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John Case

What's with the new logo?

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John in Andalucia

With respect to those that like the current logo, this reminds me of a t-shirt you might pick up on holiday, IMO. It's not a bad design in its own right, but it just says "fun in the sun" to me, and not a lot else.

t-shirt_holiday.jpg

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Jeff in St Pete

I'm not a fan of the cartoon logo, but I don't have any other suggestions to offer. Right now I am trying to come up with a logo for the Costa Rican Palm Society. In my opinion, the cartoon aspect makes it look too amateurish for the IPS.

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freakypalmguy

Here's a little tweak on Bill's design

post-1261-1260118969_thumb.jpg

Now that I think about it, didn't the old IPS logo look just like this with a little color?

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Kim

Can we clarify the objective, please? Is the redesign intended:

1) for Palmtalk only?

2) to replace the existing IPS logo?

If it's for Palmtalk only, it doesn't matter; cartoon? Fine. But if the new logo is intended to replace the existing IPS logo, the cartoon version is dismal, in my opinion. The existing IPS logo of the fan and feather palms with the negative image inside the circle is a much more sophisticated and meaningful graphic and artistic representation of the Society.

John in Andalucia's effort deserves honorable mention -- very nice effort, John! The boxed-in look is attractive for many uses, but looks a bit flat, or corporate, on a shirt.

Sorry for being more of a critic than an artist; I don't have the skills to graphically transform a palm image to a logo.

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bgl

The objective would be a new logo for the IPS, not just for PalmTalk. And it's great to see this lively discussion. The more input, the better! :) I should add a bit of background. The current logo was designed by Lester Pancoast of Miami. It was introduced in the Dec. 2001 issue of PALMS. Lester was an artist and also an IPS Director. Tragically he died in 2003.

Even though the existing logo is tasteful and artistic I have found that most people (and especially those who are relatively new to the world of palms) find it ambiguous and even confusing. In some cases it takes them a little while to even connect it to palms. In my mind, a logo should be dramatic, yet simple, in its ability to get a message across. In our case we obviously want to instantly "plant the seed" (pun intended) in people's, and potential new members', minds that palms are beautiful and something they should pay more attention to, and get involved with.

I think the design by John (in Andalucia) is excellent, even though I'm not sure the "square" look is the best. But then, again, I have no idea how that could be changed or improved upon!

Keep the ideas and suggestions coming please!

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PatientPalms

John, Can you show me your design in B&W? Our logo will need to be used in B&W applications as well as color...

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PatientPalms
Now that I think about it, didn't the old IPS logo look just like this with a little color?

Have there been others?... I want to see old designs.

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John in Andalucia
John, Can you show me your design in B&W? Our logo will need to be used in B&W applications as well as color...

Bill, if you mean 1-bit B&W as opposed to greyscale, then that won't work. Here's a monochrome version.

IPS_logo.pngIPS_logo_mono.png

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Dypsisdean

Kim has the right idea - what is the objective?

Logos aren't supposed to be "beautiful" art. They are supposed to be recognizable big and small, up close and at a distance. That is why Nike, Pepsi. etc. use graphics.

Advertising is a different animal all together, and can include beautiful photos, drawings, animations, etc. - that use and include a recognizable logo as a part of the advertising 'theme.'

If we want to use a photo in a square design - the sky is the limit. We can use anything. We've seen thousands of nice photos that would work in PalmTalk. But my line of thinking wanted to use something that had an outline of the palm, one that would reside against the background or what ever it was printed on - what's known as a transparency. In other words it doesn't really have a structured outline. Again look at any company logo. Otherwise you have a colored box (or other form) surrounding every printing, obscuring the background color. Not many logos are just square, oval, or rectangular photos. They are all graphics.

As a "box": LastTry-1.jpg

As a Transparency: LastTry.png

As B & W: mono.png

The other problem with the photo type approach is the printing. Although I don't know all the techniques, it gets extremely expensive when there are more than a few distinct colors. For example, how many colors are in John's logo? Photos have many shades and shapes, and silk screening is impossible. What is easily generated on the computer can be expensive and problematic in other applications.

So that is why graphics are used for logos:

- The can have transparent backgrounds and have a recognizable "shape." (Note: the Nike "swoop") Photos can not.

- They have distinct and easily and consistently reproduced colors. (The Coke "Red" is a special color code that will retain it's unique shade through every form of reproduction) The color rendition of a logo can be as identifiable as the shape. Photos can not be reproduced consistently across different usages.

- They can be made monochrome (because there is no "shading"), and scale from the one inch size to the poster behind a presentation. Problematic for photos.

So to continue with Kim's thought

- Should it be a "simple" logo that can be integrated into all kinds of advertising - or advertising all on it's own?

- Should it be photo oriented with a geometric shape as opposed to a palm tree or frond outline (a transparency)?

- Should it even have colors - and how many?

- Should it be used from the 1 inch size as an icon here, and also usable as a poster as well (Note: I think the small size will have to use "IPS" and the large size can accommodate the full name, artfully surrounding any logo. On a 1 inch logo, the type is just too small to be useful.)

- A max size is extremely important, because it will determine the necessary resolution of the original artwork. That should actually be the first consideration.

- Should it be designed to be usable as silk screening or other 3,4,5, color processing. (no shadings) Reproducing photos (or intricate colored shading) on letterheads, bumper stickers, shirts, is a totally different technique.

- And I am sure there are others.

All of these considerations were taken into account for the logo I designed. Now if those are not what are desired, then many more possibilities become available. But Kim is right - what are the objectives? That will tell us what constraints and techniques are in play.

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doubravsky

I started reading this thread liking the current (cartoon) design, until I saw the one John designed. I much prefer his ... and I'd buy that t-shirt and coffee mug!!!

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Kim
- Should it be a "simple" logo that can be integrated into all kinds of advertising - or advertising all on it's own?

- Should it be photo oriented with a geometric shape as opposed to a palm tree or frond outline (a transparency)?

- Should it even have colors - and how many?

- Should it be used from the 1 inch size as an icon here, and also usable as a poster as well (Note: I think the small size will have to use "IPS" and the large size can accommodate the full name, artfully surrounding any logo. On a 1 inch logo, the type is just too small to be useful.)

- A max size is extremely important, because it will determine the necessary resolution of the original artwork. That should actually be the first consideration.

- Should it be designed to be usable as silk screening or other 3,4,5, color processing. (no shadings) Reproducing photos (or colored shading) on letterheads, bumper stickers, shirts, is a totally different technique.

- And I am sure there are others.

All of these considerations were taken into account for the logo I designed. Now if those are not what are desired, then many more possibilities become available.

Even if these parameters are precisely what is desired, many more possibilities exist. Why not set the desired parameters and put out a call for design entries? It would not be surprising to find we have many talented graphic artists in the IPS. It could be a fun process; a call for entries with specific criterion for the design, a reasonable period of time for design development followed by a deadline for submission in a predetermined format. Post the accepted entries on Palmtalk, and vote. This will take some time, but I guess there is no urgency. What do you all think?

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PatientPalms

Dean, Kim, all,

It should be a simple logo that can be incorporated into advertisements.

If should not be photographic in nature, it should work as 1bit B&W, no shading or greyscales.

It shouldn't have defined colors, as has been noted, too problematic on the printing end.

Is should be sizable from 1"x1" to 10'x10' (note, lettering doesn't even have to be incorporated into the design!, see Swoosh, gold arches, etc.)

Max size, I can't imagine ever printing this thing bigger than a 6'x6' vinyl cutout... but because of this I think our logo needs to be in a vectorable format, .eps, .png, etc...

Yes, it should be silk-screenable (silk screening last much longer than printed coloration on a tshirt. I've done both personally, silk screen last 3 times longer, i.e. better products)

Google some images for "Corporate logo", any good corporate logo can be done in b&W (or any one color), resized, and stuck onto anything and still create some recognition in your memories... Perhaps we should just spend a couple bucks and hire a pro to keep the potential infighting low. John likes his design the best, I like mine (sorta) and Dean likes his... :)

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Mark_NoVA

We often wish that the general public knew that there is more variety in the palm world than a few common palms.

Design challenge: can anyone come up with a logo incorporating several palms from around the world? (Since we are the IPS).

ex. 1: a coconut, a dypsis, a lipstick palm, a couple others; perhaps chosen for beauty and diversity of form;

ex. 2: geographic diversity: one each from Austalia, SE Asia, Himalayas, N & S America, Africa, Europe, Middle East etc.

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bgl

Mark,

As interesting as those ideas might be I believe we need to have simplicity in mind. The only option that I can think of if we were to include different palms would be to have a separate design for each palm, and come up with a generic design that could then be used in combination with either a Dypsis, or Cocos or Cyrtostachys (or whatever) design. I don't know anything about the practical aspect of this, but I believe that with today's technology it might be feasible. Except for the fact that we probably have enough of a challenge right now coming up with ONE design, let along one that would be able to incorporate different types of palm designs. But something to think about!

Bo-Göran

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gsn

At the risk of NOT being an IPS member,and having no say in the matter, therefore why am I voicing an opinion? Here is food for thought!

Logos that have certain ICONIC recognition,(Coca Cola,Pepsi,Nike,ect... even lesser know logos))are NOT changed every 10 years or so.

They remain fairly consisent, even over a hundred years or more. If they change, they change very little,and they still retain the basics of the design, color, shape!

Changing the IPS logo design might be a fun exercise for the current members, even increasing interest among current members, but recognition of the logo and the IPS by non members, I would think, would not be enhanced by changing it every decade or so? Granted those iconic logos have been enhanced by millions of ADS, but still there is a reason that they have not changed essentially for the life of the company/product!

Not trying to rain on anyones parade here, just pointing out that change isn't always the way to go,unless the current logo is so out of touch with what the IPS represents,or wants to represent!

Edited by gsn

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Mark_NoVA

Yes, simplicity is a requirement!

It might be possible to do this in a simple and attractive manner (the current logo has several palms, for example), but it would be difficult!

But, it might be an idea better suited to larger graphics than a logo. Perhaps those t-shirts discussed on another thread!

Mark,

As interesting as those ideas might be I believe we need to have simplicity in mind. The only option that I can think of if we were to include different palms would be to have a separate design for each palm, and come up with a generic design that could then be used in combination with either a Dypsis, or Cocos or Cyrtostachys (or whatever) design. I don't know anything about the practical aspect of this, but I believe that with today's technology it might be feasible. Except for the fact that we probably have enough of a challenge right now coming up with ONE design, let along one that would be able to incorporate different types of palm designs. But something to think about!

Bo-Göran

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Jeff Searle

I don't care for the "cartoon look". It's too simple, basic and on the cheesy side if you ask me. The old one is much better. I think we need something that looks closer to a real palm tree.

Jeff

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Dypsisdean
Dean, Kim, all,

It should be a simple logo that can be incorporated into advertisements.

If should not be photographic in nature, it should work as 1bit B&W, no shading or greyscales.

It shouldn't have defined colors, as has been noted, too problematic on the printing end.

Is should be sizable from 1"x1" to 10'x10' (note, lettering doesn't even have to be incorporated into the design!, see Swoosh, gold arches, etc.)

Max size, I can't imagine ever printing this thing bigger than a 6'x6' vinyl cutout... but because of this I think our logo needs to be in a vectorable format, .eps, .png, etc...

Yes, it should be silk-screenable (silk screening last much longer than printed coloration on a tshirt. I've done both personally, silk screen last 3 times longer, i.e. better products)

Google some images for "Corporate logo", any good corporate logo can be done in b&W (or any one color), resized, and stuck onto anything and still create some recognition in your memories... Perhaps we should just spend a couple bucks and hire a pro to keep the potential infighting low. John likes his design the best, I like mine (sorta) and Dean likes his... :)

Way to go William. You actually answered the questions, and in so doing have set up a set of very specific criteria for what techniques need to be adhered to. Not much more is really needed.

You have specified that:

- Given the size parameters, the original artwork should be in a vector type format at a minimum of 300 dpi, and at least 1000 - 1500 pixels wide, maybe more.

- And as far as I know, to silk screen something the graphic will need to be a few (maybe that should be defined) solid colors, with fairly simple and distinct separations between them.

That right there eliminates a lot of design options.

- If it is a vector graphic, and not too detailed, it could probably be made to have a transparent background after the fact. But if that is one of the criteria, it should be specified. That would mean not to complicated of an outline, or "holes" in the middle of the graphic, and further limit design options. One of the biggest problems with palms is that the fronds are very finely detailed. That is why a "cartoony" look may be difficult to avoid. (more on that below)

- And almost any graphic with 3,4,5 colors will lend itself to monochrome after the fact as well.

- But designing and drawing specific species of palms and squeezing them into a small logo for the web, or a hat, will be tough. Any palm drawn to the above criteria will be somewhat "cartoony" in nature. Some line art was mentioned, and this would be a way to get away from that "cartoony" look - (although I like to call it a graphic look.) :)

- And it may be a good idea to specify a rough "foot print" as to height and width. Should it be roughly the same, or longer length wise, or in height. The older IPS logo was more long, whereas the newest one is taller than long. What is desired?

And lastly - this may need to be (or should be) a two step process. The concept and rough design would be one part. Making it "camera ready" with the hi-res artwork in the proper format is the other. No artist is going to spend many hours in providing highly detailed artwork only to have it turned down. So just providing a rough design or concept would get more people interested in trying. Perhaps a prize for the concept that "wins." Then finding the graphic designer to provide the finished, project ready files would be easier to find and decide on. It would be easier getting estimates, and finalizing technical considerations, if a rough design is agreed on. It would also make the design more of our own idea. As can be seen already, every artist and designer will come up with a completely different idea of a logo. So having a basic design first only makes sense.

I think it is also important to figure out now what the IPS is willing to spend. High quality art work and graphic design is not cheap.

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PatientPalms

Here's my rough entry... Obviously the lettering as I had before can be added as necessary when the application calls for it....

IPSLogoProof2.jpg

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Dypsisdean
Here's my rough entry... Obviously the lettering as I had before can be added as necessary when the application calls for it....

IPSLogoProof2.jpg

William,

The detail in those palm leaflets will be very difficult to deal with when blown up. (Especially if transparent) It will require very detailed art in the high-res version. And most will disappear when shrunk. That is what I found to be the major hurdle when trying to incorporate a pinnate palm with a lot of leaflets. Maybe a palmate palm would be better for those reasons.

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PatientPalms

It is in .png, I'll shrink it down teeny tiny and stick in on my vinyl cutter in the AM to see if it'll work...

If not maybe I'll make them more like elongated footbal shapes to still make it look like a pinnate palm...Just don't wanna end up with banana leaves... This icon has it's design challenges, doesn't it!? I think the coconut screams iconic. Tried lots of palmates in my prelims, baileys, bizzys, washies, etc... to the average joe in Montana, a "feather" palm screams palm "tree". :)

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_Keith
Dean, Kim, all,

It should be a simple logo that can be incorporated into advertisements.

If should not be photographic in nature, it should work as 1bit B&W, no shading or greyscales.

It shouldn't have defined colors, as has been noted, too problematic on the printing end.

Is should be sizable from 1"x1" to 10'x10' (note, lettering doesn't even have to be incorporated into the design!, see Swoosh, gold arches, etc.)

Max size, I can't imagine ever printing this thing bigger than a 6'x6' vinyl cutout... but because of this I think our logo needs to be in a vectorable format, .eps, .png, etc...

Yes, it should be silk-screenable (silk screening last much longer than printed coloration on a tshirt. I've done both personally, silk screen last 3 times longer, i.e. better products)

Google some images for "Corporate logo", any good corporate logo can be done in b&W (or any one color), resized, and stuck onto anything and still create some recognition in your memories... Perhaps we should just spend a couple bucks and hire a pro to keep the potential infighting low. John likes his design the best, I like mine (sorta) and Dean likes his... :)

Way to go William. You actually answered the questions, and in so doing have set up a set of very specific criteria for what techniques need to be adhered to. Not much more is really needed.

You have specified that:

- Given the size parameters, the original artwork should be in a vector type format at a minimum of 300 dpi, and at least 1000 - 1500 pixels wide, maybe more.

- And as far as I know, to silk screen something the graphic will need to be a few (maybe that should be defined) solid colors, with fairly simple and distinct separations between them.

That right there eliminates a lot of design options.

- If it is a vector graphic, and not too detailed, it could probably be made to have a transparent background after the fact. But if that is one of the criteria, it should be specified. That would mean not to complicated of an outline, or "holes" in the middle of the graphic, and further limit design options. One of the biggest problems with palms is that the fronds are very finely detailed. That is why a "cartoony" look may be difficult to avoid. (more on that below)

- And almost any graphic with 3,4,5 colors will lend itself to monochrome after the fact as well.

- But designing and drawing specific species of palms and squeezing them into a small logo for the web, or a hat, will be tough. Any palm drawn to the above criteria will be somewhat "cartoony" in nature. Some line art was mentioned, and this would be a way to get away from that "cartoony" look - (although I like to call it a graphic look.) :)

- And it may be a good idea to specify a rough "foot print" as to height and width. Should it be roughly the same, or longer length wise, or in height. The older IPS logo was more long, whereas the newest one is taller than long. What is desired?

And lastly - this may need to be (or should be) a two step process. The concept and rough design would be one part. Making it "camera ready" with the hi-res artwork in the proper format is the other. No artist is going to spend many hours in providing highly detailed artwork only to have it turned down. So just providing a rough design or concept would get more people interested in trying. Perhaps a prize for the concept that "wins." Then finding the graphic designer to provide the finished, project ready files would be easier to find and decide on. It would be easier getting estimates, and finalizing technical considerations, if a rough design is agreed on. It would also make the design more of our own idea. As can be seen already, every artist and designer will come up with a completely different idea of a logo. So having a basic design first only makes sense.

I think it is also important to figure out now what the IPS is willing to spend. High quality art work and graphic design is not cheap.

Cool. When does PalmTalk reach 6 billion served?

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Dypsisdean
It is in .png, I'll shrink it down teeny tiny and stick in on my vinyl cutter in the AM to see if it'll work...

Try blowing it up first. I think you will lose all of the detail. You need to start with the 1000 - 1500 pixel (300 dpi) version first. Then shrink that version down. I think you will see the difficulties then.

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LJG

How much is the IPS spending on this?

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Dypsisdean
How much is the IPS spending on this?

Len,

As I suggested two posts above, "I think it is also important to figure out now what the IPS is willing to spend. High quality art work and graphic design is not cheap."

They initially thought they could just use the logo we had been using here for essentially nothing. Now this whole can of worms has opened up.

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bgl

On the surface these may seem like quick and easy decisions. Unfortunately, that's not quite how the IPS functions. I know what I would like to see done. That's not necessarily how a majority of the Directors feel about the issue... In the meantime, if you have any exciting ideas or suggestions, feel free to post them here. And I'll keep everyone posted about whatever progress we make in the decision department!

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Dypsisdean

I got my hands on an absolutely beautiful illustration (graphic) of a palm that I have placed into some logos given the feedback we have received so far. This is extremely Hi-Resolution. It could go on a billboard. The original is over 7000 pixels wide. Everything we discussed has been taken into account. And I believe this can be silkscreened because the colors are actually separated - not as a photo. First - three small samples with different backgrounds. The first two are just a sample of adding a background color to the center. The third is all transparent. And the forth shows how detailed this illustration really is, for extremely large usage. They look more yellow after uploading to Photobucket, but the tint can be easily adjusted to look better "fertilized." :)

Blue center (transparent outside): Blue640-1.png

Black center (transparent outside): Black640-1.png

All transparent (center and outside): HiResLogoRedLetters640-1.png

And this shows how detailed this illustration really is :

Picture8-3.png

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Dypsisdean

One small icon for the Forum, and three larger to see the detail - perhaps T-shirt size.

PalmTalk180-1.png

Blue1280-3.png

Black1280-2.png

HiResLogoRedLetters1280-3.png

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Moose
I don't care for the "cartoon look". It's too simple, basic and on the cheesy side if you ask me. The old one is much better. I think we need something that looks closer to a real palm tree.

Jeff

Yabba-dabba-Do!

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Dypsisdean

Oh, and two monochromes for William.

Green.png

BW.png

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John in Andalucia

With my design approach, my aim is to promote the International Palm Society foremost by name and acronym. The graphic is intended to give a "jungle feel", and say, "green environment". With a fundamental change, I have taken on board Bill's comments about printing. Full colour printing is not only expensive, but where t-shirts and stickers are concerned, less durable. The preferred option, spot colour printing is vibrant, less costly, and much more durable. Another bonus to spot colour artwork, is that you have the option to produce silk screen-printed t-shirts. This is the process that produces the highest quality t-shirts. Digital laser t-shirt printing is cheap and doesn't last.

Here is my design, currently broken down into 5 colours (the t-shirt on the left) with a transparent background. The t-shirt on the right uses my original photographic image, and is included here to show the transition from photo to spot-colour artwork.

t-shirt_screenprint.jpg

IPS_logo2.jpg

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Don
Bill, I think it works okay as a business card logo. As long as the letters "IPS" remain in the design, it backs up the small text.

IPS_business_card.jpg

Very nice John!

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Pivi
- Given the size parameters, the original artwork should be in a vector type format at a minimum of 300 dpi, and at least 1000 - 1500 pixels wide, maybe more.

If image is in vector then it's not important how big original pictures is because you can always magnify it as much as you want and you will not loose quality. The quality remains the same.

i.e. you can take 640*480 pixel vector image and make it 10 times biger 6400*4800 the quality will be the same and you will not loose a singel detail. That's why it is called a vector image, as opposed to a raster image.

Vector image doesn't mean it doesn't have background. It can be with background or transparent.

Logo should be transparent by the way, without any backgruound because background look ugly on logos. So only logo shape, without background. And no square filled shapes, only logo shape.

I like John's approach, but for me minus is that filled square. So i think it should be logo shape, no squares.

Edited by Pivi

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PatientPalms

Agreed Pivi!

John's design (to me) is more of a marketing campaign... Like for a particular year(or given time period), we would use that vistaprint.com style for our media/marketing materials... our flyers/postcards etc. would have that design incorporated into them... It is classy and appears polished, I think the design is lost when the # of colors and shading is reduced

Dean, how complicated is your design when silhouetted? not greyscale, just B&W... the all transparent (outside and center) version and can your reproduce without lettering? I'm starting to think the logo shouldn't have lettering as it creates problems when reducing size... Do you prefer a more realistic palm for the logo or something more stylized? I think both have ups and downs...

The lettering can always be added when needed. The goal of a logo is to create symbolic recognition. I think the lettering conflicts and make it look more like a stamp or seal. I also think the realistic palms create a difficulty when reprinting very small. my current stylized palm may even be to tough. I did like the stylizeing in my most recent palm of the trunk. It reminds me of the air travel from one location on the globe to another, a tradition of the palm society; our Bi-annuals. Just scaled my image up and down; The stylization of my leaves will not be acceptable as-is for vectorability. Perhaps this is where a graphic artist comes into play...

IPSLogoProof2.jpg

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Zeeth
One small icon for the Forum, and three larger to see the detail - perhaps T-shirt size.

PalmTalk180-1.png

Blue1280-3.png

Black1280-2.png

HiResLogoRedLetters1280-3.png

I really like this one actually, this would be the best design I've seen so far for a T-shirt. Not sure about everything else, someone else can chime in on that, but for a T-shirt, this design is very good.

I like the blue and white backgrounds, the black doesn't look as good.

Edited by Zeeth

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PatientPalms
On the surface these may seem like quick and easy decisions. Unfortunately, that's not quite how the IPS functions. I know what I would like to see done. That's not necessarily how a majority of the Directors feel about the issue... In the meantime, if you have any exciting ideas or suggestions, feel free to post them here. And I'll keep everyone posted about whatever progress we make in the decision department!

Store front neon at corporate headquarters? B) ok, so that's high hopes for today, but no problem with planning for tomorrow is there?! The point of the exercise is to demonstrate that a logo must be able to be used in a plethora of applications... Try doing that with today's current logo!

IPSLogoProof2-1.jpg

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John Case
It is in .png, I'll shrink it down teeny tiny and stick in on my vinyl cutter in the AM to see if it'll work...

If not maybe I'll make them more like elongated footbal shapes to still make it look like a pinnate palm...Just don't wanna end up with banana leaves... This icon has it's design challenges, doesn't it!? I think the coconut screams iconic. Tried lots of palmates in my prelims, baileys, bizzys, washies, etc... to the average joe in Montana, a "feather" palm screams palm "tree". :)

I agree with Bill on the palate leaf but for different reasons.

To the uneducated (and there are a lot of them around) the palmate leaf will look to many as the general shape of a marajuana leaf and the IPS will translate to the International Pot Society. It will take one person to start a bad image for us......

I would avoid the palmate shape totally.

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Pivi

Doesn't pinnate leaf crown looks as marijuana?

Anyway, i would not take it that far.

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John Case

My final input on the logo because I have no design skills.

Successful logos over time become more and more simple as the brand becomes mor and more well known. The main image is what lasts over time. Golden arches, McDonald's; Red dot, Coca Cola, Trisected circle, Mercedes Benz; Swoosh, Nike.

The initial logos were more complex (had letters in them) because they were still seeking immediate brand recognition Now that they have it, the logo is totally simplified becasue it is the image that evokes the brand, not the words.

Our image, whatever it will be, must be striking. However, we may not achieve commercial success as the companies above. Are there examples of interest groups that hace a logo? None come to mind.

It is still in my mind that the logo, while meaningful to us, must spark the curiousity of those who see it and motivate them to find out what it is, whether its on the website, a T-shirt, or coffee mug. I would expect the folks in HI to have alhoa shirts with the logo as a pattern, etc.

The logo is really for external consumption. Our interests in palms will not change due to a logo and battles over it are non-productive. I'll use it if I have the opportunity to, but if it does not convey the message to outsiders, I probably won't use it much.

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PatientPalms
Are there examples of interest groups that hace a logo? None come to mind.

peta_logo.jpg

Republican_Logo.jpg

Star%20of%20David.png

nascar-2306.jpg

etc. etc. etc.

There's tons of em...

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