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CFPACS June 13th Meeting


Bob Johnson

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I believe that many had been tried there over the years, but 1989 wiped out most of them. Brad told me that his dad tried many tropical palms there and got tired of them being wiped out in freezes - one reason that there are so many cycads on the property, the cycads would come back from the freezes much more readily than the tropical palms would.

Across the bay in St. Petersburg there are some very favorable microclimates (such as the Kopsick Palm Arboretum) where more tropical palms are planted.

The Attalea have been there for decades and have unknowingly developed several feet of trunk. The old leaf bases hid them for years. This area of Tampa is not as warm as coastal areas of St. Pete (Kopsick Arboretum) but equal to the remaining lower 1/2 of the Pinellas peninsula.

Tampa, Interbay Peninsula, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10A

Bokeelia, Pine Island, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10B

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Thanks for the shots!

Did he say how old the Lodoicea was? Also, how did he get the seed?

I don't know the details on where he got the Lodoicea seed or how old the plant is. I believe that they are very slow and take over 20 years to show a trunk. I would guess that the seed in the atrium that you posted a pic of is the seed from the palm. I have seen the empty seeds for sale from time to time. It is the largest seed in the plant kingdom and quite a novelty.

Ray or some of the others from the Tampa Bay area might know some additional details.

Bob Johnson
Orlando, Florida, USA

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I believe that many had been tried there over the years, but 1989 wiped out most of them. Brad told me that his dad tried many tropical palms there and got tired of them being wiped out in freezes - one reason that there are so many cycads on the property, the cycads would come back from the freezes much more readily than the tropical palms would.

Across the bay in St. Petersburg there are some very favorable microclimates (such as the Kopsick Palm Arboretum) where more tropical palms are planted.

The Attalea have been there for decades and have unknowingly developed several feet of trunk. The old leaf bases hid them for years. This area of Tampa is not as warm as coastal areas of St. Pete (Kopsick Arboretum) but equal to the remaining lower 1/2 of the Pinellas peninsula.

So Ray, if I understand you correctly it is a favorable microclimate for central Fla but not as good as the warmest parts of St. Pete. If his garden was started in the 60s it has seen some bad freezes in addition to '89. The several different Attalea species throughout the property have survived those freezes. Seems to be one that will suffer leaf damage in a freeze but will come back.

Bob Johnson
Orlando, Florida, USA

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You hit it right on the head Bob. For Hyphaene, Attalea, Coccothrinax and Borassus to achieve that size, you need a bit of a special microclimate.

Tampa, Interbay Peninsula, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10A

Bokeelia, Pine Island, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10B

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Hello all,

To all of you who showed up on Saturday, thank you for coming and I hope you enjoyed both Dad's garden and Dorothy's beautiful lakefront home. That is the place where I caught my first fish (bream on a cane pole sitting in my granddad's lap) and learned how to water ski. It has a special place in my childhood memories.

The Lodoicea was not grown from the seed pictured. That seed was not viable when it was given to my parents. The seed that produced the palm was sent via airmail by Mel Sneed when he visit the Seychelles sometime in the "70s I believe. This could be referenced due to articles Mel wrote about the trip in Principes as the IPS journal was known at the time.

Yes it is very slow and not real happy in the atrium. It is protected during the winter, the leaf damage happened in the past probably due to a lowering ground water table during drought and too little irrigation. I read where Bo gets three fronds a year in that tropical, volcanic soil. We are lucky to get one frond every three years, it has been trying to push the emerging leaf for the past 12 months. Last summer I power washed the algae off the atrium roof so maybe more sun will help.

The garden experienced many freezes from 1961 through 1989. Many different palm species were tried over the years but unfortunately not much has been added since 89. The garden was always an experiment to Dad, he and Dent Smith were good friends and would always compare the results of the latest freeze. He was growing so many new things that the freezes would be looked at as room for more to be planted out. He did tire of the cycle and did begin collecting more cycads because they mostly rebound with new flushes of leaves, or at least resprouted from the ground level.

One thing I learned from growing up as the son of a palmophile is that each cold snap was really different. The snow of 1977, the hard freeze (1985?) that followed a long growing period, or one I remember that had high northern winds that was devastating to many different "hardy" things. Microclimates don't work every year in central Florida.

Thanks again Bob.

Brad Young

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Hello all,

To all of you who showed up on Saturday, thank you for coming and I hope you enjoyed both Dad's garden and Dorothy's beautiful lakefront home. That is the place where I caught my first fish (bream on a cane pole sitting in my granddad's lap) and learned how to water ski. It has a special place in my childhood memories.

The Lodoicea was not grown from the seed pictured. That seed was not viable when it was given to my parents. The seed that produced the palm was sent via airmail by Mel Sneed when he visit the Seychelles sometime in the "70s I believe. This could be referenced due to articles Mel wrote about the trip in Principes as the IPS journal was known at the time.

Yes it is very slow and not real happy in the atrium. It is protected during the winter, the leaf damage happened in the past probably due to a lowering ground water table during drought and too little irrigation. I read where Bo gets three fronds a year in that tropical, volcanic soil. We are lucky to get one frond every three years, it has been trying to push the emerging leaf for the past 12 months. Last summer I power washed the algae off the atrium roof so maybe more sun will help.

The garden experienced many freezes from 1961 through 1989. Many different palm species were tried over the years but unfortunately not much has been added since 89. The garden was always an experiment to Dad, he and Dent Smith were good friends and would always compare the results of the latest freeze. He was growing so many new things that the freezes would be looked at as room for more to be planted out. He did tire of the cycle and did begin collecting more cycads because they mostly rebound with new flushes of leaves, or at least resprouted from the ground level.

One thing I learned from growing up as the son of a palmophile is that each cold snap was really different. The snow of 1977, the hard freeze (1985?) that followed a long growing period, or one I remember that had high northern winds that was devastating to many different "hardy" things. Microclimates don't work every year in central Florida.

Thanks again Bob.

Brad Young

Brad,

Thanks for the information on the Lodoicea. I did not know that it had been that slow for you!

I have heard so many comments from people that really enjoyed the day and left very inspired by your Dad's garden - both those that had been there years ago and those that saw it for the first time. Thanks again for all that you did to host us!

Bob

Bob Johnson
Orlando, Florida, USA

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