"Winter-Protection" (not for the average person)

[BobbyinNY 7]

Bobby, about the palms that you're growing in containers - how long have they been potted up?  You know I totally admire how you've created a tropical oasis up north - it's amazing.  That has to be the showpiece of the neighborhood.  Love seeing the pics of your set-up.

I have a question - when you set up a container for a palm - or other tropical - for long-term use, how do you prepare it?  What medium do you use - and what about drainage?   Hope you don't mind all the ??s - I have some tropicals I'd like to keep in containers, and I want to do it right

Hi there Sunny... you can ask all the questions you like  

While I'm no "expert" on palm-potting I find that just keeping them in a container where they're mildly restricted works best for me - don't go too big. Let the palm outgrow the container. I use regular Miracle-Grow potting mix and I mix in about 20% perlite for extra drainage - that's the key.. I drill lots of holes in the bottom of the pots for extra drainage and I only water them when they're almost dry - then I soak them and wait for them to dry again. During the spring/summer/early fall when they're outdoors in the baking sun I don't have as much control over their watering due to rain - so this is mostly when they're inside. Now also the palms that I actually grow INDOORS (like inside my house) are treated totally different than the palms that I keep outside in the greenhouse. Indoor palms get do not get anywhere near the amount of sunlight and the conditions are much dryer so I don't water as much indoors - just mist the leaves more frequently.

[BobbyinNY 7]

Bobby, about the palms that you're growing in containers - how long have they been potted up?  You know I totally admire how you've created a tropical oasis up north - it's amazing.  That has to be the showpiece of the neighborhood.  Love seeing the pics of your set-up.

I have a question - when you set up a container for a palm - or other tropical - for long-term use, how do you prepare it?  What medium do you use - and what about drainage?   Hope you don't mind all the ??s - I have some tropicals I'd like to keep in containers, and I want to do it right.

Hi there Sunny... you can ask all the questions you like  

While I'm no "expert" on palm-potting I find that just keeping them in a container where they're mildly restricted works best for me - don't go too big. Let the palm outgrow the container. I use regular Miracle-Grow potting mix and I mix in about 20% perlite for extra drainage - that's the key.. I drill lots of holes in the bottom of the pots for extra drainage and I only water them when they're almost dry - then I soak them and wait for them to dry again. During the spring/summer/early fall when they're outdoors in the baking sun I don't have as much control over their watering due to rain - so this is mostly when they're inside. Now also the palms that I actually grow INDOORS (like inside my house) are treated totally different than the palms that I keep outside in the greenhouse. Indoor palms get do not get anywhere near the amount of sunlight and the conditions are much dryer so I don't water as much indoors - just mist the leaves more frequently.

[BobbyinNY 7]

Bobby, about the palms that you're growing in containers - how long have they been potted up?  You know I totally admire how you've created a tropical oasis up north - it's amazing.  That has to be the showpiece of the neighborhood.  Love seeing the pics of your set-up.

I have a question - when you set up a container for a palm - or other tropical - for long-term use, how do you prepare it?  What medium do you use - and what about drainage?   Hope you don't mind all the ??s - I have some tropicals I'd like to keep in containers, and I want to do it right.

Hi there Sunny... you can ask all the questions you like  

While I'm no "expert" on palm-potting I find that just keeping them in a container where they're mildly restricted works best for me - don't go too big. Let the palm outgrow the container. I use regular Miracle-Grow potting mix and I mix in about 20% perlite for extra drainage - that's the key.. I drill lots of holes in the bottom of the pots for extra drainage and I only water them when they're almost dry - then I soak them and wait for them to dry again. During the spring/summer/early fall when they're outdoors in the baking sun I don't have as much control over their watering due to rain - so this is mostly when they're inside. Now also the palms that I actually grow INDOORS (like inside my house) are treated totally different than the palms that I keep outside in the greenhouse. Indoor palms get do not get anywhere near the amount of sunlight and the conditions are much dryer so I don't water as much indoors - just mist the leaves more frequently.

[BobbyinNY 7]

oops... how did that thing post so many times ..

[SunnyFl 9]

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 20 2006,09:28)

QUOTE

Let the palm outgrow the container. I use regular Miracle-Grow potting mix and I mix in about 20% perlite for extra drainage - that's the key.. I drill lots of holes in the bottom of the pots for extra drainage and I only water them when they're almost dry

Thanks for all the info - so, I'm on the right track with the Miracle-Gro potting mix, but I'd been adding sand.  So I should switch to perlite.   I do drill the holes in the bottom of the container, but I'd been trying to improve drainage with a layer of lava rock at the base.  Is this a bad idea?

Really like the poly-tunnels for cold-protection - do you use a heater that you can leave unattended?

[GREENHAND 12]

hey bobby , nice construction, how many circuts do you have for outside power, most of those space heaters draw around 15 amps , that is almost all of a 20 amp circut, my outside power is on a ground fault that is also on my bathroom plugs, if my greenhouse heater was on and my wife used the blow dryer it would kick the breaker, i had to add another circut and it is ok now. it would proberly  kick a 20 amp breaker if you try to run two space heaters, but you could run a cord from some other place like the garage or somewere near. it looks like you got it under controll and are ready for the cold.!!

[BobbyinNY 7]

hey bobby , nice construction, how many circuts do you have for outside power, most of those space heaters draw around 15 amps , that is almost all of a 20 amp circut, my outside power is on a ground fault that is also on my bathroom plugs, if my greenhouse heater was on and my wife used the blow dryer it would kick the breaker, i had to add another circut and it is ok now. it would proberly  kick a 20 amp breaker if you try to run two space heaters, but you could run a cord from some other place like the garage or somewere near. it looks like you got it under controll and are ready for the cold.!!

Mike,

I really went all out this year. I have a really good friend who's an electrician and he installed (4) waterproof outdoor outlets for me - all on separate breakers. We drilled a hole in the side of the house and ran PVC to the deck. (1) of the outlets is a 230-volt, 30-amp, NEMA 6-30 outlet which I will use to run my Dayton 21,000-btu heater. The maximum you can get out of a 110-volt heater is 1500-watts (5000btu) and I would've had to use about (4) of them for my biosphere. Apparently, the 230-volt heater is alot more efficient becuase the higher voltage makes it heat up alot quicker and uses less amperage. The other structures will just use (1) regular 1500-watt heater on it's own circuit.

[BobbyinNY 7]

Thanks for all the info - so, I'm on the right track with the Miracle-Gro potting mix, but I'd been adding sand.  So I should switch to perlite.   I do drill the holes in the bottom of the container, but I'd been trying to improve drainage with a layer of lava rock at the base.  Is this a bad idea?

Really like the poly-tunnels for cold-protection - do you use a heater that you can leave unattended?

hey there Sunny....

No using lava rocks isn't a bad idea - I used to do it cause I thought it would help drainage, but I find that it just makes the whole pot heavier. If the soil you're using is a very light mixture, and you have enough holes in the bottom, then you shouldn't have any problems at all with drainage. Remember, it's really all about how much water the plant is using at any given time. If it's 90f outside and the sun is draining all the water then it doesn't need to be as light as if it's indoors and it's 68-72f..  Most plants I've found out will tell you how happy they are just by paying close attention to them. I've had several plants that were sitting in large pots and not drinking any water at all, and I repotted them into SMALLER pots and they started growing like crazy. Tropicals kinda like to be crowded a bit and break out their environment into the next biggest one.

[SunnyFl 9]

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 20 2006,15:36)

QUOTE

[

hey there Sunny....

No using lava rocks isn't a bad idea - I used to do it cause I thought it would help drainage, but I find that it just makes the whole pot heavier. If the soil you're using is a very light mixture, and you have enough holes in the bottom, then you shouldn't have any problems at all with drainage. Remember, it's really all about how much water the plant is using at any given time. If it's 90f outside and the sun is draining all the water then it doesn't need to be as light as if it's indoors and it's 68-72f..  Most plants I've found out will tell you how happy they are just by paying close attention to them. I've had several plants that were sitting in large pots and not drinking any water at all, and I repotted them into SMALLER pots and they started growing like crazy. Tropicals kinda like to be crowded a bit and break out their environment into the next biggest one.

Yes, the lava rocks really do add to the weight!  Makes it hard to move the pots around - but on the other hand, they don't blow over as easily when we get strong winds.

My potted plants will be kept outdoors (except in a cane) as there's something about my house - plants don't thrive in here.  They decline quite quickly - think there's not enough light and definitely not enough humidity.  But if I have to move, there are too many favorites that I couldn't bear to leave behind - I guess you know how that is, since you're looking forward to bringing your tropical treasures to FL when you move here.

By the way, that double-trunking palm was a P. elegans, wasn't it?  Very, very nice - is it potted or in the ground?

[tropicalb 43]

okay...the dome houses are totally cool...the protection shells built with lumber and love are awesome...

having an electrician coming out and installing wiring specifically for running your heaters so your plants can be comfy this winter is the ULTIMATE expression of your some-may-say maniacal love of palms.

when i read that i almost fell over! and i complain and freak out when it gets anywhere NEAR 32F in the "winter" here in Southern Cal...i'm draggin the zamias and the hyophorbes inside the house and cussin' up a storm at what i consider a cold spell (meaning it lasts more than a day or two)...

Bobby...my hat is off to you...

YOU DA MAN!!!!

[K_Palm 1]

(BigFrond @ Oct. 19 2006,12:09)

QUOTE

Wow Bobby!

My wife would have a cow if I pull the same "palm protection" as you did.  She's already complaining that I care more for my palms than her.  Hmmm... I probably move south before I spend the $, time, and engergy. .   You are quite the handyman Bobby!  Good luck with the palms through the winter.  If successful, maybe NASA may ask you to help them with their biosphere research.

I had my wife read this thread and she wants to start a support group for women whose husbands have gone palmnutty!!!

[BobbyinNY 7]

Ok, here is the "Palm-Scraper"(term borrowed from Rusty-Pine Island) almost complete - just a shelf for the fan and door for the front and I'm done.  

[BobbyinNY 7]

underneath the Palm-Scraper

[BobbyinNY 7]

Inside the Palm-Scraper..

[Gileno Machado 199]

Bobby:

Your garden is the classic palm paradise in the north and you are probably the most admired grower in this forum. It would be a pitty if you move south and we lose an incredible reference represented with your passion and determination of growing these plants in completely adverse conditions. Did the local press discover your home grown coconuts and Adonidias yet? I'd love to visit your magic garden sometime and celebrate in one of your tropical parties. You're the kind of neighbor we'd all like to have around... ::

[BobbyinNY 7]

Bobby:

Your garden is the classic palm paradise in the north and you are probably the most admired grower in this forum. It would be a pitty if you move south and we lose an incredible reference represented with your passion and determination of growing these plants in completely adverse conditions. Did the local press discover your home grown coconuts and Adonidias yet? I'd love to visit your magic garden sometime and celebrate in one of your tropical parties. You're the kind of neighbor we'd all like to have around...  

Gileno,

Thank you for the very nice words. You're more than welcome to come here anytime you'd like and be our guest. Although I really love growing palms here in NY, I know I'd really be able to build a paradise in a more hospitable climate without shelling out so much $$$$$.... But, hey..... it's only money right?

[SunnyFl 9]

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 22 2006,22:49)

QUOTE

Although I really love growing palms here in NY, I know I'd really be able to build a paradise in a more hospitable climate without shelling out so much $$$$$.... But, hey..... it's only money right?

However the FL homeowners ins. cost will more than wipe out the palm-protection savings, unfortunately.  

I kinda agree with those who think it would be a shame to lose the northernmost serious palm grower.  I doubt anyone has a tropical garden like yours up there!

Re:  your queen palm - what size container do you have it in?  Have always wondered how large-ish palms can be maintained as potted plants, but you're obviously doing it.  I once had a lutescens - about 5' tall - that I'd kept in a large (well, I thought it was) pot.  When I planted it in the ground, it was nothing but a mass of tightly tangled roots strangling the palm - and it wasn't doing well.  It recovered soon after it went in the ground and turned into a most beautiful palm.

[spockvr6 22]

(SunnyFl @ Oct. 22 2006,23:17)

QUOTE

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 22 2006,22:49)

QUOTE

Although I really love growing palms here in NY, I know I'd really be able to build a paradise in a more hospitable climate without shelling out so much $$$$$.... But, hey..... it's only money right?

However the FL homeowners ins. cost will more than wipe out the palm-protection savings, unfortunately.  

No doubt!

I could replace my entire yard many times over for what it would cost us in increased taxes and insurance to move to a warmer area (like say downtown St. Pete)....even if we bought another house that was the same value as the one we have!

Two sets of people just moved in across the street from us into houses they just bought this year.  I looked up their taxes....they pay almost triple what I do!  And, I am certain that they have JUA (Citizens) Homeonwers insurance, which no doubt is again at least triple what I pay.

Such is the way the system is set up.  But, thank goodness we at least have the tax cap if we elect to stay in one house for awhile.

[palmtreesforpleasure 392]

Bobby, Bobby, Bobby

what a mighty effort

as a person who has partied on your deck overlooking the gardens, i can see you and Cari in a more tropical climate partying all year round outside, with you playing with your band under a canopy of 1000 palms

all the best to you and Cari

colin

[BobbyinNY 7]

Re:  your queen palm - what size container do you have it in?  Have always wondered how large-ish palms can be maintained as potted plants, but you're obviously doing it.  I once had a lutescens - about 5' tall - that I'd kept in a large (well, I thought it was) pot.  When I planted it in the ground, it was nothing but a mass of tightly tangled roots strangling the palm - and it wasn't doing well.  It recovered soon after it went in the ground and turned into a most beautiful palm.

Hey Sunny.....

Yeah, that queen is in a 50-gallon pot. That's a good question... There is a guy down on the water not too far from here that has (10) 25-foot P. Elegans in pots and they look great year after year...  I think some palms actually LIKE to have their roots constrained better than others....

However the FL homeowners ins. cost will more than wipe out the palm-protection savings, unfortunately.

I couldn't imagine that even the most expensive Homeowners ins. in Florida would cost more than property taxes up here on Long Island. I pay a relatively low amount of property taxes and it's over $10,000/year. Most people here are paying between $12-15k on a relatively small lot (1/4 acre) Our county is one of (if not the most) expensive areas to live in the country-it's just ridiculous

[spockvr6 22]

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 23 2006,08:11)

QUOTE

I couldn't imagine that even the most expensive Homeowners ins. in Florida would cost more than property taxes up here on Long Island. I pay a relatively low amount of property taxes and it's over $10,000/year. Most people here are paying between $12-15k on a relatively small lot (1/4 acre) Our county is one of (if not the most) expensive areas to live in the country-it's just ridiculous

The person buying the average house around here (last years average sales price was something around $325-350k) here can expect to pay $6000-7000 in property taxes and $6000-10,000 in homeowners insurance (depends on location).  

Remember that our pay scale down here is not like yours either.   And, the average house is not on anything like a 1/4 acre lot....more like 50 or 60' wide by 100' deep.

[Neofolis 10]

I can't believe how much you guys have to pay.  Here I pay about £1,500 p.a. council tax, which I assume is similar to your property tax and about £280 p.a. for home insurance.

I assume the high insurance prices are due more to hurricane damage than crime rate.

[BobbyinNY 7]

The person buying the average house around here (last years average sales price was something around $325-350k) here can expect to pay $6000-7000 in property taxes and $6000-10,000 in homeowners insurance (depends on location).  

Remember that our pay scale down here is not like yours either.   And, the average house is not on anything like a 1/4 acre lot....more like 50 or 60' wide by 100' deep.

WOW.. that is expensive. Although your house prices are cheaper. I wish we could buy a house for $350k here. Most houses in a DECENT AREA START AT AROUND $500k, with a brand-new house going for between $650-800k in a nice neighborhood. But I had no Idea your Homeowners was that expensive... Is it like that in ALL Florida now or just around Tampa/St. Pete?

I can't believe how much you guys have to pay.  Here I pay about £1,500 p.a. council tax, which I assume is similar to your property tax and about £280 p.a. for home insurance.

I assume the high insurance prices are due more to hurricane damage than crime rate.

WOW, Corey... that's cheap.. but you know.. It's really all relative. I pay $2.25 per gallon for Regular Gas for my car while you probably pay about $4-$5 so it all evens out.

[redant 1,047]

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 23 2006,09:36)

QUOTE

WOW.. that is expensive. Although your house prices are cheaper. I wish we could buy a house for $350k here. Most houses in a DECENT AREA START AT AROUND $500k, with a brand-new house going for between $650-800k in a nice neighborhood. But I had no Idea your Homeowners was that expensive... Is it like that in ALL Florida now or just around Tampa/St. Pete?

From palm beach county all the way to the keys it is nearly impossible to get homeowners Ins. Your only choices are the citizens (state pool) or something like Lloyds of London. Many people have seen rates go from $2,500 a year to $10,000 a year. The Mil rate in Palm beach county is around 2% and a decent but not great house will easily cost you $450,000 leaving you a $9,000 a year tax bill. That leaves you with a $19,000 per year PRE MORTGAGE bill for modest housing. No wonder people are startling to leave.

[spockvr6 22]

(redant @ Oct. 23 2006,10:01)

QUOTE

From palm beach county all the way to the keys it is nearly impossible to get homeowners Ins. Your only choices are the citizens (state pool) or something like Lloyds of London.

Same here Doug.

Pinellas,Hillsborough and most of Pasco are pretty much Citizen's territory.  I checked on this a few months ago and insurers laughed at me.

My current insurer (Liberty Mutual) told me that they are looking to cut 50-75% of their current policies in Pinellas.  Fortunately our house is not on their current hit list.  They also told me that if we moved, even to the house next door, they will not give us another policy.

So, between the insurance concerns, and the fact that taxes will skyrocket if one moves, we have no plans to leave our current house anytime soon!  However, with the dropping like a rock property values (which is happening in just about all overheated markets) it sure is a buyers market in that regard.

Our millage rate is 2.24 if memory serves.  Some areas are as high as 2.6!  

To me, it seems ridiculous to have to pay 2-2.5% of one's home value every year in taxes.  If it werent for the Save Our Homes Cap / Homestead exemption, there would have been a homeowner's revolt in this state already!

[spockvr6 22]

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 23 2006,09:36)

QUOTE

WOW.. that is expensive. Although your house prices are cheaper. I wish we could buy a house for $350k here. Most houses in a DECENT AREA START AT AROUND $500k, with a brand-new house going for between $650-800k in a nice neighborhood.

Again....remember the payscale!

There is a big difference in what a given job pays in NY versus FL.  

Our cost of living has increased dramatically in the past half decade, but wages have not really increased in kind.  This is why most of my new neighbors are from places like California and the northeast as the increase in cost of living does not present an obstacle to them, even if they took a pay cut to come here.

Most folks fom my area that have moved in the past few years have moved further north as these counties are still generally less expensive to live in than the areas closer to Tampa.  When gas was cheap, no one minded the extra drive to work!

[Walt 1,204]

My aunt and uncle have a condo on Jupiter Island, at 19900 Beach Road. Last year their taxes were $16,000.00! Then there's the matter of a whopping Condo maintenance fee. I think that's around 5 grand/year.

[Kathy 18]

Hey Bobby -- looks great!  I've been wondering whether you'd started your building projects yet (I've been working my x$#! off from waking to sleep figuring ways to buy my island home in a year or two, so haven't logged on as much....).

So, since my hubby would not help me with a project like this, and since what I buy next will depend on whether I can build something like this, are you just using 2 x 4's?  And how do you anchor it to the ground?  Are nails good enough or are you using screws?  Do you build it laying on the ground and then tilt it up?  Sorry for all the "girly" questions, but I'd really like to be able to protect some tropicals....

[BobbyinNY 7]

Again....remember the payscale!

There is a big difference in what a given job pays in NY versus FL.  

Our cost of living has increased dramatically in the past half decade, but wages have not really increased in kind.  This is why most of my new neighbors are from places like California and the northeast as the increase in cost of living does not present an obstacle to them, even if they took a pay cut to come here.

Most folks fom my area that have moved in the past few years have moved further north as these counties are still generally less expensive to live in than the areas closer to Tampa.  When gas was cheap, no one minded the extra drive to work!

I guess what really matters is how much you have left after all the necessities at the end of the month. Here are some average expenses on Long Island (not including mortgage) just to give an example.....

Property Taxes...                                                       12,000-15,000k/Year

Car Insurance (new car) , full coverage, good driving record:  $2000/year

Electricity - normal house (not mine..lol)                                   $2400/year

Heating oil (or gas)                                                                   $2400/year

Cable TV(with Internet)                                                            $1500/year

Other expesnses that might differ from place to place....

Regular Gas: around $2.35/gallon

Sales Tax :  8.5%

State Income Tax: around 5-7% of your annual salary..

[spockvr6 22]

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 23 2006,14:44)

QUOTE

I guess what really matters is how much you have left after all the necessities at the end of the month. Here are some average expenses on Long Island (not including mortgage) just to give an example.....

Sad to say....without going into too many details, those expenses are not far off what many folks down here pay.  

I am never sure how folks afford to do it.  I guess they just arent able to save any $ and are a few paychecks away from dire straits.

[NBTX11 89]

I just can not believe some of the rates being quoted.  San Antonio has probably by far the cheapest cost of living of just about any major city in the US.  The average home sale is $137,000.  For 200-250K, you can get an absolutely gorgeous 4 br, 3 ba, 3 car, 2500+ sq ft home in a fantastic neighborhood.  There are still "nice" cozy 3br 2ba 2car being sold for 99,000 dollars.  I am not kidding, folks.  Home owners ins is pretty reasonable - we don't get hurricanes although they do near the coast.  The wages seem to be about the same as FL, without the ridiculous home prices (I lived in FL back when homes were cheap in the 90s).  Property taxes would be around 3k for a 200k home.  No state income tax.  Do I sound like an ad for the state tourism people.

[spockvr6 22]

Jim -

I have heard exactly these things about Texas, especially southern Texas.

It sure seems like a great place to live.

I can see why south Texas is so inexpensive to live in (work down there seems a bit hard to come by), but San Antonio is undergoing a major boom.  I would have thought this area would have seen housing prices skyrocket.

[Walt 1,204]

Bobby: Your taxes are outrageous (12-15K a year)! I''m just picking myself up off the floor, holding my heart! (LOL)

My property taxes for 2005 were $1,920, and I have 5.60 acres!

That's my house with the green roof, surrounded by trees, at the end of a 627 feet long shell driveway from the main road (you can magnify it one more level):

http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF....=h&om=0

While my taxes are low, I'm grandfathered in under the Florida Save Our Homes Amendment. If I were to sell my place today, the new buyer's taxes would probably be four times as high. Still low by Long Island standards.

BTW, this satellite photo was taken about two years ago, right after the three hurricanes we had, as some homes have blue roofs, emergency FEMA tarped roofs.

Luckily, my home escaped wind damage.

[BobbyinNY 7]

Bobby: Your taxes are outrageous (12-15K a year)! I''m just picking myself up off the floor, holding my heart! (LOL)

My property taxes for 2005 were $1,920, and I have 5.60 acres!

That's my house with the green roof, surrounded by trees, at the end of a 627 feet long shell driveway from the main road (you can magnify it one more level):

http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF....=h&om=0

While my taxes are low, I'm grandfathered in under the Florida Save Our Homes Amendment. If I were to sell my place today, the new buyer's taxes would probably be four times as high. Still low by Long Island standards.

BTW, this satellite photo was taken about two years ago, right after the three hurricanes we had, as some homes have blue roofs, emergency FEMA tarped roofs.

Luckily, my home escaped wind damage.

--------------

Mad about palms

WOW WALT!!!.. that's incredible..... Even if it was 5-6k/year, for over 5 acres... that's alot of property in Florida. I'd love to visit sometime..... Well, we're coming down and looking around St. Augustine area in December... (kind of a compromise for my wife who still wants to feel the chill once-in-awhile). My plan is to sell this house that we have here in NY, buy something down there for like 1/2 the price for cash so we have no mortgage, and not have to work 2 jobs just to make ends meet.. Knowing me, I'll probably work 2 jobs anyway cause that's the way I am, but at least it'll be more out of desire than need. I'm really hoping to get involved in the palm industry  in some way or another.

[NBTX11 89]

(spockvr6 @ Oct. 23 2006,16:07)

QUOTE

Jim -

I have heard exactly these things about Texas, especially southern Texas.

It sure seems like a great place to live.

I can see why south Texas is so inexpensive to live in (work down there seems a bit hard to come by), but San Antonio is undergoing a major boom.  I would have thought this area would have seen housing prices skyrocket.

Larry, they are telling us housing prices are going to skyrocket and catch up, unlike FL where it is starting to level off.  SA is booming, new huge Toyota plant went in.  AT&T is becoming a giant again due to mergers - based in SA.  Several other fortune 500 companies here too.  Housing is booming - a lot of real estate tycoons are descending on SA due to the lower real estate market.  All trying to make a profit.  They filmed the last season of "Flip this House" in SA.  Housing is 137K (probably 140-150K now) but recently was under 100K so it's starting to pick up.

[spockvr6 22]

(syersj @ Oct. 23 2006,18:32)

QUOTE

Larry, they are telling us housing prices are going to skyrocket and catch up, unlike FL where it is starting to level off.

Much of FL has actually started to decline.  Short of the lousy tax/insurance situation, it is now a serious buyers market.  There are ridiculous numbers of houses for sale around here and none seem to be selling.

[BobbyinNY 7]

Much of FL has actually started to decline.  Short of the lousy tax/insurance situation, it is now a serious buyers market.  There are ridiculous numbers of houses for sale around here and none seem to be selling.

Yeahy...... time to buy in FL.... Just have to convince the wife...

[Jeff Searle 1,060]

Need a job when you get here? :cool:

[Neofolis 10]

Going by everyone's expenses, I get the impression the payscale in the US is somewhat higher than here.  I think the average family wage here is £30,000-£40,000 per annum, which at current exchange rates would be about $56,000-$74,000, but that said the exchange rate is somewhat in our favour at the moment.  Based on a more normal exchange rate of x1.5 it would only be $45,000-$60,000, but then I guess many of you would be above average earners.

[spockvr6 22]

(Neofolis @ Oct. 24 2006,03:45)

QUOTE

Going by everyone's expenses, I get the impression the payscale in the US is somewhat higher than here.  I think the average family wage here is £30,000-£40,000 per annum, which at current exchange rates would be about $56,000-$74,000, but that said the exchange rate is somewhat in our favour at the moment.  Based on a more normal exchange rate of x1.5 it would only be $45,000-$60,000, but then I guess many of you would be above average earners.

The average household income in this country is, last I heard, around $45,000.