Copernicia seeds (purchased from RPS) floating after 24 hours in water

[SoulofthePlace]

I have purchased Copernicia baileyana and macroglossa seeds from RarePalmSeeds as fresh seeds as is marked on their website, but they all float in water even after a day in water. Is this normal with Copernicia seeds to float in water or to take several days to sink? Since I had many floating seeds in the past from RPS I started only purchasing marked-as-fresh seeds from them, but it seems they still send me old seeds perhaps? It's 13 seeds where 3 are the extras and all 13 seeds of Copernicia baileyana float hopelessly in water and rattle. Copernicia macroglossa 7 seeds are floating out of 10 purchased. They are not the cheapest seeds either. Is it worth trying to germinate them? What is the technique?

[Moose]

13 minutes ago, SoulofthePlace said:

I have purchased Copernicia baileyana and macroglossa seeds from RarePalmSeeds as fresh seeds as is marked on their website, but they all float in water even after a day in water. Is this normal with Copernicia seeds to float in water or to take several days to sink? Since I had many floating seeds in the past from RPS I started only purchasing marked-as-fresh seeds from them, but it seems they still send me old seeds perhaps? It's 13 seeds where 3 are the extras and all 13 seeds of Copernicia baileyana float hopelessly in water and rattle. Copernicia macroglossa 7 seeds are floating out of 10 purchased. They are not the cheapest seeds either. Is it worth trying to germinate them? What is the technique?

Try the baggie method

[Monòver]

Two weeks ago i recived 10 Copernicia hospita seeds from RPS. Only one float and was rotten and two weeks later 5 are sprouted.

Mine were 48 of soak in water and i keep them in coco peat with a temperature of 27°C.

[SoulofthePlace]

Thank you for the info. My garage gets 30C in summer while outside 25-26C (because of polycarbonate roof windows) and it does not cool down much at night. I may keep the germinating seeds in it instead of sun exposed large vessels covered with plexiglass. What if I use a small narrow and tall nursery pot say 2L size and fill 50% with potting soil, but then fill another 30% on top with vermiculite and have the seeds in the vermiculite and when seeds germinate their roots will grow into the soil below thus removing the need to handle seeds after germination. What do you think?

[Monòver]

In my opinion is better for germinate seeds the baggie method and after they germinate, put them in the pot. With the baggie method you can keep everytime the perfect moisture.

I think your temps are perfect.

This was mi first time with Copernicia seeds and i don't have experiece with floating seeds, but your seeds are with you and the only thing you can do is wait to see if something happen.

[mike in kurtistown]

Copernicia seeds sometimes are sent with a thin outer shell. Gently squeeze with a pliers until it cracks, then remove with your fingernail. But if the seed is too old, this may still not help. Didn't with my gigas and tectorum seeds.

[palmad Merc]

5 hours ago, Monòver said:

In my opinion is better for germinate seeds the baggie method and after they germinate, put them in the pot. With the baggie method you can keep everytime the perfect moisture.

I think your temps are perfect.

This was mi first time with Copernicia seeds and i don't have experiece with floating seeds, but your seeds are with you and the only thing you can do is wait to see if something happen.

Do you squeeze the coir till you don't get a drop of water, only just moist?

I'm getting dp baronii black petiole from RPS and wondering what method.

 

[SoulofthePlace]

Is there a difference between using a ziplock bag and a plastic container with a clear lid such as from yoghurt or from ice-cream?

[Monòver]

20 hours ago, palmad Merc said:

Do you squeeze the coir till you don't get a drop of water, only just moist?

I'm getting dp baronii black petiole from RPS and wondering what method.

Yes, the same RPS advice, only moist, never wet. With wet coir you will have mold problems.

5 hours ago, SoulofthePlace said:

Is there a difference between using a ziplock bag and a plastic container with a clear lid such as from yoghurt or from ice-cream?

I am using plastic containers from the chinese restaurant in my city. But the ziplock bag system is as goog as the plastic container.

This is my plastic container with the last Copernicia seeds.

Uppsss!!! One more is sprouted.

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Absolutely nothing wrong with these seeds. Every single one sank once i cracked the shell

[SoulofthePlace]

Thanks. I'll crack the shells before germinating. I got some C. seeds sunk now after 3-4 days in water, but some are still afloat. RPS at least could respond to my inquiry and not ignore it. How about using glass containers or glass bottles, glass jars for seed germination? Are those kind of cntainers equal zip loc bag nethod?

Also what do you think about adding DIATOMACEOUS EARTH into the soil or into the germination medium to prevent bugs, worms eating up the germination seeds?

Also.... Latania loddigessii seeds came in some kind of powder and despite changing water daily they stink somehow (specific smell, not rotting I suppose). One or two Lat. lod. seeds end turned soft into some kind of jellyish substance. Instead of 1 seed now 2 seeds are floating.

Edited June 23, 2018 by SoulofthePlace

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

RPS is in the seed selling business (mainly large quantities to growers and knowledgeable enthusiast) not the seed growing business.  The volume of seed that they sell doesn't allow them to respond to every single inquiry about specific germination techniques, nor do I think they have experience growing everything from palms, to cacti to cycads, to screw pines to agave, etc., etc. to offer advice other than the best practice that can be found online with a 2 minute google search.  

[SoulofthePlace]

6 hours ago, TexasColdHardyPalms said:

RPS is in the seed selling business (mainly large quantities to growers and knowledgeable enthusiast) not the seed growing business.  The volume of seed that they sell doesn't allow them to respond to every single inquiry about specific germination techniques, nor do I think they have experience growing everything from palms, to cacti to cycads, to screw pines to agave, etc., etc. to offer advice other than the best practice that can be found online with a 2 minute google search.  

You think it is ethical to mail floating/rattling seeds especially that I only order marked as "NEW" seeds and I also made a note in my order "Please fresh, new seeds only" which means if the seeds are old they should not send them to me and only charge me fore the seeds that are fresh.

The very beginning of their website writes about them selling small packets of 2 to 10 seeds each as well as 10000 seeds wholesale. They even have special samplers to beginners, which means their main target is retail as well as wholesale.

Also why is it a problem to even briefly respond to an order that has some defective merchandise in it? They have at least two employees there who both respond to me almost every time I write to them asking them for this or that palm tree (as a "wantlist"), they answered most of my inquyiries about sales, but once I pay and they ship, it becomes impossible to receive a reply. If I ship defective goods to a customer you know well what will happen, especially if no response is received from a merchant.

Also, I have been subscribing my eail to their Newsletter which they recently recommended to me again. Over the years I never received their Newsletter, and I notice they got new seeds, but am not sure when they became new and newsletter is not even in my spam folder. These kind of issues are not human error. It is neglect and are easily fixable.

"We always make every effort to offer you the best and friendliest service. With us you can be sure of species purity, correct identification and extraordinarily high germination rates at low prices: that´s the advantage of buying through rarepalmseeds.com

Our reputation is your guarantee. We love what we do, and think that is reflected in our work. See for yourself!"

your benefits in buying from rarepalmseeds.com

Freshness: All seeds are completely fresh and viable. We take samples from all deliveries of our collectors, in order to test the freshness and germination rates. These are very rarely low (although in some palm seeds this is sadly unavoidable), occasionally acceptable, but mostly excellent. Germination rates of up to 100% have been reported by many customers.

Customer satisfaction: Customers who are not satisfied with the germination of their seeds will be reimbursed by us (except where due to obvious customer error). Hundreds of customer letters can testify to the quality of the seeds delivered and to our friendly service.

They do ship for free and include extra seeds, but from a 10 seed order received 13 seeds and all 13 were floating and rattling while I clearly asked for fresh seeds as marked on their page. Only after 4 days in water 9 seeds went down and 4 are still floating. I got almost my money's worth though.

Also if I was to be reimbursed for non-germination, I have ony germinated less than 1% of what they sent me over the years, I never requested that kind of action as one never knows when the buyer's germination was not done correctly. So I take it as my experience and started buying only seeds that are marked as NEW. The Copernicia seeds cost over €1 each, not cheap and all floating in the beginning.

In the past I bought Washingtonia seeds from them. I am good at identifying all 3 including the hybrid. RPS seeds turned out to be something else once they germinated, for example instead of Filifera they turned out as Robusta. When I talked to Tobias, he wrote that to his opinion Washingtonia only has one species. To my knowledge there are W. robusta, W. filifera and W. Hybrid "filibusta" and I am able to tell all three apart even i the middle of the night (after 11 years of growing them). Everyone makes mistakes, RPS is a good source of seeds, they just have to do what they say they will all the time and not just sometimes. That's what secretary is for. I never bother a company unless there is a problem.  My order was for about €80, although usually for €30. I reordered some seeds several times as I was unable to germinate even a single seed. With improved technique and a hotter summer I was able to already germinate a few seeds, also this time I oprdered only "NEW" ones.

Gladly I was offered some free seeds by a couple good guys as I no longer have a budget to buy more seeds. The 10+ year long economic crisis have become worse this year.

This is like a my review of RPS from whom I bought seeds for about a decade.

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

I purchased/recieved the same seeds that you did and 101 out of 101 were sinkers with the shell removed.  Floating seeds dont always mean they are bad especially if they are a species with an outter shell like copernicia. 

[SoulofthePlace]

12 hours ago, TexasColdHardyPalms said:

I purchased/recieved the same seeds that you did and 101 out of 101 were sinkers with the shell removed.  Floating seeds dont always mean they are bad especially if they are a species with an outter shell like copernicia. 

Thanks for advising. Today, after 4 days in water only one Copernicia seed is floating (an one seed of other two species, which is not a problem as they sent me extras). No complaints. I am happy with the seeds.

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Three days since recieving in the mail and i already have a few germinating baily seeds. Faster and fresher than usual. Nothing but ultra high quality seed here. 

[SoulofthePlace]

You crack the shells open completely remove the shells or partially?

[Hferrell87]

You will want to completely remove the outer shell from the seed and then soak for a day or so, changing the water every 24-hours. 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Remove the whole thing