tim_brissy_13 464 Report post Posted March 7, 2011 Andrew, I dont believe alfredii usually has windows. As far as I'm aware only B. sp windows retains the windows in the fronds as they open. Here is my B. madagascariensis (formerly sp. non windows). It is a slowish but steady grower. The palm to its right is a Parajubaea cocoides grown from seed in 2003. I have 2 B. alfredii seedlings that are significantly faster than the madagascariensis and are so far bulletproof in this climate. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted March 8, 2011 Alfredii has windows--just looked it up on palms.org. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tyrone 1,993 Report post Posted March 8, 2011 Alfredii has windows--just looked it up on palms.org. Yes, but they're small, unlike the other one called "windows" which doesn't have a name yet. Even some Cocos nucifera get smallish windows for a bit. Best regards Tyrone Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted March 9, 2011 (edited) Maybe comparatively, but I only have alfredii--the windows are long and narrow. I'm not measuring now, but I would guess a centimeter wide and as much as 15 centimeters long. Edited March 9, 2011 by Mandrew968 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tyrone 1,993 Report post Posted March 9, 2011 Yes, "comparatively" no windows. Just looking at my windows form and the slits are half the length of the leaf and more than 1cm wide, also the whole leaf is a wider more rounded leaf than alfredii. It will be good when the windows form actually gets named and then we can talk about the 3 species clearly. However I think there is another species out there at least. I got some Beccariophoenix sp "pointed seed" and the seed does look much smaller and different to all the others. From 200 seed I've had 2 come up but I'm really happy. One big difference to the others is it's almost a remote germinator. What I mean is although it's not as remote as Parajubaea and Livistona it puts the plant about 1cm away from the seed. The other species keep the seedling right up hard against the seed. Who knows what these will turn out like. Best regards Tyrone Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted March 10, 2011 (edited) Very awesome, Tyrone! This is why I joined palm talk thanks Edited March 10, 2011 by Mandrew968 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BS Man about Palms 2,344 Report post Posted March 11, 2011 my biggest B. alfredii... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted March 11, 2011 Just planted mine in my front yard, yesterday Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kumar 150 Report post Posted March 11, 2011 What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quaman58 1,969 Report post Posted March 11, 2011 What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ? Generally on this species, the young leaves are somewhere between a strap leaf & one that is fully pinnate. The leaflets show signs of separating, but are still attached at the ends; hence the "windows". About the middle third oh the leaf is open. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Xenon 1,381 Report post Posted March 11, 2011 (edited) Crispy alfredii.... the spear has since pulled... Jonathan Edited March 11, 2011 by Xenon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rafael 423 Report post Posted March 11, 2011 my biggest B. alfredii... Why is it still potted? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BS Man about Palms 2,344 Report post Posted March 11, 2011 Its the nature of my life... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kumar 150 Report post Posted March 13, 2011 What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ? Generally on this species, the young leaves are somewhere between a strap leaf & one that is fully pinnate. The leaflets show signs of separating, but are still attached at the ends; hence the "windows". About the middle third oh the leaf is open. Thanks for this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quaman58 1,969 Report post Posted March 13, 2011 What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ? Generally on this species, the young leaves are somewhere between a strap leaf & one that is fully pinnate. The leaflets show signs of separating, but are still attached at the ends; hence the "windows". About the middle third oh the leaf is open. Thanks for this Kumar, I just realized there's a great picture at the beginning of this thread showing a windows leaf. Check it out! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kumar 150 Report post Posted March 13, 2011 Kumar, I just realized there's a great picture at the beginning of this thread showing a windows leaf. Check it out! I think you mean Tim's photo. Yes, it does resolve my doubt. Thanks again Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Moose 1,469 Report post Posted February 13, 2012 I purchased this Beccariophoenix alfredii at the South Florida Palm Society Sale at Montgomery Botanical Center this last March. It was in a seven gallon container. The palm has opened two leaves and has a spike emerging. It appears that it has responded well to the spot I choose and the soil amendments made. Ron. I've been looking for this thread. . Beccariophoenix alfredii photos I posted on August 22, 2009 Same Beccariophoenix alfredii at 7 ft overall height. Photo taken two days ago. Not a rocket but a good steady grower. Took the 2010 winter without a blemish. By the way, Mike Harris (Waykoolplantz) has a pair of Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form on either side of the observation deck overlooking his huge Koi pond. Jeff Searle and I were admiring them about 9 months ago. They have a bluish hue to the fronds and look very, very special. Jeff and I are kicking ourselves in the #&$ for not getting more of these when they were available. Perhaps Mike would be so kind to post some photos. Or - I'll try to get some photos the next time I visit. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeff Searle 1,060 Report post Posted February 13, 2012 Ron, Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted February 13, 2012 That's a SWEET alfredii, Moose! That spiraling white fly likes mine, but it doesn't seem to hurt it at all... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quaman58 1,969 Report post Posted February 13, 2012 Ron, Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot? Is the "coastal" form identical to madagascariensis (no windows)? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Moose 1,469 Report post Posted February 13, 2012 Ron, Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot? Yes Jeff that is what I meant. Mike Harris' are the nicest and largest I've seen. quaman58 - I believe that Beccariophoenix alfredii is the Beccariophoenix "no windows". It was called that because it was being cultivated but had not yet been described. The Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form may be a variant of Beccariophoenix alfredii. That was my assumption when it first was being distributed. In my opinion it looks distinct enough to be warranted as a seperate species. That is based on observed subjection backed by no facts or data. But what do I know? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quaman58 1,969 Report post Posted February 13, 2012 Ron, Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot? Yes Jeff that is what I meant. Mike Harris' are the nicest and largest I've seen. quaman58 - I believe that Beccariophoenix alfredii is the Beccariophoenix "no windows". It was called that because it was being cultivated but had not yet been described. The Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form may be a variant of Beccariophoenix alfredii. That was my assumption when it first was being distributed. In my opinion it looks distinct enough to be warranted as a seperate species. That is based on observed subjection backed by no facts or data. But what do I know? Thanks Ron. So does that mean perhaps 4 species are kicking around? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Moose 1,469 Report post Posted February 14, 2012 Bret - I had to do a bit of looking. Can't go by recollection any more it seems. According to Kew - only two species of Beccariophoenix are recognized, alfredii and madagascariensis. I checked an old Floribunda list from Winter 2008. B. alfredii, madagascariensis and sp. (no windows) {with salt tolerant comment} were listed. I may have misspoke about alfredii being the "original" no windows. Jeff has noted that alfredii is "high plateau". The sp. (no windows) may be the "Coastal Form", i.e. salt tolerant. Because of all my calcareous soil, madagascariensis did very poorly for me. The alfredii has done well so far so it may be assumed that these two species may be growing in two different soil types in habitat. Checking the current Floribunda Winter 2012 List B. alfredii, sp. (no window) and sp. window are listed. perhaps Jeff's sp. window was being called madagascariensis before and was found to be different, I don't know. Bottom line: Two species are recognized. Two other sp. are around and may be variants or seperate species. Potentially 4 species and who knows, they may find more in the genus? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Manolitus 17 Report post Posted February 14, 2012 Bret - I had to do a bit of looking. Can't go by recollection any more it seems. According to Kew - only two species of Beccariophoenix are recognized, alfredii and madagascariensis. I checked an old Floribunda list from Winter 2008. B. alfredii, madagascariensis and sp. (no windows) {with salt tolerant comment} were listed. I may have misspoke about alfredii being the "original" no windows. Jeff has noted that alfredii is "high plateau". The sp. (no windows) may be the "Coastal Form", i.e. salt tolerant. Because of all my calcareous soil, madagascariensis did very poorly for me. The alfredii has done well so far so it may be assumed that these two species may be growing in two different soil types in habitat. Checking the current Floribunda Winter 2012 List B. alfredii, sp. (no window) and sp. window are listed. perhaps Jeff's sp. window was being called madagascariensis before and was found to be different, I don't know. Bottom line: Two species are recognized. Two other sp. are around and may be variants or seperate species. Potentially 4 species and who knows, they may find more in the genus? Moose, Good job keeping yours green. I have one that is roughly your size maybe a little bigger, but is not as green. I was always told that iron and magnesium had to be supplemented ? Winter however was no problem. Manny Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted February 14, 2012 The "coastal" is now madagascarensis. Alfredii is what was known as "high plateau". The windows version will soon have a name--it will be latin for "windows"--this is the one that needs constant doses of iron to look good. I think Tyrone said he has come across a "pointy seed" version. That would make possibly 4 species of Beccariophoenix. Let it be noted that originally, the "windows" version was madagascarensis. Mattyb had a good thread about all of this--Beccariophoenix breakdown. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Moose 1,469 Report post Posted February 14, 2012 Manny - Thank you for your kind words. Sometimes its better to be lucky than good. I keep the AFEC palm special feed going. It was getting brown tips on the leaflets. Heavily mulching (8 inches) around it over a year ago seems to have helped. It also gets a feeding of Sequestrian 138 each spring. Andrew - thanks for the heads up to Matty's thread. I am sure he is more up on the Beccariophoenix current standings than I. Tried to search for some accurate answers to Bret's questions at the Kew webpage. Bret - I had to do a bit of looking. Can't go by recollection any more it seems. According to Kew - only two species of Beccariophoenix are recognized, alfredii and madagascariensis. I checked an old Floribunda list from Winter 2008. B. alfredii, madagascariensis and sp. (no windows) {with salt tolerant comment} were listed. I may have misspoke about alfredii being the "original" no windows. Jeff has noted that alfredii is "high plateau". The sp. (no windows) may be the "Coastal Form", i.e. salt tolerant. Because of all my calcareous soil, madagascariensis did very poorly for me. The alfredii has done well so far so it may be assumed that these two species may be growing in two different soil types in habitat. Checking the current Floribunda Winter 2012 List B. alfredii, sp. (no window) and sp. window are listed. perhaps Jeff's sp. window was being called madagascariensis before and was found to be different, I don't know. Bottom line: Two species are recognized. Two other sp. are around and may be variants or seperate species. Potentially 4 species and who knows, they may find more in the genus? Moose, Good job keeping yours green. I have one that is roughly your size maybe a little bigger, but is not as green. I was always told that iron and magnesium had to be supplemented ? Winter however was no problem. Manny Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Really full garden 1,479 Report post Posted February 16, 2012 About three years ago I purchased seeds from RPS that were listed as Beccariophoenix sp."Coastal form".I am always interested in new palms that have potential for my beach garden and these seemed to fit the criteria.They have been slow and today this one is going to be planted. As you can see they have no "windows". Did anyone else purchase these seeds? I just looked on the RPS archive and they no longer list any Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form. This palm suffered a slow death at the beach.Never really adapted despite all efforts. I now have one planted in my highland garden and it seems to be growing well after six months. I still have one spare just in case. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted February 28, 2012 Sorry to hear that, Scott. Over the weekend, I planted a 7gal Beccariophoenix madagascarensis(no windows--coastal form) in my backyard. It came from a shade house and is now in the full sun. The grower warned me that they were yellow and didn't look too good, but I got one anyways I dug a deep hole and filled it back in with a bunch of tortoise dung and ironite. The palm is a little bit lower than the surrounding soil, but is not below the root initiation zone. I hope this will be an easy grower for me--it's right next to a Dypsis Leptocheilos so when I go to put down iron, next time, I can just throw it down EVERYWHERE I will post photos of both species soon... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
redant 1,147 Report post Posted February 28, 2012 "I dug a deep hole and filled it back in with a bunch of tortoise dung and ironite" Um tortoise dung, don't see that used on a regular basis, I;m sure it's great though. I have 4 Beccariophoenix madagascarensis(no windows--coastal form) in the ground for several years. They don't seem to need additional iron like the windows which I give generous servings to several times a year. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yachtingone 107 Report post Posted February 28, 2012 Here are pics of my no windows form. The lawn chair for scale. It's overall height is 7'. Randy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted February 28, 2012 "I dug a deep hole and filled it back in with a bunch of tortoise dung and ironite" Um tortoise dung, don't see that used on a regular basis, I;m sure it's great though. I have 4 Beccariophoenix madagascarensis(no windows--coastal form) in the ground for several years. They don't seem to need additional iron like the windows which I give generous servings to several times a year. What else would I do with it? It's mostly grass. I have a ton of it from the new family pet. It doesn't smell as offensive as dog and cat stuff(dries up in a day) and is not nearly as disconcerting when you accidentally step in some. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cedric 97 Report post Posted February 28, 2012 I have a ton of it from the new family pet. It doesn't smell as offensive as dog and cat stuff(dries up in a day) and is not nearly as disconcerting when you accidentally step in some. What species? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mandrew968 1,605 Report post Posted February 28, 2012 I have a ton of it from the new family pet. It doesn't smell as offensive as dog and cat stuff(dries up in a day) and is not nearly as disconcerting when you accidentally step in some. What species? Sulcatta. About 40 lbs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hammer 650 Report post Posted February 29, 2012 Here are pics of my no windows form. The lawn chair for scale. It's overall height is 7'. Randy Randy, How long ago did you plant these? And how large were they when you put them in the ground? Thanks, Adam Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yachtingone 107 Report post Posted February 29, 2012 Adam those are pics of the same plant. I put it in the ground almost 3 years ago from 5 gallon container. It's been a very good grower for me. I keep waiting for a hard frost to do damage but so far so good! Randy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
redant 1,147 Report post Posted February 29, 2012 Updated pictures of my windows form, might be my favorite palm for my climate, just stunning when nice and green. First 2 pics are the same palm, then my smaller one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DoomsDave 8,685 Report post Posted February 29, 2012 Here are pics of my no windows form. The lawn chair for scale. It's overall height is 7'. Randy Yours look more like some very nice alfredii. I think no-window/coastal form is a lot more yellow, and has much stiffer shuttlecock "badminton birdie" crown of leaves. Very nice! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Central Floridave 81 Report post Posted March 1, 2012 windows Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hammer 650 Report post Posted March 1, 2012 Does anyone have a sense for how heat sensitive the B. Alfredii and the B. Mad. (no windows) are? I got some of each in pots. I have no option for planting them out at this time. They will be sitting on concrete in courtyard all summer this year. I'd love to keep the leaves in the warmest, sunniest location but am worried I may fry the roots. It can get pretty hot in the rootzone in black plastic pots sitting on concrete in later afternoon sun. Anyone have experience with this kind of situation? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DoomsDave 8,685 Report post Posted March 1, 2012 Adam: No-windows do need their water to be happy. I've not had too many problems about getting too warm in the roots, as long was you keep them watered enough. If in doubt, give 'em a drink. You are very very unlikely to overwater them unless you go totally crazy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites