus fortunei planted as a palm, no Phoenix canariensis or Washingtonias. In my area you can also grow Trachycarpus fortunei, though its certainly not subtropical here! Well much cooler then Yalta offcourse. But T. fortunei can go down to -20 C at sheltered sites!

Well usely you see those palm planted when the climate allows it as those are vast and easy growing palms. In Sochi thought you see also Washintonoa and Phoenix canariensis thanks to the much milder climate. Its gets much better protection from the high Caucassus mountains then Yalta.

Yalta is also pretty far north, at arround 46 degrees latitude north. So its more a warm temperate climate then really subtropical.

Alexander

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SouthSeaNate

The map is very wrong, it doesn't show Malta as sub-tropical, when here is USDA zone 11a.

We can grow Plumeria, Delonix, Poinsettia & palms such as Dypsis lutescens with ease.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cheshirepalms

This is by no means detailed or entirely accurate, but its does give a basic, realistic idea of where the zones are and still fitting in most of Europe.

xtra-europe.gif

Edited by cheshirepalms

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SouthSeaNate

This map is one of the most accurate I have seen for Europe & it even has Malta on it, which is missing from many maps lol

zone.PNG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas

The map is very wrong, it doesn't show Malta as sub-tropical, when here is USDA zone 11a.

We can grow Plumeria, Delonix, Poinsettia & palms such as Dypsis lutescens with ease.

The thing is, sub-tropical climate is not measured by USDA zones, nor by were tropical plants like Plumeria, Delonix, Poinsettia ect. can grow. Almost whole coastal Mediterranean has sub-tropical climate ( Csa ).

Mediterranean climate is a form of sub-tropical climate acording to Köppen climate classification.

Sub-tropical climate has three forms:

1. Humid Subtropical climate ( Cfa )- warm, hot but humid summers and dry, mild winters.

2. Mediterranean climate ( Csa )- Hot and dry summers, but humid and mild winters.

3. Highland variety ( Cfb, Cwb )

So we all live in subtropical climate technically.

Dubrovnik is according to Köppen climate classification bordeline humid subtropical (Cfa) and Mediterranean climate (Csa). Because here only 2 summer months has less than 40 millimetres (1.6 in) of rainfall.

This year summer was humid subtropical, because we had alot of rainfall. Record even.

Areas with sub-tropical climate in the world.

Subtropical.png

Edited by Cikas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas

This map is one of the most accurate I have seen for Europe & it even has Malta on it, which is missing from many maps lol

zone.PNG

Not that accurate at all. For example Istria is USDA 9 according to this map. And in real life is USDA 8.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
palmazon

That's like saying we yankees can grow Ptychosperma elegans, Alocasia, and Codiaeum in Boston...

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SouthSeaNate

The map is very wrong, it doesn't show Malta as sub-tropical, when here is USDA zone 11a.

We can grow Plumeria, Delonix, Poinsettia & palms such as Dypsis lutescens with ease.

The thing is, sub-tropical climate is not measured by USDA zones, nor by were tropical plants like Plumeria, Delonix, Poinsettia ect. can grow. Almost whole coastal Mediterranean has sub-tropical climate ( Csa ).

Mediterranean climate is a form of sub-tropical climate acording to Köppen climate classification.

Sub-tropical climate has three forms:

1. Humid Subtropical climate ( Cfa )- warm, hot but humid summers and dry, mild winters.

2. Mediterranean climate ( Csa )- Hot and dry summers, but humid and mild winters.

3. Highland variety ( Cfb, Cwb )

So we all live in subtropical climate technically.

Dubrovnik is according to Köppen climate classification bordeline humid subtropical (Cfa) and Mediterranean climate (Csa). Because here only 2 summer months has less than 40 millimetres (1.6 in) of rainfall.

This year summer was humid subtropical, because we had alot of rainfall. Record even.

Areas with sub-tropical climate in the world.

Subtropical.png

Yes I know all Mediterranean climates are sub-tropical, but I was referring to the map that had "subtropical enclaves" on it. And USDA zones are helpful to guide you what will grow in your climate.

This map is one of the most accurate I have seen for Europe & it even has Malta on it, which is missing from many maps lol

zone.PNG

Not that accurate at all. For example Istria is USDA 9 according to this map. And in real life is USDA 8.

I said it was the most accurate I had seen, no map is going to be 100% accurate for everywhere as they are merely interpretations, especially over large areas where climate data is limited. It is however one of the few that actually has Malta on it, most miss it off completely.

That's like saying we yankees can grow Ptychosperma elegans, Alocasia, and Codiaeum in Boston...

Ok, the previously mentioned tropical plants can be grown outside, unprotected, year round... But I'm guessing you knew that anyway... :interesting:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cheshirepalms

The map southseanate has published, is the best by far and gives a great general idea of where the zones are located. It's impossible to show everything on a map covering thousands of miles. It sums up the UK nicely with such a large scale.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cluster

Malta does not look zone 11 to me with those lows not even Lampedusa, but I am no expert:).

ps:the temperatures in Cyprus are for a small period of time not 1961-1990 but regarding climates people use different measures of mean temperatures so everything is even more subjective. As far as zones go it seems to me Limassol is in the same one as Malta, though a bit warmer in annual mean.

http://www.weatherbase.com/weather/weather.php3?s=10671&cityname=Limassol-Limassol-District-Cyprus

http://www.tutiempo.net/clima/Akrotiri/176010.htm

malta:

http://www.weatherbase.com/weather/weather.php3?s=79561&cityname=Valletta--United-States-of-America

Edited by Cluster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SouthSeaNate

Malta is in USDA zone 11a. To work out the zone you need to find the absolute minimum temperature every year over a 30 year period, then average those temperatures out to find the mean. In Malta the annual average absolute minimum is 6.2C, putting it in zone 11a. This is worked out from a weather station in the centre of the island too, so at the coast it will be a little milder still.

And yes a little unfair to compare the Limassol averages, which are from 1991-2005 & not the standard 30 year period used by most other meteorological agencies around the world, to averages for Valletta, which doesn't even have a weather station & seems to be using general averages, rather than from actual data. There are two weather stations used for data in Malta, one at Luqa Airport & the other at Balzan. If using Balzan data then the annual mean is a little closer to that of Limassol... Though it's not a competition :winkie:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Malta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cluster

Limassol is just as warm as Lampedusa and if you check the true mean temperatures (tu tiempo records the true mean of official stations/WMO not the (max-min)/2) of the past 10 years they are equal at 20 c and they are impressive we only have a warmer official weather station in the southwest Madeira island. Did not not know usda was the average absolute minimum. Lampedusa had a low around 3c this year, but obviously it only goes like that very few times.

Edited by Cluster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SouthSeaNate

Tutiempo records are not that accurate, it has shown below freezing temperatures for Luqa Malta before when the record low there is +1.4C. I would be very surprised if it dropped to 3C there as the lowest last winter at Luqa (inland) was 7C & lowest here at the coast was 9C.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
nick

Primary, the USDA zones were worked out for the US climate and the topography there (without nearly no protection against northern cold spells) You can find those zones for Europe also, but it makes little sence to count on. It can be only a rough evaluation.

For example, in some USDA 10 zones you can grow coconut trees e.g. in Malta (zone 11) do they survive as in Madeira?

The focus has to be on more issues as to mention the absolute min temperatures reached once in 30 years. :interesting:

Look what grows on your spot and be lucky or not, that's my opinion.The plant is the indicator. :)

only my 2c

cheers nick

Edited by nick
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cluster

I agree with Nick the plant either grows or only grows for some years(till a cold winter) or does not grow and that is what will count at the end. The problem with coconuts is not just extreme temperatures but lack of heat for prolonged time and the USDA system won't work for them necessarily. Anyway with or without coconuts there are plenty of lovely palms like this garden shows us that many people can appreciate:)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Explorer

According to that USDA map I should have a zone 8 climate. Well lots of so called zone 8 palms like Butia are not coldhardy here. Only those things wich survive in a zone 7 winter can be grown in the long term. And at least every 8 or 10 years we get a really cold winter here. Those cold ones determine whats really hardy in the end.

Alexander

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SouthSeaNate

Primary, the USDA zones were worked out for the US climate and the topography there (without nearly no protection against northern cold spells) You can find those zones for Europe also, but it makes little sence to count on. It can be only a rough evaluation.

For example, in some USDA 10 zones you can grow coconut trees e.g. in Malta (zone 11) do they survive as in Madeira?

The focus has to be on more issues as to mention the absolute min temperatures reached once in 30 years. :interesting:

Look what grows on your spot and be lucky or not, that's my opinion.The plant is the indicator. :)

only my 2c

cheers nick

The USDA zones are not worked out from topography, they are worked out, as I explained, from the average absolute annual minimum temperature recorded over a 30 year period. It isn't worked out from the absolute minimum recorded every 30 years... So the same system can tell you what zone you are in wherever you are. Obviously it is only useful to a certain degree, as like you mentioned a 10b/11a climate can support a Cocos nucifera in Florida, but not in California, or Cyprus or Malta...

There are no Coconut palms in Malta, that I know of, but frost has never been recorded here. The record low temperature for Malta is 1.2C, which was recorded in Valletta in 1859. So night time temperatures are no problem for many tropical plants during the winter, it is the daytime highs which are more of a limiting factor to such tropicals as Coconut palms...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
nick

SouthSeaNate, you are also right, I just wanted to explain not to focus too much on the USDA-Zones. We are in Europe and I wonder how many people attract attention to this US issue based on this bismarckia thread. The maps and zones are incomplete, as some mentioned here.

Regarding the topography US vs. Europe, the biggest difference are the protecting mountains (pyrenees, alps or the turkish highland) agaist the cold/frost in the Mediterranean. But as you say, daytime highs during the winter period can be more a limiting factor even if it is frost free.

So suck it and see. :innocent:

cheers

Nick

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas

We have some strange weather on Mediterranean these days. Formation of hurricane in Mediterranean. :bemused:

10437767_856138777750672_284579917894797

http://youtu.be/KEyLN_ob0GU

Edited by Cikas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jimhardy

California Coconut

image.jpg

Edited by Jimhardy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Phoenikakias

Errrr, is it still alive?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alicante

California Coconut

image.jpg

That california coconut it's placed very strategically with a lot of things for his care and a lot of special treatments like "hotter" soil. Or at least that's what I readed and it says the sign below it.

067afebf.jpg

Errrr, is it still alive?

I don't know what to say if it survived to the winter because I don't know the answer (i'm from Spain, not CA) but looking at the last Street View, it only has 1 (maybe 2?) leaves, and it's from October 2014...

maybe the answer is yes ¿? I really hope not :crying: . But 3 colder months have passed through it... and until June all the months are colder than October. (looking at the official climate chart)

24uz5ao.jpg

Coconuts are totally impossible to be grown in California. All unprotected "projects" have ended in a very sad way, it only survived this one with special carings, so really it's a kind of "cheat" because is not growing under natural conditions of Newport Beach. Because it would died his first winter. (I say that basing on Newport Beach official climate chart and basing in this last 2 years daily temperatures during November, December, January,February and March of Newport Beach)

Edited by pRoeZa*

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alicante

Cicas, I don't see the same bismarckia compared year after year in that thread. if you post 4 years worth of weather data I would still not be convinced, I could post my own last 4 years and it would be very misleading. You need long term averages and extremes, not 4 years of data to determine if a palm is viable. And it's not me you have to convince, it's your bismarckia that you have to convince to keep growing year after year for you.

I am well aware of the differences between Europe and the US. However, my skepticism arises when I look at your particular location, and I compare it to Greece. If Kostas and Constantinos have difficulty growing a particular palm, and they are surrounded by more water than you and they are further South than you where it's much warmer, then it's simply really hard to fathom that you could grow something that they can't. That's where my skepticism comes from. And don't interpret my skepticism as discouragement, quite the contrary, by all means, plant a coconut if you must, I would be very happy for your success, and not the least bit jealous either. I am only jealous of your rich culture and architecture, which we just don't have over here. The hot Summers, that you can keep for yourself. The hottest I am willing to deal with when it comes to gardening is Hawaii's elevations above 800 feet.

Years ago I had to spend the entire month of December in Europe. I spent a lot of time that month to find a place in Europe where I could escape the dreary Winter even just for a few days. So I looked at all the Winter averages. The only place in all of Europe that had Winter averages similar to Southern California was the Canary Islands. All of Greece, Italy, Southern France and Spain are plagued by average December and January lows 12C or worse.

That climate is not a comparation with the southern parts of Europe, it's a comparation with Canary Islands ¿? It's a joke, right? :floor: My friend, you are wrong! They play in absolutely different leagues.

Mate... The Canary Islands got temps like Miami if we talk about minimums almost all the year (specially on winters); only a degree lower in summer. And almost the same maximum temperatures as Orlando in winters.

Comparing your climate with that one of the Canary Islands is... like comparing Hawaii with Texas. :hmm: (well if we talk about pluviometry Canary Islands are very dry; like SoCal but SoCal from Mexico, not EEUU's SoCal)

The lowest temperature recorded ever in Santa Cruz, CA is -9ºC; or basically in Florida, like in Orlando which is at 28ºN like the Canary Islands it's -8ºC. (I'm basing in the recorded on official stations)

Let me say you something; -8ºC at Canary Islands...¿? yes, in places with more than 2000m or I think even more altitude.

In the whole 2014, any day it went under 20ºC (as maximum temperature, not minimum); think that in Tenerife for example, the lowest temperature recorded in the history is 10.1ºC in 2011; (another lower recording in the history, of 9.4ºC, was registered in 1950 but it's not very clear because in that era, the meteorological stations weren't very accurate) in Tenerife temps under 13º are very very rare; they occur about 2/3 times in a decade. And is on USDA zone 12b. With obviously, a lot of coconuts which they fructify. In a few places being a problem some ones planted on the street because they can fall on people heads or they can fall below cars.

Years ago I had to spend the entire month of December in Europe. I spent a lot of time that month to find a place in Europe where I could escape the dreary Winter even just for a few days. So I looked at all the Winter averages. The only place in all of Europe that had Winter averages similar to Southern California was the Canary Islands. All of Greece, Italy, Southern France and Spain are plagued by average December and January lows 12C or worse.

Hope you are joking Axel... you are talking like continental Europe is worse than north california... You can go to Marbella any day in December and feel warmer at night than yesterday night in your place or even in downtown santacruz... Now you are not speaking the truth basically if you think in places like Almuñecar or Malaga in December (maybe in late February you could have few cold nights) you feel cold... Actually I can say without fear that Almeria in Spain is wyyyy warmer in winter than any palmy place like San Diego in south california....

Canary Islands is in a different league climate wise than socal, you can compare Canary Islands to Hawaii but not socal to Canary islands.... is just not comparable...

100% agreed Halekuma. Southern California has almost the same averages as a lot of places in Spain's coast and Europe too. For example the Valencian Community coast, Murcia coast, and all southernmost Spain coast. That without counting Malta, Ibiza and Mallorca, southernmost Portugal, the coast of Sicily, the southermost coast of Greece, south islands of Greece, Cyprus...

Edited by pRoeZa*

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alicante

BTW Cikas you got some very beautiful palm trees here!!!

How are looking now those Adonidas? I would like a lot to see some photos specially for seeing their winter resistance.

And mate! Those ones doesn't "look like crap" like you said on the first page. Those ones are beautiful! :greenthumb:

SAM_3921_zps97b78368.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Phoenikakias

What I see however is a headlight near them aiming at them! A very clever way to keep immediately surounding temps higher during night. :winkie: Of course if you are able to pay electricity bill...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alicante

Uhh! Now I understand the big difference with those ones planted on Dubvronik's streets too.

SAM_3920_zpsceb11e0c.jpg

I am seeing that they're in a type of tourist complex or something like that, no ? I think it deserves for those 3 beautiful palms from the previous photo!

Edited by pRoeZa*

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
akaranus

two pics after winter, after 3 years in ground, they sure dont look good and established, question is will they ever...i think they are on the road to slow degrading end..

P1130585.jpg
P1130587.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Kostas

I think they are on a slow road to establishing. Bismarckia want lots of water during the growing season and take many years to establish after transplanting. They should eventually be ok but really need to be kept moist during the growing season

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas

They will be OK. They look as good as they can be after hurricane strong winds, we've had this winter (the strongest in the last 10 years). And these two are planted on very exposed position.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Phoenikakias

I do not like what I see... On some occasions I made some comments regarding the cultivation of Bizzies in Europe.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LivistonaFan

Cikas, how is your Bizzie looking now in peak of summer after this cold winter? I couldn´t find another post about it, so I hope it is thriving?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
akaranus

All bizzies in croatia died last winter...temperatures were from -5 to -8 for couple of days...there is no survivers after that in ours relatively cold and moist winters(the main problem for bizzies after absolute minimume)

Edited by akaranus
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LivistonaFan

That is really sad:(, maybe Cikas can confirm his loss or is he in an exceptional microclimate? I didn't know it got that cold down there, because Cikas said Dubrovnik is at least a solid 9b( I was once there and couldn't see much more than occasional CIDPs and Washingtonias between pines and cypresses. Maybe I was in the wrong region, but this would look more like a solid 8b/9a longterm) ? I searched for some temperature charts and the only ones I found didn't show that low temperatures, but since you live there you should know what temperatures really were there. 

Here are the charts I found:

5b709a4d2ad7b_Screenshot(341).png.063b9b

Interestingly, the 27th of February is missing in this chart. Maybe they switched the station off to make Dubrovnik look more warm in winter:D?

5b709a5c03f2e_Screenshot(340).png.3943f6

With these temperatures the Bizzies should have survived, although they might not have liked the conditions (especially the almost daily rainfall)?

Maybe the weather stations are directly at the sea in front of a south/west facing wall, this would explain the distinct temperature difference between your experiences and the recordings:blink:.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas
1 hour ago, akaranus said:

All bizzies in croatia died last winter...temperatures were from -5 to -8 for couple of days...there is no survivers after that in ours relatively cold and moist winters(the main problem for bizzies after absolute minimume)

Not last winter. Last winter minimum in Dubrovnik was around 0C. Mine bizzie died after cold wave that lasted for few days at begining of 2017. At my place apsolute minimum was - 5.4C. We were 48 hours below freezing. That was the worst cold wave in the last 40-50 years. Bizzie died from crown rot. We had alot of rain after the cold wave. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas
23 minutes ago, LivistonaFan said:

That is really sad:(, maybe Cikas can confirm his loss or is he in an exceptional microclimate? I didn't know it got that cold down there, because Cikas said Dubrovnik is at least a solid 9b( I was once there and couldn't see much more than occasional CIDPs and Washingtonias between pines and cypresses. Maybe I was in the wrong region, but this would look more like a solid 8b/9a longterm) ? I searched for some temperature charts and the only ones I found didn't show that low temperatures, but since you live there you should know what temperatures really were there. 

Here are the charts I found:

5b709a4d2ad7b_Screenshot(341).png.063b9b

Interestingly, the 27th of February is missing in this chart. Maybe they switched the station off to make Dubrovnik look more warm in winter:D?

5b709a5c03f2e_Screenshot(340).png.3943f6

With these temperatures the Bizzies should have survived, although they might not have liked the conditions (especially the almost daily rainfall)?

Maybe the weather stations are directly at the sea in front of a south/west facing wall, this would explain the distinct temperature difference between your experiences and the recordings:blink:.

Last winter our minimum was around 0C. And that event lasted only one night. Even my banana plants had good leaves after that winter. Soo maybe Akaranus mistaken the last winter with winter 2016/2017. In early 2017. we had cold wave. Worst cold wave in the last 40-50 years. Our normal winters are USDA 9b/10a. But apsolute minimum during that cold wave was - 5.4C. Which was very very cold for my place Trsteno. Even our native plants were damaged by the cold. Alot of dead birds and other animals. My Bizzie died from crown rot few months after the cold wave (cold wave lasted few days). 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas

Also Akaranus is from Split ( 165 km north of Dubrovnik ). And he is refering to the whole coastal Croatia, not just Dubrovnik. Split and northen parts of coastal Croatia were much colder than Dubrovnik during that cold wave ( early 2017. ). Even the last winter had cold wave there with a few degrees below zero.

As for palms in Dubrovnik. The most common palms are CIDP, true date, Washingtonia robusta, filifera, Chamaerops, Trachycarpus. Not because of our climate, but because other palm species were not available in nurseries and stores until recently ( when Croatia became a member of EU ). Even now they are rare and hard to find in nurseries and stores here. All palms in my garden are ordered from other EU countries ( Spain, the Netherlands, Germany ect.. ).

CIDP will become very rare here in future ( red palm weevel ). Alot of palms died from that pest.

Our USDA zone is ( the sum of the absolute minimums in the last 30 years ) is upper USDA 9b. But every 40-50 years we can get USDA 9a minimum. But normaly cold waves here are short. They last 1-2 days in whole winter. And 40% of our winters ( 4 out 10 winters on average ) we do not go below freezing at all whole winter.

Other palms like Butia, Sabal, Queens, Jubea, Parajubaea, Trithrinax, livistona, other phoenix species ect. are very rare here.

Alot of people here do not care for palms at all. And they only know 2 palm species, fan and feather ( :D ). Different, more rare palms can be find only in private gardens of people like me ( who really like exotic plants ).

Here is some palms in Dubrovnik area.

343579-svetik.jpg

dubrovnik-croatia.jpg

lopud_22_110614_tw768.jpg

palme-posat.jpg

s12.jpg

Edited by Cikas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cikas

Some photos from my garden taken this summer ( all of these survived that cold wave ). This is just small part of my collection ( I need to take photos )

Alocasia

P7231099.jpg

P7231100.jpg

Parajubaea cocoides

P7231105.jpg

Butia catarinensis

P7291107.jpg

P7291110.jpg

Sabal yapa ( this one was a pleasant surprise, because it is native to the tropical region )

P7291111.jpg

P7291112.jpg

Phoenix loureirii

P7191105.jpg

P7191107.jpg

Sabal bermudana ( one of few I had )

P7231097.jpg

P7231098.jpg

Parajubaea microcarpa with strelitzia alba in background

P7231103.jpg

Queen palm ( one of many in my garden ) with strelitzia nicolai

P5091004.jpg

I also have planted in garden Butia eriospatha, yatay, odorata, paraguayensis, Sabal minor and causiarum, Phoenix sylvestris, reclinata, theophrasti, Trithrinax campestris and acanthocoma, Trachycarpus latisectus, ukhrulensis, takil, martianus ( Khashia hills form ), Livistona nitida, australis and chinensis. chamaerops all main forms, serenoa repens green form, chamadorea elegans, radicalis and pochutlensis, brahea dulcis blue ect.. many more species are in pots waiting for to be planted.

Also had other exotic plants like strelitzia ( alba, nicolai, few different forms of reginae ), few types of edible bananas ( like Fen ba jiao, Ice cream, Pisang ceylon ect.. ), alocasia, colocasia, many different types of hippeastrum ( they are everywere in my garden ), some bromelid species, agaves, yuccas, few aloe species, cycads ect..

My collection is always expanding. :)

I even had ripe edible bananas in my garden ( before early 2017 cold wave ).

P9220823.jpg

P9220825.jpg

PC290986.jpg

P1050993.jpg

 

 

Edited by Cikas
  • Upvote 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Xhoniwaters1

Good to hear your Parajubaea made it through that. And the ones you listed are supposedly the least cold hardy. Sabal yapa too. :greenthumb:

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...