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SubTropicRay

Cold air headed for Florida midweek

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Walt
Incredibly, the high here yesterday was only 49F !

Yes, that is one thing that hurt us - I was hoping that it would get at least into the mid 50s, giving it further to go to reach 32 after dark.

With a high of 49, freezing was just too close, especially under these conditions.

Well, yesterday's high made little difference in my case. My high was 58 degrees and my low was 28 this morning. Further, Palmdale, 25 miles south of me, hit 62 degrees yesterday and had a low of 22 degrees this morning!

When you are in the low rural inland areas, there's less to hold back the temperature rise during the day and less to hold temperatures up at night. It's semi analogous to the desert, where it gets very hot during the day, yet cold at night.

Archbold Biological Station (10 miles south of me) is like this. It statistically has the highest January average high day temperature, but the lowest nighttime temperatures.

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Bob Johnson
Incredibly, the high here yesterday was only 49F !

Yes, that is one thing that hurt us - I was hoping that it would get at least into the mid 50s, giving it further to go to reach 32 after dark.

With a high of 49, freezing was just too close, especially under these conditions.

Well, yesterday's high made little difference in my case. My high was 58 degrees and my low was 28 this morning. Further, Palmdale, 25 miles south of me, hit 62 degrees yesterday and had a low of 22 degrees this morning!

When you are in the low rural inland areas, there's less to hold back the temperature rise during the day and less to hold temperatures up at night. It's semi analogous to the desert, where it gets very hot during the day, yet cold at night.

Archbold Biological Station (10 miles south of me) is like this. It statistically has the highest January average high day temperature, but the lowest nighttime temperatures.

That makes sense, Walt. You were actually higher and lower than Orlando was yesterday. Your climate there sounds like it is more extreme at both ends of the spectrum - a 30 degree difference in less than one day!

So, do higher daytime temps help at all, anywhere?

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Bob Johnson

Check out these Central Fla temps:

"Since midnight, the NWS recorded lows in the teens and 20s across Central Florida. The coldest place was in Plymouth, near Lake Apopka, where the mercury dipped to a frigid 16 degrees.

Other low temperatures included: 21 degrees in Kenansville, 20 degrees in Okahumpka, 22 degrees in Scottsmoor, 24 degrees in DeLand, 24 degrees in Pierson and Umatilla, 25 degrees in Apopka, and 26 degrees in Lisbon." (from the Orlando Sentinel)

16 degrees . . . Ouch!

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mnorell

I just did a Google street view around Plymouth, Florida. They have (after 16F, I should probably say "had") lots of Queens and roebelenii, I also saw a few Dypsis lutescens, but these are in newer housing tracts. In many older-looking areas it's S. palmetto, oaks, pines, etc.

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tikitiki

Thats what is so strange about Florida. I went over to a friends neighborhood 5 miles from me and half of his neighbors including him had fried palms the others had no problems at all just houses away from each other. My whole neighborhood looks ok though.

Edited by tikitiki

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tikitiki

I has got to help the soil temps at least. I think once a plant cell burst due to the water inside freezing the damage is done no matter how fast it heats up.

So, do higher daytime temps help at all, anywhere?

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happ

It appears West Florida faired a bit better than the East Coast. The data provided & description of frost is very helpful to all U.S. palm growers. Wish Floridans milder conditions tonight. :)

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Cristóbal

yes. dont forget put informations in the palmtalk freeze damage forum. this is very important.

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Walt
Archbold Biological Station in south Highlands County logged 15 degrees, just two degrees shy of their all-time record (on two occassions) of 13 degrees, the last time being Jan. 5, 2001!

Holy crap!!

Isn't Highland Co big Citrus area? That's got to hurt.

Hope your palms are OK Walt.

Thanks. I have some foliage damage on some unprotected king palms, but by and large, after looking at them late this afternoon, they fared pretty well. Of course, things may be different tomorrow. Plus, my local forecast is for lots of frost tonight. Oddly, I had very little frost this morning, and frost is the big foliage destroyer for me, with respect to tender palms.

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ruskinPalms

Sigh.... I registered a low of 27.3F in Ruskin, FL in my backyard 20 feet from pond.... That pond was steaming out like crazy all night and unfortunately may have lead to a little frost formation on palms and plants. That being said, I went out and walked around the front and back yards last night and there really was very little frost formation, I did feel some frosty fronds in the backyard more than the front. I protected nothing. My coconut looks RIP or at least 100% defoliated, it was struggling anyway from the prolonged cool of this winter. And I am expecting at least 100% defoliation if not death of V. arecina, A. alexandrae and Adonidia. Probably will see 75% to 100% defoliation of Roystonea, D. lutescens and W. bifurcata but I am thing that the bigger ones will pull through. Spindles and bottles look great for the most part - these took 29F last year pretty well too. Oh, actually my one triple V. arecina in the front of my house looks like it took very little damage though because it was nicely canopied by a large queen palm. Another cool thing is that a lot of smaller palms including D. lutescens and Adonidia that were under the bigger palms like my Bismarckia and Washingtonia look like they will make it through pretty good, and of course the Bizzies and Washies are fine. T. radiata looks like it will make it fine since it was under canopy even though some of its more exposed fronds are probably history. Schflera got melted up high, just plain old open sky burn rather than frost, same for a F. elastica. Bananas and papayas foliage is melted, actually papayas look no worse than last years freeze at 29F and not all the foliage is melted really. A. cunninghamiana looks pretty good so far even though it had definite frost on the fronds, it will probably see some latent frond damage but the darn things will probably live to see another freeze - we'll wait and see. Mango tree was in flower..dammit..will probably drop leaves but live. Various little Pritchardia thurstonii seedlings around the yard look remarkably fine! These could be a really neat fan palm for central florida if they are able to pull this freeze. All my crotons are absolutely fine which is interesting. Ixora in front is a little burned and Philodendron xanado look only a little burned in the front - these both are completely exposed. More tropical hibiscus will be defoliated, but others look fine. Well - I have a lot of other plants I could comment on but there is no point in doing so since the damage will present itself more and more over the next couple of weeks to months. May see a light freeze and frost again tonight which will not help at all. Thankfully the previous night did not freeze so it will only be 2 nights of freeze instead of 3. I am questioning if it really went down to 27F in my yard last night because as of right now it doesn't look like 27F damage - but the closest FAWN station in Balm which is about 10 to the northeast and inland from me registered about 23.5F as a low so 27F in my yard is pretty damn plausible... I really don't trust a lot of the PWS's in my area - everything in Apollo Beach and Sun City Center registered around 30F for a low. So who really knows. Unfortunately, I think my station is pretty accurate...

  • Upvote 2

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junglegalfla

Looks like I dodged a bullet. Nothing looks out of the oridinary for this time of year. Aroids and banana leaves look fine too. Phew :o

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Walt

I guess many Floridians can pitch the latest USDA hardiness zone map. The proof is in the pudding:

On Thursday morning January 22, 2009 the temperature dropped as low as 18 deg. F at Tallahassee in the north, 15 deg. F at Archbold central and 23 deg. F at Palmdale in the south.

Many areas saw their lowest minimum temperature since the winter of 2000-2001, other areas the coldest since 1996-1997.

As follows are selected minimum temperatures across the state this morning.

North-

Tallahassee AP- 18

NWS COOP Tallahassee- 18

Jacksonville Cecil AP- 18

Keystone Heights- 18

CWOP #KI4ZBO Lake City- 19

FAWN Live Oak- 19

Cross City AP- 19

NWS COOP Jasper- 19

NWS COOP Cross City- 19

NWS COOP Glen St. Mary- 20

FAWN Alachua- 20

FAWN MacClenny- 20

USFS RAWS Sandborn- 20

CWOP #7748 High Springs- 20

USFS RAWS Olustee- 20

USFS RAWS Eddy Tower- 20

CWOP CW1450 Trenton- 20

Crestview AP- 21

USFS RAWS Bloxham- 21

Perry AP- 21

CWOP #9628 Palm Coast- 20

NWS COOP Chipley- 21

Gainesville AP- 21

NWS COOP Quincy- 21

Jacksonville AP-22

Marianna AP- 22

FAWN Quincy- 22

FAWN Jay- 23

USFS RAWS Wilma- 23

NWS COOP Orange Springs- 23

CWOP #3965 Milton- 25

CWOP #W4RLR Crestview- 25

Pensacola NAS- 27

St. Augustine AP- 27

Pensacola AP- 29

Central-

NWS COOP Archbold- 15

KN4LF-3 Nobleton East- 15

FAWN Brooksville- 16

NWS COOP Mount Plymouth- 16

CWOP #1327 Holder- 17

CWOP #DW0011 Bushnell- 18

KE4HJ Lady Lake- 18

CWOP #DW1496 Citrus Springs- 19

Beverly Hills- 19

CWOP #DW2188 Spring Hill- 19

USFS RAWS Central- 20

CWOP #6582 Lakeland- 20

CWOP #KF4ORW-2 Dade City- 20

Brooksville AP- 20

Ocala Shady AP- 20

FAWN Okahumpka- 20

Ocala AP- 21

CWOP #DW0473 Hudson- 21

FAWN Kenansville- 21

CWOP #CW7784 Sorrento- 22

USFS RAWS Archbold- 22

NWS COOP Scottsmoor- 22

CWOP #CW4013 Plant City- 22

CWOP #3502 Valrico- 22

CWOP #KN4LF-2- Lakeland- 22

CWOP #WC4PEM-9 Polk City- 22

CWOP # CW3266 Zolfo Springs- 23

CWOP #WX4DAN Valrico- 23

K4TR Brooksville- 23

CWOP DW1061 Odessa- 23

CWOP #CW4224 Lutz- 24

FAWN Citra- 24

FAWN Umatilla- 24

NWS COOP Deland- 24

FAWN Apopka- 25

FAWN- Okahumpka- 25

FAWN Ona- 25

Tampa Vandenberg AP- 25

Daytona Beach Intl AP- 26

USFS RAWS Merritt Island- 26

USAF Cape Canaveral- 26

FAWN Arcadia- 26

CWOP #KI4EFL-2 Lakeland- 26

CWOP #KN4LF-1 Lakeland- 26

FAWN Dover- 27

Lakeland AP- 27

Bartow AP- 27

CWOP #W4CLL Plant City- 27

NWS COOP Orlando East- 27

Leesburg AP- 27

Kissimmee AP- 27

Melbourne Intl AP- 28

CWOP #DW1717 Dade City- 28

FAWN Balm- 28

Sanford AP-28

Plant City AP- 28

K4UCQ Balm- 29

Orlando Intl AP- 29

NWS COOP St. Leo University- 29

CWOP #CW5072 Palm Harbor- 29

CWOP #CW2932 Oldsmar- 29

FAWN Avalon- 30

NWS COOP Clermont- 30

NASA Titusville- 30

Vero Beach AP- 30

Winter Haven AP- 30

CWOP #N4GD Pinellas Park- 31

NWS Tampa Bay Ruskin- 32

Titusville AP- 32

Orlando Executive AP- 32

FAWN Sebring- 32

Tampa Intl AP-34

Tampa Peter O'Knight AP- 34

St. Petersburg- Clearwater AP- 35

South-

FAWN Palmdale- 23

CWOP #7827 Venus- 24

Punta Gorda AP- 26

FAWN Immokalee- 27

Fort Pierce ARC- 28

Fort Pierce AP- 28

USFS RAWS Panther West- 27

CWOP #DW1790 Lehigh Acres (E. Ft. Myers)- 27

NWS COOP Labelle- 27

NWS COOP Ortona- 27

FAWN Belle Glade- 28

CWOP #DW0986 Palm City- 28

FAWN North Port- 28

NWS COOP Okeechobee- 29

FAWN Clewiston- 29

NWS COOP Big Cypress (Everglades)- 29

NWS COOP Devils Garden (Everglades)- 29

NWS COOP Clewiston- 29

NWS COOP Moore Haven- 30

CWOP #K4JHI Okeechobee- 30

USFS RAWS Cache (Dade Co W)- 30

FAWN Ft. Pierce- 31

Kendall (SW Miami) AP- 31

NWS COOP South Bay- 31

CWOP #KC8NZJ-1 Port St. Lucie- 31

SFWMD S140W (Broward Co W)- 32

NWS COOP Marco Island- 33

Naples AP- 34

Homestead AP- 35

FAWN Homestead- 35

West Palm Beach AP- 35

Homestead AFB- 37

Fort Lauderdale Exec AP- 38

Fort Lauderdale Intl AP- 39

Homestead AP- 39

FAWN Fort Lauderdale- 40

Fort Lauderdale AP- 41

Miami Intl AP- 43

Keys-

CWOP #CW0924 Ramrod Key- 43

Marathon AP- 49

Key West Intl AP- 50

Key West NAS- 50

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ruskinPalms

OK Walt, what gives. You have the NWS in Ruskin reporting 32F....The NWS is only about a mile and half inland and NE from me - and I am pretty sure my community is at about 10 to 20 feet higher elevation than the land the NWS sits on. Also the NWS is a treeless, canopyless field not near any kind of water. Why is my yard, on a pond no less, so much colder than EVERY other station in my area?? Anyone have a guess?

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aricle
My coconut looks RIP or at least 100% defoliated, it was struggling anyway from the prolonged cool of this winter.

Same here... I've had three in the ground for a few years and had some great growth this past year, but all three are toast. Everything was too large to cover. One of my Roystonea's has 5 feet of trunk and doesn't look bad at all. It did really well last year too under the same conditions. I hope you don't have much damage with yours.

I hate the winter. :angry:

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Jimbean

32F Here in Rockledge, and 28F in Port St. John.

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tikitiki

I have 6 in the ground they all look fine two look perfect. About 6 miles from me there is a yard that has about 6 as well all with 3 foot of wood and fruit. All 6 are fried bad. I hope I mine make it through tonight.

My coconut looks RIP or at least 100% defoliated, it was struggling anyway from the prolonged cool of this winter.

Same here... I've had three in the ground for a few years and had some great growth this past year, but all three are toast. Everything was too large to cover. One of my Roystonea's has 5 feet of trunk and doesn't look bad at all. It did really well last year too under the same conditions. I hope you don't have much damage with yours.

I hate the winter. :angry:

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koolthing78
I guess many Floridians can pitch the latest USDA hardiness zone map. The proof is in the pudding:

On Thursday morning January 22, 2009 the temperature dropped as low as 18 deg. F at Tallahassee in the north, 15 deg. F at Archbold central and 23 deg. F at Palmdale in the south.

Many areas saw their lowest minimum temperature since the winter of 2000-2001, other areas the coldest since 1996-1997.

As follows are selected minimum temperatures across the state this morning.

Maybe I'm just trying to be optimistic (and in no way trying to start a climate change debate--I really have no idea whether it's happening or not), but who's to say this actually *wasn't* an 80's-style freeze, and maybe due to climate change the temperatures just weren't as low? USDA climate zones are based on average yearly minimums, and in big freeze events that only happen every decade or 2, a place that is legitimately 10a (like St. Pete) could hit 24 or so, and still keep its distinction, because that sort of event is just so rare. So maybe climate is changing, and this is the "new" devastating freeze. Of course, we could also be heading into an ice age, and each winter will continue to just get worse and worse until we're all planting windmill palms. But I like the first possibility better.

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koolthing78

Ruskin Palms, I am so sorry to hear about your palms & other tropicals. From an unselfish standpoint, I feel for the amount of work you've put in, and the frustration of living so close to other areas that seemingly fared better (not to mention Tikitiki rubbing his unscathed coconuts in your face (j/k tiki!)). From a more self-centered standpoint, it's disappointing to hear all the damage at 27 degrees--I know that's low, but with the constant thought of experiencing those kinds of temps as a possibility, I was hoping some of those things would have surprised with their resiliency. Fortunately, when the scheffleras were defoliated here in 2003 (probably the last time you hit 27), it was purely cosmetic, and they started putting out the cutest tiny leaves almost immediately. Hopefully that coconut pulls through!

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SubTropicRay
I hate the winter.

Ditto baby, ditto.

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bubba

From the limited information I have,I believe South Florida missed a huge bullet.Those are some incredibly low temperatures Walt posted for Central Florida but nothing to rival 1989.Out in the Glades,some of the areas I am familiar with, pulled through with no damage to Winter corn.The cane actually likes cooler weather and even a short freeze increases substantially the amount of sucrose.

It is very disheartening to hear about edge testers, who suffer damage to sensitive Tropicals.The good news is you can replant and have new ones quickly in the Tropical Savanah.

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ruskinPalms

Hi Eric, thanks for wishing me well. Provided I don't have another freeze this year, I think at least 75% of my garden will recover, 100% recovered from a 29F advective freeze from a year ago. I am trying to look at the positive things that can be gleaned from all this. For some reason, Hyophorbes have just been plain tougher than advertised for me. Cold hardy palms like Bismarckia, Washingtonia and Syagrus make really great canopy palms that really do seem to work, at least to save some D. lustescens and Hyophorbes planted under them. Wodyetia is probably a little tougher than advertised too, as long as they are larger and trunking since I have seen them survive 25F in Brandon FL, a place that hits mid 20's EVERY year consistently. Also, A. cunninghamiana really does seem to be tougher than other Archontophoenix species, at least for me, and might be a truly viable option for a taller crown shafted palm that can be grown consistently in true 9B areas for 10 to 20 years at a time - between the historic freezes. And larger Roystonea still do seem to be pretty tough in 9B areas. I expect my larger Royal to make a full recovery, the seedling I had planted out looks a bit more trashed though. I went out and pulled on spears of all my palms I could reach and squeezed lots of crowns. I know it is VERY early in the game, but everything seems rock solid (though not frozen hahaha, it was already up to about 60F by then). One tropical that I didn't mention earlier that surprising seems ok is Plumeria, no mushy stems, unlike last year right after the advective freeze when several stems were black and mushed. I am actually very curious to see what makes it because this was a rather HARD freeze, at least for me; and I will replant with the palms that are successful to acheive the overall tropical look that I desire. I think there will be some interesting successes to come out of this.

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Davidl

You are right about the zone map Walt. The temp for clewiston was strange because they was around 37 and I had 31 here which was close to the reading you posted. The frost was bad in most places away from town.

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SubTropicRay

Not much consolation but if we had been growing palms on these very dates in 1985, we would all likely have given up palms altogether and started growing evergreens. Here are some numbers for perspective.

RECORDS FOR JANUARY 21:

RECORD LOWS

LOCATION FOR JAN 21

ARCADIA :ARCF1 20 IN 1971

ARCHBOLD :ACHF1 23 IN 1977

AVON PARK 2 W :AVPF1 21 IN 1985

BARTOW :BARF1 22 IN 1985

BROOKSVILLE CHIN HILL :BROF1 *13 IN 1985

BUSHNELL 2 E :BSHF1 *12 IN 1985

CHIEFLAND 5 SE :CHIF1 10 IN 1985

FORT MYERS/PAGE FIELD :FMY 32 IN 1985

& 1971

INVERNESS 3 SE :INVF1 *15 IN 1985

MOUNTAIN LAKE :LWLF1 17 IN 1985

LAKELAND LINDER FIELD :LLDF1 *20 IN 1985

MYAKKA RIVER STATE PARK :MKCF1 22 IN 1971

PARRISH :PARF1 24 IN 1971

PLANT CITY :PLCF1 21 IN 1985

PUNTA GORDA 4 ESE :PNTF1 27 IN 1985

& 1971

SARASOTA-BRADENTON :SRQ *23 IN 1971

ST LEO :STLF1 *18 IN 1985

ST PETE/ALBERT WHITTED :SPG *27 IN 1985

TAMPA INTERNATIONAL APT :TPA *21 IN 1985

TARPON SPRINGS :TRPF1 22 IN 1985

VENICE :VNCF1 27 IN 1985

& 1971

WAUCHULA 2 N :WAUF1 22 IN 1971

WEEKI WACHEE :WEEF1 17 IN 1985

WINTER HAVEN :WHNF1 *19 IN 1985

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SubTropicRay

More info from NWS.

PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT

NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE MIAMI FL

440 PM EST WED JAN 21 2009

...COLDEST MAXIMUM DAILY TEMPERATURES IN SIX YEARS OVER MUCH OF

SOUTH FLORIDA...

DESPITE FULL SUNSHINE, HIGH TEMPERATURES ACROSS SOUTH FLORIDA TODAY

ONLY REACHED THE MID TO UPPER 50S AS A RESULT OF THE MODIFIED ARCTIC

AIRMASS FIRMLY ENTRENCHED ACROSS THE REGION. SOME OF THESE

TEMPERATURES WERE THE COLDEST DAILY MAXIMUM TEMPERATURE READINGS

OBSERVED SINCE JANUARY 2003.

HERE ARE TODAY`S HIGH TEMPERATURES AT THE FOUR PRIMARY OBSERVATIONS

SITES ALONG WITH THE LAST DATE THESE READINGS WERE AS COLD OR COLDER:

MIAMI INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT: 57 DEGREES, COLDEST SINCE JANUARY 18,

2003 (55 DEGREES).

FORT LAUDERDALE INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT: 58 DEGREES, COLDEST SINCE

FEBRUARY 13, 2006 (58 DEGREES).

PALM BEACH INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT: 56 DEGREES, COLDEST SINCE JANUARY

24, 2003 (50 DEGREES).

NAPLES REGIONAL AIRPORT: 56 DEGREES, COLDEST SINCE JANUARY 24, 2003

(56 DEGREES).

PALM BEACH AND NAPLES AIRPORTS BOTH SET DAILY RECORD LOW MAXIMUM

TEMPERATURE READINGS, WITH MIAMI AND FORT LAUDERDALE FALLING JUST

SHORT OF THEIR DAILY RECORDS.

THE AVERAGE HIGH TEMPERATURE IN SOUTH FLORIDA THIS TIME OF YEAR IS

IN THE MID 70S.

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SubTropicRay

More

PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT

NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE MIAMI FL

1150 AM EST THU JAN 22 2009

...FREEZING TEMPERATURES OVER A LARGE PART OF SOUTH FLORIDA EARLY

THIS MORNING...

EARLY THIS MORNING, LOW TEMPERATURES PLUMMETED TO BELOW FREEZING

OVER MOST OF THE INTERIOR SECTIONS OF SOUTH FLORIDA. IN FACT, A HARD

FREEZE OCCURRED OVER SOME NORTHERN INTERIOR LOCATIONS. READINGS WERE

IN THE MID TO UPPER 20S FROM PARTS OF GLADES COUNTY SOUTH ACROSS

MOST OF HENDRY COUNTY INTO INTERIOR SECTIONS OF COLLIER COUNTY.

WESTERN PALM BEACH COUNTY IN THE BELLE GLADE AREA ALSO SAW LOWS IN

THE MID TO UPPER 20S.

FARTHER SOUTH, TEMPERATURES ALSO MANAGED TO REACH THE FREEZING MARK.

LOWS BETWEEN 30 AND 32 WERE REGISTERED AS FAR SOUTH AS TAMIAMI TRAIL

IN COLLIER COUNTY, AND IN THE FAR WESTERN SUBURBS OF PALM BEACH,

BROWARD AND MIAMI-DADE COUNTIES.

HERE ARE SOME SELECT LOW TEMPERATURES FROM INTERIOR SOUTH FLORIDA

(UNOFFICIAL READINGS INDICATED BY *):

GLADES COUNTY

PALMDALE: 23 (22 RECORDED AT 2 FT ELEVATION)*

ORTONA: 27

MOORE HAVEN: 30

HENDRY COUNTY:

LABELLE: 27

DEVILS GARDEN: 29

BIG CYPRESS: 29

AIRGLADES AIRPORT: 30 (29 RECORDED AT 2 FT ELEVATION)*

CLEWISTON: 30 *

INLAND COLLIER COUNTY:

IMMOKALEE: 27 (25 RECORDED AT 2 FT ELEVATION)*

GOLDEN GATE ESTATES: 27 *

BIG CORKSCREW: 31 *

GOLDEN GATE: 32 *

INLAND AND WESTERN PALM BEACH COUNTY:

BELLE GLADE: 28 (26 RECORDED AT 2 FT ELEVATION)*

SOUTH BAY: 31

THE ACREAGE: 31 *

JUPITER FARMS: 31 *

LOXAHATCHEE: 31 *

WELLINGTON: 34 *

INLAND BROWARD

ALLIGATOR ALLEY NEAR COLLIER COUNTY LINE: 32 *

CORAL SPRINGS: 31 *

WESTON: 36

SOUTHWEST RANCHES: 35 *

INLAND MIAMI-DADE:

TAMIAMI AIRPORT: 31

THE REDLAND: 32 (30 AT 2 FT ELEVATION) *

HOMESTEAD: 35 (33 AT 2 FT ELEVATION) *

OVER METRO AREAS, LOW TEMPERATURES WERE MOSTLY IN THE MID 30S TO

LOWER 40S. NAPLES GOT DOWN TO 34, WITH MARCO ISLAND REGISTERING A

NEAR-FREEZING 33. OVER ON THE EAST COAST, LOWS RANGED FROM 35 AT

WEST PALM BEACH TO 43 AT MIAMI INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT, WITH MOST

EASTERN METRO LOCATIONS IN THE MID 30S TO AROUND 40. A NOTABLE

EXCEPTION TO THIS WAS IN CORAL SPRINGS WHERE AN UNOFFICIAL

TEMPERATURE OF 31 WAS RECORDED.

AREAS OF FROST WERE COMMON OVER INTERIOR AND WESTERN LOCATIONS, WITH

PATCHY FROST ON ROOFTOPS AND ON THE TOPS OF CARS OBSERVED IN METRO

SOUTHEAST FLORIDA. THE FULL EXTENT OF CROP DAMAGE FROM THE FREEZING

TEMPERATURES WILL NOT BE KNOWN FOR A FEW DAYS, BUT THE TEMPERATURES

OBSERVED THIS MORNING ARE CAPABLE OF DAMAGING CROPS, ESPECIALLY IN

AREAS THAT DROPPED INTO THE 20S.

COLD TEMPERATURES WILL CONTINUE TONIGHT, ALTHOUGH NOT AS COLD AS

THIS MORNING.

FOR A FULL LISTING OF OBSERVED LOW TEMPERATURES, GO TO THE REGIONAL

TEMPERATURE AND PRECIPITATION SUMMARY UNDER HEADER ASUS62 KMFL.

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BS Man about Palms
See? Told you so.

Does that mean your sending the halogens? :lol:

wait a sec, what kind of halogens? I have those super bright double halogen things on a tripod, like a work lamp thing... Do those put out a big enough amount of heat to affect temp under the tarp?

805673011311md.jpg

Yep, I just set them on the floor. (Heat rises, so take that thing apart, you can you know) On the nights in my greenhouse "without them on", its usually 3 degrees higher than outside or so. When on, its usually 6 degrees or so higher. There are better ways to heat, but for a quick simple solution, they are hard to beat. Also, based on what I remember of your area, you would need 4-6 lights (4-500 or 6-250?)

Good luck again folks,

Bill

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SubTropicRay

INLAND BROWARD

ALLIGATOR ALLEY NEAR COLLIER COUNTY LINE: 32 *

CORAL SPRINGS: 31 *

WESTON: 36

SOUTHWEST RANCHES: 35 *

Jeff Searle was this your low temp??

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phatmiata

underground weather, and BayNews9 both had my area at 27F, but i was reading avg of 30F all night long. No frost that i could see, dog and cat water bowls did not freeze, and pretty much everything that was under the granddaddy oaks looks like it had minimal damage. The only open area in the backyard i have is where my bananas, papayas are planted, they are toasty, but other than that everything looks okay. I think the oaks REALLY helped me bigtime becasue just down the road my neighbors with grass lawns now have frosty lawns, roofs, cars, etc. :mrlooney:

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Walt
OK Walt, what gives. You have the NWS in Ruskin reporting 32F....The NWS is only about a mile and half inland and NE from me - and I am pretty sure my community is at about 10 to 20 feet higher elevation than the land the NWS sits on. Also the NWS is a treeless, canopyless field not near any kind of water. Why is my yard, on a pond no less, so much colder than EVERY other station in my area?? Anyone have a guess?

Don't feel so glum because it was colder at my place! I had three thermometers out last night (not counting one digital sensor placed in the wrapping around the trunk of my coconut palm. I wanted to know what the temperature was at all times during the night up close to the growth bud).

Of my two digitals, both under tree canopy, I recorded 28.0F and 28.2F!!!!! But further, I had one Halsey-Taylor hi-lo mercury thermometer place between two triangle palm petioles. The thermometer was exposed to the direct sky. This thermometer recorded just over 23 degrees! That may have been a somewhat false reading, due to that placement of the thermometer. In any event, I believe my open yard was close to 25 degrees. Some of my P. sellums were hurt, mainly those bordering the north side of my property, which is always the coldest.

That being said, my buddy recorded a low of 34.3F 500 feet from the eastern shore of lake June. Even the lakes had a hard time keeping up the temperature last night but at least it stayed above freezing. I must go into town tomorrow and take a look-see at critical plants (E.G. bananas, papayas, and some coconut palms) to see if they got burned or freeze damaged. Usually, it's 5-8 degrees warmer in town (at 70 higher elevation than my place) on radiational cooling nights. While I don't know officially, because there's no recording station for Lake Placid, the plants will tell me if there was a freeze/frost or not.

For most of the day my king palms looked okay, but around sunset I could see they were foliaged damaged, some more than others. The leaves started to curl and they looked darker on some palms, but not all. My majesty palms seemed to have done alright, as no damage was aparent by sunset.

My Sheffler tree will defoilate, as the leaves were blackened. My travler's palm leaves are showing some damage on the lowest fronds.

What's strange to me is my Ficus microcarpa tree is showing leaf damage but my two Ficus lyrata trees are not, and they should be less cold hardy.

I suspect there will be more damage tomorrow.

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popper1

Walt-

Be sure to let us know how the Spathodea you mentioned in the other post made out. I saw 30 here with plentiful frost. Both my Spathodea made it OK as they were protected by a large tree so no frost on them. My yellow is getting ready to flower, I hope the buds stay intact.

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surgeon83

34 isn't so bad, Ray. I got 30.7. That's right. at 11pm when I was frantically trying to protect a few palms, I read 34.0 and I already had a solid sheet of ICE over the water collected in my sailboat. That was at 11pm already. Heavy frost on EVERYTHING this morning. I don't doubt MacDill's historic readings a bit after the last few nights- I am totally convinced that the AFB and myself have the lowest readings in the area because we are a cold sink due to low elevation. Not a good combination at all. If only a double negative would mean positive in this case. Everything in my area was totally white, but just a couple of miles north, nothing. You have a much better place. I doubt I will get any meaningful offers, but I am actually going to put my house for sale by owner in the hopes of moving north to a better microclimate, higher elevation, and closer to work. I figure I have nothing to lose except perhaps getting insulted by ridiculously low offers.

Hard to assess damage just yet, but I will keep everyone apprised.

I have never had a freeze since starting with palms, except a brief 32 in 2004 in Galveston when all I had was a queen and 3 sagos. And I wasn't there to witness it.

I'm glad not everyone got so totally screwed last night. Hope everyone's palms pull through OK

-Brian

34F here at 7AM but the ice train was everywhere overnight including St. Pete. St. Pete was in the upper 30's to near 40F and the frost was widespread.

Tampa's airport temps have warmed over the years. Either that or the jet exhaust is around at the exact moment the temp readings are taken. The low at the airport was 36F.

Start planting some oaks Larry.

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ron@springhammock

My temps bottomed out at 26F, though only briefly. I'm usually only one or two degrees colder than Orlando, but last night fortunes weren't with me and I was a good 5 degrees colder. After getting home from work this evening, the stench of the carnage was obvious. Many plants suffered, but fortunately, it doesn't look like there is a lot of fatal damage. I thought this was supposed to be a convectional freeze, but damage looks more like a radiational freeze, with stuff in the open badly damaged and protected plants barely harmed.

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Walt
Walt-

Be sure to let us know how the Spathodea you mentioned in the other post made out. I saw 30 here with plentiful frost. Both my Spathodea made it OK as they were protected by a large tree so no frost on them. My yellow is getting ready to flower, I hope the buds stay intact.

David: Thanks for reminding me of the African tulip. Yes, I will definitely check that tree to see if the cold affected it.

Walt

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_Keith

I am still kind of in shock as to how cold you guys got, especially down in the south. At least it looks like you will now get to enjoy a week of beautiful spring weather.

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ruskinPalms

I guess I should have added that it did not drop below 32F until a little after 1230 AM on my weather station, I'm not sure when it actually got back above 32F in my yard because the computer I have it hooked up to is not working right but I am thinking the warmup was rapid this morning. The the closest FAWN station to me in Balm was at 23.6F at 6:00 AM and had jumped to 33.1F by 8:15 AM, broke 60F by 2:30 PM and topped out at 64.4 at 5:00 PM - a swing in temperatures of over 40 degrees F in a little over 12 hours! It was probably below freezing for about 8 hours in my yard, could have been worse I guess....... And by the way, I am citing 2 foot temps from the Balm station, the 6 foot temps were a couple degrees warmer but big deal. The vast majority of may palms and tropical decorative plants occupy the 1 to 3 foot height range so I do look at the lower level temps a lot. The 27.3 F in my yard was measured at about 4.5 feet, just FYI. So hell, it may have been 27.8F at 6 feet in my yard - yippee!!!

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epicure3
Hi Eric, thanks for wishing me well. Provided I don't have another freeze this year, I think at least 75% of my garden will recover, 100% recovered from a 29F advective freeze from a year ago. I am trying to look at the positive things that can be gleaned from all this. For some reason, Hyophorbes have just been plain tougher than advertised for me. Cold hardy palms like Bismarckia, Washingtonia and Syagrus make really great canopy palms that really do seem to work, at least to save some D. lustescens and Hyophorbes planted under them. Wodyetia is probably a little tougher than advertised too, as long as they are larger and trunking since I have seen them survive 25F in Brandon FL, a place that hits mid 20's EVERY year consistently. Also, A. cunninghamiana really does seem to be tougher than other Archontophoenix species, at least for me, and might be a truly viable option for a taller crown shafted palm that can be grown consistently in true 9B areas for 10 to 20 years at a time - between the historic freezes. And larger Roystonea still do seem to be pretty tough in 9B areas. I expect my larger Royal to make a full recovery, the seedling I had planted out looks a bit more trashed though. I went out and pulled on spears of all my palms I could reach and squeezed lots of crowns. I know it is VERY early in the game, but everything seems rock solid (though not frozen hahaha, it was already up to about 60F by then). One tropical that I didn't mention earlier that surprising seems ok is Plumeria, no mushy stems, unlike last year right after the advective freeze when several stems were black and mushed. I am actually very curious to see what makes it because this was a rather HARD freeze, at least for me; and I will replant with the palms that are successful to acheive the overall tropical look that I desire. I think there will be some interesting successes to come out of this.

Bill, I'm still trying to figure out how you seemed to fare worse than others in the Bay area. I see that Ruskin is very close to the Gulf. Are you in a cold pocket of some sort or are you just growing more tender species than others reporting here? Spring will be here soon. Actually, for Fla, probably Friday. :lol:

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Walt

The depth of cold air was deep yesterday morning, much deeper than what is more typical of radiational freezes for me.

In 2006 I had a 27 degree low and my large Ficus altissima was mostly defoliated up to about the 15 feet level. By 18 ft the defoliation had stopped. Same goes for pothos vines. I have these vines growing up many tree trunks. They make good indicators to show when the air temperature drops below about 30 degrees.

My pothos vines were damaged up to about the 15 feet level during the above freeze. However, yesterday my pothos vines were damaged up to about the 30 feet level.

As I write this (at 4:08 A.M. EST) my temperature is about two degrees higher than yesterday morning.

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SunnyFl
PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT

NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE MIAMI FL

1150 AM EST THU JAN 22 2009

...FREEZING TEMPERATURES OVER A LARGE PART OF SOUTH FLORIDA EARLY

THIS MORNING...

EARLY THIS MORNING, LOW TEMPERATURES PLUMMETED TO BELOW FREEZING

OVER MOST OF THE INTERIOR SECTIONS OF SOUTH FLORIDA. IN FACT, A HARD

FREEZE OCCURRED OVER SOME NORTHERN INTERIOR LOCATIONS. READINGS WERE

IN THE MID TO UPPER 20S FROM PARTS OF GLADES COUNTY SOUTH ACROSS

MOST OF HENDRY COUNTY INTO INTERIOR SECTIONS OF COLLIER COUNTY...

good. lord. Collier County??? I am feeling very blessed. Because whatever happened out there, it wasn't anything like that! At worst we still didn't go below 32.

Walt said:

I guess many Floridians can pitch the latest USDA hardiness zone map. The proof is in the pudding

I totally agree. I do think we'll be able to hang onto Z 10 though - barely - with most stations nearest me recording lows of 35 -37. We're about the same as St. Pete/Clw airport, and since I don't have a precise thermometer, those are the best ways for us to figure out our temp.

This is what I don't understand - maybe someone can explain? Both mornings, we had some ice on windshields. A dusting of frost in small exposed areas in the front yard, none in the back yard. Did not see frost on plants. Saucers of water on the deck, and water in the birdbath didn't freeze. Car thermom, which is fairly accurate when not in full sun, showed a low of 37, with the nearest station to me, at a similar elevation and exposure, also reporting a low of 37. So - is it possible to have temps above 32F, and still have ice on windshields?

Ray posted that Southwest Ranches dropped to 35. Our lows during cold events are similar to theirs - during the last bad cold event (2001 or 2003, can't recall), we compared our temps with them, and our low was the same as theirs. This makes sense - they have the advantage of lattitude, but are well inland. OTOH Pinellas is surrounded by water, and our elevation is higher than most of the county.

What I'm waiting to find out is, how did our bottle, our spindle, and my beloved 2-trunked lutescens (from a $1.00 throwaway at Lowe's!) fare these past two nights? I got home after dark yesterday so couldn't tell. My husband also got home after dark but checked them and thought they were okay. Hibiscuses didn't defoliate, and crotons & cordylines seemed fine (hard to see in the dark tho).

Btw - I checked NWS analysis of how cold it actually got. They had Archbold at 15 - a record-breaker! But here in St. Pete, there is no way this was anything like the freezes of the '80's.

A positive note: the coming days are forecast to be much warmer. For those of us who may have gotten thru this unscathed, take heart: January is drawing to a close, and if we get through this one, we may be all right. Or we can hope....

winter - bleah! just plain hate it.

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bubba

Jan. 23,2009-West Palm Airport-Low-46F;Beach-Low-52F

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Davidl

Well last night was not as bad as the night before it will bottom out somewhere around 40 even though Noaa says 36 which is hard to understand when if you blink you will miss Moore Haven all together :) I don't put much faith in the Noaa site when it comes to predicting my area maybe because they are getting faulty data I am not sure but the weather channel gets is closer almost every time.

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