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Sabal sp. 'huge leaf' (Ferguson Garden)

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buffy

Guys & Gals: Any info on this palm besides the descriptive name?

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Ken Johnson

OK Phill, can we get a picture?

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Rod

post-262-1225510886_thumb.jpg

O.K. Here's a foto of my Sabal sp. 'hugh leaf'. It's not a real good picture, but you should get an idea. Let me know if you need specific photos.

Rod Anderson

Phoenix, Arizona

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buffy
post-262-1225510886_thumb.jpg O.K. Here's a foto of my Sabal sp. 'hugh leaf'. It's not a real good picture, but you should get an idea. Let me know if you need specific photos. Rod Anderson, Phoenix, Arizona

How old is that Sabal? What does it measure? I'd love to see a photo of a leaf with somebody in the picture for size reference.

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Jerry@TreeZoo

Hard to tell from the pic but if you assume that the height of the house eaves is 8', then the leaf looks about 6' wide and long. You need a better pic of the frond alone of course.

Sabals are really hard for me to tell apart. I see a million S palmettos everyday, but telling a domingensis from a riverside from a bermudana from a yapa from a yada yada, I am clueless.

It looks like a palm I have seen labeled Riverside.

Jerry

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Rod

post-262-1225583418_thumb.jpg

Here is Tom Blank and his wife Suzanne holding a leaf of Sabal sp. 'Huge Leaf'.

Rod Anderson

Phoenix

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Ken Johnson

Beside the size and shape looking like causiarum the color looks like one too. Those petioles are somewhat consitent with domingensis and causirum, which some think are the same.

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Phil

Group,

Sometimes plants grown are named by their locality. In this case, the locality is a domestic one. The mother plant is at the Fegusson Garden in Orange County. This is a very old garden that is seldom visited. But, about a year or two ago, the PSSC did go there. The seeds I grew were collected about six to eight years ago. Because of so many plants in our greenhouse, many weren't moved along to bigger pots. So, I have over the past year had a few smaller ones for sale. As for the exact species ID, I'd only be guessing. I'll leave this up to the taxonomist who might also solve the exact species name of Sabal riverside while they are at it.

Phil

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sonoranfans
Beside the size and shape looking like causiarum the color looks like one too. Those petioles are somewhat consitent with domingensis and causirum, which some think are the same.

This sabal was unusual, it has a short ~ 4' petiole that is alot thicker than a bermudana(also around 4')and the frond was nearly flat with deeply divided leaflets that had fine pointed tips. Its fronds are different than any sabal I have seen. It will not be nearly as wide as some others given the short petiole. My understanding of the domingenesis and causiarum is that they are very wide for sabals(near 20'). This "big leaf" should have a pretty dense crown in the future with the shorter petioles and the large almost flat fronds.

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Jerry@TreeZoo

Sabals petiole length varies a lot depending on how much sun they get. In shade they really stretch out and in sun they shorten up. So does the entire leaf more or less.

Looking at it again and seeing Rod's new pic, it doesn't look that different from a healthy, well fertilized S. palmetto.

Jerry

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sonoranfans
Looking at it again and seeing Rod's new pic, it doesn't look that different from a healthy, well fertilized S. palmetto.

Jerry

Yep it could be that its a healthy, well fertilized sabal palmetto, those are actually quite rare from what I have seen.

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Jerry@TreeZoo
Looking at it again and seeing Rod's new pic, it doesn't look that different from a healthy, well fertilized S. palmetto.

Jerry

Yep it could be that its a healthy, well fertilized sabal palmetto, those are actually quite rare from what I have seen.

In Floriduh, home to 10 billion S. palmettos, you hardly ever see a well fertilized one. In the wild, they naturally are in lousy soil that is N and K deficient, showing a little paler green or yellow/orange discoloration. In the maintained landscape, few people fertilize them properly as there is the notion that they are native and need nothing more than God gives them.

Jerry

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Al in Kona

I have a Sabal sp. 'huge leaf' (Ferguson garden) growing in our garden. It pretty much fends for itself in that it rarely gets supplemental watering or fertilizing either. About all I've done is throw some mulch around it to help control weed growth. The width of each leaf is at least 1.5m (5ft.) and you can see the petiole size by the pic below. Here it is:

post-90-1225757884_thumb.jpg

post-90-1225757903_thumb.jpg

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Rod

post-262-1258772497_thumb.jpg

I've had some requests for a picture of my 'huge leaf' after the two nights of lows of 23° back in January of 2007. It is the palm nearest the corner of the house. My hyphaene thebaica in the left of the picture looks tough - it survived also.

Rod Anderson

Phoenix

p.s. I have limited seeds of this palm listed for sale in the 'for sale' section.

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Kris

Iam surprised that after years of palm cataloguing,still some varities of sabals are called as huge leaf & riverside...by the way are these S.Palmetto with big leaf & huge trunks ? :hmm:

And for me all sabals do look similar...kindly forgive my ignorance. :huh:

love,

kris :blink:

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peachy

What a really fantastic looking palm !!!! I want one.....now !! Who actually cares what is called...its just spectacular.

Peachy....for once too impressed for a smart A wise crack

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Jono Miller
Looking at it again and seeing Rod's new pic, it doesn't look that different from a healthy, well fertilized S. palmetto.

Jerry

Yep it could be that its a healthy, well fertilized sabal palmetto, those are actually quite rare from what I have seen.

In Floriduh, home to 10 billion S. palmettos, you hardly ever see a well fertilized one. In the wild, they naturally are in lousy soil that is N and K deficient, showing a little paler green or yellow/orange discoloration. In the maintained landscape, few people fertilize them properly as there is the notion that they are native and need nothing more than God gives them.

Jerry

If you want to see a well-fertilized Sabal palmetto in Florida, my favorite is out the West Fort Island trail, south of Crystal River. Take County Road 44 out to the end on the Big Bend coast. There's a park out there with a beach and a bathroom. At the south end is a raised drain field with a VERY healthy cabbage Palm. I'd be interested in other extremely robust cabbage palms, if you are willing to share.

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Jeff zone 8 N.C.
Guys & Gals: Any info on this palm besides the descriptive name?

As a palm collector I learned a long time ago to jump on getting some new type of seed especially when it was rarely available and selling for a cheap price. So many times that I have not bought seeds, I wished later that I had gotten them and then could not find them anymore. I got my seeds today from Rod for this Sabal sp. 'huge leaf' (Ferguson Garden). Since there has been some discussion on whether this is just a well fertilized S. palmetto I am going to have to say no way. The seeds both with fruit on and cleaned are MUCH bigger than S. palmetto, S. minor, or S. riverside that I had on hand to quickly compare with. They were close to S. causiarum fruit size but actual seed size was noticably larger than the S. causiarum seeds I had. Hopefully someone else with seeds to compare will post their ideas. Thanks a million Rod!

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NCpalmqueen

I hate to bump this old thread, but I am wondering if this mystery palm ever got a definitive ID. I just planted out 4 today. Jeff --any update from yours?

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BS Man about Palms

Cindy, how did your move go? I have two friends that lived near Jungle Music moving to North Carolina (Raleigh area) and they said the temps were similar to ours.. reading yours and kahilli's posts closer, I see that is not the case... :(

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NCpalmqueen

Cindy, how did your move go? I have two friends that lived near Jungle Music moving to North Carolina (Raleigh area) and they said the temps were similar to ours.. reading yours and kahilli's posts closer, I see that is not the case... :(

We've had the best summer to move plants. Plenty of rain and cooler than normal. So far, of all the big palms I moved, I haven't lost any yet. They seem to be recovering fine. I still have several more to move but will wait until next Spring to get them. It's too late in the season now for a full recovery before winter.

No, your climate is nothing similar to ours here in the Piedmont of NC. Hot and humid summers, cold wet winters. Raleigh proper is definitely a zone 8.

How is your garden looking???

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sonoranfans

Guys & Gals: Any info on this palm besides the descriptive name?

As a palm collector I learned a long time ago to jump on getting some new type of seed especially when it was rarely available and selling for a cheap price. So many times that I have not bought seeds, I wished later that I had gotten them and then could not find them anymore. I got my seeds today from Rod for this Sabal sp. 'huge leaf' (Ferguson Garden). Since there has been some discussion on whether this is just a well fertilized S. palmetto I am going to have to say no way. The seeds both with fruit on and cleaned are MUCH bigger than S. palmetto, S. minor, or S. riverside that I had on hand to quickly compare with. They were close to S. causiarum fruit size but actual seed size was noticably larger than the S. causiarum seeds I had. Hopefully someone else with seeds to compare will post their ideas. Thanks a million Rod!
Really doubt this palm is a sabal palmetto. It might be a hybrid, but its not riverside either, I had one of those, no similarity. I remember huge leaf with very thick petioles that I have never seen on a sabal palmetto, and relatively flat deeply divided leaves. whatever it is, the leaf isn't all that huge compared to domingensis or causiarum or even riverside. But it is a different form than all of them, too different. I have seen thousands of sabal palmetto, in the wild and in yards, those petioles were nearly 2x as thick at the leaf base as any of them. Edited by sonoranfans

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