Green versus silver bismarckia

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

I've gotten really curious about the green bismarckia. Unfortunately, I've never gotten consistent answers on the whole green versus silver debate.

Version 1 of the story says they are just as hardy and grow under the same conditions as the silver form, see http://www.rarepalmseeds.com/pix/BisGre.shtml. Ed Brown in Jacksonville Florida reports that the green ones have far outperform the blue one in terms of hardiness (See post #9 here:) The green one is much, much more common in Antanarivo where temps are quite cool compared to the silver bismarckia habitat, and there are many quite tall and large green bismarckia all over Antanarivo. Some have suggested that because of the lack of wax, the green one is much more efficient at photosynthesis and happens to grow faster and better in cooler climates. Even Jeff Marcus reports that the green one is far easier to grow on the humid Hilo side of the big Island because the seedlings have much more fungal resistance.

Version 2 of the story says the green ones are much, much more tender than the blue ones and happen to be slower and more tropical in their requirements. Some sort of green form made the rounds in Southern California and failed, so people here have pretty much given up on them.

I realize that the blue one is far more desirable from an aesthetic point of view, but if I can find the green type that fits under version 1, it would actually be a better choice for a more heat deprived USDA 10a for someone who would like a ginormous palm. I am never gonna find out unless I play around a bit. I ordered a bunch of bismarckia seeds, the green form and the blue form. I have the green and blue ones in exactly the same conditions, at around 27C. Lo and behold, the green ones took 2 weeks to germinate, and the blue ones are still sitting there doing nothing. So far the only other germinators are livistona muelleri and archont. purpurea.

Anyone else played around with the green ones?

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Here is a pic of the baggie showing the sinker roots on steroids:

[LJG]

Your mistake is comparing what someone says in HI or FL to what happens in CA. You can grow coconuts in some zone 9 FL areas. Also Toby is hazarding guesses of cultivation requirements on many descriptions. He is a seed bank, not a guy growing all this stuff in Germany.

Trust me, these are much harder to grow in CA then their blue counter parts.

[sonoranfans]

Your mistake is comparing what someone says in HI or FL to what happens in CA. You can grow coconuts in some zone 9 FL areas. Also Toby is hazarding guesses of cultivation requirements on many descriptions. He is a seed bank, not a guy growing all this stuff in Germany.

Trust me, these are much harder to grow in CA then their blue counter parts.

Cool tolerance versus cold tolerance perhaps... Certainly the preponderance of evidence for cold tolerance is that the silver bizzies are better. If you want to grow under heavy canopy, perhaps the green grow better with less light and that makes sense.

[Kris]

nice visual,and updates please.since I want to revive my old germination thread which is almost dead.

thanks and love,

kris.

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Your mistake is comparing what someone says in HI or FL to what happens in CA. You can grow coconuts in some zone 9 FL areas. Also Toby is hazarding guesses of cultivation requirements on many descriptions. He is a seed bank, not a guy growing all this stuff in Germany.

Trust me, these are much harder to grow in CA then their blue counter parts.

Len, all I am putting forward is the thesis that a lot of anectotal information suggests there may be a strain of green bismarckia that would do well in foggy coastal zone 10a locations in Central and Northern California. I mention Tobias only because he has seeds of the green ones, I am not basing my theory on his website. In fact, I suspect what he says is wrong, because the strain I am theorizing exists should be quite different in cultural requirements. Putting Ed Brown's result aside for a moment (even though I don't see what his results have to do with coconuts or Fl vs CA), there is still plenty of evidence such a strain exists. I may be full of shit thinking there's a bismarckia strain that would thrive in ceroxylon country, but that's the whole joy of experimentation. Let's find out. For right now, I have no evidence stating that the seeds Toby is selling right now are the same green ones that failed in Southern California, nor do I know they are the cool tolerant ones either.

I've scoured through the old Journals of the SCPS, and actually found an account of a really fast growing healthy green one in Beachside Huntington Beach that had a good 30 feet of trunk and ended up succumbing to scorching hot Santa Ana winds. This once again supports my theory, it's tolerant to cool and wet, and dislikes hot and dry. That's just what I need up here in my neck of the woods.

There's no harm in germinating a few to see what they'll do. If they don't grow in diurnal mid-40's to mid 70's, nothing is lost other than I will know Toby's seeds aren't the green cooler growing faster version. I do know the blue strain is native to areas where the diurnal swing is 90/120F, that's never going to thrive here in Ceroxylon country. Someday I'll go to Madagascar and collect my own seeds in Antanarivo to find the cooler growing strain.

[MattyB]

Maybe try Satranala

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Maybe try Satranala

That actually sounds like a great idea, if only I knew where to find one or find seeds.

[PalmnutVN]

Near my place of work.....

[_Keith]

I was gifted two Green Bizzies that are supposedly very cold hardy. They will face their first winter in the ground this year. But then again, they sure look like Sabals at this early age.

[Xerarch]

Great side-by-side of green vs. blue! same age and everything. Thanks

[Cedric]

Might be humidity is the issue. The Silver blue can take both the green one not having the waxy protective coating might require more humidity. They both gow fine for me.

Not sure why the green one should be more cold tolerant for the same reason.

[Bennz]

Near my place of work.....

b2.jpg

Green one is WAY better looking!! I was offered free silver seedlings once and turned them down. Not everyone finds them ugly, but I do.

[paulgila]

Near my place of work.....

b2.jpg

great photo, Nick. you don't see them side by side to compare very often.

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Near my place of work.....

b2.jpg

Green one is WAY better looking!! I was offered free silver seedlings once and turned them down. Not everyone finds them ugly, but I do.

Beauty is obviously in the eye of the beholder. When I see the green and blue one side by side, I most definitely prefer the blue one. But the green one would be neat to have just for the sheer size and if it's a better grower for cooler areas.

[Zeeth]

I love Bismarckia, but personally I prefer the green. To me they look like a Borassus when well grown.

[_Keith]

I am on the blue side as well.

[Kris]

I am on the blue side as well.

even I love the blue version.

[avanza]

I'm blue