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Persistent Cold Air in Florida

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BigBpalms
DSCF1145-1.jpg

was 26 in oviedo this morning - frost on everything, all palms look bad except caryota max(himilayan) forecast calling for snow and sleet on friday night?

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falcon1988

Ouch!!!! I went along the yard to see what was damage i have to say everything is good shape some burn here and there

i mostly covered the tender/small palms the leafs that are touching the fabric are burned not bad but noticeable, I hit

last night around 37-38 when i got from work at 4am it was 39.6. not bad but there was light frost on the ground have to see

what turners up on damage. Man this really getting old I had to recheck to see what state. I lived in i thought i was back into Ohio

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www.dadluvsu.com

All the tropicals took a big hit. Mauritia, Pigafetta, Socratea, etc look dead... curled over and dead. Pinangas and some Arecas (ipot, macrocalyx, etc.) are already beginning to show bad burns... Oddly enough my swamp submerged Cyrtostachys appears to be fine. :blink:

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spockvr6
Some yard pics... low was 19.6* on my field gauge. Pics were taken at around 8:30 am...

Gotta tell ya Jay......the amount of space you have there is fantastic!

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happ
Im sure all you Floridians could care less, but we made it above freezing for the second day in a row after a week of sub 32 daytime highs, and nighttime lows in the mid teens to low 20s. Today was the "warmest" day @ 39. It was almost slightly pleasant. 1-2" of snow is coming tomorrow evening with the Alberta clipper thats passing through, then for sat and sunday, the highs will be in the mid 20s, lows back down to low to mid teens. The Potomac river is mostly frozen over, which has not happend in about 10 years or so, and the Chesapeake Bay is beginning to freeze, and that has not completely frozen over since the winter of 77. Fortunately, about 7 days from now, its forecast to actually go above 40 for the first time in weeks! Normal high here this time of year is 43. Until then the best well manage during the day is barely above freezing starting monday or tuesday. YUK! I feel for all you down there. I hope everything comes through ok. Im planning on visiting St. Petersburg/ Tampa around the 21 of Jan, and im fully expecting to see lots of damage. My friend who lives in St. Pete is already reporting things are not doing so hot in his yard, and around town in general, but its not nearly as bad as the other (east) side of the bay down there.

Good luck!

The Chesapeake beginning to freeze???? That is bad!

Whew - those teens at night! I remember having to cope with that after moving back up to No. VA from St. Pete. It was during the infamous winter of 77-78, the two years my husband and I mistakenly thought we could live there. This winter is beginning to sound comparable to that. I'm glad you got a "warmup" but a shame there's more snow in store.

Yeah, your friend's yard is probably having some trouble, depending on what he has planted out. I hope our temps will be warmer when you get here, but this is one bad, bad winter - I wish you could have seen St. Pete during a more normal year, there are a lot of nice palms and crotons everywhere. There won't be, after this arctic blast.

This winter is strange - amazingly bad everywhere, can't believe the scenes from all over the country - even Europe.

Wish we could meet you when you visit St. Pete & maybe do a tour of Kopick Palm Arboretum. But I'll be just out of surgery. Anyway, if you have time, try to stop by Kopsick. It's really impressive and they ought to get thru this fine - they're in the warmest spot in St. Pete.

Larry in Tarpon said:

I think Ill be saying "Hello 20's" tomorrow morning!

If not this morning, then by Saturday night. It's 35 at our place and holding. For Saturday night, though, they dropped the forecast low from 35 to 32, now it's 31. The trend is getting colder and will probably end up in the 20's. On Saturday evening, my house will look like a greenhouse.

For me, the saddest thing is that once this is over, there'll be far fewer palms and crotons in the area - and probably more pines, podocarpus, ligustrum and yaupons (zzzz)..... If I wanted to look at stuff like that every day, I'd be living in Georgia. :rage::rage::rage:

Sunny, I've had the pleasure of visiting St Pete\ Tampa & really enjoyed the Sunken Gardens and Dali museum. How do banyan hold up in these temps? [suppose they are fine]. Especially admire the huge Ficus benghalensis in Crescent Pk. Hate the thought of all those wonderful specimens damaged :o

Edited by happ

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spockvr6
ALERT THE MEDIA - IT HIT 52f in my yard!

This oddity is also being seen in my yard.......I thought my thermometer was broken, but apparent it does have the ability to ready over 50F!

post-200-1262885821_thumb.png

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spockvr6
How do banyan hold up in these temps? [suppose they are fine]. Especially admire the huge Ficus benghalensis in Crescent Pk. Hate the thought of all those wonderful specimens damaged :o

They hold up fine because where they are is the warmest part of town by a wide margin!

Example----

33.7F at my house this AM and 42F where the Banyans are. Interior Tampa (at the Vandenberg AP) logged 24F. It is no coincidence that the only area of Tampa Bay with such magnificient Banyans is in the immediate downtown St. Pete area.

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fastfeat
DSCF1145-1.jpg

And yet the plastic Pothos in the background seems, oddly, unaffected...

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Paul The Palm Doctor!
Good luck everyone..But for once I have to gloat. Wish I could share some with ya... I left the house just after 7am to see 50F and it touched maybe 73F at my place today... :D

I can beat that. A min of 73F and a max of 91F with high humidity. :mrlooney:

Tyrone,

That is just another winters day average temperature range here. Well, winter is pushing it. But, that is what the locals call it.

dk

Hey Don: All looks beautiful here; no trace of any cold damage. Lowest 46 F. last night. Clouds rolled in from the Keys! I guess that South Florida pays dividends every once in a while even though the insurance on the house is unaffordable, the property taxes are exorbidant, the roads are hopelessly outdated, it's too flat, no one wants to learn English, and the water tastes like piss...but at least the coconuts are still green. I'll parlay that into a reason to celebrate the next freakin' day of terrorism in my homeland any day!

Dr. Paul

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Dave-Vero

Vero Beach, 28 early this morning, was 2 degrees colder than Orlando. Something like 10 hours at freezing or lower, with two interruptions of warmer temperatures (up to 34). No frost in my neighborhood

Looking undamaged: Carpentaria, Archontophoenix cunninghamiana, Dypsis plumosa, D. decaryi, D. carlsmithii, assorted Chamaedorea, Cryosophila williamsii (rootspine).

Damaged: Satakentia liukiuensis (brown spots on leaves. Total browning is almost certain--most of the leaves on the two plants will be toasted), Coconut (neighbor's tree looking very brown)

Possibly light leaf damage: Archontophoenix tuckeri.

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spockvr6
Hey Don: All looks beautiful here; no trace of any cold damage. Lowest 46 F. last night. Clouds rolled in from the Keys! I guess that South Florida pays dividends every once in a while even though the insurance on the house is unaffordable, the property taxes are exorbidant, the roads are hopelessly outdated, it's too flat, no one wants to learn English, and the water tastes like piss...but at least the coconuts are still green. I'll parlay that into a reason to celebrate the next freakin' day of terrorism in my homeland any day!

Dr. Paul

Your glass is surely HALF FULL! Great optimism :)

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spockvr6
Vero Beach, 28 early this morning, was 2 degrees colder than Orlando. Something like 10 hours at freezing or lower, with two interruptions of warmer temperatures (up to 34). No frost in my neighborhood

Looking undamaged: Carpentaria, Archontophoenix cunninghamiana, Dypsis plumosa, D. decaryi, D. carlsmithii, assorted Chamaedorea, Cryosophila williamsii (rootspine).

Damaged: Satakentia liukiuensis (brown spots on leaves. Total browning is almost certain--most of the leaves on the two plants will be toasted), Coconut (neighbor's tree looking very brown)

Possibly light leaf damage: Archontophoenix tuckeri.

If that Carpentaria makes it through that temp, I want seeds!

Mine are WIMPS! I lost a whole dang trunk last year (probably 8-10 ft of wood) and took a good amount of leaf damage on other ones.

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Paul The Palm Doctor!
Hey Don: All looks beautiful here; no trace of any cold damage. Lowest 46 F. last night. Clouds rolled in from the Keys! I guess that South Florida pays dividends every once in a while even though the insurance on the house is unaffordable, the property taxes are exorbidant, the roads are hopelessly outdated, it's too flat, no one wants to learn English, and the water tastes like piss...but at least the coconuts are still green. I'll parlay that into a reason to celebrate the next freakin' day of terrorism in my homeland any day!

Dr. Paul

Your glass is surely HALF FULL! Great optimism :)

I think, Larry that I developed a bizarre sense of optimism just by living through stuff!! I really understand our folks' anger, disappointment, and sadness, but it's realy an issue of cosmetics: beauty vs. the sudden loss of same! We get old and someday some doctor is going to tell each of us that things aren't going to be good anymore. Now, that is a lecture that will generate much of the same emotions as our folks are feeling now, but now, these are things that we can and will overcome after this shockingly lousy month.

February brings more sun and more HEAT, yeah! Spring is gorgeous in Fla...always is! Then, my thoughts turn to stayin' cool, and replanting stuff that I really didn't care for so much anyway.

That's my take, and I'll never be popular for these and other reasons but I don't care because I love life more than I need approval by anyone other than my own conscience.

Paul

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Dave-Vero

Larry, what are likely to be siblings of one carpie are fruiting already in the nursery owner's back yard. I think both of my carpies may flower for the first time this year. They've quit the fast vertical growth mode.

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gsn

Scott here reporting from the ICEBOX of central Florida! last night my low was 28.3F!

These are my low temps for the last 6 days...

1/2 - 37.2F

1/3 - 33.8F

1/4 - 30.2F

1/5 - 35.1F

1/6 - 26.3F

1/7 - 28.2F

Forecast for the next 2 nights 38-39 depending on source then freezing temps for 2 more nights after that...

To all who said we have had these long COOL spells in Florida before, I don't ever remember anything even remotely like this, if the forecast holds up, that will have been 10 days where my LOW was never above 40F. I have lived in Florida for 50 years and don't remember seeing that, maybe I'm getting OLDTIMERS though? :lol:

Good thing I have some of those common OLD queen palms, otherwise everything would be brown...just sayin

Edited by gsn

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junglegalfla

Larry,

The banyan at Crescent Lake is only about a mile from my place. I saw 31 this morning, I highly doubt it was as warm as 42 at crescent, granted it's smallish body of water but the park is also on a slight hill. I'm walking there tonight after work, I'll take a look. The banyans across from the Vinoy could very well have seen 42 though.

P.S. Takes frigid weather to get you out of the shadows & posting again huh? :P:lol:

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Paul The Palm Doctor!
Larry,

The banyan at Crescent Lake is only about a mile from my place. I saw 31 this morning, I highly doubt it was as warm as 42 at crescent, granted it's smallish body of water but the park is also on a slight hill. I'm walking there tonight after work, I'll take a look. The banyans across from the Vinoy could very well have seen 42 though.

P.S. Takes frigid weather to get you out of the shadows & posting again huh? :P:lol:

Me, too, since I found out the cancer has spread and I still haven't made any treatment decisions.

I'm sorry for my acidic-toned missives, but you know that I love y'all, it's just that I don't know how to prioritise stuff, and I get a bit short-patienced at times, but I apologise for any preceived rudeness.

I'll smack my self!! There: I deserved that!!! (big wink!!)

Paul

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junglegalfla

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spockvr6
Larry,

The banyan at Crescent Lake is only about a mile from my place. I saw 31 this morning, I highly doubt it was as warm as 42 at crescent, granted it's smallish body of water but the park is also on a slight hill. I'm walking there tonight after work, I'll take a look. The banyans across from the Vinoy could very well have seen 42 though.

P.S. Takes frigid weather to get you out of the shadows & posting again huh? :P:lol:

You are right....I was thinking of the huge ones near Vinoy which are right next to Albert Whitted AP.

There is a USF weather station located in Campbell Park (closest thing I could find to Crescent Lake) and it showed 36F this morning. So, a notable drop from the Albert Whitted reading.

Theres another amateur station that looks be be near MLK and 45th St, and that station showed 30F!

From what Ive gathered over time, the ultra-protected area of St. Pete seems to be east of 4th Street.

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spockvr6
Larry,

The banyan at Crescent Lake is only about a mile from my place. I saw 31 this morning, I highly doubt it was as warm as 42 at crescent, granted it's smallish body of water but the park is also on a slight hill. I'm walking there tonight after work, I'll take a look. The banyans across from the Vinoy could very well have seen 42 though.

P.S. Takes frigid weather to get you out of the shadows & posting again huh? :P:lol:

Me, too, since I found out the cancer has spread and I still haven't made any treatment decisions.

I'm sorry for my acidic-toned missives, but you know that I love y'all, it's just that I don't know how to prioritise stuff, and I get a bit short-patienced at times, but I apologise for any preceived rudeness.

I'll smack my self!! There: I deserved that!!! (big wink!!)

Paul

Paul-

I dont find your tone acidic at all. So save the smacks for someone who deserves it! GSN perhaps? Or maybe one of those California snarks? LOL.

On a serious note, sorry to hear of your health. Keep the glass half full!

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JayW
Some yard pics... low was 19.6* on my field gauge. Pics were taken at around 8:30 am...

Gotta tell ya Jay......the amount of space you have there is fantastic!

Thanks! I have a few Sabal Minors that I'll be planting around next spring. I also have around 30 Sabal Lisa's, some I'll be planting within a couple years. I'll have to find homes for a bunch of the others.

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JayW
DSCF1145-1.jpg

And yet the plastic Pothos in the background seems, oddly, unaffected...

Strange, isn't it? :huh:

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Paul The Palm Doctor!
Larry,

The banyan at Crescent Lake is only about a mile from my place. I saw 31 this morning, I highly doubt it was as warm as 42 at crescent, granted it's smallish body of water but the park is also on a slight hill. I'm walking there tonight after work, I'll take a look. The banyans across from the Vinoy could very well have seen 42 though.

P.S. Takes frigid weather to get you out of the shadows & posting again huh? :P:lol:

Me, too, since I found out the cancer has spread and I still haven't made any treatment decisions.

I'm sorry for my acidic-toned missives, but you know that I love y'all, it's just that I don't know how to prioritise stuff, and I get a bit short-patienced at times, but I apologise for any preceived rudeness.

I'll smack my self!! There: I deserved that!!! (big wink!!)

Paul

Paul-

I dont find your tone acidic at all. So save the smacks for someone who deserves it! GSN perhaps? Or maybe one of those California snarks? LOL.

On a serious note, sorry to hear of your health. Keep the glass half full!

I'm DAMNED WELL GOING TO TRY, LARRY!! You know I will.

Paul

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SunnyFl
Thank you! Yeah, I have lived in the DC area my whole life, and while I was a kid in 77 (im 38 now) I very vividly remember the winter of 77/78 when the whole Chesapeake froze over as far down as south of the Bay Bridge. That was just amazing to see. The Potomac is now pretty frozen over, just about shore to shore and almost down to the Woodrow Wilson bridge. ITs not flat ice either. Since its been windy it is very chopped up jagged looking ice, sort of like ice jam looking i guess. Its been YEARS, probably 12 or more since we have seen the Potomac freeze like that. There IS ice forming on the Chesapeake too, but its not bad yet, but it is there and is noticeable. Have not seen ice on the bay in probably 20 years or more, save for maybe just a small lining just on the shoreline.

I was just in St. Pete in September for 10 days, so I did get to see it before this cold snap. It had been since 1991 since I had been to Tampa/ St. Pete, and MAN does it ever look alot different and BETTER! I was blown away by all the stuff that just grows down there. Our houseplants here turn into trees down there! THere were many times I was just stunned to be driving or walking along, and I see a big tree, then when I got close saw it was a giant scheffelera or rubber tree(ficus)..etc.

Is Kopick the place that is right down town on the water, just north of the Pier? The first place my friend took me right after he picked me up from TPA was a "Palmetum" that was right on the water in downtown St. Pete, not too far from the pier, and the Vinoy...etc. Ahhh... coffee / breakfast at the Vinoy.... good stuff! I had a great time down there, save for the day I laned ( it was pouring until we hit St. Pete) it was mostly sunny and pretty darn warm back then. There are ALOT of places down there that I want to visit, and many that I did visit that I want to go back to. My tow favorites were the Sunken Garden / Crescent lake ( that banyan is HUGE!) and of all places, Caddys on the beach / Sunset beach on Treasure Island.

As far as my friends yard, well, hes got TONS of stuff that we have as houseplants up here. Philodendrons, Dracenas (BIG ONES), some parlor palms, LOTS of Plumeria, scheffalera, rubber plants.... and the list goes on. He is in "interior" St. Pete, almost dead center of the peninsula, at what is the very southern most block of "Pinellas Park".

Anyway, I hope everything comes thru ok down there! St. Pete/ Tampa is very likely to be my future home, for multitudes of reasons. Its a fantastic climate, AND, they have pro ICE HOCKEY!!!! the best of both worlds! haha! Its not a matter of "if" anymore, its now just a matter of "when" for me. 38 winters here is enough, even though many in the last 10 years or so have been VERY MILD up here.

This might be a good time to consider moving here. Housing is much more reasonable - and yeah, the climate here is (usually) terrific. About the "houseplants" that grow outdoors - yep, we grow pothos right up into the trees - when they climb trees, those little leaves become giant. Philodendrons, dracaenas, ficus are all landscape plants for us. I have a shefflera tree by my house that is at least 15' maybe more, multi-trunked - it flowered this past summer. I think that D. lutescens is used as a popular "indoor" palm up north. Here, they're planted outdoors - and they grow like weeds.

It sounds as if your friend lives very close to us. We're just south of Pinellas Park, right on the border. And about Gizella Kopsick (I misspelt it this morning - frozen brain syndrome hehe) - it is right on the water near the pier.

Amazing to hear about the Chesapeake. Yeah, I remember the winter of '77-78 up there. It was most miserable. I was working in McLean at the time. Just cold-cold-cold and it kept snowing! ehhh. We left in March of '78 and as I got in my car to leave for FL, it started snowing again.

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cobra2326

I read 23.2F in Spring Hill last night. Not to worried though, Spring Hill freezes every year so I'm always prepared. I'll try to post a pic of the A. cunninghamiana that's been in the ground 3 years now and has about 6 ft of trunk, 8-9 ft overall now. I protect it every year.

Also, Thought this was funny:

post-748-1262913157_thumb.png

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gsn

Well I am trying to figure out this warm-up forecast for here tonight, which is 38-39 depending on source, when it is already 39.2F at 8:30 PM!

8:00 AM tomorrow is a long way off, I can't imagine we will stay at 39F all night, but that is what they are saying!!! :lol:

No watches or warning from the NWS for any of Florida except for the panhandle west of Lake City.

Edited by gsn

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Alicehunter2000

Ok....now I'm getting a bit worried. After this rain tonight, tommorow night and saturday night its supposed to get down to possibly 20 degrees!

What do I do? I have Christmas lights.....should I wrap lights around my Bizmarkia's? I have 6 in the ground. I've got 3 outdoor extension cords. Do I wrap the spear then put the lights on the outside? I have never wrapped lights to protect palms before.......should I or shouldn't I?

They all seem to have handled temps down to 25 for several nights and for many hours at a time......but that extra 5 degrees is what I'm worried about.

Here are the Bizzies in question......help me save them!

post-97-1262916932_thumb.jpg

post-97-1262916970_thumb.jpg

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Alicehunter2000

Another.....shivering for help!

post-97-1262917045_thumb.jpg

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Alicehunter2000

1 more.....chattering in the cold.

post-97-1262917125_thumb.jpg

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Alicehunter2000

The last one.........hmm I thought I had 6 :hmm:

post-97-1262917192_thumb.jpg

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war_eagle

Here is what I have done to protect my Foxtail here in Houston. This method is getting a MAJOR test this weekend with projected lows of 25, 23, 25, 29 coming up, but it was worked well for the last three years. I tie up all of the fronds fairly tightly. Next I wrap xmas lights from the base to the top. One string of lights should be fine for your Bizzies. The type of lights is very important. I use the older style mini-lights. LED lights will not produce enough heat and rope lights will melt your palm (sounds crazy, but I'm not the only one who has does it). After wrapping with the lights I wrap with a blanket. Next I wrap with a tarp if the forecast is especially cold or precipitation is expected. The end result looks like a glowing totem poll, sort of. Personally I think this would add enough heat to keep a Bizzie alive when temps are 20, probably even a little lower.

There are many other methods as well, but I have used the above method with success. Good luck.

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gsn
Well I am trying to figure out this warm-up forecast for here tonight, which is 38-39 depending on source, when it is already 39.2F at 8:30 PM!

8:00 AM tomorrow is a long way off, I can't imagine we will stay at 39F all night, but that is what they are saying!!! :lol:

No watches or warning from the NWS for any of Florida except for the panhandle west of Lake City.

35.8F here at 10:30PM ...still waiting for the warm-up!!! :lol:

There are some some clouds moving in from the south ,but have not reached us yet..maybe that will reverse the downward trend!

Edited by gsn

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FRITO

David, I throw a sheet on mine and then a blue tarp with some bungees. I have a tring of 25count c-7 xmas lights drapped on the palm underneath.

I protected my L. saribus with a 90 w halogen and some old sheets.

goodluck

Luke

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Dave-Vero

Vero Beach tonight is a puzzle. Predicted low is 37, while the latest posted reading from the airport is 33. WunderMap shows all other local stations about 40 (51 at the beach with a southerly breeze).

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BS Man about Palms

You know I was thinkin...some of you could be growing a pretty nice Ceroxylon right now.... :D

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Tyrone
You know I was thinkin...some of you could be growing a pretty nice Ceroxylon right now.... :D

That's cruel, but I was thinking the same. But that's like saying we should grow lipsticks when the summer temps are hot and humid.

Best regards

Tyrone

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PalmatierMeg

David, your Bizzies don't look exceptionally large. I have a L. grandis about the size of several of the smaller ones. Last winter I tented it with a pair of step ladders and the white cloth cover from out T-bird. Then I set one of those clamp-on, aluminum shop lights on the ground inside the tent and aimed it toward the heart of the palm. That gave out enough heat to keep the Licuala alive through 32F nights. All it got was some tip burn where the frosted cloth touched it. A small space heater can accomplish the same thing but I didn't have one last year. The point is to keep the palm's growing point a few degrees above a death sentence. The cover/tent serves to hold enough heat to do that. King sheets might do that or you can clamp together enough cloth to make that tent. If you have a heating pad without automatic shutoff, you can wrap one of the smaller palms with the heating pad on the growing point.

Meanwhile, at 12:45 a.m. I'm sitting in front of the computer because I can't sleep for trying to figure out how to keep my 10' Areca concinna warm enough to survive the weekend.

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Paul The Palm Doctor!
Well I am trying to figure out this warm-up forecast for here tonight, which is 38-39 depending on source, when it is already 39.2F at 8:30 PM!

8:00 AM tomorrow is a long way off, I can't imagine we will stay at 39F all night, but that is what they are saying!!! :lol:

No watches or warning from the NWS for any of Florida except for the panhandle west of Lake City.

That checks out, Scott! Next Tuesday, this will ALL be a lousy memory!

Dr. Paul

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SunnyFl
Next Tuesday, this will ALL be a lousy memory!

Dr. Paul

Yep, one stinkin' memory and a stinkin' pile of mush. :angry:

Paul, I am very sorry to hear of the problems you are facing and hope that you can get through this. No worries about what you called your "acidic-toned missives" - and no smacking yourself either.

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SunnyFl

Guys, I am just amazed by the forecasts for Saturday & Sunday nights. This is so unreal - in the last 20 years, we've only done real cold protection once. January 24 freeze of either 2001 or 2003, I can't recall which year it was. We wrapped up a foxie and tented a small spindle palm. They both got through it with bronzed leaves but recovered. The spindle palm is alive and well today and about 10' tall with the classic spindle shape. (The foxie & a nearby glauca died the following summer of standing water during a bad rain when we were out of town)

People around my neighborhood have bottles, spindles, foxies and adonidias and over the years, the plants have grown to maturity and look terrific. And no one here ever does cold protection - not even in that January freeze. It's hard to think that by Monday, it could all be gone.

Epicure wrote:

So, for those of you that brought potted plants and palms into the house, do you get worried about little critters crawling around or are they really not found this time of year?

In FL, critters are found at all times of year. This is what I don't like about bringing stuff in - lord only knows what could come crawling out. We've had to chase lizards and tiny frogs around and gently carry them back outside. But what I worry about is palmettos and other nasty bugs - I can't stand the thought of those, eeek.

edited b/c I just recalled that we did do a feeble cold-protection another time - just tossed some frostcloth over a few things. The "covered" things got brown spots where the frostcloth touched. The uncovered stuff was fine with no spots at all.

Edited by SunnyFl

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