Beccariophoenix and frost. I´m surprised.

[Alberto]

 Our winters are a lot warmer then when I was a child. Lately there are 1 to 3 freezes every winter and sometimes even a frostless one some years ago... Last june I wasn´t at home when there was a freeze again. I heard reports varying from -2 to -5ºC in my region. Not sure how cold it was here at my place. This Beccariophoenix alfredi was planted on one of the lowest and coldest spots of my property. It was badly frost burned at the strap leave seedling stage and after that I protected the little palm every winter with a cloath [big bag].This year it was exposed to the sky, but I´m surprised how it responded. Some more flat leaves are bronzed but the overall look is OK. Big surprise. 

 

Edited August 12, 2017 by Alberto

[Alberto]

Effect of the frost on Strlitzia nicolai , near the house, a warmer spot. 2nd pic Dypsis abositrae, also a better location. 

[Alberto]

This two other B. alfredii oplanted at a little higher spot are even better

[DoomsDave]

OUCH on your ambositrae!

Alfredii are a real winner, yes indeed.

Let us know if the ambie recovers.

[RedRabbit]

That's pretty impressive if you ask me. Strlitzia nicolai are decently cold tolerant so I'm surprised the Alfies went through that nearly unscaved. These are just great palms all around.

[Alberto]

1 hour ago, DoomsDave said:

OUCH on your ambositrae!

Alfredii are a real winner, yes indeed.

Let us know if the ambie recovers.

It will recover, but I was hoping for a hardier palm.....

[Missi]

Brazil gets frost?! 

[Alberto]

2 hours ago, Missi said:

Brazil gets frost?! 

 Southern Brazil gets frost, specially at higher altitude on the southern tablelands. A lot of cold hardy species you grow there in the States comes from this region, like pindo , Trithrinax brasilensis, queen palm, etc

[Tyrone]

Alberto your frost experience is almost identical to mine. I saw -3C I reckon and saw identical damage to strelitzia nicolai and a lot of my stuff even under canopy is burnt. My pritchardias look like I threw sulphuric acid onto them, as do my hyophorbe indicas under canopy. My P roebellinis look real burnt, But my alfrediis right next to them have sailed through like nothing really happened, except for a couple of tinged spots but nothing really bad.  I didn't even protect my little ones in the ground and they're still fine opening new leaves in winter. A real winner. Gonna plant more.

[Alberto]

41 minutes ago, Tyrone said:

Alberto your frost experience is almost identical to mine. I saw -3C I reckon and saw identical damage to strelitzia nicolai and a lot of my stuff even under canopy is burnt. My pritchardias look like I threw sulphuric acid onto them, as do my hyophorbe indicas under canopy. My P roebellinis look real burnt, But my alfrediis right next to them have sailed through like nothing really happened, except for a couple of tinged spots but nothing really bad.  I didn't even protect my little ones in the ground and they're still fine opening new leaves in winter. A real winner. Gonna plant more.

Ooooch, that hurts. Thats the reason I don´t try any palm that hasn´t any potential cold anf frost hardiness.  I´d hate to loose years of work in one night....

[Josh-O]

its a good thing D. Ambos are fast growing. It should bounce back in no time flat.

[Alberto]

8 hours ago, Missi said:

Brazil gets frost?! 

And snow in my state Paraná 4 years ago...   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhSIaeGQNdc

[tim_brissy_13]

Same experience here this winter. Only around 0-1C but heavy frost saw most of my palms badly burnt including D ambositare, baronii, Hedyscepe, Rhopalostylis sapida, Ceroxylon ventricosum, parvum, Archontophoenix myolensis and purpurea among others. Both of my B alfrediis were the only two unprotected palms with no damage and they have grown throughout winter as well. I'm shocked they are so much more frost hardy than D ambositrae and R sapida in particular.

[GottmitAlex]

Gotta love the B. Alfredii. If any of my C. Nucifera do not make it, I will happily replace them with more B. Alfredii. It's actually a win-win palm. 

[Tyrone]

7 hours ago, tim_brissy_13 said:

Same experience here this winter. Only around 0-1C but heavy frost saw most of my palms badly burnt including D ambositare, baronii, Hedyscepe, Rhopalostylis sapida, Ceroxylon ventricosum, parvum, Archontophoenix myolensis and purpurea among others. Both of my B alfrediis were the only two unprotected palms with no damage and they have grown throughout winter as well. I'm shocked they are so much more frost hardy than D ambositrae and R sapida in particular.

That's not good at all Tim. I'm surprised the rhopies and ceroxylon burnt at that temp. Thought they were way hardier.

[Tyrone]

Alberto, I'm intrigued by your climate. Had a look at carembeis climate stats and it follows mine relatively well except I'm about 2C colder than you for winter maximums only. My rainfall is lower but I'm on peat and clay and irrigate in the warm weather a lot. Humidity is high year round here too. Are you growing Euterpe edulis that is from parana state at all?

[Palm Tree Jim]

Keep us updated on the progress.

[Alberto]

2 hours ago, Tyrone said:

Alberto, I'm intrigued by your climate. Had a look at carembeis climate stats and it follows mine relatively well except I'm about 2C colder than you for winter maximums only. My rainfall is lower but I'm on peat and clay and irrigate in the warm weather a lot. Humidity is high year round here too. Are you growing Euterpe edulis that is from parana state at all?

Years ago I tried to grow Euterpe edulis from Paraná´s subtropical frostfree atlantic plane. But they died with heavier frost. Some years ago I found a population of E. edulis growing in araucária forest in the municipality of Reserva in Paraná, at 850m altitude. From this seeds I have mature plants growing in the Muncipality of Tibagi and also here at my place in Carambeí.I think this are cold hardier then the lowland variety. RPS sold seeds of this strain some time ago.

[Tyrone]

6 hours ago, Alberto said:

Years ago I tried to grow Euterpe edulis from Paraná´s subtropical frostfree atlantic plane. But they died with heavier frost. Some years ago I found a population of E. edulis growing in araucária forest in the municipality of Reserva in Paraná, at 850m altitude. From this seeds I have mature plants growing in the Muncipality of Tibagi and also here at my place in Carambeí.I think this are cold hardier then the lowland variety. RPS sold seeds of this strain some time ago.

That is very interesting. My lowland variety E edulis all died here. I got some of the parana ones last year and went looking for the seedlings last week, expecting to find them all dead. Well they're alive and not looking too bad for one leaf stage. I think our climates have lots of similarities. I'm always looking for something that has very close climate and I think your climate is more similar to me than anywhere in Australia or NZ except for overall rainfall. That being said even if it's not raining there's always humidity or moisture somewhere. It's hard to find a dry day to mow the lawn or spray for weeds all year round. Aracauria angustifolia seems to just love it here, and although butias are really adaptable the one capitata (old naming) I have here planted by the previous owner has just quadrupled in size in 4 years since I started irrigating it in summer and looks like it's extremely happy in this climate. I'm wondering what other palms come from your area or do well for you. We should compare lists. 

[Alberto]

Tyrone,so you bought the seeds from RPS last year ?  How was the germination rate ?  This seeds came from the Euterpe edulis that I cultivated at my fathers farm in Tibagi, a little warmer municipality, but also very frosty sometimes. This palms matured faster then at my place. The origin of all this palms were from the seeds collected in Reserva -state Paraná. 

Euterpe edulis needs lots of water.  The palms that I planted where the rainwater of roofs collects , grew a lot faster

Edited August 16, 2017 by Alberto

[Alberto]

1 hour ago, Tyrone said:

 Aracauria angustifolia seems to just love it here, and although butias are really adaptable the one capitata (old naming) I have here planted by the previous owner has just quadrupled in size in 4 years since I started irrigating it in summer and looks like it's extremely happy in this climate. I'm wondering what other palms come from your area or do well for you. We should compare lists. 

I´m always curious about the flora of regions with a similar climate as mine here. Some of the native palms of my region are listed below. Wat are the native palms of your region in Albany ?  

[Tyrone]

On 17/08/2017, 7:38:47, Alberto said:

Tyrone,so you bought the seeds from RPS last year ?  How was the germination rate ?  This seeds came from the Euterpe edulis that I cultivated at my fathers farm in Tibagi, a little warmer municipality, but also very frosty sometimes. This palms matured faster then at my place. The origin of all this palms were from the seeds collected in Reserva -state Paraná. 

Euterpe edulis needs lots of water.  The palms that I planted where the rainwater of roofs collects , grew a lot faster

Yes the seeds were from RPS and I could tell straight away that they were good quality. I think from 20 seeds I got 16 palms so that's 80% germination. I just put the seeds into a community pot in moist open mix with a bit of spaghnum over the top and put the whole pot into a plastic bag and keep inside at room temp around 22-24C. After a couple of months they were up. After 6 months I put them into there own pots. I hope they grow well here. Thanks for giving me the location of their origin. This will give me information on the ideal growing conditions for them.

[Alberto]

On 16/08/2017 21:02:10, Alberto said:

I´m always curious about the flora of regions with a similar climate as mine here. Some of the native palms of my region are listed below. Wat are the native palms of your region in Albany ?  

Are there any native palms in your region/

[Tyrone]

On 17/08/2017, 8:02:10, Alberto said:

I´m always curious about the flora of regions with a similar climate as mine here. Some of the native palms of my region are listed below. Wat are the native palms of your region in Albany ?  

No native palms here unfortunately. We do have native cycads. Only one species down here, Macrozamia reidlii. I've got a couple growing here that were never planted and I was amazed to find them here as I'm on the remains of a peat swamp and they're meant to grow on sand and gravel. I have an island on the main lake that the previous owner just used to mow everything on. I planted an Archontophoenix cunninghamiana on the island and a few months later right next too it all these cycad leaves pop out of the ground. It was an M reidlii and it's growing well.

The closest native palm to my area is Livistona alfredii 1600 km north of me with one specimen growing on NW cape and the rest in a place called Millstream further north and inland. But Livistona australis grows like a weed here as it grows further south than here on the east coast of Australia. Most Livistonas should do well here except the tropical ones.

Things that do well for me so far in unprotected sites are Parajubaea torralyi, cocoides, sunkha, Judaea, Brahea, Sabals, Butia capitata, Beccariophoenix alfredii, Livistona australis, L chinensis, Rhopalostylis bauerii, Bismarckia, Dypsis decipiens. Under some canopy doing well, Chambeyronia macrocarpa and hookeri, Hedyscepe, Rhopalostylis sapida, Rhopalostylis bauerii, and Kermadec Island form, Ceroxylon quindiense(only small), and Ravenea glauca. My Howeas, and Archontophoenix have all various degrees of frost burn even under canopy from my neg 3C this year. I was surprised by the Howeas burning.

Surprisingly under some canopy my Arenga westerhoutii and Syagrus pseudococos didn't burn at all, whereas my Hyophorbe indicas and Pinangas (yes I'm crazy for planting Pinangas) look terrible.

Under denser canopy in my nursery area all my New Caledonian stuff is doing very well. I've got Cyphophoenix elegans, Burretiokentia hapala, Cyphophoenix alba, Kentiopsis olivaformis, pyriformis, piersonoreum, all doing better than they did in my old Perth garden where the summers were too hot. I've even got a multiplanted pot of Acanthophoenix rubra doing well too.

But I'm always looking out for new cold tolerant stuff to put in. So far Beccarriophoenix alfredii is the stand out winner.

[Tyrone]

Other things growing well though not palms that took my neg 3C temp with only minor damage was Ficus benjamanii and Ficus macrophylla (Moreton Bay Fig). These become huge canopy trees great for protecting more tender palms

[Alberto]

12 hours ago, Tyrone said:

No native palms here unfortunately. We do have native cycads. Only one species down here, Macrozamia reidlii. I've got a couple growing here that were never planted and I was amazed to find them here as I'm on the remains of a peat swamp and they're meant to grow on sand and gravel. I have an island on the main lake that the previous owner just used to mow everything on. I planted an Archontophoenix cunninghamiana on the island and a few months later right next too it all these cycad leaves pop out of the ground. It was an M reidlii and it's growing well.

 

Wow you grow a lot of different palms. Some of them I didn´t dare to try here... yet. 

I also cultivated some Macrozamia riedlei, M. comunis and M. miquelii. The only one that grows faster is M. comunis. The others are excruciatingly slow. I´m not sure if I´m doing something wrong , or maybe a lack of specific mychorrizae, ..... They are growing in a sandy, acid , poor soil. 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Another interesting macrozamia mower story... I had planted a few 5G communis and johnsonii around the nursery and some of the weeds got a little tall last year.  While I was mowing I accidentally ran right over a johnsonii and the mower blades cut 1/3 of the caudex off including all of the roots and 70% of the leaves.  I picked it up the remaining cycad chunk and threw it in a pot and believe it or not the plant rooted right back out and looks great today. 

[Tyrone]

On 22/08/2017, 7:28:24, Alberto said:

Wow you grow a lot of different palms. Some of them I didn´t dare to try here... yet. 

I also cultivated some Macrozamia riedlei, M. comunis and M. miquelii. The only one that grows faster is M. comunis. The others are excruciatingly slow. I´m not sure if I´m doing something wrong , or maybe a lack of specific mychorrizae, ..... They are growing in a sandy, acid , poor soil. 

I'm a little crazy growing some stuff down here Alberto. I had a great lot more species in my Perth garden that I just couldn't try down here. It was sad leaving.

M reidlii is just painfully slow. You're probably doing everything right.