What's up with my Jubaea?

[Neofolis]

My Jubaea seems to have been going downhill for some time.  Growth stopped for a long time, now it has started again, it is very slow, even for a Jubaea and the new leaves are coming through quite yellow and after a fairly short period start to develop brown, dead patches.

This picture illustrates the yellow colour of the new leaves.

Here you can see some of the brown patches.

Here is another view of a large brown patch.

[Kris]

Dear neofolis  

i like to suggest that you start feeding those

chelian wine palm(Baby) with slow release

all palm fertilizer in peletised form.

that baby needs lot of nutritions and change the

pot size to bigger one.

here in india we do not have specilized all palm

fertilizers, some of us feed our plants with D.A.P_

Di amoniam phosphate. i.e 20 grams for 1 bucket

full of water. stir it will till the granules dissolve and

start using on the pot sides every week ends.

preferebly during the spring season & early summer.

Love,

Kris(India).

[Neofolis]

Thanks for the advice Kris.  I think you are probably right about the pot, although it is a very tall pot, not visible in the pictures, I know Jubaeas are particularly long rooted and the roots are already out of the bottom of the pot.  Fortunately it is still small, so it is in my polytunnel, so re-potting this time of year won't be as much of an issue as it would be outside.  I do already use a palm specific fertilizer, but it is a soluble fast release fetrtilizer.  I prefer fast release fertilizers for pots, partly because it is easier to administer, but also because a good watering will help to leech out any build up of salts in the pot, which is less effective with slow release fertilizers.  I think the re-potting is also necessary because the medium has become very heavy and compressed, due mainly to the root growth, so there is probably insufficient air getting to the roots.  I'm in the process of experimenting with alternative media that retain their airiness better, so this would be another good trial.

[Nigel]

Corey, I have seen that a lot, it can be one of two things.

1. The soil is too compacted and wet, the roots cant breathe and fail to take up Iron as a result.

2. You have overdone the soluble fertiliser, Jubaeas dont like too much fert.

Personally, I would take it out of the pot, wash away ALL the soil ( not a problem for a jub) and resoil it with an airy mix, not horrible john innes.

It would help to include some of the chelated nutrients you can buy for greening up magnolias and rhododendrons into your soul mix before compelting this exercise.

[Bilbo]

One additional factor might just perhaps be the "double glazing" with bubble poly.

Without adequate ventilation (I cant tell if there is any) it could get too humid for a Jub.

I appreciate you have wrapped early for Christmas and the cold but you still need some air movement.

Regardez

Jon

[Neofolis]

Thanks Nigel, both of those could be correct, I am fertilizing less now, but the soil is very compacted.  Jon, I do have a fan circulating the air and there is a fair bit of ventilation, the humidity isn't extremely high at around ground level, but it may be an issue.

I'll try re-potting in a lighter mix, when I get the opportunity and see what happens.

[MattyB]

When you repot, take a close look at the roots.  Look for any mushy black ones.  Treat w/ fungicide if you find any.  I lost a D. St. Lucie to rot and it started just like yours; yellowing and brown patches.

[Neofolis]

Thanks Matt.  Does anyone know of any decent fungicides sold in the UK or will any do?

[Bilbo]

Corey my friend I dont want to sound blase` or trite but the fact is that the best fungicides do appear to be banned under EU legislation. (No surprises there!).

Anyway they are usually Copper based if you can track them down . . .

Regardez

Juan

[Neofolis]

I'd rather not use banned chemicals, if I can avoid it.  Are there any well known UK brands that might work?

[Nigel]

Corey, in my opinion you do not need to use fungicide on that palm. I think the roots will appear quite ok, it just needs resoiling quite badly.

[Neofolis]

Thanks again Nigel.  Funnily enough, the Jubaea is one of my more recently repotted palms, so the root growth stimulant I got from you obviously works.

[Neofolis]

Sorry Nigel, I meant to ask.  You expressed your dislike of John Innes and I have to confess that I have not been very impressed with it either, what would you use?

[Nigel]

(Neofolis @ Oct. 28 2006,07:54)

QUOTE

Sorry Nigel, I meant to ask.  You expressed your dislike of John Innes and I have to confess that I have not been very impressed with it either, what would you use?

John Innes is a very balanced soil,some swear by it. I have seen very nice palms grown in it, when the palm is larger.

However, in my experience, in small pots it turns into pure water soaked lead , the air is removed and palms go yellow and grow slowly.

I now use pure coir ( with various additives) for tiny seedlings, and coir mixed with soil conditioner or compost ( and various additives) for larger plants.

These mixes hold a lot of water but also drain freely and contain a lot of air.

[chris.oz]

Nigel,

Hi buddy.... How are your Jubs coming along?   I have about 20 just going pinnate now,  some up to 50mm thick at the base.   I have lost quite a few seedlings along the way.  I would say it seems to have worked like this:

100 seeds

90-95 germinate

70 last 12 months

50 last 24 months.

After 3 years I have about 33% left.

These palms live in full sun year round and have very short  fronds.

I use very little fert on them.....any ideas on qty of fert that s best and the ratio:  I a using 12/3/12 and 12/3/18 for palms with potassium deficiency.

CHRIS

[Neofolis]

Thanks Nigel, I've actually been experimenting with adding coir to my potting mixes for the reasons you mentioned, although I have found that if the mix is mainly coir it can shrink quite a bit.  Personally I have also found it less obvious when things need watering, because it stays looking almost identical when it is dry as when it is wet.  I have also been adding composted bark to try to get more air into the mix, although this seems to break down fairly rapidly and might make the medium a little too acidic for some plants.  It also stays very dark when dry, making it less obvious that things need watering.

Often I receive plants in a mix that seems to be super light and airy and almost sponge like in texture, kind of springy, but it is usually through third parties, who don't know the make up of the medium.

[Bilbo]

John Innes is (in theory at least!) an excellent seed or potting mix depending on its number.

Trouble is often the loam which may be very variable and storage.

If stale the fert content decomposes and can harm plant, especially, seedling growth.

My method: buy only small quantities at a time from a reliable source and store in a cool dry location away from sunlight. Costs more in the short term to be sure.

If you are commercial then use a proper sterilizer oven and not the microwave tho the latter works for small quantities.

Dont tell wife.

Regardez

Juan

[Neofolis]

I only ever buy it as I need it.  Originally I thought it was the sand/grit that was making the mix too heavy.  It may just be that I am not repotting freqently enough, but other plants that I have received don't seem to suffer the same affliction in whatever mix they came in.

[Frond-friend42]

This little guy was developing a brow tip so I got concerned and followed this thread for ideas. I reported him with a mix of a little sad, coco coir, miracle gro perlite, and about 20 % cactus mix. Also some orchid bark to help the water flow fast and a bit of osmocote in the upper part of his new pot. 

But first I treated the roots that look underdeveloped and maybe infected with both 10% bleach and then diluted antifungal, immunox, containing propiconazile, cyhalothrin, and "other (pest-killing) ingredients" .  Maybe toxic overkill? Then reported and watered and set him out in some dappled sunlight to help him dry a bit. It was about 45 degrees outside.  Interested in any expert feedback.

Thanks.

[Frond-friend42]

This little guy was developing a brow tip so I got concerned and followed this thread for ideas. I reported him with a mix of a little sad, coco coir, miracle gro perlite, and about 20 % cactus mix. Also some orchid bark to help the water flow fast and a bit of osmocote in the upper part of his new pot. 

But first I treated the roots that look underdeveloped and maybe infected with both 10% bleach and then diluted antifungal, immunox, containing propiconazile, cyhalothrin, and "other (pest-killing) ingredients" .  Maybe toxic overkill? Then repotted and watered and set him out in some dappled sunlight to help him dry a bit. It was about 45 degrees outside.  Interested in any expert feedback.

Thanks.

[kinzyjr]

40 minutes ago, Frond-friend42 said:

This little guy was developing a brow tip so I got concerned and followed this thread for ideas. I reported him with a mix of a little sad, coco coir, miracle gro perlite, and about 20 % cactus mix. Also some orchid bark to help the water flow fast and a bit of osmocote in the upper part of his new pot. 

But first I treated the roots that look underdeveloped and maybe infected with both 10% bleach and then diluted antifungal, immunox, containing propiconazile, cyhalothrin, and "other (pest-killing) ingredients" .  Maybe toxic overkill? Then reported and watered and set him out in some dappled sunlight to help him dry a bit. It was about 45 degrees outside.  Interested in any expert feedback.

Thanks.

Doesn't look that unhealthy.  Keep us updated.

[Shiveringtropicals]

20 hours ago, Frond-friend42 said:

This little guy was developing a brow tip so I got concerned and followed this thread for ideas. I reported him with a mix of a little sad, coco coir, miracle gro perlite, and about 20 % cactus mix. Also some orchid bark to help the water flow fast and a bit of osmocote in the upper part of his new pot. 

But first I treated the roots that look underdeveloped and maybe infected with both 10% bleach and then diluted antifungal, immunox, containing propiconazile, cyhalothrin, and "other (pest-killing) ingredients" .  Maybe toxic overkill? Then reported and watered and set him out in some dappled sunlight to help him dry a bit. It was about 45 degrees outside.  Interested in any expert feedback.

Thanks.

i'm not an expert but i have a bunch of jubaea freshly germinated aswell and mine also have a brown tip, i think it could be just the way they are when they're small.

they germinated at the end of summer and they still look healthy now.

[Frond-friend42]

This one seems to be doing a bit better. I have it covered over with a zip lock over the top, which seems to help filter the light and keep it moist.   

[Shiveringtropicals]

I have mine outside at the moment and they seem to be growing slowly.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Shiveringtropicals

[Frond-friend42]

Its doing great. Holding this guy under a light made him have a growth spurt. I'm in dry Utah, and I have it a foot deep (pot constructed out of three). Those last ones look good and healthy.