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BobbyinNY

OCTOBER THREAD.. How's it going....

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amazondk

Happ,

I think our elevation is nearer to 300 feet above sea level.  It is still a long way to the ocean from here.  But the nights in general are not too bad.

dk

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Exotic Life

Hi,

The weather is here to warm for the time of year. It's a little cooler then last week, we have now day's around the 18-19C/64-66F. Couple day's ago we hit more times the 20C/68F and one day almost 23C/73F and we don't got rain a lot of sun. Normal day tempetures for this time of year is 15C/59F. The nights are warmer to, normal for this time of year is 6C/42F, for me i have got one night so far this october that i recorded 7.8C/44.6F the rest of the nights are between the 10-14C/ 50-57F.

The expect for next couple of day's plenty of sunshine and the same tempetures. So october still to warm but i don't care :)

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spockvr6

I can tell its going to be the coldest night of the season here.

The dewpoints are running around 44F right now (910PM)!  With a temp that has already fallen to 69F, we have nowhere to go but down.  I figure it we will liletl go below the 60F mark for the first time this season.

And, during much of the day today, the dewpoints weer in the high 30's F!

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spockvr6

Check out these NWS maps for tonights lows around FL.

nwfl.jpg

nefl.jpg

orlando-1.jpg

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spockvr6

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SoLando

Watched the Gator game in the garage (we've got a 32" in the garage!) and I had to put on sweats!! I was freezing. Also made hot chocolate. ..I know, I'm a wimp..........

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Exotic Life

I recorded last night 8.8C/47.8F, some places of florida are colder ... pfff thats strange to hear and see :)

Now the sun is there and a blue sky, the expect for today 19C/66.2F ...

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spockvr6

(spockvr6 @ Oct. 14 2006,21:12)

QUOTE
 I figure it we will go below the 60F mark for the first time this season.

Got close...61F at 722AM.

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SoLando

Was 60 here last night. Pretty dang cold!

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happ

62F here but it may not even rise above 70 under today's deep marine layer.   :P

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Scott Mcintosh

I recorded 56.7 @ 5:33 am this morning in N. W. Tampa dew pt. of 41

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SunnyFl

(SoLando @ Oct. 15 2006,00:19)

QUOTE
Watched the Gator game in the garage (we've got a 32" in the garage!) and I had to put on sweats!! I was freezing. Also made hot chocolate. ..I know, I'm a wimp..........

about 20 years ago, I'd have been wearing the sweats too, I suppose.   And there's no doubt, there was a decided cool-down this morning, with a stiff wind blowing (had to stake the baby cassia back up).

but after a few hours of yard work, it felt quite, hm, hot.  But not sweltering, thank goodness.  Today was a perfect day for yardwork and since the drama down the street has quieted down a bit, I may go back out there.  

this is a welcome but all-too-brief duration between the ebb of summer's worst heat and the dreaded ending of DST.

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Tyrone

Well here in Oz it's warming up. 26C on Thu, 29C on Friday, then 15Cmin 33Cmax and thunderstorms Sat, 15C min and 31C and thunderstorms Sunday. After that the mins are staying up around 15C with humidity. A humid summer is a brewin'.

regards

Tyrone

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PalmsZA

Hi Ty

A humid summer is a brewin'

Tell me about it, its sooo humid here right now I start sweating just looking at my spade! Todays temp is 27c with a discomfort index (real feel) of 35c. It due to be a bit cooler until Thurday when it gets into the 30's again. Mins are at the 20-22c mark.

Palms are growing well.

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amazondk

Here is a look around Brazil for the days forecast.  It looks like summer is here for the most part.  Although it is relatively cool here in Manaus as it appears to be going into our winter.

dk

HighsOct.jpg

LowsOct16.jpg

The dark spots are the coldest.

SatOct16.jpg

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Steve

My Neighbor across the street recorded 38F (3C) in his front yard and 36F (2C) in his back yard yesterday.  He lives down a hill from me in a bit of a natural bowl, so it was probably a couple of degrees higher at my place on top of the hill.  Nonetheless, it was the coldest morning so far.  Average low for yesterday is 49F (9.4C).

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amazondk

Regarding the satellite photo I guess that means the coldest of the cloud formations, the bar graph on the image did not show up.  dk

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BobbyinNY
My Neighbor across the street recorded 38F (3C) in his front yard and 36F (2C) in his back yard yesterday.  He lives down a hill from me in a bit of a natural bowl, so it was probably a couple of degrees higher at my place on top of the hill.  Nonetheless, it was the coldest morning so far.  Average low for yesterday is 49F (9.4C).

I hear ya Steve... We're about the same as you, maybe a tad warmer... I measured 39.7 in the coldest part of my yard this morning.... had a touch of frost... :(  .... Stuff is still growing - go figure.

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NBTX11

Lowest for me so far this month is 58F - only temp in 50s so far.  People don't realize this but South Texas is one of the warmest areas or the country year round, they think So Cal, FL or Ariz, but "usually" S TX is just as warm if not warmer than those locations, with the exception of the brief cold fronts that barrel through in winter.  Usually the national high in the winter is somewhere in South Texas, usually in Laredo, McAllen, etc.  Lots of snowbirds in deep S. TX from areas like NY, MI, MN, etc.  

Oct  H    L

1    91  75  

 2    91  75  

 3    91  69  

 4    90  69  

 5    91  67  

 6    94  66  

 7    89  71  

 8    88  65  

 9    87  64  

10   79  63

11   84  62

12   90  64

13   75  58

14   76  65

15   85  70

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spockvr6

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 16 2006,11:55)

QUOTE
I measured 39.7 in the coldest part of my yard this morning.... had a touch of frost... :(

Whoa!  A touch of frost at almost 40F?

What was the dewpoint and what height above ground did you measure the temp?

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spockvr6

(syersj @ Oct. 16 2006,12:13)

QUOTE
Lots of snowbirds in deep S. TX from areas like NY, MI, MN, etc.

When I look at housing prices in that area, I want to move there too!

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spockvr6

(syersj @ Oct. 16 2006,12:13)

QUOTE
Lowest for me so far this month is 58F - only temp in 50s so far.

Still hanging onto the 60's (by a thread at 61.0F) for this season in my little patch of the north Pinellas tundra :D

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NBTX11

(spockvr6 @ Oct. 16 2006,13:44)

QUOTE

(syersj @ Oct. 16 2006,12:13)

QUOTE
Lots of snowbirds in deep S. TX from areas like NY, MI, MN, etc.

When I look at housing prices in that area, I want to move there too!

Yeah, housing prices are dirt cheap there compared to just about everywhere else in the country.  It's a lot like South Florida culture wise, with what I would call a Spanglish culture being right near the border with Mexico with out the south florida high cost of living.

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SunnyFl

(syersj @ Oct. 16 2006,12:13)

QUOTE
usually" S TX is just as warm if not warmer than those locations, with the exception of the brief cold fronts that barrel through in winter.  Usually the national high in the winter is somewhere in South Texas, usually in Laredo, McAllen, etc.  Lots of snowbirds in deep S. TX from areas like NY, MI, MN, etc.  

Yeah, housing prices are dirt cheap there compared to just about everywhere else in the country.  It's a lot like South Florida culture wise, with what I would call a Spanglish culture being right near the border with Mexico with out the south florida high cost of living.

Where is this - Laredo?  When you mention the cold fronts that come through, what are the temperatures involved - and what zone is it, what kinds of palms do you grow?

I assume by "without the south florida high cost of living" you mean home prices/ins that are affordable?  Would be very interested in hearing more (and any palm pics are always welcome :) )

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happ

(SunnyFl @ Oct. 16 2006,21:20)

QUOTE

(syersj @ Oct. 16 2006,12:13)

QUOTE
usually" S TX is just as warm if not warmer than those locations, with the exception of the brief cold fronts that barrel through in winter.  Usually the national high in the winter is somewhere in South Texas, usually in Laredo, McAllen, etc.  Lots of snowbirds in deep S. TX from areas like NY, MI, MN, etc.  

Yeah, housing prices are dirt cheap there compared to just about everywhere else in the country.  It's a lot like South Florida culture wise, with what I would call a Spanglish culture being right near the border with Mexico with out the south florida high cost of living.

Where is this - Laredo?  When you mention the cold fronts that come through, what are the temperatures involved - and what zone is it, what kinds of palms do you grow?

I assume by "without the south florida high cost of living" you mean home prices/ins that are affordable?  Would be very interested in hearing more (and any palm pics are always welcome :) )

St Pete is in a higher climate zone [salvador Dali  :cool: ] .  Arctic fronts sweep down the Rio Grande valley & it can snow over the Gulf.  These events don't occur every winter but sub-freezing temperatures are more likely in Texas than in Florida & California.

Gloom under mostly cloudy/cool

San Francisco : 64/56

LA : 72/62

San Diego : 69/64

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spockvr6

(syersj @ Oct. 16 2006,15:51)

QUOTE
 It's a lot like South Florida culture wise, with what I would call a Spanglish culture being right near the border with Mexico with out the south florida high cost of living.

Oh no!  The "bling bling" has reached South Texas too??!?!?

LOL.

When I first moved to Ft Lauderdale from Maine, I was amazed at how many folks actual cared what type of rims were on their car, never mind what type of car they were driving.

In Maine, if our car wasnt rusted out, it was a good one.  And, I had never even heard of aftermarket rims!

In FL, image is everything  ???

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SunnyFl

(happ @ Oct. 16 2006,22:15)

QUOTE
St Pete is in a higher climate zone [salvador Dali  :cool: ] .  Arctic fronts sweep down the Rio Grande valley & it can snow over the Gulf.  These events don't occur every winter but sub-freezing temperatures are more likely in Texas than in Florida & California.

S-s-s-snow???

Ehhh - the 4-lettered "S" word  :P

Thanks for the heads-up on that one!  I'd rather stay in good ole zone 10, if I have any choice in the matter.

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NBTX11

(happ @ Oct. 16 2006,22:15)

QUOTE

(SunnyFl @ Oct. 16 2006,21:20)

QUOTE

(syersj @ Oct. 16 2006,12:13)

QUOTE
usually" S TX is just as warm if not warmer than those locations, with the exception of the brief cold fronts that barrel through in winter.  Usually the national high in the winter is somewhere in South Texas, usually in Laredo, McAllen, etc.  Lots of snowbirds in deep S. TX from areas like NY, MI, MN, etc.  

Yeah, housing prices are dirt cheap there compared to just about everywhere else in the country.  It's a lot like South Florida culture wise, with what I would call a Spanglish culture being right near the border with Mexico with out the south florida high cost of living.

Where is this - Laredo?  When you mention the cold fronts that come through, what are the temperatures involved - and what zone is it, what kinds of palms do you grow?

I assume by "without the south florida high cost of living" you mean home prices/ins that are affordable?  Would be very interested in hearing more (and any palm pics are always welcome :) )

St Pete is in a higher climate zone [salvador Dali  :cool: ] .  Arctic fronts sweep down the Rio Grande valley & it can snow over the Gulf.  These events don't occur every winter but sub-freezing temperatures are more likely in Texas than in Florida & California.

Gloom under mostly cloudy/cool

San Francisco : 64/56

LA : 72/62

San Diego : 69/64

Sorry Happ, that's not true.  The Rio Grande Valley experienced a snowfall in Dec 04, I believe, and before then it hadn't snowed (at all) since 1895.  There is absolutely NO difference in climate between Central Florida and deep South Texas.  Summers might actually be hotter.  Now if you're talking further north in Texas, for example, where I am, then yes, it can snow lightly once every 10-15 years.  Last snowfall (other than a trace) was 1986 I believe in the San Antonio area (we missed the Dec 04 snowfall).  The Rio Grande Valley is zone 10a long term and has averaged a 10b the past 10-15 years.  I've lived in both TX and FL and normally the cold fronts aren't any worse that what they get in North and Central FL (South FL stays warmer of course).  Huge difference between North and South Texas.  Most people see an ice or snow storm hitting north texas on the weather channel, but they don't realize is that the RGV could be 80F at the same time.  Watch the national highs all winter and at least 50% of the time it will be somewhere in south Texas (either that or somewhere like Ft myers, FL  

As far as palms, if you can grow it in Tampa, Orlando, Melbourne, or Cocoa FL, you can grow it in Deep S. TX.  Some palms are more adaptable here due to the drier climate - less susceptible to cold.  The RGV has been bottoming out in the mid 30s for winter lows.  Most winters no freezes.  Same to a certain extent with Laredo and corpus christi further up the coast, Corpus gets about 1 freeze every 2 years or so.  I live 200 miles (or so) north of the valley and my lows are in the mid 20s once or twice year. Sure there might be an 89 type event but that is once every 30 or 40 years, maybe 50 years.    

The artic fronts that come through deep south TX are no worse than what hits FL.  North Texas and even Central Texas DO get quite cold though on average, and this may be what you are thinking about.  

As far as real estate, the Average cost of a home in SA is 137K.  Probably around 100K in the valley (my guess).  So the big real estate gains haven't hit here yet, although they are starting to as this is becoming hot market.

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NBTX11

(SunnyFl @ Oct. 16 2006,22:34)

QUOTE

(happ @ Oct. 16 2006,22:15)

QUOTE
St Pete is in a higher climate zone [salvador Dali  :cool: ] .  Arctic fronts sweep down the Rio Grande valley & it can snow over the Gulf.  These events don't occur every winter but sub-freezing temperatures are more likely in Texas than in Florida & California.

S-s-s-snow???

Ehhh - the 4-lettered "S" word  :P

Thanks for the heads-up on that one!  I'd rather stay in good ole zone 10, if I have any choice in the matter.

It doesn't snow any more in deep S. Texas than it does in St. Pete. Gauranteed.  Check the weather stats for the valley if you don't believe me.

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happ

USDA lists Brownsville as 9b :

http://www.usna.usda.gov/Hardzone/hzm-sm1.html

Though warmer than much of SoCalifornia/NoFlorida

http://blue.utb.edu/paullgj/tropical_agriculture/

likelihood of frost/freezing is higher.

Despite frequently seeing temperatures above 100 °F, sometimes as early as February[2] and as late the end of October, the highest temperature ever recorded in McAllen is only 110 °F, once in 1998 and once in 1999. The lowest temperature ever recorded in McAllen is 17 °F, on January 12th, 1962, which is far lower than would be expected at the same latitude in Florida or on the west coast of North America, due to its location in the middle of the continent.

http://www.answers.com/topic/mcallen-texas

Galveston Xmas Eve Snow Storm:

http://www.srh.noaa.gov/hgx/projects/xmasevesnow04.htm

Its a geographical thing.  Without mountains [California] and peninsular moisture [Florida] arctic fronts cross well into northern Mexico, further south than Miami.

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NBTX11

Happ,

First of all, the 1990 USDA map you are referring to is based on 12 years of data, and even then is on the border of 10a.

I have attached the 56 years worth of data - 56 year avg min low for Brownsville is 33.6F

This is far more reliable than 12 years worth of data that includes some of the 80s cold snaps.

http://www.srcc.lsu.edu/southernClimate/atlas/

If some of our valley members are on here they can verify the valley is zone 10.

Also, according to the arbor day zone map they are zone 10.

http://www.arborday.org/media/zones.cfm

"The lowest temperature ever recorded in McAllen is 17 °F, on January 12th, 1962, which is far lower than would be expected at the same latitude in Florida or on the west coast of North America, due to its location in the middle of the continent."

This is actually a true statement, because they are on the same latitude with South Florida.  I stated they are equal climate wise with Central Florida which is 100% correct.  Tampa and Orlando for example has almost the exact same record cold temperatures.

All time Record Lows:

Tampa 18F

Orlando 19F

Brownsville 15F

SPI 17F

The Galveston snowfalls and freezes are irrelevant to the valley because that was 500 miles up the Texas coast.  That would be like showing a weather pattern from San Francisco and equating it to San Diego.

Also from one of the websites you posted:

Feb. average temperature of 61.1o F. is warmer than San Diego, California (57.8o F.), Tampa, Florida (60.7o F.), and Orlando, Florida (60.5o F.) (Climate Prediction Center).   Extreme South Texas, thus, has the warmest winter weather in the continental United States west of South Florida.  What the data do not show are the  occasional blasts of  cA (continental Arctic) air masses.  The strong and very dry northwest winds wreak havoc with leafy tropical vegetation such as bananas.  Although classified as USDA climate zone 9B (winter lows between 25o-30o F.), it is very rare to have temperatures below 30o F. When these do occur, about once every five years, it is the result of a massive Arctic invasion which drives freezing temperatures as far south as Miami in Florida.  These freezes are devastating in the Lower Rio Grande Valley.

Happ, I think we're splitting hairs, but the bottom line is the Valley is a Zone 10 with rare freezes (once every 5-10 years, and even rarer severe freezes.  It is equal with Central Florida, even though it is on the same latitude with South Florida.

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BobbyinNY

I think this map really says it all.....

post-57-1161095345_thumb.jpg

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Tyrone

(PalmsZA @ Oct. 16 2006,09:18)

QUOTE
Hi Ty

A humid summer is a brewin'

Tell me about it, its sooo humid here right now I start sweating just looking at my spade! Todays temp is 27c with a discomfort index (real feel) of 35c. It due to be a bit cooler until Thurday when it gets into the 30's again. Mins are at the 20-22c mark.

Palms are growing well.

Our weather is not quite as good as yours yet. But I'm looking forward to the weekend when the weather improves a couple of notches.

regards

Tyrone

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Neofolis

Our weather remains generally exceptionally mild, although it is somewhat messed up.  On the night/morning of 10th/11th the temperature didn't drop below 17°C/63°F, the following night it dropped to 4°C/39°F.  The warmest night of the month, followed by the second coldest, very odd.

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NBTX11

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 17 2006,10:29)

QUOTE
I think this map really says it all.....

That's a generalized map that doesn't say anything in my opinion..  I've lived in FL and Texas for over 6-7 years each. and am familiar with both the RGV and South Florida.  Quick, raise of hands of those who have actually lived in South Texas and Florida, not just seen weather stats on some website.

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BobbyinNY
That's a generalized map that doesn't say anything in my opinion..  I've lived in FL and Texas for over 6-7 years each. and am familiar with both the RGV and South Florida.  Quick, raise of hands of those who have actually lived in South Texas and Florida, not just seen weather stats on some website.

Jim,

I've never lived in South Texas, but I lived in Ft. Lauderdale for 6 years and can say that, even though I wasn't a palm afficionado at the time, I did pay attention to the weather - mostly to tease my family up north about how warm it was, and can only remember once where the temperature got below like 39f and that was during Christmas of 89..

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NBTX11

(BobbyinNY @ Oct. 17 2006,11:53)

QUOTE
That's a generalized map that doesn't say anything in my opinion..  I've lived in FL and Texas for over 6-7 years each. and am familiar with both the RGV and South Florida.  Quick, raise of hands of those who have actually lived in South Texas and Florida, not just seen weather stats on some website.

Jim,

I've never lived in South Texas, but I lived in Ft. Lauderdale for 6 years and can say that, even though I wasn't a palm afficionado at the time, I did pay attention to the weather - mostly to tease my family up north about how warm it was, and can only remember once where the temperature got below like 39f and that was during Christmas of 89..

Your right, Ft lauderdale and Miami-Dade do stay warmer than TX.  I stayed with relatives in both Homestead and Okeechobee FL when I lived in FL, so I am well aware of what S. FL is like.  But Deep S. TX stays a lot warmer than most people think, bottoming out at around 34 or 35F, kinda like Tampa or Orlando.  North and Central Texas can and do get VERY cold (teens and 20s), but "normally" that doesn't apply to South Texas (except for those rare freezes that we have all heard about).

Jim

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BobbyinNY
Your right, Ft lauderdale and Miami-Dade do stay warmer than TX.  I stayed with relatives in both Homestead and Okeechobee FL when I lived in FL, so I am well aware of what S. FL is like.  But Deep S. TX stays a lot warmer than most people think, bottoming out at around 34 or 35F, kinda like Tampa or Orlando.  North and Central Texas can and do get VERY cold (teens and 20s), but "normally" that doesn't apply to South Texas (except for those rare freezes that we have all heard about).

Jim

ahhh... ok, Jim.. that makes more sense to me now.. So south Texas is alot more like Central FL (Orlando, Tampa)

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Exotic Life

Like Neofolis say, we have here a very mild october, they say that october maybe gonna break the old record.

Last night was a little cold with 6.9C/44.4F but today the sun was shining again with al blue sky and 18.8C/65.8F. From tomorrow the night temps are more and more rising and the expect the next 6 day's night temps around the 14-15C/57.2-59F and day temps between the 18-20C/64.4-68F

Normal for this time of year Night tempeture 6C/42F and a day tempeture from 15C/59F

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Steve

Bobby,

Is your new Trachy going to brave the elements this year, or did you put the greenhouse over it?

You mentioned that stuff is still growing.  It seems like my Trachy has grown more in September and early October than it did in July and Aug.  It was really dry and hot those moths this year.

What did you use to protect your outdoor queens last weekend?  What temp do they start to show cold damage at?

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