Beccariophoenix

[tim_brissy_13 434]

Andrew, I dont believe alfredii usually has windows. As far as I'm aware only B. sp windows retains the windows in the fronds as they open.

Here is my B. madagascariensis (formerly sp. non windows). It is a slowish but steady grower. The palm to its right is a Parajubaea cocoides grown from seed in 2003.

I have 2 B. alfredii seedlings that are significantly faster than the madagascariensis and are so far bulletproof in this climate.

[Mandrew968 1,605]

Alfredii has windows--just looked it up on palms.org.

[Tyrone 1,910]

Alfredii has windows--just looked it up on palms.org.

Yes, but they're small, unlike the other one called "windows" which doesn't have a name yet. Even some Cocos nucifera get smallish windows for a bit.

Best regards

Tyrone

[Mandrew968 1,605]

Maybe comparatively, but I only have alfredii--the windows are long and narrow. I'm not measuring now, but I would guess a centimeter wide and as much as 15 centimeters long.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Mandrew968

[Tyrone 1,910]

Yes, "comparatively" no windows. Just looking at my windows form and the slits are half the length of the leaf and more than 1cm wide, also the whole leaf is a wider more rounded leaf than alfredii. It will be good when the windows form actually gets named and then we can talk about the 3 species clearly.

However I think there is another species out there at least. I got some Beccariophoenix sp "pointed seed" and the seed does look much smaller and different to all the others. From 200 seed I've had 2 come up but I'm really happy. One big difference to the others is it's almost a remote germinator. What I mean is although it's not as remote as Parajubaea and Livistona it puts the plant about 1cm away from the seed. The other species keep the seedling right up hard against the seed. Who knows what these will turn out like.

Best regards

Tyrone

[Mandrew968 1,605]

Very awesome, Tyrone! This is why I joined palm talk thanks

Edited March 10, 2011 by Mandrew968

[BS Man about Palms 2,337]

my biggest B. alfredii...

[Mandrew968 1,605]

Just planted mine in my front yard, yesterday

[Kumar 149]

What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ?

[quaman58 1,939]

What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ?

Generally on this species, the young leaves are somewhere between a strap leaf & one that is fully pinnate. The leaflets show signs of separating, but are still attached at the ends; hence the "windows". About the middle third oh the leaf is open.

[Xenon 1,000]

Crispy alfredii.... the spear has since pulled...

Jonathan

Edited March 11, 2011 by Xenon

[Rafael 412]

my biggest B. alfredii...

Why is it still potted?

[BS Man about Palms 2,337]

Its the nature of my life...

[Kumar 149]

What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ?

Generally on this species, the young leaves are somewhere between a strap leaf & one that is fully pinnate. The leaflets show signs of separating, but are still attached at the ends; hence the "windows". About the middle third oh the leaf is open.

Thanks for this

[quaman58 1,939]

What is a 'window' ? Does it refer to leaflets joined at the end by the sliver of green thread ?

Generally on this species, the young leaves are somewhere between a strap leaf & one that is fully pinnate. The leaflets show signs of separating, but are still attached at the ends; hence the "windows". About the middle third oh the leaf is open.

Thanks for this

Kumar, I just realized there's a great picture at the beginning of this thread showing a windows leaf. Check it out!

[Kumar 149]

Kumar, I just realized there's a great picture at the beginning of this thread showing a windows leaf. Check it out!

I think you mean Tim's photo. Yes, it does resolve my doubt. Thanks again

[Moose 1,465]

I purchased this Beccariophoenix alfredii at the South Florida Palm Society Sale at Montgomery Botanical Center this last March. It was in a seven gallon container. The palm has opened two leaves and has a spike emerging. It appears that it has responded well to the spot I choose and the soil amendments made.

Ron.

I've been looking for this thread.

.

Beccariophoenix alfredii photos I posted on August 22, 2009

Same Beccariophoenix alfredii at 7 ft overall height. Photo taken two days ago.

Not a rocket but a good steady grower. Took the 2010 winter without a blemish.

By the way, Mike Harris (Waykoolplantz) has a pair of Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form on either side of the observation deck overlooking his huge Koi pond. Jeff Searle and I were admiring them about 9 months ago. They have a bluish hue to the fronds and look very, very special. Jeff and I are kicking ourselves in the #&$ for not getting more of these when they were available. Perhaps Mike would be so kind to post some photos. Or - I'll try to get some photos the next time I visit.

[Jeff Searle 1,060]

Ron,

Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot?

[Mandrew968 1,605]

That's a SWEET alfredii, Moose! That spiraling white fly likes mine, but it doesn't seem to hurt it at all...

[quaman58 1,939]

Ron,

Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot?

Is the "coastal" form identical to madagascariensis (no windows)?

[Moose 1,465]

Ron,

Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot?

Yes Jeff that is what I meant. Mike Harris' are the nicest and largest I've seen.

quaman58 - I believe that Beccariophoenix alfredii is the Beccariophoenix "no windows". It was called that because it was being cultivated but had not yet been described.

The Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form may be a variant of Beccariophoenix alfredii. That was my assumption when it first was being distributed. In my opinion it looks distinct enough to be warranted as a seperate species. That is based on observed subjection backed by no facts or data. But what do I know?

[quaman58 1,939]

Ron,

Have the B. sp. Coastal Form become hard to find now? Or maybe something larger than a 1 or 3 gallon size pot?

Yes Jeff that is what I meant. Mike Harris' are the nicest and largest I've seen.

quaman58 - I believe that Beccariophoenix alfredii is the Beccariophoenix "no windows". It was called that because it was being cultivated but had not yet been described.

The Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form may be a variant of Beccariophoenix alfredii. That was my assumption when it first was being distributed. In my opinion it looks distinct enough to be warranted as a seperate species. That is based on observed subjection backed by no facts or data. But what do I know?

Thanks Ron. So does that mean perhaps 4 species are kicking around?

[Moose 1,465]

Bret - I had to do a bit of looking. Can't go by recollection any more it seems.

According to Kew - only two species of Beccariophoenix are recognized, alfredii and madagascariensis.

I checked an old Floribunda list from Winter 2008.

B. alfredii, madagascariensis and sp. (no windows) {with salt tolerant comment} were listed. I may have misspoke about alfredii being the "original" no windows. Jeff has noted that alfredii is "high plateau". The sp. (no windows) may be the "Coastal Form", i.e. salt tolerant.

Because of all my calcareous soil, madagascariensis did very poorly for me. The alfredii has done well so far so it may be assumed that these two species may be growing in two different soil types in habitat.

Checking the current Floribunda Winter 2012 List

B. alfredii, sp. (no window) and sp. window are listed. perhaps Jeff's sp. window was being called madagascariensis before and was found to be different, I don't know.

Bottom line: Two species are recognized. Two other sp. are around and may be variants or seperate species. Potentially 4 species and who knows, they may find more in the genus?

[Manolitus 17]

Bret - I had to do a bit of looking. Can't go by recollection any more it seems.

According to Kew - only two species of Beccariophoenix are recognized, alfredii and madagascariensis.

I checked an old Floribunda list from Winter 2008.

B. alfredii, madagascariensis and sp. (no windows) {with salt tolerant comment} were listed. I may have misspoke about alfredii being the "original" no windows. Jeff has noted that alfredii is "high plateau". The sp. (no windows) may be the "Coastal Form", i.e. salt tolerant.

Because of all my calcareous soil, madagascariensis did very poorly for me. The alfredii has done well so far so it may be assumed that these two species may be growing in two different soil types in habitat.

Checking the current Floribunda Winter 2012 List

B. alfredii, sp. (no window) and sp. window are listed. perhaps Jeff's sp. window was being called madagascariensis before and was found to be different, I don't know.

Bottom line: Two species are recognized. Two other sp. are around and may be variants or seperate species. Potentially 4 species and who knows, they may find more in the genus?

Moose,

Good job keeping yours green. I have one that is roughly your size maybe a little bigger, but is not as green. I was always told that iron and magnesium had to be supplemented ? Winter however was no problem.

Manny

[Mandrew968 1,605]

The "coastal" is now madagascarensis. Alfredii is what was known as "high plateau". The windows version will soon have a name--it will be latin for "windows"--this is the one that needs constant doses of iron to look good. I think Tyrone said he has come across a "pointy seed" version. That would make possibly 4 species of Beccariophoenix. Let it be noted that originally, the "windows" version was madagascarensis.

Mattyb had a good thread about all of this--Beccariophoenix breakdown.

[Moose 1,465]

Manny - Thank you for your kind words. Sometimes its better to be lucky than good. I keep the AFEC palm special feed going. It was getting brown tips on the leaflets. Heavily mulching (8 inches) around it over a year ago seems to have helped. It also gets a feeding of Sequestrian 138 each spring.

Andrew - thanks for the heads up to Matty's thread. I am sure he is more up on the Beccariophoenix current standings than I. Tried to search for some accurate answers to Bret's questions at the Kew webpage.

Bret - I had to do a bit of looking. Can't go by recollection any more it seems.

According to Kew - only two species of Beccariophoenix are recognized, alfredii and madagascariensis.

I checked an old Floribunda list from Winter 2008.

B. alfredii, madagascariensis and sp. (no windows) {with salt tolerant comment} were listed. I may have misspoke about alfredii being the "original" no windows. Jeff has noted that alfredii is "high plateau". The sp. (no windows) may be the "Coastal Form", i.e. salt tolerant.

Because of all my calcareous soil, madagascariensis did very poorly for me. The alfredii has done well so far so it may be assumed that these two species may be growing in two different soil types in habitat.

Checking the current Floribunda Winter 2012 List

B. alfredii, sp. (no window) and sp. window are listed. perhaps Jeff's sp. window was being called madagascariensis before and was found to be different, I don't know.

Bottom line: Two species are recognized. Two other sp. are around and may be variants or seperate species. Potentially 4 species and who knows, they may find more in the genus?

Moose,

Good job keeping yours green. I have one that is roughly your size maybe a little bigger, but is not as green. I was always told that iron and magnesium had to be supplemented ? Winter however was no problem.

Manny

[Really full garden 1,477]

About three years ago I purchased seeds from RPS that were listed as Beccariophoenix sp."Coastal form".I am always interested in new palms that have potential for my beach garden and these seemed to fit the criteria.They have been slow and today this one is going to be planted.

As you can see they have no "windows". Did anyone else purchase these seeds? I just looked on the RPS archive and they no longer list any Becarriophoenix sp. Coastal form.

This palm suffered a slow death at the beach.Never really adapted despite all efforts. I now have one planted in my highland garden and it seems to be growing well after six months. I still have one spare just in case.

[Mandrew968 1,605]

Sorry to hear that, Scott. Over the weekend, I planted a 7gal Beccariophoenix madagascarensis(no windows--coastal form) in my backyard. It came from a shade house and is now in the full sun. The grower warned me that they were yellow and didn't look too good, but I got one anyways I dug a deep hole and filled it back in with a bunch of tortoise dung and ironite. The palm is a little bit lower than the surrounding soil, but is not below the root initiation zone. I hope this will be an easy grower for me--it's right next to a Dypsis Leptocheilos so when I go to put down iron, next time, I can just throw it down EVERYWHERE

I will post photos of both species soon...

[redant 1,044]

"I dug a deep hole and filled it back in with a bunch of tortoise dung and ironite" Um tortoise dung, don't see that used on a regular basis, I;m sure it's great though. I have 4 Beccariophoenix madagascarensis(no windows--coastal form) in the ground for several years. They don't seem to need additional iron like the windows which I give generous servings to several times a year.

[yachtingone 106]

Here are pics of my no windows form. The lawn chair for scale. It's overall height is 7'.

Randy

[Mandrew968 1,605]

"I dug a deep hole and filled it back in with a bunch of tortoise dung and ironite" Um tortoise dung, don't see that used on a regular basis, I;m sure it's great though. I have 4 Beccariophoenix madagascarensis(no windows--coastal form) in the ground for several years. They don't seem to need additional iron like the windows which I give generous servings to several times a year.

What else would I do with it? It's mostly grass. I have a ton of it from the new family pet. It doesn't smell as offensive as dog and cat stuff(dries up in a day) and is not nearly as disconcerting when you accidentally step in some.

[Cedric 97]

I have a ton of it from the new family pet. It doesn't smell as offensive as dog and cat stuff(dries up in a day) and is not nearly as disconcerting when you accidentally step in some.

What species?

[Mandrew968 1,605]

I have a ton of it from the new family pet. It doesn't smell as offensive as dog and cat stuff(dries up in a day) and is not nearly as disconcerting when you accidentally step in some.

What species?

Sulcatta. About 40 lbs.

[Hammer 650]

Here are pics of my no windows form. The lawn chair for scale. It's overall height is 7'.

Randy

Randy,

How long ago did you plant these? And how large were they when you put them in the ground? Thanks, Adam

[yachtingone 106]

Adam those are pics of the same plant. I put it in the ground almost 3 years ago from 5 gallon container.

It's been a very good grower for me. I keep waiting for a hard frost to do damage but so far so good!

Randy

[redant 1,044]

Updated pictures of my windows form, might be my favorite palm for my climate, just stunning when nice and green. First 2 pics are the same palm, then my smaller one.

[DoomsDave 8,509]

Here are pics of my no windows form. The lawn chair for scale. It's overall height is 7'.

Randy

Yours look more like some very nice alfredii. I think no-window/coastal form is a lot more yellow, and has much stiffer shuttlecock "badminton birdie" crown of leaves.

Very nice!

[Central Floridave 78]

windows

[Hammer 650]

Does anyone have a sense for how heat sensitive the B. Alfredii and the B. Mad. (no windows) are? I got some of each in pots. I have no option for planting them out at this time. They will be sitting on concrete in courtyard all summer this year. I'd love to keep the leaves in the warmest, sunniest location but am worried I may fry the roots. It can get pretty hot in the rootzone in black plastic pots sitting on concrete in later afternoon sun. Anyone have experience with this kind of situation?

[DoomsDave 8,509]

Adam:

No-windows do need their water to be happy. I've not had too many problems about getting too warm in the roots, as long was you keep them watered enough. If in doubt, give 'em a drink.

You are very very unlikely to overwater them unless you go totally crazy.