Jump to content
gsytch

Persistent Cold Air in Florida

Recommended Posts

Alicehunter2000

Walt that bottle palm is a beauty. Hope it pulls through ok. Up here the temps only barely touched freezing....much better than predicted. I'm sure that inland just a few miles fared much worse. There is alot to be said to be near large bodies of water .....microclimate-wise. We currently have an even cloud cover........hope it stays through tonight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Walt
Walt that bottle palm is a beauty. Hope it pulls through ok. Up here the temps only barely touched freezing....much better than predicted. I'm sure that inland just a few miles fared much worse. There is alot to be said to be near large bodies of water .....microclimate-wise. We currently have an even cloud cover........hope it stays through tonight.

I only had my bottle palm planted this past August 31st. I bought it from and had it planted by a local nursery. It was a 45 gallon size and cost $125; plus, I had to pay $75 for delivery and planting, which included the removal of a sickly triangle palm (that just didn't want to grow normally) in the same planting hole.

My new bottle palm opened two new (and shed two old) fronds since it was planted, plus it has a robust new spear pushing up, about 18 inches long. No way am I chancing this palm being damaged/killed by cold; hence, why I wrapped it.

I have another (smaller) bottle palm in a 15 gallon pot on my lanai. Last night I pulled it out of its round water tray (dish) and moved it up close to my patio doors, where it would be more protected. I noted lots of roots growing out the pot bottom. So, this spring I will plant it out in the yard, close to the house where I can protect it.

Yes, I saw the low temperatures up in the panhandle this morning. They were much better near the Gulf.

100_2843.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
DCA_Palm_Fan

Thanks Walt. I will definitely be happening, just the timing has to be worked out.

EDIT on my post where I said it was warmer here than in Fairbanks, AK. I MEANT to say Juneau, NOT Fairbanks. Its -33F in Fairbanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
happ

I think California gardeners can empathize with this current Florida cold snap since it has characteristics of 2007 & 1990. In northern California minimum temps stayed below freezing for nearly 2 wks in the Central Valley & devastated citrus industry. The "banana belt" [coastal SoCal] recorded freezing for 5-6 nights straight in many areas. As I recall any attempt at protecting trees was worth it w/ limited results. I once even considered using a large fan.

Wind & clouds are our friends & there is a significant cloud cover moving over Florida today. Good luck my friends! :greenthumb:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
PalmatierMeg
.

So far today, we've brought in all the potted tropicals from the shade garden and crowded them onto a tarp in our FL room.

Hi Meg,

Your FL room must look like our bedroom. We spread out the visquene and have all our potted crotons there. They fill the room, and the potted palmies are in the foyer.

post-94-1262525509_thumb.jpg

Sunny, my place looks a lot like yours, except for palms, not bromeliads. I left the broms outdoors; hope wasn't a mistake. At 12:40 temp out front hit a balmy 50.0. I don't think we'll get close to 60. The heater in the shadehouse did its job. Temp there never fell below 50, is now 57. Not sure how cold it got here last night, but I think it was above forecasted 34, thank the Lord. Now to face the coming days/nights. I haven't gone outside to check stuff in the gardens but I will. I will also have to mist the shadehouse, sans heater.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BobSDCA
I wanted to put in my two cents as far as this cold front and protection. We are obviously in for a week of weather we haven't seen in awhile, but it is the prolonged chilly weather we really aren't used to. On the west coast from Tampa to Naples, temps aren't getting to 60 for some time, and getting near or just above 32 every night. Even if it doesn't freeze, and you get just a light frost, you will see what prolonged cold, non-freezing weather can do to your palms. Certain palms are used to this (Archontophoenix, Syagrus, etc.), but there are some plants that just will not deal with the wind and chill EVEN if you never get a frost. There will be no "bounce-back" temps, so I would recommend keeping a close eye on the following plants, which I am sure were recent plantings in a lot of yards around here:

Coconuts - hate this, this is why they don't do well in CA

Non-Hawaiian Pritchardias

Carpoxylon

Neoveitchia

Pinanga spp.

Areca spp.

Some will have no problem with prolonged cool:

Archontophoenix

Syagrus

Kentiopsis

Chambeyronia

Corypha

Arenga

Caryota

Hope that helps!

I hit 39F about an hour ago and saw even Brooksville was at 33F. I am curious how high it will get today.

I agree Christian - most of the palms that grow well in southern California should take a weeks worth of cool to cold weather without a freeze. You may just get some minor leaf spotting! The more tropical stuff - I am curious about. When weather was much colder in the 80's and 90's only certain microclimates in central Florida seemed to be able to get by with some of the tropicals, but over the last decade is seems like people have been planting them everywhere! I guess I am just a bit jealous because we haven't had that kind of warm up here in California this decade! In fact it has been cooler than normal in many winters here, and we have had a few cool springs to boot!

I don't mean to suggest an experiment in central Florida (especially on peoples prized palms regarding the cool spell), but I am curious how the tropicals survive with this long of a cold snap. If it doesn't freeze in most places - a weeks worth of cold may not be too bad! In 2007 I placed two Manila palms on my covered patio for the winter on heating pads. They were getting too large to bring back into the house after 5 years of growth. They didn't even last the winter and died by January. The freeze dealt the final blow, but they were on their way out before then. With the Manila palms it took about a month of cool temperatures below 50F at night and cool days - below 68F to make them decline. Perhaps a week of this may not be too devastating as long as there is no freeze!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
gsn
weather.com-----NWS-----------w/underground

39 ------------------ 40 -----------------40

35 ------------------ 38 -----------------38

32 ------------------ 38 -----------------38

33 ------------------ 37 -----------------36

32 ------------------ 39 -----------------38

revised forecast temps 24 hours later in parenthesis

weather.com-------NWS-----------w/underground

39 -------------------- 40 ------------------- 40

35 -(34)------------ 38 -(34)----------- 38- (34)

32 -(33)------------ 38 -(32)----------- 38- (32)

33 -(31)------------ 37 -(31)------------36- (31)

32 -(31)------------ 39 -(30)------------38 -(31)

revised forecast 24 hours later in brackets

.......weather.com-------------NWS---------w/underground

Fri... 39 ------------------ 40 ------------------ 40

Sat.. 35 -(33)------------ 38 -(34)------------- 38- (34)

Sun.. 32 -(33)-[31]------ 38 -(32)-[33]------ 38- (32) [32]

Mon.. 33 -(31)-[33]------ 37 -(31)-[31]------ 36- (31) [31]

Tue.. 32 -(31)-[29]------- 39 -(30)-[27]-------38 -(31) [27]

Tuesday night is looking good 27-29...NOT!!! :angry:

I hit 39F about an hour ago and saw even Brooksville was at 33F.

Hey I feel really,really lucky my low was 33.8F last night/this morning... I was almost a whole degree above Brooksville (yippee,where is that sarcasm emoticon when you need it) which is always the coldest area of central Florida, by a WIDE margin!!! :hmm::angry:

Although credit given, where credit is due, 18 hours before the event they got the forecast RIGHT for a change, here anyway!

Edited by gsn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tala

this wk nothing beyond the pale for here, suffered thru much worse just earlier in this same decade. What we should be worried about is whats coming after this - lows predicted at 26f or colder for beyond metro O'town for upcomig wkend - only solace is the persistent ineptitude of most all weather prog.'s, blind monkeys w/ darts have supplied more accuracy in the past. Regardless now I'm paying attention ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Walt
I think California gardeners can empathize with this current Florida cold snap since it has characteristics of 2007 & 1990. In northern California minimum temps stayed below freezing for nearly 2 wks in the Central Valley & devastated citrus industry. The "banana belt" [coastal SoCal] recorded freezing for 5-6 nights straight in many areas. As I recall any attempt at protecting trees was worth it w/ limited results. I once even considered using a large fan.

Wind & clouds are our friends & there is a significant cloud cover moving over Florida today. Good luck my friends! :greenthumb:

Wind and clouds are our friends at night, but not so much during the day.

I was partially saved last night (temperatures over most of the night were higher than forecasted) due to medium cloud cover that started to move in around 9 P.M. Last night at my place was a radiational cooling night, as the wind totally died at sunset. Hence, the cloud cover was very effective at holding down rising ground heat.

However, today is cloudy and there is little soil warmup due to lack of the sun's radiant heat. Yesterday was totally clear and sunny; hence soil temperatures warmed up substantially, re releasing that heat last night. I'm concerned that tonight might be colder than last night do to this fact.

Yesterday I covered all my ixora shrubs (growing on east and south side of house). I only covered them one at a time as the sun's rays moved off of them and surrounding soil, thus trying to contain as much rising ground heat as I could within the tented-like coverings. I can't do that today, and that has me somewhat concerned. But, if the cloud cover continues through the night, then I may escape a freeze again tonight.

But what concerns me even more is that three more days of this cold weather is forecasted, and then the warm up will be slight, and still below normal for this time of the year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Walt
this wk nothing beyond the pale for here, suffered thru much worse just earlier in this same decade. What we should be worried about is whats coming after this - lows predicted at 26f or colder for beyond metro O'town for upcomig wkend - only solace is the persistent ineptitude of most all weather prog.'s, blind monkeys w/ darts have supplied more accuracy in the past. Regardless now I'm paying attention ...

Well, yesterday the weatherman had me in panic mode, as he forecasted (and he said it, IMO, gleefully -- that %$#@!) a low of 26 degrees here in the low areas. Since I'm in a low area, well, you know how I took it. Luckily, he was off by nine degrees.

Okay, so I escaped a freeze last night. I may even escape a freeze tonight. But what in the Sam Hill difference will it make if I get toasted a week from now! I don't want to be wiped out two years in a row.

Here I thought with all this pro Cap & Trade pontification about global warming, bolstered by an El Nino weather pattern, that the synergistic effect of the two would be a freezeless, frostless winter. I've been trying to ask Al Gore this question but he must be hiding somewhere.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
gsn

Well the NWS just took the forecast for here down below freezing for the next 4 nights... I just missed freezing last night! If the forecast is close that will mean we will have had 5 nights at or below freezing... And 6 nights below 40F!

For those who are saying we have gone through this before,I say WHEN??? Even in 89 we only had 3 nights below freezing albeit 89 was COLDER lows ,but who knows as they keep revising the forecast DOWN, we might get there!

NWS

32

29

27

31

We got hit pretty hard last year,and some things haven't even grown a full canopy yet. I was hoping we would make it through this year without incident, but it looks like it might be worse?

Anyone got any good deals on slash pines???

Edited by gsn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Davidl

For small palms it can be quit damaging but larger palms like coconuts will yellow a little but that's all. Carpoxylon is a problem when there young but I'm not sure about large ones. Maybe someone that has a large carpoxylon in a cooler than southern coastal climate can give more info about how they take cool weather.It was 38.2 in the station a mile east of me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
amazondk
Here I thought with all this pro Cap & Trade pontification about global warming, bolstered by an El Nino weather pattern, that the synergistic effect of the two would be a freezeless, frostless winter. I've been trying to ask Al Gore this question but he must be hiding somewhere.

Maybe you can find him on the Big Island on the Kona coast. That is a good place to go when it is cold in other parts. Anyway I have not seen him around here.

dk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Trópico

Hey all,

You may want to look ahead just a little bit.

Weather. com (which I think is the most conservative of all forecasts (?))

Tonight

Jan 3

Partly Cloudy

49°

32°

Mon

Jan 4

Sunny

55°

32°

Tue

Jan 5

Sunny

51°

29°

Wed

Jan 6

Sunny

54°

32°

Thu

Jan 7

Mostly Sunny

60°

46°

Fri

Jan 8

Showers

56°

30°

Sat

Jan 9

AM Clouds / PM Sun

49°

26°

Chance of freezing emphasized. Will we see snow too (Friday)?

Anyways this is going to be a long week!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alicehunter2000

Last night, not too bad......tonight.........I got a bad feeling about (especially when I stand outside). Got the fireplace blazing, the living room like a jungle, the space heater in the mini-greenhouse and the pile of sheets on standby.........its going to be colder tonight than last (there is cloud cover however.........so maybe?

42 degrees at 2:30 p.m. Sunday, Panama City, Florida.

Walt, for somebody who has such a mean avitar, I would have figured you for a Rottweiler owner ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
spockvr6
42 degrees at 2:30 p.m. Sunday, Panama City, Florida.

Yes...this is the kicker today! I see an awful lot of 40's for highs today across the state.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
www.dadluvsu.com

Very cloudy here, been gray skies all afternoon. Looks very ominous overhead... Hopefully the clouds will help keep some of the heat close to the ground tonight. Wind has stopped. I don't think SoFla is going to have the disastrous cold the news forecasters would have us believe. Bottomed out at 42 in the shadehouse last night... Brought in the gigantic mapu today... I'm a bit protective of this one!

Here's a bit of tropical warmth for all you cold weather warriors up north... B)

DSC05172.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Walt
Walt, for somebody who has such a mean avitar, I would have figured you for a Rottweiler owner ;)

My avatar is The Bad! The late, great, Mr. Lee Van Cleef of The Good, The Bad, And The Ugly.

On two other forums I frequent my forum name and avatar is Col. Mortimer!

100_8166.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
velutina

Florida, this is karma for your climate-superiority complex ;p

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
tikitiki

Thanks I needed that. It did help.

Very cloudy here, been gray skies all afternoon. Looks very ominous overhead... Hopefully the clouds will help keep some of the heat close to the ground tonight. Wind has stopped. I don't think SoFla is going to have the disastrous cold the news forecasters would have us believe. Bottomed out at 42 in the shadehouse last night... Brought in the gigantic mapu today... I'm a bit protective of this one!

Here's a bit of tropical warmth for all you cold weather warriors up north... B)

DSC05172.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
DCA_Palm_Fan
Very cloudy here, been gray skies all afternoon. Looks very ominous overhead... Hopefully the clouds will help keep some of the heat close to the ground tonight. Wind has stopped. I don't think SoFla is going to have the disastrous cold the news forecasters would have us believe. Bottomed out at 42 in the shadehouse last night... Brought in the gigantic mapu today... I'm a bit protective of this one!

Here's a bit of tropical warmth for all you cold weather warriors up north... B)

DSC05172.jpg

That is just fantastically, amazingly GORGEOUS!!! I would almost give an arm to have one of those, especially one of those of that size! BEAUTIFUL!!!!! :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BS Man about Palms
Was checking out my local forecast for the next 10 days. Lows will be mostly low-mid 40s. Highs will be 60s. That's down 10-15 degrees from our normal hi/low. So far this winter definitely looks cooler than normal. I can deal with that if lows stay above 40. We may get more rain than usual. Good, because we are 14+" down.

You've just described a typical California winter!

On the Coast Happ, I think you are spot on! (You get warmer than me!! ;) )

ANYWAY,

Good luck to all of you "palm troopers" out there! I hope things fare OK!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cristóbal

It is to be interesting to see what happen in this winter with the cocos nucifera, adonidia, royals in central florida and the crytostachys renda in south florida.

Today I check the weather there for the next 2 weeks - COLD !

I am very sorry for my friends in Florida to see this happen, in the last winter is also bad there.

But the truth is for any place in the united states (less hawaii), this can and does happen. California, Florida, Arizona, Texas.....freeze can happen in these areas in any year, you can only hope this year it dont happen.

Edited by Cristóbal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Kailua_Krish

It wasnt nearly as bad at my house as it was predicted (although I can't speak for the rest of Ocala). Looking at the damage to the non-woody tropicals, the top layer of some banana leaves and brugmansia were "boiled spinach" but the lower leaves were fine (the brugs are still flowering/holding flowers?!?). I think my house was just under and the duration wasnt nearly as bad as they said. Knocking on wood for the next few nights, have added even more lights (heat lamps & x-mas lights) on my smaller more delicate palms.

-Krishna

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SunnyFl

The freeze warnings are going pretty far south.

post-94-1262570160_thumb.jpg

post-94-1262570200_thumb.jpg

I don't see how we can avoid a freeze - if it ever got up to 50 today, I don't know when it was. Every time I came in from doing yard work, the thermom was showing mid-40s. It's only 43 now. Uh-oh.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
happ
It is to be interesting to see what happen in this winter with the cocos nucifera, adonidia, royals in central florida and the crytostachys renda in south florida.

Today I check the weather there for the next 2 weeks - COLD !

I am very sorry for my friends in Florida to see this happen, in the last winter is also bad there.

But the truth is for any place in the united states (less hawaii), this can and does happen. California, Florida, Arizona, Texas.....freeze can happen in these areas in any year, you can only hope this year it dont happen.

Agree wholeheartedly that nowhere in the continental U.S. is immune from occasional cold regardless of what a person believes about global warming :rolleyes: The scientific data shows that arctic airmasses can & do penetrate well in the the middle latitudes. I am sorry for all those dealing with this cold-wave esp the duration. But we know from experience in California that regrowth happens or it becomes an opportunity to plant something else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BobSDCA
It is to be interesting to see what happen in this winter with the cocos nucifera, adonidia, royals in central florida and the crytostachys renda in south florida.

Today I check the weather there for the next 2 weeks - COLD !

I am very sorry for my friends in Florida to see this happen, in the last winter is also bad there.

But the truth is for any place in the united states (less hawaii), this can and does happen. California, Florida, Arizona, Texas.....freeze can happen in these areas in any year, you can only hope this year it dont happen.

Agree wholeheartedly that nowhere in the continental U.S. is immune from occasional cold regardless of what a person believes about global warming :rolleyes: The scientific data shows that arctic airmasses can & do penetrate well in the the middle latitudes. I am sorry for all those dealing with this cold-wave esp the duration. But we know from experience in California that regrowth happens or it becomes an opportunity to plant something else.

I also agree with the above statements, and we all have to scrable to protect our favorite plants during the cold! My rule of thumb in southern California is that if there is a threat of a feeze and it is a cold clear night - 9:00 p.m. roles around and if it is 40F or under....we will probably have a freeze. Only once did the clouds come in to save me, but I can usually be found pulling in the plants under my covered patio or in the house, just like ya'll! I hope that 26F doesn't come true....nobody wants that!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
popper1

I am concerned, as we all are, about not only the next couple days but what is lurking this weekend. I saw that we aren't the only ones. Houston, which had to deal with snow in December and pretty lousy temps since, has a 21 forecast for Thursday night.

wow.

david

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
amazondk

I hope you are doing ok up there. It does look like there is more cold on it´s way to you all. I just watched this video this morning, and it is not optomistic. WOW from Accuweather! .

As the weatherman says though, enjoy the weather it is the only weather you´ve got.

dk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Paul The Palm Doctor!
I wanted to put in my two cents as far as this cold front and protection. We are obviously in for a week of weather we haven't seen in awhile, but it is the prolonged chilly weather we really aren't used to. On the west coast from Tampa to Naples, temps aren't getting to 60 for some time, and getting near or just above 32 every night. Even if it doesn't freeze, and you get just a light frost, you will see what prolonged cold, non-freezing weather can do to your palms. Certain palms are used to this (Archontophoenix, Syagrus, etc.), but there are some plants that just will not deal with the wind and chill EVEN if you never get a frost. There will be no "bounce-back" temps, so I would recommend keeping a close eye on the following plants, which I am sure were recent plantings in a lot of yards around here:

Coconuts - hate this, this is why they don't do well in CA

Non-Hawaiian Pritchardias

Carpoxylon

Neoveitchia

Pinanga spp.

Areca spp.

Some will have no problem with prolonged cool:

Archontophoenix

Syagrus

Kentiopsis

Chambeyronia

Corypha

Arenga

Caryota

Hope that helps!

I hit 39F about an hour ago and saw even Brooksville was at 33F. I am curious how high it will get today.

EXCELLENT "TWO CENTS," BRO!! Christian is very right about the prolonged cold vs. our usual one-two-three cold nights' events. Crown rot due to fungus becomes a big issue esp. coconut palms. Don't go crazy with copper fungicides though; coconut palms hate it if it isn't used correctly. IOt wouldn't be a bad idea to secure som,e Aliette and Subdue Maxx, broad spectrum fungicides though. (Use as directed on label!!) If you've done what you normally would have done (in these situations) sit tight and wait. Three weeks from now you will still be seeing things unfold in terms of latent "lack of heat/freeze/frost" damage. Not all palms as Christian stated so well, will bounce back, others will very slowly. No one can tell your particular outcome due to timing, moisture in crown that freezes, soil temperaturers, win chill issues and/or microclimates.

Paul N.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Paul The Palm Doctor!
I am concerned, as we all are, about not only the next couple days but what is lurking this weekend. I saw that we aren't the only ones. Houston, which had to deal with snow in December and pretty lousy temps since, has a 21 forecast for Thursday night.

wow.

david

Everyone in the Eastern 2/3 of North America is way sub-normal, David! This prolonged batch of Arctic "ice" just keeps training on down!! Even Anchorage, AK is not as cold as is MN, IL, IN, IA, WI, OH, NY and the Dakotas. Crap weather foe tropical plants' lovers/growers, indeed! If misery loves company than we have plenty of "kindred spirits" out there! In a word: "YUCKY!"

Paul

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
tank

21F on the West side of Gainesville Fl this morning.

Forecasting 6 days of lows below 25F.

That's "Brutal, Juice, brutal"!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alicehunter2000

Jason, wow that's low.......sorry to hear it. Now I'm really starting to believe in coastal proximity as opposed to pure lattitude. I have seen a variety of temps around Panama City area from 27 degrees to 32 for overnight lows. The bad news is that its freezing either way and it has lasted for several hours overnight even now it is still below freezing according to my pack porch gauge (8:00 am). The good news for me is that it didn't get below 25 degrees and that there is no precipitation associated with the cold. Looks like no frost. Hopefully, everyones plants will survive and will be stronger in the long run. I know Regina and Kyle are sweating it down there in G-ville as well. Kyle....how low did it get in the campus palm garden?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Walt

I bottomed out here at exactly 32 degrees F this morning. I all but knew it would be colder this morning than yesterday morning as it was cloudy all day yesterday and soil temperatures didn't rise but a degree or two.

I left all my ixora shrubs covered yesterday, but will uncover them to allow solar radiation to heat up the soil around them, then recover the ixoras late this afternoon so as to help capture and contain rising ground heat.

However, this may all be academic by Wendesday morning, as my local weather forecast is calling for a low of high 20s high ground and low 20s low ground.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
spockvr6
Now I'm really starting to believe in coastal proximity as opposed to pure lattitude.

Better to have both and end this nonsense!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
spockvr6
Kyle....how low did it get in the campus palm garden?

Not sure if the garden is in this exact spot, but the UF station on campus logged 31.6F.....not too bad.

http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstation...p?ID=KFLGAINE10

http://www.wunderground.com/wundermap/?lat...pix=0&dir=0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
spockvr6

36.2F at 756AM. I saw some light frost on a few house rooftops around my neighborhood, as well as some on a few car roofs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
PalmatierMeg

39.0 under the front awning at 7:45 - 30 minutes after sunrise. When I left for work thermometer had risen to 42. I just hope the sun really cooks the ground. The heater in the shadehouse kept temp at ~53 during the night. Now we get to face Monday night.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Walt
Now I'm really starting to believe in coastal proximity as opposed to pure lattitude.

Better to have both and end this nonsense!

Let me just give my opinion about latitude. When I first moved to Lake Placid (actually outside the incoropated town limits), an elderly lady nursery owner (who originally moved up here from Miami) told me that on radiational cooling nights it's actually warmer in Lake Placid (up on the Lake Wales Ridge) then inland areas 75 miles to the south. These areas are off the the Lake Wales Ridge; hence, cold air drains and settles there.

If all other conditions, topographical features, etc., are equal, then I submit the farther south your location, the warmer it will be. That would be the qualifier. But we know empirically that points/areas in proximity to large bodies of water (E.G. Gulf, Atlantic Ocean, Lake Okeechobee -especially the southeast side) are warmer, at least on radiational cooling nights than points inland much farther south.

Every winter I seem to learn more about the climate in my immediate environs. While I knew altitude was a major factor in a given location being warmer during a radiational cooling event, as opposed to locations in lower areas, this past January 2009 really proved the point to me.

With respect to my immediate surroundings, my property is in a low area. Up in town (just 1-1/2 as the crow flys) is 70 feet higher in elevation. I can state empirically that this difference is worth a full USDA hardiness zone during radiational cooling events.

Further, I believe (as it applies here deep inland on the Lake Wales Ridge), altitude/elevation is even a greater factor, with respect to higher nighttime temperatures on radiational cooling nights than lake side locations.

In January of 2009 I had back to back nights of 27, 23.5, and 27degrees. My zone 10 palms and shrubs were devastated. I drove around many lakes and the same plants were freeze/frost damaged, but to a much lesser extent, except the same plants at the back of the homes nearer the lakes. The lake effect, say within 100 feet of the lake protected the plants (palms, shurbs, etc.).

However, up in town, I found absolutely no freeze/frost damage whatsoever. I also drove along US 27 to other higher elevation locations outside of town and again, I saw no damage.

This was also the case back on January 5, 2001, when my all-time open yard low (during a radiational freeze) dropped to 22 degrees. I drove up into town and was flabergasted, as I saw no damage, yet my garden was turned to mush.

Also, during the 23.5 degree night I had last January, I noticed tropical foliage (pothos vines, philodendron scandens, etc.) I have growing up tree trunks, freeze damage stopped at around 30 feet above the ground. That indicated to me how the air was stratified, and that while it was 23.5 degrees at 5 feet above ground, it was probably just over 30 degrees at 30 feet above the ground. Hence, the the town being 70 feet in elevation higher than at my place, it was probably in the mid 30s to low 40s. Regardless of what the low temperature was in town, there was no damage to the foxtails, coconut palms, royals, D. lutescens, etc.

In the 12+ years I've lived here, I only saw damage up in town once, and that was from an advective freeze back on January 23 (I think) 2003. The damage was mostly dessication from the high, dry north winds, and not freeze damage per se. At my place, down of the Lake Wales Ridge's east side, there was virtually no damage that night, as my location as well as the trees surrounding my property reduced the wind speed. I recorded a low of 29.5 degrees that night.

Had I of known then (when I bought my property) what I know now, how important elevation is out here in the deepest Florida pennisular inland, I would have bought my property on high ground. But at the time, palm and tropical growing wasn't even a consideration for me. Further, 90% or more of cold events here are radiational in nature, so high ground is the place to be. What advective events we have are mostly less cold, wihile the following night or two are colder radiational events.

I think immediate lake front locations (on the largest lakes, due to their thermal effect and inertia) are the second best place to be. But lakefront land is 10 times the cost, not to mention the yearly property taxes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...