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Problems with Jubutygrus


buffy

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Hey cameron,

I recall you had a nice small juvenile yatay x syagrus in your garden from patrick schafer. I recently bought 2 and am wondering how yours is looking. As I recally it was the most unique mule I had ever seen, even a light grey/green instead of the typical dark green. Do you have any photo updates? I also got yatay x jubaea and (B xJ)xJ.

Edited by sonoranfans

Formerly in Gilbert AZ, zone 9a/9b. Now in Palmetto, Florida Zone 9b/10a??

 

Tom Blank

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The Yatay Queen is my fastest grower. It was set back by the freeze of 2010-2011. Burned to the ground when it was pretty small. After that, it took off. It's now 9 feet with a basketball size base. I'll try to get a new picture. Very robust. There is certainly a hit or miss experience with hybrid vigor, but when it shows up (Gary Levine's Jub x Queen, My Yatay Queen), look out.

Longview, Texas :: Record Low: -5F, Feb. 16, 2021 :: Borderline 8A/8B :: '06-'07: 18F / '07-'08: 21F / '08-'09: 21F / '09-'10: 14F / '10-'11: 15F / '11-'12: 24F / '12-'13: 23F / '13-'14: 15F / '14-'15: 20F / '15-'16: 27F / '16-'17: 15F / '17-'18: 8F / '18-'19: 23F / '19-'20: 19F / '20-'21: -5F / '21-'22: 20F / '22-'23: 6F

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The Yatay Queen is my fastest grower. It was set back by the freeze of 2010-2011. Burned to the ground when it was pretty small. After that, it took off. It's now 9 feet with a basketball size base. I'll try to get a new picture. Very robust. There is certainly a hit or miss experience with hybrid vigor, but when it shows up (Gary Levine's Jub x Queen, My Yatay Queen), look out.

Cameron this is a great cold hardy story, it deserves its own thread. Im sure there are a number of growers out there trying in zon 8a/b/9a that would be very interested in you success there. I would love to see a pic of that one, its what made me want the yatay x syagrus cross...

Formerly in Gilbert AZ, zone 9a/9b. Now in Palmetto, Florida Zone 9b/10a??

 

Tom Blank

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Everybody ignored my post !

Soil temp drops in winter inhibiting K and Mg take up.

Warm days encourages plant to grow. Result spotting.

If the summer growth does not show spotting but it appears in winter thats what it is !!!!

Resident in Bristol UK.

Webshop for hardy palms and hybrid seeds www.hardy-palms.co.uk

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How cold is the soil in the winter in UK?

Here only some winter nights are freezing and it warms up during the day.

Only one of my Jubutyagrus shows this kind of spotting ,all receive splemental NPK and i doubt this is the reason.

Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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Guys: I've looked at all my Jubutygruses. They all have the same symptoms. Not as bad as the bed planted one, but definitely there. I think it has to be cold damage since all three are planted in different soils in different parts of the yard. I have a JubXQueen close to one of them that shows nothing. Also have the Yatay Mule nearby that shows nothing. It's the nature of some Jubutygruses. Bad brown spotting from cold. I only hit 27F with lots of nights of heavy frost and two nights with frozen snow on the fronds. And remember, one of mine is from Patric and two are from Tim. Also of note, I have two of Tim's still in pots that are exposed to all the same conditions except cold and they look perfect. One more note, in the winter of 2010-2011, we stayed below freezing for 4 days straight with an ultimate low around 15 or 16. At that time, one of my Hopper Jubutygruses was still small enough to wrap in a blanket. It came through without a blemish. So the problem is frost and frozen precipitation, not cold. These palms are susceptible to frozen water. Let's see if they will grow out of this sensitivity.

Longview, Texas :: Record Low: -5F, Feb. 16, 2021 :: Borderline 8A/8B :: '06-'07: 18F / '07-'08: 21F / '08-'09: 21F / '09-'10: 14F / '10-'11: 15F / '11-'12: 24F / '12-'13: 23F / '13-'14: 15F / '14-'15: 20F / '15-'16: 27F / '16-'17: 15F / '17-'18: 8F / '18-'19: 23F / '19-'20: 19F / '20-'21: -5F / '21-'22: 20F / '22-'23: 6F

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Everybody ignored my post !

Soil temp drops in winter inhibiting K and Mg take up.

Warm days encourages plant to grow. Result spotting.

If the summer growth does not show spotting but it appears in winter thats what it is !!!!

Well doesnt look like that is what happened to mine, plenty of summer spotting on one palm, with less on new growth(less time exposed). There is always non on new growth initially, but then it sets in during summer. the other shows much less, very faint on oldest fronds only. And my winter low was 37F, only twice below 40 all winter. I also see some of this spotting, a minor amount, on the oldest 2 fronds of my mule. None at all on my copernicia, which are most susceptible of all my palms to K defficiency.

Formerly in Gilbert AZ, zone 9a/9b. Now in Palmetto, Florida Zone 9b/10a??

 

Tom Blank

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Everybody ignored my post !

Soil temp drops in winter inhibiting K and Mg take up.

Warm days encourages plant to grow. Result spotting.

If the summer growth does not show spotting but it appears in winter thats what it is !!!!

Well doesnt look like that is what happened to mine, plenty of summer spotting on one palm, with less on new growth(less time exposed). There is always non on new growth initially, but then it sets in during summer. the other shows much less, very faint on oldest fronds only. And my winter low was 37F, only twice below 40 all winter. I also see some of this spotting, a minor amount, on the oldest 2 fronds of my mule. None at all on my copernicia, which are most susceptible of all my palms to K defficiency.

Here the same. Last winter was frost free and the younger leaves look the same as what Buffy posted above.

Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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Genetic then. I see the same thing, but winter always makes it worse. Is it an inability to uptake nitrogen?

Longview, Texas :: Record Low: -5F, Feb. 16, 2021 :: Borderline 8A/8B :: '06-'07: 18F / '07-'08: 21F / '08-'09: 21F / '09-'10: 14F / '10-'11: 15F / '11-'12: 24F / '12-'13: 23F / '13-'14: 15F / '14-'15: 20F / '15-'16: 27F / '16-'17: 15F / '17-'18: 8F / '18-'19: 23F / '19-'20: 19F / '20-'21: -5F / '21-'22: 20F / '22-'23: 6F

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I have a Butyagrus that has chronic K deficiency --- I correct with K and Mg but if I dont keep on it -- it yellows trees 15-16 tall beautiful and almost coconut like but can't stop the chlorosis for any length of time. Best regards Ed

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How cold is the soil in the winter in UK?

Here only some winter nights are freezing and it warms up during the day.

Only one of my Jubutyagrus shows this kind of spotting ,all receive splemental NPK and i doubt this is the reason.

I think the problems start when the soil is down to maybe 12C or 13C ... how cold is your soil in winter ? The fact the ones that didnt see cold dont spot just reinforces what I said. I think some Butias are just vulnerable to this problem , its genetic ,you can plant 2 right next to each other and 1 will do it and 1 wont, and this gene is being passed on.

Resident in Bristol UK.

Webshop for hardy palms and hybrid seeds www.hardy-palms.co.uk

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I have a Butyagrus that has chronic K deficiency --- I correct with K and Mg but if I dont keep on it -- it yellows trees 15-16 tall beautiful and almost coconut like but can't stop the chlorosis for any length of time. Best regards Ed

Yes ed, this is what I expect with K or Mg deficiency chlorosis and yellowing, not brown spotting with no hint of yellowing... I have seen the chlorisis on my rupicolas before I switched to florikan time release palm special, and K deficiency on a copernicial transplant, this looks nothing like either. K deficiency starts yellowing at leaflet tips and works inward. After a while th eleaflet tips become necrotic, but not before yellowing has been quite obvious. My jubutiagrus have never seen any fert besides lots of florikan palm special, great stuff. My rupicolas and copernicias have no Mg or K deficiencies at this time. Im starting to think that jubutiagrus has some kind of genetic susceptibility to mold spot. While my winters have little rain, there is a lot of condensing dew.

Formerly in Gilbert AZ, zone 9a/9b. Now in Palmetto, Florida Zone 9b/10a??

 

Tom Blank

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My Hopper one is green and beautiful year-round with no spots. The damage on Buffy's looks similar to what I have with a Jubaea Butia hybrid that I just chalked up to it being too wet in central Florida.

-Krishna

Kailua, Oahu HI. Near the beach but dry!

Still have a garden in Zone 9a Inland North Central Florida (Ocala)

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So some kind of fungus with wet and/or cool weather. I can buy that. As much as the nitrogen deal looked right to me, it never made logical sense based on the green sands. I'm wondering with enough age and mass, if it will grow out of this. When I can get the crown away from irrigation. When the leaves have a lot of mass. I'm wondering. Sounds like we just have to wait and see.

Longview, Texas :: Record Low: -5F, Feb. 16, 2021 :: Borderline 8A/8B :: '06-'07: 18F / '07-'08: 21F / '08-'09: 21F / '09-'10: 14F / '10-'11: 15F / '11-'12: 24F / '12-'13: 23F / '13-'14: 15F / '14-'15: 20F / '15-'16: 27F / '16-'17: 15F / '17-'18: 8F / '18-'19: 23F / '19-'20: 19F / '20-'21: -5F / '21-'22: 20F / '22-'23: 6F

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Being a molecular biologist by career, I would make the point that some crosses between different species are likely to create significant problems for surviving offspring. They simply are not meant to be. 50% of human fertilization events end up as aborted embryos so early on that the woman does not know she is even pregnant. I believe the Hopper cross is created in a different manner than Patrick's cross. I have two of the Hopper crosses and I find them very slow growing which also might argue that there is just something not right with this "genetic combination." I assume in breeding horses or even dogs you simply would not wish to create certain crosses as they are problematic and create a weak animal.

palmaddict

Bonita, California (San Diego)

Zone 10B

10 Year Low of 29 degrees

6 Miles from San Diego Bay

Mild winters, somewhat warm summers

10 Miles North of Mexico/USA Border

1 acre

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Slow growing? My Hopper cross is perhaps the fastest grower in my yard by biomass. At the same time though my JxS is slower than many others report and my BxP has been extremely finicky. These crosses seem to vary a lot even among the same seed batches.

-Krishna

Kailua, Oahu HI. Near the beach but dry!

Still have a garden in Zone 9a Inland North Central Florida (Ocala)

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So some kind of fungus with wet and/or cool weather. I can buy that. As much as the nitrogen deal looked right to me, it never made logical sense based on the green sands. I'm wondering with enough age and mass, if it will grow out of this. When I can get the crown away from irrigation. When the leaves have a lot of mass. I'm wondering. Sounds like we just have to wait and see.

I am treating with neem oil every 2 weeks. If it is graphiola, the instructions say to treat regularly and remove the most infected leaves as it can spread to the newer ones. The leaf spot looks similar to the spotting I had on a brahea dulcis when I first moved to florida. that palm withered and died after about 18 months, but I suspect it had more to do with excessive moisture than a fungal infection. And by the way I do have one hopper x jubutyagrus that is 4'+ tall and shows very minor spotting. It is in a more sandy soil than the one that spotted prolifically. I do not find these Hopper jubutyagurs to be slow at all. A 2 year old seedling at 4'+ from plant with 2 strap leaves plus spear at 18" tall.

Formerly in Gilbert AZ, zone 9a/9b. Now in Palmetto, Florida Zone 9b/10a??

 

Tom Blank

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Why where the leaflets are "protected" from sun by a bending or broken leaflet, the leave tissue is green?

Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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Why where the leaflets are "protected" from sun by a bending or broken leaflet, the leave tissue is green?

Alberto is this a question in respose to my post... If so I dont understand, if not, ignore this post.

Formerly in Gilbert AZ, zone 9a/9b. Now in Palmetto, Florida Zone 9b/10a??

 

Tom Blank

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Over the years I've become convinced that planting palms in completely "engineered" or "replaced" soil is a mistake in all but the most inhospitable native soils. Turns out it is difficult to make a soil or soil substitute better than what nature has provided us. Sure, bedding-type plants can be made to thrive in compost-laden soil replacements, but palms stretch their roots far too far and have different needs than bedding plants. My soil is disturbed crap subsoil from construction of the home, light and orangy-colored and nutrient poor. Other plants despise this but most hardy palms thrive in it with the exceptions being Trachycarpus and needle palms.

You should have used the native soil after adding the drainage in my opinion.

Edited by ryjohn
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Why where the leaflets are "protected" from sun by a bending or broken leaflet, the leave tissue is green?

Alberto is this a question in respose to my post... If so I dont understand, if not, ignore this post.

No ,sorry. Not a response to your writings :)

Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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Fungal. I have a Butia archeri with the same symptoms. My B. odorata and B. catariensis show nothing. My S. romanzo. and J. chilensis show nothing. I only see it in the cocoids, but its not simply Jubutygrus.

Longview, Texas :: Record Low: -5F, Feb. 16, 2021 :: Borderline 8A/8B :: '06-'07: 18F / '07-'08: 21F / '08-'09: 21F / '09-'10: 14F / '10-'11: 15F / '11-'12: 24F / '12-'13: 23F / '13-'14: 15F / '14-'15: 20F / '15-'16: 27F / '16-'17: 15F / '17-'18: 8F / '18-'19: 23F / '19-'20: 19F / '20-'21: -5F / '21-'22: 20F / '22-'23: 6F

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Over the years I've become convinced that planting palms in completely "engineered" or "replaced" soil is a mistake in all but the most inhospitable native soils. Turns out it is difficult to make a soil or soil substitute better than what nature has provided us. Sure, bedding-type plants can be made to thrive in compost-laden soil replacements, but palms stretch their roots far too far and have different needs than bedding plants. My soil is disturbed crap subsoil from construction of the home, light and orangy-colored and nutrient poor. Other plants despise this but most hardy palms thrive in it with the exceptions being Trachycarpus and needle palms.

You should have used the native soil after adding the drainage in my opinion.

I have Jubutygrus in the finest woodlands soil, completely undisturbed outside of the hole to plant with the same problem.

Longview, Texas :: Record Low: -5F, Feb. 16, 2021 :: Borderline 8A/8B :: '06-'07: 18F / '07-'08: 21F / '08-'09: 21F / '09-'10: 14F / '10-'11: 15F / '11-'12: 24F / '12-'13: 23F / '13-'14: 15F / '14-'15: 20F / '15-'16: 27F / '16-'17: 15F / '17-'18: 8F / '18-'19: 23F / '19-'20: 19F / '20-'21: -5F / '21-'22: 20F / '22-'23: 6F

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If it is fungal, then my first choice would be Daconil. Far more effective than Neem, imo, and I do a lot of spraying for aerial fungi. Clearys ( thiophanate methyl-comes in genetic names as well like T-storm at John Deeres) would also be effective and its nice because you can drench the soil with the solution and gives you two wks coverage. It takes a wk for the plant to fully take it up, but you can also spray the leaves with the same solution. Daconil is only to be sprayed on the leaves, lasts a wk. You can alternate the Daconil with the Neem if you want, but be sure to spray the Neem in the late afternoon when the sun is much weaker. Any fungicide should be done in the late afternoon/early am-esp if outside. For that matter, you could spray hydrogen perioxide also. That will do a good job of drying out the spores, but it also has to come into direct contact with the spores.

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Over the years I've become convinced that planting palms in completely "engineered" or "replaced" soil is a mistake in all but the most inhospitable native soils. Turns out it is difficult to make a soil or soil substitute better than what nature has provided us. Sure, bedding-type plants can be made to thrive in compost-laden soil replacements, but palms stretch their roots far too far and have different needs than bedding plants. My soil is disturbed crap subsoil from construction of the home, light and orangy-colored and nutrient poor. Other plants despise this but most hardy palms thrive in it with the exceptions being Trachycarpus and needle palms.

You should have used the native soil after adding the drainage in my opinion.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My Two Cents...

Not in my opinion. I wouldn't be able to grow successfully nearly any of the palms and companion plants on my property if the soil had been strictly unnourished native soil. The trick is to nourish ALL your garden soil but it takes a few years if your soil is as poor as mine was. Simply adding a layer of good compost twice a year and a layer of mulch on top of that over the years has yielded a dark, fertile loam with lots of organic, biological activity occurring where it was originally hard, poor clay soil that only the hardiest of plants (non-subtropical) would grow. Everything thrives now because the soil is closer to what those plants would be growing in in their natural habitats.

Jim in Los Altos

Jim in Los Altos, CA  SF Bay Area 37.34N- 122.13W- 190' above sea level

zone 10a/9b

sunset zone 16

300+ palms, 90+ species in the ground

Las Palmas Design

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I am with Jim here 100%. I never amend the hole when I plant, but I do put down a thick layer of composted leaves every year. I would do the mulch as well, but always run out of time, and I don't really need to in my yard. But addressing all of the planting area is really the way to go.

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If you have commercial crop farmers in the area, ask them about the soil, and what corrections they make. Here we have sugar cane farmers. Sugar cane is optimal at a ph of 6.5. Every farmer here Limes their field every other year. I learned something from that without ever having to run a soil test.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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If it is fungal, then my first choice would be Daconil. Far more effective than Neem, imo, and I do a lot of spraying for aerial fungi. Clearys ( thiophanate methyl-comes in genetic names as well like T-storm at John Deeres) would also be effective and its nice because you can drench the soil with the solution and gives you two wks coverage. It takes a wk for the plant to fully take it up, but you can also spray the leaves with the same solution. Daconil is only to be sprayed on the leaves, lasts a wk. You can alternate the Daconil with the Neem if you want, but be sure to spray the Neem in the late afternoon when the sun is much weaker. Any fungicide should be done in the late afternoon/early am-esp if outside. For that matter, you could spray hydrogen perioxide also. That will do a good job of drying out the spores, but it also has to come into direct contact with the spores.

So you believe thiophanate methyl applied as a soil drench would protect the leaves? My xJubutyagrus is already too large for spraying, but the soil drench would be ideal... IF it works. I couldn't find online about it.

Steve

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Steve-thiophanate methyl is designed to be used as a soil drench. That is why it is used with Subdue or Truban as a preventative so often. They are all systemics through drenches. The plant takes it up through the roots and it helps to resist/fight a fungus. Read the label, you can find it online. Look for Clearys label.

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Steve have you thought about using a sprayer like this? They work really well for fungicides. insectides etc and the stream of water can reach really far. https://www1.zoysiafarms.com/prodspec.jsp?id=20ED There are other sprayers as well that might give you more height. As long as you have enough solution in the bottle, you can easily tilt it upwards.

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Steve-thiophanate methyl is designed to be used as a soil drench. That is why it is used with Subdue or Truban as a preventative so often. They are all systemics through drenches. The plant takes it up through the roots and it helps to resist/fight a fungus. Read the label, you can find it online. Look for Clearys label.

I know it can be used as a soil drench, but a little different question is whether that mode of delivery works for foliar issues. Normally one reads of soil drenches for root rots etc. and foliar spray for foliar spots/blights. But it should work given that this article describes it as "xylem mobile". The article says it can work as a preventative but not very effective on an existing problem. So a 'topical' spray of some sort is required to kill existing spores.

http://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/BP/BP-70-W.pdf

Steve

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I disagree with some of that article. For instance, they say concerning contact fungicides • " Must be applied before spores land on and infect leaves." and thats baloney. What Daconil and others do is dry out the spores so they cannot replicate and spread. The fungicide has to come into direct contact with the spores-but when the fungicide does, it gets rid of the spores. There are other things that should be done at the same time to get rid of a fungus (removing as many infected leaves and throwing away, isolating the plant where possible , keeping the foliage dry) but fungicides can and do play an important part in getting rid of/controlling of the fungus. Another thing is that its totally impractical (as well as not true) to say that fungicides always have to be applied before the fungus is there. That means that you would constantly be spraying-and no one does that. There are times when a grower might see weather conditions that might lend itself to a fungus, and spray before hand, but that is not the norm.

Concerning the Clearys-when the fungicide is in the plant system, it will help to resist a fungus, and will help to control it. Purdue is a good university for hort info, so I am really surprised to see this here.

You are correct in thinking that most systemics that are soil drenches are for phythium etc, Clearys is just one of the few drenches that addresses other types of fungi. Thats why its used so much with Subdue and Truban as a combo drench for preventative methods

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I have a Butyagrus that has chronic K deficiency --- I correct with K and Mg but if I dont keep on it -- it yellows trees 15-16 tall beautiful and almost coconut like but can't stop the chlorosis for any length of time.

Best regards

Ed

My larger one does the same thing here in NC...One leaf at a time. I need to feed it soon! It is still a very pretty palm. I recently moved it and it looks like it will be fine.

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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I have two that I think are jubutiagrus from Patric, the two show the black spots, but a lot more which is in partial shade, wetter soil, but the soil quality is the same ...,my rainy season is in autumn-winter, rarely freezes, and when more black spots show them.
My Hopper jubutiagrus
also shows black spots, only at older leaves, but grows like a rocket!!

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Sergi, are you saying that the Jubutyagrus growing in shade shows more leave spots???

Take a look at mine.i have the impression that the sun causes the black spotting................

Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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hi Alberto!

i saw your pic at another thread.
well... my jubutyagus are still small, last year they started to grow pinnate fronds..., one was planted last year in full sun, and has a minor problem, the other one is in partial shade, it has sun all day less at midday...and the soil remains wet more time, this one shows more black spots along this winter , last summer with hot sun(40cª-104f), the older leaves remains green...i have no rain during all the summer
...i live in a small island, with a lot of sea influence, almost every day the palms have dew during many hours, from evening to next day morning..., i have clay soil, limestone, jubaeas grows well, butias needs some help to grow well, and syagus have serious problems to grow without yellow fronds due to high Ph...
my first thought was a lack of potassium, but both are fertilized in the same way...

regards

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Thanks!

After reading the your experience and Axel´s I´m changing my my mind now. Here there is also dew, most of the nights and this associated with a kind of phungus can also be the reason.....

Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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Here is a pic of some of my hybrids, from left to right. JubaeaxButia, B. Eriospatha x Jubaea, JubaeaxSyagrus, Jubutiagrus. They all stood together this winter, lowest temperature was 24F. Only the Jubutiagrus shows spots on leave, maybe it is a combination of the cold and wet soil. But why would only the jubutyagrus suffer from it? Btw. The JxS for me has been supreme to the Jubutiagrus, it was a much smaller plant than the Jubutiagrus but has grown much faster and is now even bigger and healthier.

Regards Matthijs

post-1964-0-51240100-1368168903_thumb.jp

post-1964-0-33554600-1368169015_thumb.jp

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this is really starting to look like a genetic susceptibility with this 3 way hybrid. Interestingly, B x J is fine, J x B is fine and B x S and J x S are fine. It could be mold susceptibility and the mold needs sun to grow, hence explaining the clean underside of leaflets shown by alberto.

Formerly in Gilbert AZ, zone 9a/9b. Now in Palmetto, Florida Zone 9b/10a??

 

Tom Blank

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The lesions Mathijs shew us, are clearly a phungus. This are different from the dark brown tiny dots on the other Jubutyagrus shown here

Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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