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Ferns around palms


ThunderSRQ

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I'd like to ask for some input from anyone who has used ferns as understory directly adjacent to their palms (I have quite a few unique fern types and thought they'd look great in my shaded/filtered light palm areas).

However, I don't know if the ferns may absorb too much moisture and so negatively impact the amount of water available to the palm or if the "thatch" that develops in/under a group of ferns will hold moisture better (similar to mulch) and be beneficial to the palm -- ???

Thanks...

Tim

Sarasota, Florida USA (zone 9B) - 1 acre with approx. 91 types of palms & many other plants/trees

My two favorite palms are Teddy Bears and Zombies... zombieteddybear2-compressed.jpg

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I've got Boston Fern covering the entire trunk and base of a 6 ft. clear trunk B. capita.....no ill effects that I can discern.

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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They go together like peas and carrots. I just planted 10 Blechnum gibbum's around the base of my palms yesterday. Boy it looks good.

Best regards

Tyrone

Millbrook, "Kinjarling" Noongar word meaning "Place of Rain", Rainbow Coast, Western Australia 35S. Warm temperate. Csb Koeppen Climate classification. Cool nights all year round.

 

 

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GO for it, they can even help with moisture loss somtimes.

Regards,

Bruce

Innisfail - NQ AUS - 3600mm of rain a year average or around 144inches if you prefer - Temp Range 9c to 43c

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Hi ThunderSRQ,

I would make sure that the ferns have the same requirements as the palm, ie I would not plant ferns that like wet conditions around arid palms etc, but as we know most combination's will go together.

Regards

Wanderanwills

Stephen

Broome Western Australia

Where the desert meets the sea

Tropical Monsoon

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I've attached ferns onto the trunks of palms once there is enough of a canopy for the palm fronds or surrounding trees to create a shady environment-- platyceriums (staghorn family), polypodiums and even aspleniums (birds nest types). They do look good together.

Word of cauthion though-- often the trunks of palms are smooth and even waxy and it takes some time before the fern roots provide enough stability for the entire plant. I'll look for pictures-- I know I have some around here somewhere.

Gene

Manila, Philippines

53 feet above sea level - inland

Hot and dry in summer, humid and sticky monsoon season, perfect weather Christmas time

http://freakofnaturezzz.blogspot.com/

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I've attached ferns onto the trunks of palms once there is enough of a canopy for the palm fronds or surrounding trees to create a shady environment-- platyceriums (staghorn family), polypodiums and even aspleniums (birds nest types). They do look good together.

Word of cauthion though-- often the trunks of palms are smooth and even waxy and it takes some time before the fern roots provide enough stability for the entire plant. I'll look for pictures-- I know I have some around here somewhere.

Not sure is this was what you had in mind but still an interesting thinsg for the garden

post-1017-12698701898191_thumb.jpg

Gene

Manila, Philippines

53 feet above sea level - inland

Hot and dry in summer, humid and sticky monsoon season, perfect weather Christmas time

http://freakofnaturezzz.blogspot.com/

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I've attached ferns onto the trunks of palms once there is enough of a canopy for the palm fronds or surrounding trees to create a shady environment-- platyceriums (staghorn family), polypodiums and even aspleniums (birds nest types). They do look good together.

Word of cauthion though-- often the trunks of palms are smooth and even waxy and it takes some time before the fern roots provide enough stability for the entire plant. I'll look for pictures-- I know I have some around here somewhere.

Not sure is this was what you had in mind but still an interesting combination for the garden

post-1017-12698701898191_thumb.jpg

Gene

Manila, Philippines

53 feet above sea level - inland

Hot and dry in summer, humid and sticky monsoon season, perfect weather Christmas time

http://freakofnaturezzz.blogspot.com/

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Nice contrast with the trunk of the Areca Catechu

post-1017-12698716013263_thumb.jpg

Platycerium Grande on a Livistonia Rotundifolia trunk

post-1017-12698716473948_thumb.jpg

Another Platycerium Grande

post-1017-12698717238451_thumb.jpg

Gene

Manila, Philippines

53 feet above sea level - inland

Hot and dry in summer, humid and sticky monsoon season, perfect weather Christmas time

http://freakofnaturezzz.blogspot.com/

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Here's a small pup that I tore off its mother a few months back

I tied it in teh middle oa Trio of Fox Tail Palms where it is completely shaded out

Looks like it loves its micro climate/environment

post-1017-12698717779624_thumb.jpg

post-1017-12698717899944_thumb.jpg

Gene

Manila, Philippines

53 feet above sea level - inland

Hot and dry in summer, humid and sticky monsoon season, perfect weather Christmas time

http://freakofnaturezzz.blogspot.com/

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If you click on those pictures/thumbnails -- a much bigger version of the photo pops up.

There you can see the rope, string or wires that we wrapped around the fern and the trunk. Just make sure there is no gap between them so that the roots can cling to the trunk as soon as possible.

if a gap can't be avoided just fill it with leaves so that there is some sort of medium the fine roots can crawl through to ge to the trunk.

Gene

Manila, Philippines

53 feet above sea level - inland

Hot and dry in summer, humid and sticky monsoon season, perfect weather Christmas time

http://freakofnaturezzz.blogspot.com/

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that looks awesome gene!

tims question,though,was about planting ferns in the ground at the base of the palms :lol:

the "prince of snarkness."

 

still "warning-free."

 

san diego,california,left coast.

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tims question,though,was about planting ferns in the ground at the base of the palms laugh.gif

I'm guessing none of the ferns are the dreaded "vampire ferns" -- so his palms should be safe...rolleyes.gif

Thanks for all the input -- I did have a lot of boston ferns in my yard before I started my plant collection but I've removed most of them to clear the way for more unusual stuff (however, the thatch layer they produce is VERY significant and full of seeds -- it takes quite a while to get rid of them once they've become well-established). I found a very cool-looking, large leafed blue-green fern at a big box store and have it planted under a palm as my first ferny-palm thing -- I'll try to remember to get a shot of it (and hopefully the ID) and post it.

Here's a picture (from 2004) showing one of the main (former) boston fern areas over to the left:

post-1263-12698923682946_thumb.jpg

Sarasota, Florida USA (zone 9B) - 1 acre with approx. 91 types of palms & many other plants/trees

My two favorite palms are Teddy Bears and Zombies... zombieteddybear2-compressed.jpg

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tims question,though,was about planting ferns in the ground at the base of the palms laugh.gif

I'm guessing none of the ferns are the dreaded "vampire ferns" -- so his palms should be safe...rolleyes.gif

Thanks for all the input -- I did have a lot of boston ferns in my yard before I started my plant collection but I've removed most of them to clear the way for more unusual stuff (however, the thatch layer they produce is VERY significant and full of seeds -- it takes quite a while to get rid of them once they've become well-established). I found a very cool-looking, large leafed blue-green fern at a big box store and have it planted under a palm as my first ferny-palm thing -- I'll try to remember to get a shot of it (and hopefully the ID) and post it.

Here's a picture (from 2004) showing one of the main (former) boston fern areas over to the left:

That's a very nice yard, how about an updated pic?

How close to the coast are you?

Keith 

Palmetto, Florida (10a) and Tampa, Florida (9b/10a)

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How about this look ? Down the back where I planted some very young native palms a few days ago.

post-51-12699458095931_thumb.jpg

There's some habitat bangalows there too.

post-51-12699457106743_thumb.jpg

Happy Gardening

Cheers,

Wal

Queensland, Australia.

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I wish I had a large oak tree - those are wonderful.

And an added benefit is that the palms under the canopy aren't damaged as bad in the winter. A coconut near me that was under canopy got close to no damage this winter, while coconuts even right by the coast were fried.

Keith 

Palmetto, Florida (10a) and Tampa, Florida (9b/10a)

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  • 2 years later...

Howdy all....haven't been on here in awhile.....Revived this old thread because my Butia that I mentioned previously is doing very poorly. It appears to be dying slowly. The oldest fronds have been turning brown like they are drying out. This palm was transplanted about 8 years ago and it was an absolutely beautiful palm with maybe 4 times the number of fronds than it has now.

After transplant I had to cut at least half the fronds because of transplant root loss. It has never regained the number of fronds it had initially. A few years ago, I introduced the Boston Fern to the trunk and have had a sprinkler system in place. The water turns on this station for 10 minutes/ 3 times a day.

Upon pulling the rotting boots from the tree around the base, I've noticed that multitudes of slugs are calling it home. This probably is a silly question, but do you think the fern/moisture/slugs are killing this very large mature tree? I come from the area of the country where butia's are very common. I also see alot of them with Boston Fern, but maybe not in conjunction with the constant moisture on the trunk my tree is experiencing. Any comments appreciated, this tree cost me $600 eight years ago and I would hate to lose it.

post-97-074587600 1335828264_thumb.jpg

post-97-074383500 1335828293_thumb.jpg

post-97-049946800 1335828313_thumb.jpg

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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It certainly can't hurt to remove the ferns and let that area dry out, regardless of the issue.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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David,

I've seen a lot of Butia palms with the ferns in the trunks so that alone shouldn't be a problem. The moisture might be an issue.

Why do you water so frequently and for such a short duration? Normally that is the best method for tropical ferns, bromeliad, orchids, and such, but I don't see any of those in your pictures (other than common ferns). For palms and shrubs, I would water for about an hour once every week or two. Ten minutes worth probably won’t even make it through the mulch.

Kathryn

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Kathryn, my problem is that I initially set the sprinkler system up with 9 stations. If I run the stations for more than 10 minutes each the water pump runs for 1 1/2 hours strait. When it was run for longer and less frequently I was burning out sprinkler contact switches at a rate of a switch every month or two. I have tried to find a way to run only certain stations without running through the entire yard but the system doesn't seem to allow deep watering for that many stations. I will look at the system again today and see if I can set the schedule to run deep watering on alternating days of the week while not running other stations at all. Also have the problem that my lawn need more frequent less deep watering and I get overlap into the bed/lawn and lawn/beds which my result in inadvertant frequent watering of palms that don't need it.

Going to look at the system again today with a fresh brain to see if something better can be done. Thanks for the input.

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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Well now I'm feeling like a dope.. :rant: ...actually read and followed the instructions for my watering system and found out how to solve the problem. Didn't realize that the 3 programs would actually roll into each other if there were no time conflicts so daily watering is not neccessary for that station. Doh (Homer Simpson Emoticon)

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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Hello David, good to see you back.

I was just thinking the other day about you and how you were doing.

I agree w/ others that your Butia is getting too much water and will not dry out. Could'nt hurt to drench the soil w/ subdue if you have some.

Cheers

Orlando, Florida

zone 9b

The Pollen Poacher!!

GO DOLPHINS!!

GO GATORS!!!

 

Palms, Sex, Money and horsepower,,,, you may have more than you can handle,,

but too much is never enough!!

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Yes ferns and Palms look good together. But in your area I would stay away from 'Tuberous' Sword Fern (Nephrolepis cordifolia) its very invasive in FL. Unless you want it to climb your palm trunks. Ferns come in all types of environments so use the ones that best suits your needs.

Edited by Palm crazy
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At the other end of the scale, if you put small/young palms close to big established tree ferns they may be lucky to find any soil at all. Those roots can be very dense and go for a long way out from around the tree. We have made this mistake before our smaller ferns and palms fail under big tree ferns but Bromiliads do great.

Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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At the other end of the scale, if you put small/young palms close to big established tree ferns they may be lucky to find any soil at all. Those roots can be very dense and go for a long way out from around the tree. We have made this mistake before our smaller ferns and palms fail under big tree ferns but Bromiliads do great.

Couldn't agree more. Tree ferns are hungry, thirsty monsters that kill all competition so be very careful about placement.

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