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Dr. John Dransfield visits the Big Island

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neoflora
Bo, this "canaliculata" Dypsis I might have some info on if you wanted to know more about its origin. Ron Lawyer sold me a plant a few years ago he collected himself in Madagascar. He brought back some seedlings and seed. He sold me a plant he grew from seed. He had no ID on it. Well 1 1/2 years later I bring in a plant from Jeff Searle called Dypsis canaliculata which is like the one you have and that every one else's I have seen called "canaliculata". Looking at the two closely one can see they are the same exact plant. So if one really wanted to know more, they could contact Ron. :)

I plead the fifth. I don,t remember were this palm was collected. The larger plants I have are really starting to look interesting.

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rafiki
Bill,

Did you send seed to Jeff Marcus? If you google "Dypsis sahanofensis" you'll find an entry in Dave's Garden Plantfiles that has a photo of a mature speciment from Jeff's garden, and it looks to me like it's the true species. What I'm dying to know is if the seedlings Jeff is currently selling as Dypsis sahanofensis are from his tree. I've been growing plants from him for a couple years now and they are good growers and are so far consistent with the true species. If Jeff's plant is the true species, AND the seedlings he's selling are from his tree, then this palm is going up in numbers really fast because he clearly has a lot of them and a lot have made their way to SoCal.

Matt

I checked the site...Matt...thanks for the lead! The inflorescence and leaflet arrangement look ok for D. sahanofensis in Dave's Garden. Only prob is that it is difficult to tell if the palms are clustering. They do look single stemmed? Any way you can check with him? D. sahanofensis has many stems...up to 12 per per plant according to POM. The ones we have seen have up to 8 stems. I sincerely hope it is the true species...though! Jeff Marcus is on the ball regarding Mad palms...one of the best! Good luck!

Bill.

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Matt in SD

Hi Bill,

I was going to call Jeff this week anyways...I've got a few things to ask him about and hope it's long enough after his new list came out that we won't chew me out for calling to chat (but I will order stuff depending on his answers). I'll post here when I find out . You can see two plants in the photo, but can't tell if they are from one clump or are two separate plants. If the seeds of the plants he's been selling are from his plant, then I think it's nearly certainly the true species as they are suckering at a 1g size. We may be close to a mystery solved on this one (not sure if it has reached mystery status yet though).

Matt

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bgl

Just talked with Jeff. He pointed out that I made a mistake in post #8. There are two photos in that post and this is what I wrote:

"Here are two Dypsis at Floribunda. Both were referred to as Dypsis sp. mealybug, and then assumed to be Dypsis mananjarensis. John ruled out this as a possibility, and also felt that the two palms may, in fact, be two different species. The one on the left is a definite unknown. The one on the right is possibly Dypsis malcomberi."

Apparently I managed to confuse the two. It's the one in the photo on the LEFT that is possibly Dypsis malcomberi!

(I believe someone else may have mentioned this in one of the posts above, but I don't feel like going thru 200 posts....)

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Matt in SD

I talked to Jeff too. He didn't have much time, but did confirm that his "Dypsis sahanofensis" plants are from his tree. So we know what our plants will grow up to look like. BUT, Dr. Dransfield identified these palms as Dypsis hiarakae. I didn't get a confidence measure from Jeff, but I would guess that this is a solid ID since Jeff's plants are mature and probably had at least an old inflorescence if not actual flowers to look at. D hiarakae from the POM description and photos, looks pretty similar to sahanofensis but is smaller.

One point Jeff stressed was that the prime growing conditions on the big island make many of the madagascar palms look like they're "on steroids" compared to the same plants in habitat. Sounds like JDs visit was a long and challenging day.

Matt

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bgl

Matt,

I also have a couple of tall (15-18 ft or so) palms that I bought from Jeff as D. sahanofensis and JD identified them as D. hiarakae. If I recall he was fairly definite on that ID. I'm finishing up work on my monthly aviation newsletter today and tomorrow, so won't have time for photos for another couple of days, but I'm fairly certain these are single trunked palms. I also believe I have a number of 1G seedlings in the shadehouse (from my own palms). Will have to check them out.

Bo-Göran

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Matt in SD

The hiarakae is definitely a clumper. Both according to POM and also the fact that the seedlings from Jeff's plant are already sending out suckers at a 1g pot size.

Would love to see some photos of yours with something for scale. I can't really tell how big Jeff's is.

Matt

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Matt in SD

Hmmm....just realized that I misread the POM description. Dypsis hiarakae is listed as solitary. But the palms seedlings from Jeff's palm are clearly suckering at an early stage. Can't this ever just be straightforward? I would imagine that suckering vs. solitary would not change JD's identification. Some baronii are solitary, some are suckering, some Laccospadix are suckering, some are solitary etc...

Matt

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rafiki
Hmmm....just realized that I misread the POM description. Dypsis hiarakae is listed as solitary. But the palms seedlings from Jeff's palm are clearly suckering at an early stage. Can't this ever just be straightforward? I would imagine that suckering vs. solitary would not change JD's identification. Some baronii are solitary, some are suckering, some Laccospadix are suckering, some are solitary etc...

Matt

Matt and Bo...not sure that we can sure about any of this! D.hiarake comes from a completely diff erent zone in Mad...in the far NE as opposed to D. sahanofensis which...in the Lit, comes from the SE and reasonably high up at 400m on Mt. Vatovavy. D. hiarake is single stemmed...D. sahanofensis is clustering and markedly so. Somewhere I hear a bell ringing... think JD told me via email that D. sahanofensis had been found further north on the E coast...near Soanierano-Ivongo...but it was a year or so ago and I remember being sceptical at the time trying to work out which 'hilly' area.

Another thing about the published photos on Scott's website is that the leaflets are too broad and the stems also and they appear solitary. Apart from that there is not much difference. If Jeff's plants are clustering and Scott's derived plants are not...then something is wrong. Very wrong. If Jeff's seedlings direct from him are also clustering...then you may be lucky...but I doubt it.

Still think that D. sahanofensis is a very rare palm. Will also annoy Jeff by contacting him...but he knows his Mad palms!

Cheers! Bill.

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Urban Rainforest

Bill, I ordered 2 Sahanofensis from Floribunda this spring and so far one is clustering at not quite a foot tall. These are beautifull palms!

Steve

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rafiki

Steve! Good luck!...Any chance of a photo or two of your young plants?

Cheers! Bill.

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Urban Rainforest

Thanks Bill, I'll try to get some pics up in the next day or so.

Steve

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Urban Rainforest
Steve! Good luck!...Any chance of a photo or two of your young plants?

Cheers! Bill.

Bill, Sorry I did not get back to you sooner but I have been busy potting up seedlings :) . Here is a pic of one of my palms I got from Jeff Marcus as Dypsis Sahanofensis. Here is a pic of the overall palm.

post-351-1218165605_thumb.jpg

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Urban Rainforest

And here is a close up showing the new stem at the base.

post-351-1218165728_thumb.jpg

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bgl

Finally got around to this one...bought a few palms from Floribunda in 1998 under the Dypsis sahanofensis name. They were in 1G pots. Here are two of them (dead center in the first photo). Single trunked, tall and slender. These two have about 12 ft of trunk and overall height is right around 18-19 ft. John Dransfield identified them as Dypsis hiarakae, and the photo and description on page 286 in POM certainly seems to confirm this.

post-22-1218252586_thumb.jpg

post-22-1218252607_thumb.jpg

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rafiki

Thanks Steve and Bo! Seems we must find out which parent plants the clustering 'D. sahanofensis' seedlings came from...your little palms for example..Steve!

My own seedlings are only 18 months old and it may be a year before they become distinctive.

Very interesting subject.

Cheers! Bill.

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surferjr
Dr. John Dransfield, co-editor of PALMS, the IPS Journal, has been on the Big Island since last week, and for the last few days John and his delightful wife, Soejatmi, have been our guests. Yesterday I set a personal record, when John and I went for an eight hour garden tour here. And wishing we had had more time! John kindly offered his opinion on a multitude of palms, and I was taking notes as fast as I could! I'm going to post a number of John's comments, as well as photos taken by me (in our garden and at Floribunda Palms earlier today). Not quite sure how many photos that are good enough to be posted, but I intend to post them all tonight, but not necessarily within the next half hour or so. I'll make it known when I'm posting the last one.

First - here's John in front of a group of Dransfieldii micrantha at Floribunda Palms this morning. Seemed like an appropriate beginning to this thread!

Hello :drool:

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Central Floridave

Classic thread bump. I was googlin' for laccospadix and found this thread. As I sip my morning Sunday coffee, I figured this would be a worthy thread to push to the top!

My laccospadix early this morning

ks4.JPG

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BS Man about Palms

I see Gary Levine should go back and ADD his photos missing on page 5... :angry:

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Hilo Jason

thanks for bumping this. So great to see all these pics and read the comments about them.

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BS Man about Palms

I was looking for this thread and thought I would ask if anyone knows any of the "updated" names yet?

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Tassie_Troy1971

And, the last photo: John and Soejatmi by our driveway.

WOW Bo looks like it was a great tour ,i love this drivway pic in particular .

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grant b.

Still no pictures or new/updated names. I enjoy going back to view this thread every once in a while so I just thought I'd bump it once more for the enjoyment of others.

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Moose
On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2008‎ ‎10‎:‎37‎:‎19‎, BS Man about Palms said:

When you guys sort all this out let me know, I'll be out weeding.

:bemused:

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bgl

Holy moly, it'll take me a week to go through all this! :o Moose, you're a real troublemaker! :mrlooney:

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Moose
On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2008‎ ‎10‎:‎37‎:‎19‎, BS Man about Palms said:

When you guys sort all this out let me know, I'll be out weeding.

 

6 hours ago, bgl said:

Holy moly, it'll take me a week to go through all this! :o Moose, you're a real troublemaker! :mrlooney:

I think Bill may still be out weeding :bummed:

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BS Man about Palms

What? I was out weeding, what happened?

 

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GottmitAlex
18 hours ago, bgl said:

Holy moly, it'll take me a week to go through all this! :o Moose, you're a real troublemaker! :mrlooney:

 Lol

Edited by GottmitAlex

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knell
On 7/23/2008, 6:10:48, bgl said:

Nothing new, but still a great looking palm: John Dransfield and Jeff Marcus are leaving this Lemurophoenix halleuxii for the next exciting palm. The Lemurophoenix just opened up a new frond. Very impressive!

post-22-1216872639_thumb.jpg

today, a leaf fell from this palm... i had to cut it into three pieces just to be able to clear it away. absolutely astounded at the growth of this palm in a decade

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