Who's resisted going on Facebook and why?

[yachtingone]

HERE'S A LINK TO WHAT THE FACE BOOK PAGE LOOKS LIKE TODAY. There is no way to cause problems to your computer by clicking on this link!

http://www.facebook.com/?ref=home#!/pages/palm-talk/449928175242

[PalmatierMeg]

Randy, I agree with some of what you said but I would never equate caution with fear. And while FB is "cutting edge" now someday it will be passe as betamax in the great cosmic trash heap. You use it wisely and judiciously but someone you know who knows too much may tell all. Stupidity is always cutting edge. And for every pie-eyed innocent dancing on rainbows with unicorns there are faceless trolls at work in cyberspace taking advantage of innocence - and stupidity.

Or according to the cartoon I read tonight:

Angel holding Facebook says to St. Peter: "I think we'll have to triple the space in Purgatory."

[Dypsisdean]

A quick Google of "Facebook Hacks" gives you pages that teach anyone how to hack Facebook. This is the #1 listed site - just as an example. There are some very sophisticated hacks selling for hundreds of dollars. It wouldn't be so bad if FB was diligent in trying to prevent security problems, but they are not. Or if most users weren't clueless about protecting their own computers.

http://www.facebook-hacks.org/

Welcome to Facebook Hacks, Tricks, Cheats and Secrets. The only site you will ever need for all your Facebook hacks and tricks!

So you want to know how to hack facebook hey? Well you have come to the right place!

Facebook-Hacks.org is the Number 1 site on the internet for Facebook hacks, tricks and secrets, bar none!

We have new and fresh facebook hacks posted up here every day, so don't forget to bookmark us and check back often.

Whether you want to hack facebook passwords and accounts or just play some neat tricks on your friends you have come to the right place!

[Dypsisdean]

Here's this week's latest hijacking story. And it pretty much confirms what I suspected - that only about 1/4 of the general population are concerned about computer security.

Sept. 25

"Status jacking,'' which involves the theft of login information so that hackers can post malicious messages on the profile of users, is the latest security problem that threatens social networking Web sites.

Online security company AVG looked into the safety measures within 50 global social networks. The research finds that there are almost 20,000 compromised web pages on 50 of the most popular social networks around.

The world's largest social networking site, Facebook, was found to contain more than half of the compromised sites found, while more than 7000 were on YouTube.

Peter Cameron, managing director for AVG Australia and New Zealand, said that it is necessary to raise the awareness on security issues on social networking sites among young people.

''The fact that AVG found almost 20,000 compromised web pages on the world's most popular social networking sites should make social media users sit up and take notice,'' Cameron said.

A recent British study shows that only 15 per cent of people aged 16 to 24 year olds are concerned about internet security. The figure is lower that the 23 per cent rate for the general population.

[_Keith]

Here's this week's latest hijacking story. And it pretty much confirms what I suspected - that only about 1/4 of the general population are concerned about computer security.

Sept. 25

"Status jacking,'' which involves the theft of login information so that hackers can post malicious messages on the profile of users, is the latest security problem that threatens social networking Web sites.

Online security company AVG looked into the safety measures within 50 global social networks. The research finds that there are almost 20,000 compromised web pages on 50 of the most popular social networks around.

The world's largest social networking site, Facebook, was found to contain more than half of the compromised sites found, while more than 7000 were on YouTube.

Peter Cameron, managing director for AVG Australia and New Zealand, said that it is necessary to raise the awareness on security issues on social networking sites among young people.

''The fact that AVG found almost 20,000 compromised web pages on the world's most popular social networking sites should make social media users sit up and take notice,'' Cameron said.

A recent British study shows that only 15 per cent of people aged 16 to 24 year olds are concerned about internet security. The figure is lower that the 23 per cent rate for the general population.

So Dean, using the lowest number here, which is the number of users who each have a webpage, not the number of linked objects which is much higher, this is an infection rate of 2 thousandths of 1 percent. Not to bad. Feel free to check my math, as calculation is not my claim to fame.

[Dypsisdean]

Here's this week's latest hijacking story. And it pretty much confirms what I suspected - that only about 1/4 of the general population are concerned about computer security.

Sept. 25

"Status jacking,'' which involves the theft of login information so that hackers can post malicious messages on the profile of users, is the latest security problem that threatens social networking Web sites.

Online security company AVG looked into the safety measures within 50 global social networks. The research finds that there are almost 20,000 compromised web pages on 50 of the most popular social networks around.

The world's largest social networking site, Facebook, was found to contain more than half of the compromised sites found, while more than 7000 were on YouTube.

Peter Cameron, managing director for AVG Australia and New Zealand, said that it is necessary to raise the awareness on security issues on social networking sites among young people.

''The fact that AVG found almost 20,000 compromised web pages on the world's most popular social networking sites should make social media users sit up and take notice,'' Cameron said.

A recent British study shows that only 15 per cent of people aged 16 to 24 year olds are concerned about internet security. The figure is lower that the 23 per cent rate for the general population.

So Dean, using the lowest number here, which is the number of users who each have a webpage, not the number of linked objects which is much higher, this is an infection rate of 2 thousandths of 1 percent. Not to bad. Feel free to check my math, as calculation is not my claim to fame.

Your math regarding what is one of many security issues may be correct. But it is also correct that 100% of users earlier in the year were affected when everyone's private chats in FB were made public to all their friends, and friends of friends. http://eu.techcrunch.com/2010/05/05/video-major-facebook-security-hole-lets-you-view-your-friends-live-chats/

The main problem for me is that FB has a long history of stupid and serious bugs getting past their quality control. And it has been under fire from many quarters for questionable practices regarding security and privacy for a couple of years now. So for me, it is more an issue of what will be the next bomb to drop.

I am not alone. And I tend to listen to those who know more than I. More than half of the companies in a recent McAfee survey have banned social networking sites at work. From the survey:

One reason companies are leery of employees using social networking sites is the growing number of malicious software that is transmitted on Web 2.0 applications. IT specialists in the survey favored blocking social media sites due to security risks.

I have no emotional stake in FB one way or the other. But in appears as if those who use and enjoy it enthusiastically take a defensive posture when it is criticized. That makes it hard to evaluate the information impartially and impassionately.

[yachtingone]

BTW I just noticed Facebook is watching this site! I understand Google watching but I can't understand why Facebook would? Any ideas as to why?

I do use Facebook. I had my account hacked and Facebook fixed the problem fast. I don't put anything on Facebook I don't want the world to see!!!

The best thing about Facebook to me was reconnecting contact with friends, old school mates and relatives I haven't talked to in years!!!

My 2 cents,

Randy

The link is to Palmtalk on Facebook page as it looks today. This way you can look and see without signing up with Facebook!

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000050464040#!/pages/palm-talk/449928175242

[Dypsisdean]

BTW I just noticed Facebook is watching this site! I understand Google watching but I can't understand why Facebook would? Any ideas as to why?

I do use Facebook. I had my account hacked and Facebook fixed the problem fast. I don't put anything on Facebook I don't want the world to see!!!

The best thing about Facebook to me was reconnecting contact with friends, old school mates and relatives I haven't talked to in years!!!

My 2 cents,

Randy

The link is to Palmtalk on Facebook page as it looks today. This way you can look and see without signing up with Facebook!

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000050464040#!/pages/palm-talk/449928175242

FaceBook is a phenomenon and a juggernaut. They are accumulating vast amounts of info about everyone and everything. That is why they are spidering this site.

The thing to understand (or question to ask) about FaceBook is why would they offer everyone this terrific service for free? What's in it for them? Like Google, their mission is to gather information and knowledge about people and companies. But without going into the details, the manner and the way they gather and intend to use it is very different. In other words, most techies trust Google not to read their email etc, and to keep it secure, but they don't trust FB. The methods and models are very different.

There are many rumors about what FB is really up to. They have been hiring away Google employees with lucrative offers. They have been rumored to be working on an internet phone for some reason. There have been rumors about a merger with Google. I have a feeling they don't really know what they are doing, and are having a hard time managing what they have tapped into. There are also rumors of Google starting it's own FB type service that would be offered as a more secure option. Competition is always good and perhaps would pressure FB into being more conscientious and protective of their users.

[_Keith]

Dean,

Don't get me wrong, I am not defending FB. Although I like it, and I use it every day, its privacy policy decisions in the past have been horrible. It has occasional hacks like most every other place on the Interent. I just don't think it is any less safe than most anywhere else on the Internet, and that one should not be deterred from using it for that reason.

And as for privacy, Scott McNealy said it perfectly "You don't have any, get over it."

[Dypsisdean]

Dean,

Don't get me wrong, I am not defending FB. Although I like it, and I use it every day, its privacy policy decisions in the past have been horrible. It has occasional hacks like most every other place on the Interent. I just don't think it is any less safe than most anywhere else on the Internet, and that one should not be deterred from using it for that reason.

And as for privacy, Scott McNealy said it perfectly "You don't have any, get over it."

And Keith, don't get me wrong either. I am not necessarily condemning FB. But you and I disagree. I think of it as less safe, and you do not. I have been trying to give links, technical evidence, and technical reasons supporting why I think FB is less safe. I would be curious, if we were having a beer together, to hear your technical reasoning why you feel as you do. I would like to know your thinking as to why you feel there is little danger with the recent introduction and integration of third party apps to FB, and why they do not present the well known exploits available through cross site scripting. Most of the geeks that I read are concerned. FB has no way of vetting these apps adequately.

I am not sure from what knowledge base your position comes from. My opinion comes from having read and studied quite a bit about internet security. I read several of the technical security sites almost daily. And I listen to many of the podcasts and audiobooks dedicated to computers and internet security while working in the garden. In addition, my son is the lead software engineer for one of the more popular games on FB. And I've known way too many people that have had their accounts hacked. But I pay most attention to the fact that some people whose computer knowledge I respect a great deal have decided at this time to leave FB. They understand the vulnerabilities way better than I ever could.

There are many levels of privacy. The IRS having access to your online bank accounts or stock market trading is one thing. The FBI having access to your email is another. But if you don't mind a hacker from Russia gaining access to your computer and studying all the business and personal interaction you may or may not conduct on it, while literally watching every key stroke you make, then your concerns about privacy are much different than mine.

[_Keith]

Dean,

Don't get me wrong, I am not defending FB. Although I like it, and I use it every day, its privacy policy decisions in the past have been horrible. It has occasional hacks like most every other place on the Interent. I just don't think it is any less safe than most anywhere else on the Internet, and that one should not be deterred from using it for that reason.

And as for privacy, Scott McNealy said it perfectly "You don't have any, get over it."

And Keith, don't get me wrong either. I am not necessarily condemning FB. But you and I disagree. I think of it as less safe, and you do not. I have been trying to give links, technical evidence, and technical reasons supporting why I think FB is less safe. I would be curious, if we were having a beer together, to hear your technical reasoning why you feel as you do. I would like to know your thinking as to why you feel there is little danger with the recent introduction and integration of third party apps to FB, and why they do not present the well known exploits available through cross site scripting. Most of the geeks that I read are concerned. FB has no way of vetting these apps adequately.

I am not sure from what knowledge base your position comes from. My opinion comes from having read and studied quite a bit about internet security. I read several of the technical security sites almost daily. And I listen to many of the podcasts and audiobooks dedicated to computers and internet security while working in the garden. In addition, my son is the lead software engineer for one of the more popular games on FB. And I've known way too many people that have had their accounts hacked. But I pay most attention to the fact that some people whose computer knowledge I respect a great deal have decided at this time to leave FB. They understand the vulnerabilities way better than I ever could.

There are many levels of privacy. The IRS having access to your online bank accounts or stock market trading is one thing. The FBI having access to your email is another. But if you don't mind a hacker from Russia gaining access to your computer and studying all the business and personal interaction you may or may not conduct on it, while literally watching every key stroke you make, then your concerns about privacy are much different than mine.

Having spent just about my entire adult life in the computer industry, and I am not a young man, my perspective is that no place is safe, and people are most vulnerable when they are someplace where a false sense of security exists. For me, education, diligence, and protection are the key, not hiding away, and when the inevitable happens, mitigation. Facebook's openness brings all kinds of dangers, as does life. You live with Volcanos, I live with hurricanes, others with Earthquakes, and yet others with ice storms, snow storms, you name it. One can't hide from life, just be prepared and have a plan. I see cyberspace as no different.

And I hope we get to have that beer someday. I think we'd both enjoy the conversation very much.

[Dypsisdean]

Keith,

Then we are not in that much disagreement after all. The differences are that I have no problem with the security of "cyberspace," - just these new social networking sites. Over the twenty years the internet has been around, ecommerce, banking, email, etc. have become extremely secure. The Operating Systems, Browsers, and websites have evolved and provide very safe surfing experiences these days. Trial and error over time has created a relatively safe environment.

It's these new social networking sites, and their unique architectures that I am cautious of. For the time being, I prefer the trial and error of their evolution to proceed without me. Someone hacks my computer and they have control of PalmTalk, and a few other websites I control - not good. I have to be cautious.

Let's wrap this up with some common ground.

Facebook's openness brings all kinds of dangers.....

.....people are most vulnerable when they are someplace where a false sense of security exists.

For me, education, diligence, and protection are the key.

My points are very similar to yours:

- Facebook presents new types of security concerns.

- 90% of those using FB have a false sense of security.

- Alerting and educating people is the key, and that is what I have attempted to do here.

And I hope we get to have that beer someday. I think we'd both enjoy the conversation very much.

So come to the Moku Lani and I'll buy you a couple at the Kona micro brewery. http://www.konabrewingco.com/

[ariscott]

You both should come to Darwin. Perfect beer weather.. I will provide the beer

Regards, Ari

[Walter John]

You both should come to Darwin. Perfect beer weather.. I will provide the beer

Regards, Ari

Let's see them try a Darwin stubby or two Ari, that'll shorten them up.

[Kathryn]

I like using FB to share photos with family and friends. It's also been a great tool for finding long lost friends and old classmates. The only issue I have with FB is other people posting information about me and my family. Some people take many pictures, post their every move, and share their info with everyone. I'm a little more private and often request not to not be included.

[JungleGina]

I am anti-Facebook and, yes, anti-social too. It creeps me out to think of putting myself out there online like that to bazillions of people. I don't want every whacko from my past trying to find me. I think this Venn diagram says it all.

[John in Andalucia]

I am anti-Facebook and, yes, anti-social too. It creeps me out to think of putting myself out there online like that to bazillions of people. I don't want every whacko from my past trying to find me. I think this Venn diagram says it all.

You put that so eloquently Gina! I totally agree. Good old email works for me, and you can CC anyone you want to share with. No need to put yourself in a shop window and "do a little wiggle" just to show everyone how "with it" you are. Kidding aside, the bottom line is that Facebook is a public meeting place. That's great if you like to meet in public, but really, isn't it about letting other people know how you rate socially? I couldn't care less, as long as someone is interested in me for whatever reason. I noticed on eBay recently, that people are SELLING Twitter followers! Can you believe it? Years ago I joined Friends Reunited - before the likes of Facebook. You had to join to see who from your school was listed on there, and for me, I was curious, but only to the point of recollecting some old names. One of them, who took delight in punching other kids on the arm until your arm went dead, contacted me to say, "Blimey, were did you go?" as if I'd been gone somewhere for too long. Needles to say I closed my account straight after.

[pogobob]

Paranoia strikes deep in the heart of cyber beings who delve in keyboard impulses rather than looking through each others windows to the soul. There once were those who made audible sounds that created meaningfull exchanges of feelings and ideas.

[BS Man about Palms]

Whats in that bottle in your hand Pogo...?

Well put.

[PalmatierMeg]

I am anti-Facebook and, yes, anti-social too. It creeps me out to think of putting myself out there online like that to bazillions of people. I don't want every whacko from my past trying to find me. I think this Venn diagram says it all.

Gina, you summed everything perfectly. I also get creeped out when people around me try to push FB down my throat like carnival hucksters then get offended, righteously indignant, even hostile when I'm not interested. It's so Stepford-people and cultlike.

[rozpalm]

While I am not on Facebook, I certainly can understand why people like it and I see nothing wrong with people wanting to use it as a means of social engagement. I certainly would not see them in any kind of disparaging light. Its simply a medium of social exchange that is in many ways similar to being on Palm Talk. On Palm Talk we put ourselves "out-there" by writing our opinions, posting pictures of our gardens, sometimes loved ones and especially pictures of other palm talkers (like the Searle Bros Sale or PRA's). Anyone on the internet can view these pictures and our posts, which in some ways makes Palm Talk more exposed then Facebook.

My reason for not joining Facebook is purely to do with time management (hence the amount of time I am wasting writing this post). Facebook and Palm Talk are really nothing more then a progression of tools for social exchange and interaction that exploit technology. It started with the telegraph and then the telephone at your local store. Soon the network was built out and it became possible to have a telephone in your house. After that, a revival of radio technology led to the cell phone so that people can talk to you everywhere. Then came the internet and e-mail and now social websites. Its no big deal. I would be willing to bet that when people were first getting telephones installed into their houses, there were many people trying to encourage their family, neighbors and freinds to get one too. That was certainly the case with cell phones and getting on the internet.

Lastly, I am not at all arguing that that every social website is a good thing or that you don't have to be careful with the things you post. One social website that comes to mind is Formspring. This is a site where people can ask you questions anonymously. Its seems to be used predominately by teens so you can imagine the stuff that gets posted on there and the bulling that happens.

[SunnyFl]

I am anti-Facebook and, yes, anti-social too. It creeps me out to think of putting myself out there online like that to bazillions of people. I don't want every whacko from my past trying to find me. I think this Venn diagram says it all.

Gina, you summed everything perfectly. I also get creeped out when people around me try to push FB down my throat like carnival hucksters then get offended, righteously indignant, even hostile when I'm not interested. It's so Stepford-people and cultlike.

Yes & yes. I don't like the concept of FB, just plain don't like it. And yeah - I don't need past wackos trying to find me, I don't need to waste my time on it, and I don't really like putting out a bunch of stuff about myself out there, for who-knows-who to see. And then, there's the security issues.

But maybe I'm a relic.

I still don't have a cell phone. I don't do twitter.

To be honest, I don't like these "# of posts" rankings, "friending" (whatever the hell that is - and isn't "friend" supposed to be a NOUN???) and it was too bad that Palmtalk started that bs. I started lurking more and posting less.

[junglegalfla]

I use it to keep in touch with friends & family I want to. Those that I don't want to hear from or befriend I decline and don't feel bad about it.

It's been a great tool for keeping up with everyone. It's certainly cut down on the amount of emails in my inbox. It's also been great for information sharing on topics I like and keeping up with some bands. When I google my full name, nothing facebook related comes up so I'm not paranoid about it. Now if I google my user name for palmtalk, that's a whole different story. To each their own.

Any of the social mediums when used incorrectly can have serious implications. Look at the alleged way Brett Favre dug himself a hole using myspace and his cell phone!

[peachy]

Friends tried to talk me into joining FB, so I went to the site, got overwhelmed by all the details and technical stuff and thought to hades with it. Long lost friends are lost for a reason, even if I cant remember what the reason was. I am firm believer in not letting the same dog bite me twice. Old school friends etc....gawd that was last century....who cares ? If anybody is really desperate to find out whatever became of the blonde bombshell from grade 6, there is a wonderful invention called a telephone book. My last name isnt exactly common so I am not too hard to find. When I do have a night on the town or make an official public appearance, its usually documented and photographed for the social pages in the newspaper. Outside of that, the blinds are closed on this fishbowl.

Peachy

[Dypsisdean]

Here's today's latest in the never ending litany of Facebook security breaches. This one uncovered by a special Wall Street Journal investigation. The only difference is that this one seems to be intentional and possibly worked with in concert with others. IMO, "Where there's smoke there's fire." Why don't they just notify everyone that there is no such thing as privacy on FaceBook.

Facebook Privacy Fail: Apps Leak Private Info, Report

By Daniel Ionescu, PCWorld

Oct 18, 2010 3:18 am

Even if you use the strictest privacy settings on Facebook, many applications can pass on information that personally identifies you and your friends to advertisers, says a Wall Street Journal investigation.

Your name, and in some cases your friends' names are provided to dozens of advertising and Internet tracking companies, according to the WSJ report, by simply using Facebook applications or games. It is estimated tens of millions of Facebook app users are affected, despite many using the strictest Facebook privacy settings.

Complete story here: http://www.pcworld.com/article/208058/facebook_privacy_fail_apps_leak_private_info_report.html?tk=hp_new

[Walter John]

Dean, why don't you just come out with it, do you like Facebook or not ?

[aussiearoids]

I waste way to much time on it

And even though I use a disguised Spanish equivalent of my name ,

and Americanized my birthday [ swapped day for month & vica versa ]

I STILL got people catching up ... damn I blame my family

A great SBS doco about the creator of the WWW last night .

[Dypsisdean]

Dean, why don't you just come out with it, do you like Facebook or not ?

Wal,

I really don't have a like or dislike. There are a few things I would like to see sometimes, or perhaps look up an old friend or two. But until they can provide some level of security, I'm staying away. Especially now that they may have been involved in "covert" spying, compiling, and creating profiles of the users. Kinda scary IMO. Their reputation continues to suffer. If they choose to, they could begin logging every key you press and site you visit. Hackers already have.

[yachtingone]

As many of you know I started the Palmtalk on Facebook page. I thought it would be a cool way to help promote palmtalk. Also it has a huge advantage over the palmtalk forum for posting videos. They don't go away like in palm talk! They are stored in the video section! BTW I have noticed that palmtalk on facebook always gets a big boost in signups when palmtalk talks about it even in a negative way.

The link shows what administrators get to see.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000050464040#!/insights/?sk=pp_449928175242

Randy

[BS Man about Palms]

I registered yesterday only to aid my search for the missing girl I knew/know (Thank you, she was found) But I only filled out the first page requirements and skipped everything else....

gave wrong birthday too.....

[_Keith]

I registered yesterday only to aid my search for the missing girl I knew/know (Thank you, she was found) But I only filled out the first page requirements and skipped everything else....

gave wrong birthday too.....

I think you hit the nail on the head, Bill. They can't share what they don't have.

[_Keith]

Exploration of new areas always come with danger. But it also comes with opportunity, as well. http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/21/sfund/

[Dypsisdean]

I registered yesterday only to aid my search for the missing girl I knew/know (Thank you, she was found) But I only filled out the first page requirements and skipped everything else....

gave wrong birthday too.....

I think you hit the nail on the head, Bill. They can't share what they don't have.

Not true. Nobody shared their bank account numbers, but FaceBook members still had money ripped off from their bank accounts. The problem is not with what you put on FaceBook, it's what hackers, through FaceBook, can learn about you from your computer and by tracking your web surfing habits after downloading special software onto your computer.

[Dypsisdean]

Exploration of new areas always come with danger. But it also comes with opportunity, as well. http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/21/sfund/

Zynga was the main culprit mentioned in the article I just posted who was violating users privacy.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/208058/facebook_privacy_fail_apps_leak_private_info_report.html?tk=hp_ne

[BS Man about Palms]

I have to say, once I did that, there was a link of potential "friends". About half of which I knew.

Next day I got 2 emails from people wanting to "friend me".

[Dypsisdean]

I have to say, once I did that, there was a link of potential "friends". About half of which I knew.

Next day I got 2 emails from people wanting to "friend me".

Bill,

There are so many things to be cautious of. Some day they will get them worked out. But today if you don't know how to protect yourself (by removing exif information), you can take a pic from your phone and link to it from FaceBook, and someone can easily pull up a google map of where that photo was taken, and even what time of day. Great for someone wanting to know where that prize cycad is located, or where your home, or your friend's home, is located.

[BS Man about Palms]

Yep- Dean, I'm still on your side, and very leery.

[_Keith]

Keep the water in the moats, the arrowmen in their ports, and sleep lightly, for the world is a fearful place.

[Dypsisdean]

Keep the water in the moats, the arrowmen in their ports, and sleep lightly, for the world is a fearful place.

Not if one is prudent, knowledgeable, and well informed.

[Walter John]

Keep the water in the moats, the arrowmen in their ports, and sleep lightly, for the world is a fearful place.

That's poetic, do you mind if I use that in a song ?