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gsytch

Persistent Cold Air in Florida

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mpanak
I do wonder if mine is correct but I would think that the weather station at St. Leo University on weather underground is accurate. Mine always says the same as that one. There is no doubt that it was colder Sunday night when I covered a few plants.

I just looked again and it's 27.0* at 10 pm. Maybe it's gauge placement? Where is yours set up at? Like I said above, I moved mine out into the field today and there's nothing around it for any type of warmth. I wanted to see exactly how cold it was getting out there with my palms. It's on a fence post, about 4ft off the ground.

I'm going to check with my neighbor tomorrow and compare temps, his is out on his porch on a block wall. I'm sure it will read warmer. How much though is the question.

Mine sits up high on my deck. I did take it down to ground level once last year when it got really cold to see if it changed and it didn't. Mine is cheap but I still imagine the one at the college is fairly accurate. Gonna run this new one outside and see what it reads.

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tropical1

You should be in good shape Larry. I think you will be above 32 in the AM.

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JayW
What are the rest of you reading in Tampa Bay?

43.2F/31F dewpoint and light NW winds (1-5 mph). As I look at my wind plots, the trend seems to be to a slowing of the wind speeds, so the big drop may start if this happens.

Just out of curiosity, how do you have your gauge set up? Height and placement? With mine being 4ft in an open field, I still assume that it will be accurate, to at least that area where my palms are growing?

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spockvr6
You should be in good shape Larry. I think you will be above 32 in the AM.

Heck, I dont even worry about this stuff anymore :mrlooney: Although, Id be lying if I didnt admit Id have a preference to not come home tomorrow (I am out of town for work) to a completely fried yard!

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JayW
Is weather.com accurate at all because it is way off in it's predictions for tonight compared to everything else I have looked at.

http://www.weather.com/outlook/events/spor...from=hrly_graph

http://www.accuweather.com/us/fl/saint-leo...&hbhhour=23

I can tell you this, the weather channel temp on my Yahoo page had it being 24* in Auburndale this morning... my gauge, when it was under my carport was mid 30's. I don't know where they get some of their info from.

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tropical1

Anybody have a station set up on Pine Island?

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spockvr6
What are the rest of you reading in Tampa Bay?

43.2F/31F dewpoint and light NW winds (1-5 mph). As I look at my wind plots, the trend seems to be to a slowing of the wind speeds, so the big drop may start if this happens.

Just out of curiosity, how do you have your gauge set up? Height and placement? With mine being 4ft in an open field, I still assume that it will be accurate, to at least that area where my palms are growing?

I have a Davis Vantage Pro weather station with a fan aspirated radiation shield. Mines ~6 ft off the ground.

Your placement sounds pretty much ideal, with perhaps the exception of height. I believe official readings are taken at 5-6 ft and in an open field. Of course, many of us (like myself) cant measure in an open field as we live in subdivisions with small yards. In these cases it is impossible to get a reading that is completely uninfluenced by the nearby houses, streets, trees, etc especially on dead calm nights. If the wind is howling, it doesnt seem to matter as much.

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redbeard917
27 degrees at 9:11pm brought even more palms inside.....

every room in my house has palms in it, I would post pics but I dropped my camera in the creek collecting needle palm seeds!

having a cup of coffee and hunkering down..... :bemused:

That is my fear every time I take my girlfriend's camera out on the kayak. Sorry to hear that. Good luck with the seeds. My brother has a fruiting needle but I've never got any to germinate. You're welcome to any seeds from it.

Needless to say, it is cold as hell here. I came back from Christmas at my parents' to find that a panel was missing from my greenhouse roof. But it seems to be staying fairly warm in there with just a tarp draped over the hole. The only plant outside the greenhouse that's really marginal anymore is a Eustis limequat, but it's replaceable, it was planted this year anyway. My giant crinum is total mush right now, which surprised me. So far the Rhapis and Chamaedorea microspadix in the woods are fine!

JayW, that is a nice property. I like the native plantings you've done.

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gsn

OFFICIALLY below freezing here 31.8F at 10:20 so it will be below freezing for over 10 hours in Titusville!!!

Propane heaters just fired up on the 22 ft foxlady, 18 foot foxtail, and 8 ft spindle,everything else is on it's own!

JayW, that is a nice property. I like the native plantings you've done.

the slash pines are NICE... I'm going to looking for some of those come spring!!! :winkie:

Edited by gsn

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spockvr6
OFFICIALLY below freezing here 31.8F at 10:20 so it will be below freezing for over 10 hours in Titusville!!!

Propane heaters just fired up on the 22 ft foxlady, 18 foot foxtail, and 8 ft spindle,everything else is on it's own!

Mad props to the hardcore palm protector GSN! The patron saint of monocots!

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_Keith

And the scary part is that it is only Jan 5th. Winter isn't near about over.

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epicure3
Putting a shirt on a palm is like putting one on a baby.

Obviously not growing an Aiphanes.

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redbeard917
OFFICIALLY below freezing here 31.8F at 10:20 so it will be below freezing for over 10 hours in Titusville!!!

Propane heaters just fired up on the 22 ft foxlady, 18 foot foxtail, and 8 ft spindle,everything else is on it's own!

JayW, that is a nice property. I like the native plantings you've done.

the slash pines are NICE... I'm going to looking for some of those come spring!!! :winkie:

For native trees, I'm looking into sprouting them from seed. That way you get to select for good qualities of the parent tree, also it is free. I sprouted some titi but am having less luck with other species.

I mentioned in an earlier post I'm not doing any protecting at my place. The barely marginal bizmarkia, paurotis, cardboard palm, etc., are all at my brothers place in town and unprotected!

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DCA_Palm_Fan
Is weather.com accurate at all because it is way off in it's predictions for tonight compared to everything else I have looked at.

http://www.weather.com/outlook/events/spor...from=hrly_graph

http://www.accuweather.com/us/fl/saint-leo...&hbhhour=23

I think most "official" weather reporting stations are fairly accurate, but only for a fairly small area. The "official" temp for D.C. is always taken at National airport, as is the "official" precip measurements, but it is almost NEVER truly accurate for 95% of D.C. Heck, National airport is about 1.5 miles from where I live, and its not even accurate for where I am. For instance, this last "blizzard" we got just before christmas here, the "official" snow total for D.C. was 16.4" as taken at National Airport, while I measured in 5 different places, on grass and pavement, 24" of snow.

This is one of the big reasons I use Weather Underground. You can choose a station which is closest to you, in my case there are two, one within a few blocks, and the other about a half mile away. Im fairly certain the one a few blocks away is very accurate for my immediate area, because it almost always matches exactly my inexpensive personal weather station. The one further away, is at a slightly higher elevation, and it usually runs a few degrees warmer. My temp sensor is hanging in a cedar tree, totally blocked from sun, 6' off the ground, and 12 feet away from the back of the building.

Fortunately the temps have moderated a bit today, as we got up to 37. Tomrrow were supposed to get to 38 or 39. Average highs for our area this time of year are 43. So not too far below today and tomorrow. That said, yesterday was the first day we touched freezing in several days, and today was the first day above it. The Potomac is frozen over quite alot now, which is something we have not seen here in a very long time. At least its not completely frozen, but I suspect after the even COLDER air thats coming over the weekend, it may well fully ice up.

Edited by DCA_Palm_Fan

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cfkingfish
Anybody have a station set up on Pine Island?

I have a hi-lo thermometer in my nursery there. Are you talking about Lee County Pine Island? You can check out wunderground.com and there are a few stations recording on the island.

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BS Man about Palms

Good luck everyone..But for once I have to gloat. Wish I could share some with ya... I left the house just after 7am to see 50F and it touched maybe 73F at my place today... :D

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happ
What are the rest of you reading in Tampa Bay?

43.2F/31F dewpoint and light NW winds (1-5 mph). As I look at my wind plots, the trend seems to be to a slowing of the wind speeds, so the big drop may start if this happens.

Just out of curiosity, how do you have your gauge set up? Height and placement? With mine being 4ft in an open field, I still assume that it will be accurate, to at least that area where my palms are growing?

I have a Davis Vantage Pro weather station with a fan aspirated radiation shield. Mines ~6 ft off the ground.

Your placement sounds pretty much ideal, with perhaps the exception of height. I believe official readings are taken at 5-6 ft and in an open field. Of course, many of us (like myself) cant measure in an open field as we live in subdivisions with small yards. In these cases it is impossible to get a reading that is completely uninfluenced by the nearby houses, streets, trees, etc especially on dead calm nights. If the wind is howling, it doesnt seem to matter as much.

That's an insightful observation. I live close to a road & the warming influence can not be underestimated. What my trees are also experiencing [down at the bottom of nearby canyons the temp can easily be 5-8 degrees colder].

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Tyrone
Good luck everyone..But for once I have to gloat. Wish I could share some with ya... I left the house just after 7am to see 50F and it touched maybe 73F at my place today... :D

I can beat that. A min of 73F and a max of 91F with high humidity. :mrlooney:

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Al in Kona
Good luck everyone..But for once I have to gloat. Wish I could share some with ya... I left the house just after 7am to see 50F and it touched maybe 73F at my place today... :D

I can beat that. A min of 73F and a max of 91F with high humidity. :mrlooney:

Our Kona, Big Island of Hawaii temperatures are now averaging 83`F highs and lows 70`, 71`F but forecast calls for cold to move in later this week (Friday & Saturday) with highs of only 82`F and lows of 68`F.

Tyrone, you beat our temps but then you are in mid summer and I'm in mid winter.

BS Man about Palms - Enjoy your mild winter temps as of late. Lucky you not in Florida this winter.

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gsytch

Big Drop in New Port Richey from midnight on as the winds died down or changed direction. It was 40.9F at 1am now 31.8 in my open, exposed back. 32.2 in the front. No frost evident yet. The duration of this cold is a major problem. We have NEVER seen it like this. Looking back, weather records report continuous days below 60F as ten. There are no records really showing below 50F and mine is at 3, 4 if it doesnt make it today. More cold tonight - yeah! Damage is starting to show but so far its just tender leaves and a banana here or there. We shall see. Greg :violin:

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www.dadluvsu.com

Looks like a low of 33.5 to me... I'm shivering. Flip flops aren't very warm.

DSC05173.jpg

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Jeff Searle

I had 33 degrees at 6:30 am. We'll see if any leaf damage start's to show up around the weekend. :rage::rage::rage:

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Zeeth
I had 33 degrees at 6:30 am. We'll see if any leaf damage start's to show up around the weekend. :rage::rage::rage:

All the way down there!? We had a low of 31, and there's frost outside right now. I went to my coconut palm, and there's a thin layer of ice on the leaves, I'm pretty sure that's bad!

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JayW

Glad you guys liked my native landscaping, that's what I was hoping to create. In the field, I have Sabal Minors, Sabal Palmettos, Silver Saw Palmettos, Highbush Blueberry, Slash Pines, Maple and a native Plum (which kind escapes me at the moment).

Anyway, my low reading in the field was... 20.8! My neighbors, which is on his porch, between his block home and his 2 story block RV building showed 25*. I took pic's of my gauge showing the temp... I'll try and post a pic later when I run them in. They said it was 27* in Tampa, so I believe these temps to be accurate, to where they are located.

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Exotic Life

Even cold temperatures in the warm and mild area's over there.... grrrr winter!

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spockvr6
I went to my coconut palm, and there's a thin layer of ice on the leaves, I'm pretty sure that's bad!

I am on the (distorted) mindset that ice preserves the leaves.....its like a cryogenic perservation process! Your Coconut palm just turned the clock back and is now actually much younger than it was before it froze! LOL.

I just barely snuck through with 34.3F, but I have to wonder how many more cold days/nights things can take :huh:

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spockvr6
Glad you guys liked my native landscaping, that's what I was hoping to create. In the field, I have Sabal Minors, Sabal Palmettos, Silver Saw Palmettos, Highbush Blueberry, Slash Pines, Maple and a native Plum (which kind escapes me at the moment).

Anyway, my low reading in the field was... 20.8! My neighbors, which is on his porch, between his block home and his 2 story block RV building showed 25*. I took pic's of my gauge showing the temp... I'll try and post a pic later when I run them in. They said it was 27* in Tampa, so I believe these temps to be accurate, to where they are located.

That Tampa AP reading seems odd to me. It doesnt seem to be supported by any other readings in the area.....but it is an official station.

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gsn

my low was 26.3 F.... at 8:45 AM it is still below freezing 31.3F... :(

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Alicehunter2000

Pretty much ditto to GSN's report......was able to keep a few sheets on some things. It is what it is.....we'll see how it goes.

On the positive side....No frost.

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happ
I do wonder if mine is correct but I would think that the weather station at St. Leo University on weather underground is accurate. Mine always says the same as that one. There is no doubt that it was colder Sunday night when I covered a few plants.

Unfortunately, there is no real quality control on weatherunderground. I know as my station reports there and I could have it show -1000F for the low and 1000F for the high and there would be nothing to stop this report.

From what Ive seen, most of the stations reporting to weatherunderground seem to be reasonable enough for us amateurs. But sometimes, one will see readings that make you scratch your head (i.e. stations seemingly a short distance apart but which show wildly varying readings). In cases like this, short of bad sensros, perhaps its safe to assume that the sensing locations are simply not comparable (i.e. one station has its sensor 2 ft off the ground in a wide open field while another is being influenced by nearby concrete, large buildings, etc).

Yes, Larry, I have also observed radically different readings from thermometers just around my house. That's why I have 4 instruments. Ironically, the most expensive [Oregon Scientific] is the most unreliable [occasionally off from the other thermometers by 20 degrees!].

I hate to read what you guys are going through & wish everyone a quick warmup soon.

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BS Man about Palms
Good luck everyone..But for once I have to gloat. Wish I could share some with ya... I left the house just after 7am to see 50F and it touched maybe 73F at my place today... :D

I can beat that. A min of 73F and a max of 91F with high humidity. :mrlooney:

Yeah, "summer temps" don't count... :P

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BobbyinNY
Glad you guys liked my native landscaping, that's what I was hoping to create. In the field, I have Sabal Minors, Sabal Palmettos, Silver Saw Palmettos, Highbush Blueberry, Slash Pines, Maple and a native Plum (which kind escapes me at the moment).

Anyway, my low reading in the field was... 20.8! My neighbors, which is on his porch, between his block home and his 2 story block RV building showed 25*. I took pic's of my gauge showing the temp... I'll try and post a pic later when I run them in. They said it was 27* in Tampa, so I believe these temps to be accurate, to where they are located.

Jay,

I can't BELIEVE you got down to 20.8... I bottomed out at 22f here tonight, and I'm in New York. This is the deepest Jet-stream dip I have ever seen.. I feel for you guys, believe me.. I have a ton of palms, but they're all protected. I think I'll take the cover off of my windmill just to show solidarity.

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BS Man about Palms
I had 33 degrees at 6:30 am. We'll see if any leaf damage start's to show up around the weekend. :rage::rage::rage:

Jeff- Was that at the nursery, or your house?? Then was it under canopy or exposed? If it was exposed at least the stuff under the trees probably was a good 3F or more warmer..

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Eric in Orlando

32F here at Leu Gardens this morning. I hope our luck holds up. I was really worried, they were predicting 27-28F last night and it only got to 47F yesterday for a high. I left work around 6:30 pm last night and the temperature was already down to 42.

The predicted lows for Sat and Sun have eased up a bit, hope it continues that way. Bananas/traveler tree/elephant ear foliage on the way into work this morning looked mostly green.

Summary so far for 2010;

Jan. 1 68 47

Jan. 2 59 39

Jan. 3 47 36

Jan. 4 52 33

Jan. 5 47 35

Jan. 6 32

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JayW
32F here at Leu Gardens this morning.

Strange, they reported 27* in Tampa and 25* in Brandon this morning. I bottomed out at 20.8* with my "field" gauge and my neighbors gauge, in a protected area between 2 block buildings was at 25*.

Here's my reading, sorry about the shadow...

DSCF1100.jpg

Edited by JayW

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fastfeat
Although I don't want to "jinx" things, we did have a major reprieve here last night. The evening weather forecast from the Tampa station was very bad -- calling for a fairly hard freeze (27 - 32 degrees for a 4 to 6 hour duration) all the way south to Lee County -- even though the National Weather Service forecast has remained in the 35 to 39 degree range for each night throughout this event (it's very odd how the different weather services are forecasting such a variable range of temps for this event -- ?). However, when I went outside around 1:30 AM (expecting "the worst"...), it didn't feel "bitter" at all and, when I checked the temp at the near-by Wunderground.com personal weather station, it showed that the temperature was 42.5 degrees and had actually increased about 2 degrees since midnight (I'm sure due to the cloud cover moving in).

When I got up this morning, it was 43 at that personal weather station and the Sarasota airport was reporting 51 (I'm about half-way between these two stations) -- BIG difference from the previous evening's forecast. I did have very light frost on Monday morning (low of 35 or 36 degrees) -- as far as I can tell, it was only on my windshield since I didn't see any leaf impact at all on my tropical hibiscus and the banana tree leaves are still solid. The worst day so far was Sunday when the high here only hit 47 -- however, it may struggle to get/stay above 50 again today if the cloud cover remains all day (and then the forecast is for 34 to 36 degrees tonight so not much warming up at all for a 24 hour + period).

I piled damp mulch up high around the bases of all the small and/or sensitive palms I put into the ground this past year (most are under oak canopy), covered those in exposed areas and/or the ones that are possibly more susceptible to the long-term cold, and have brought in more and more potted stuff each day since Saturday so my garage looks like a forest right now (the Carpoxolyn and my maroon leaf Areca vestiaria were brought in yesterday as a result of Christian's recommendations here -- thanks...). At some point, I'm sure I'll end up bringing my Tahina spectabilis, Cyrtostachys renda, and Verschaffeltia splendida indoors, as well (just kidding... :rolleyes: -- those are in my "40 degree group" and are the first to see shelter from any cold event/risk).

Just my two cents worth for now...

Tim

Hey Tim--

Good to hear you're hanging in there! CNN was giving Tampa (airport?) as 27 this AM--yikes!!

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fastfeat
32F here at Leu Gardens this morning. I hope our luck holds up. I was really worried, they were predicting 27-28F last night and it only got to 47F yesterday for a high. I left work around 6:30 pm last night and the temperature was already down to 42.

The predicted lows for Sat and Sun have eased up a bit, hope it continues that way. Bananas/traveler tree/elephant ear foliage on the way into work this morning looked mostly green.

Summary so far for 2010;

Jan. 1 68 47

Jan. 2 59 39

Jan. 3 47 36

Jan. 4 52 33

Jan. 5 47 35

Jan. 6 32

Eric--

That's great (if cold weather can ever be called that...) news! Hope the next wave isn't any colder.

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rozpalm

I am amazed that people so far south of me got colder then I did the last two nights. My low last night was 37.2. I verified this against three of my digital temperature gauges and the closest PWS to my location. All I can attribute it to are the lakes that are all around my property.

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PalmatierMeg
Putting a shirt on a palm is like putting one on a baby.

Obviously not growing an Aiphanes.

No Aiphanes or anything that spiny - they'd be on their own. Looks like we got to 32.9 at 8 a.m. But frost on the cars and Coccothrinax (too unwieldy to cover). I hope they don't suffer more than cosmetic damage. Tonight is supposed to be colder. Heaven help us all. It's sunny but the wind has come up for yet another day. Never seen a winter like this in all my years in FL.

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