Newly planted Beccariophoenix Alfredii

[GottmitAlex]

Well as many of you know, I just picked up a couple of Beccariophoenix's from Joe Palma.

I just planted the B. Alfredii. After the planting I removed a couple more planks from the fence in order so the Alfredii can receive a lot more sun.

At this juvenile stage, unlike the B. Fenestralis, the B. Alfredii does have a striking resemblance to juvenile Cocos nucifera. Here are the pics.

 Thanks again Joe.

 

[Ben in Norcal]

Hmmmm...methinks you need to check out the trunks on some mature Beccariophoenix...like Len Geiger's.

[Hammer]

Ben is right.  I would move that thing ASAP.  The space looks too small.  And Alfies grow roots very fast.  If you wait too long to move it, you will be risking the palm.

[Jdiaz31089]

awesome! it'll be crowded but they'll look great! 

 

I planted one about two weeks ago

[GottmitAlex]

18 minutes ago, Hammer said:

Ben is right.  I would move that thing ASAP.  The space looks too small.  And Alfies grow roots very fast.  If you wait too long to move it, you will be risking the palm.

In palms, I have never seen roots as vast as a Washingtonia. Obviously there are others with more extensive roots. I already removed two washies from the garden. 

I left the largest one.  Planted it as a seedling many moons ago. Since it was shade-grown, it has a wide base. If the Alfredii's base (bole) is as wide as the mature filibusta's base I am posting below, it should do alright. Yes, I had to open up a tad bit of the cement about four years ago...

My shoe size is 12.5" for reference.

  (BTW, I just measured the Filibusta's base diameter..29cm)

 

[GottmitAlex]

29 minutes ago, Jdiaz31089 said:

awesome! it'll be crowded but they'll look great! 

 

I planted one about two weeks ago

That's a nice one!!  Do you know its age?

[Jdiaz31089]

The original, hand written tag which i found when i planted it had, 01/09/2014 and an address in Carlsbad. I got it from Perry in Grover Beach and he said he got them as 1 gallon plants from down south. So maybe 3 years?

[GottmitAlex]

Nice. I thought they didn't grow that fast.   

It just may be possible my 5 remaining Coco's Nucifera don't make it, but I know the Becarriophoenix's will.

Although to the last, and my first planted golden malayan, dwarf coco, it hasn't skipped a beat. No stress signs, no cold damage. It went through winter with flying colors.

I lost a much larger green malayan dwarf and the golden maypan to root rot in the first week of March.  I told my Frau, from now on, no more cocos. If and when we have to replace the cocos we have, we plant something that is hardy. I opted for the Beccariophoenix genus...

 

 

 

[Ben in Norcal]

26 minutes ago, GottmitAlex said:

In palms, I have never seen roots as vast as a Washingtonia. Obviously there are others with more extensive roots. I already removed two washies from the garden. 

I left the largest one.  Planted it as a seedling many moons ago. Since it was shade-grown, it has a wide base. If the Alfredii's base (bole) is as wide as the mature filibusta's base I am posting below, it should do alright. Yes, I had to open up a tad bit of the cement about four years ago...

My shoe size is 12.5" for reference.

  (BTW, I just measured the Filibusta's base diameter..29cm)

 

Your Beccariophoenix's trunk will get WAY bigger than that, probably 2x the size, but I guess as long as you are good to keep cutting out cement?

[GottmitAlex]

21 minutes ago, Ben in Norcal said:

Your Beccariophoenix's trunk will get WAY bigger than that, probably 2x the size, but I guess as long as you are good to keep cutting out cement?

Ben, how clumsy of me. It is 29 inches in diameter. I typed 29cm....  I doubt the Beccariophoenix's will grow that wide. But if it does, I'll open up a couple of inches. No biggie.

Edited March 25, 2017 by GottmitAlex

[Ben in Norcal]

13 minutes ago, GottmitAlex said:

Ben, how clumsy of me. It is 29 inches in diameter. I typed 29cm....  I doubt the Beccariophoenix's will grow that wide.

Alex - get in touch with Len Geiger and check out his plant.  The Beccariophoenix is getting wider than that Washingtonia.

[GottmitAlex]

Just now, Ben in Norcal said:

Alex - get in touch with Len Geiger and check out his plant.  The Beccariophoenix is getting wider than that Washingtonia.

Will do! Thanks Ben

[Ben in Norcal]

1 hour ago, GottmitAlex said:

Will do! Thanks Ben

 

Picture of an adolescent B. alfredii from another thread on PT.

 

[DoomsDave]

That alfie;s trunk will fill that space, for sure. Very nicely, like Jayne Mansfield filled a cleavage gown.

Len's is grand, but he fertigates. Mine are a lot skinnier, but still robust.

Viva Alex!

And Hammer, and Len, Ben

[Ben in Norcal]

Just now, DoomsDave said:

That alfie;s trunk will fill that space, for sure. Very nicely, like Jayne Mansfield filled a cleavage gown.

Len's is grand, but he fertigates. Mine are a lot skinnier, but still robust.

Viva Alex!

And Hammer, and Len, Ben

I actually hope mine are skinnier - the monsters scare me 

(Scream?)

[RedRabbit]

7 minutes ago, Ben in Norcal said:

 

Picture of an adolescent B. alfredii from another thread on PT.

 

Wow, they get that big? I knew the other Beccariophoneix had a big trunk, but I thought alfredii would be smaller.

[DoomsDave]

1 minute ago, RedRabbit said:

Wow, they get that big? I knew the other Beccariophoneix had a big trunk, but I thought alfredii would be smaller.

Oh yes, they can, though they usually don't

 

Len ftertigates

 

[GottmitAlex]

Wow Ben. That is CIDP girth status (if not more).

In habitat, they "seem" a lot thinner. But here again, if need be, I'll open up a couple inches. I do hope it won't need a couple feet. 

 

[GottmitAlex]

36 minutes ago, DoomsDave said:

Oh yes, they can, though they usually don't

 

Len ftertigates

 

Let's hope so.

[LJG]

The habitat photos are misleading. I talked to Alfred about their size while in Madagascar and he said they are very large palms. Without scale it can be hard to tell. I will get a pic of mine tomorrow. The heavy rains have made it explode. The trunk is massive now. 

[GottmitAlex]

4 minutes ago, LJG said:

The habitat photos are misleading. I talked to Alfred about their size while in Madagascar and he said they are very large palms. Without scale it can be hard to tell. I will get a pic of mine tomorrow. The heavy rains have made it explode. The trunk is massive now. 

Thank you Len

[Zeeth]

They're big palms. They get to a point when you think "okay this looks like a fat coconut, now it'll start growing upwards!", then they just keep getting fatter and fatter.

[LJG]

This will give you an idea how big it gets. 

[Ben in Norcal]

That's what I am talking about!

[GottmitAlex]

6 hours ago, LJG said:

This will give you an idea how big it gets. 

Thank you for the pictures Len. I am seeing a lot of dressing on the trunk.

So once the petioles fall off, the trunk's diameter is like a Dactylifera's or more towards a CIDP-size?

 

 

Edited March 26, 2017 by GottmitAlex

[LJG]

I would say in-between the two.

[Hammer]

14 hours ago, LJG said:

I would say in-between the two.

According to the original article published in Palms in 2007, the trunk is 28 to 30 cm in diameter at breast height.

However two things to consider, some palms in our climate, SoCal and Northern Mexico are fatter than in their habitat. That measurement is at breast height.  The very base of the palm could be significantly wider as some palms flair at the base.

All signs are a fat palm in our area.  But we just don't know yet given that there are no trunking specimens yet.

What we do know is that before they trunk, they are HUGE at the base as Len's palm clearly shows.

[DoomsDave]

Alex, if yours gets a bit big for its britches, as we say, I wouldn't worry. It won't crack concrete. Palms are soft stemmed and grow around things, especially if the constriction isn't much, which I don't think will be a problem in your case.

Looks like the trunk will be about a foot across, maybe 18".

Thinking about it some more, maybe cut a strip out of your concrete for its entire length? It will be easier now than when your palms get large.

[GottmitAlex]

Thanks Dave. The current garden width, such as it is, measures about 2 feet (not less). 

I don't foresee an issue. Like I mentioned, if push comes to shove, I'll just open a semi-circumference bit of concrete up around the bole of the Alfredii.

One of the appealing traits the Alfredii have is just that: The more narrow and cleaner trunks compared to the more common coconut-mimics.

I must admit, the extended petiole bases do give the illusion of a much wider trunk. However, since there isn't a trunking specimen outside of Madagascar, looking at all the B. Alfredii habitat photos, one can clearly see a much thinner trunk than what the crown shaft (at ground level) makes it out to be. I hope this is the case here in North America.

In my garden, I can easily accommodate P. Dactylifera-sized trunks.

CIDP, J. Chilesis or thick-Filifera trunks are a different story.

 

 

 

Edited March 28, 2017 by GottmitAlex

[palmfriend]

On 2017/3/25 9:34:21, GottmitAlex said:

Well as many of you know, I just picked up a couple of Beccariophoenix's from Joe Palma.

I just planted the B. Alfredii. After the planting I removed a couple more planks from the fence in order so the Alfredii can receive a lot more sun.

At this juvenile stage, unlike the B. Fenestralis, the B. Alfredii does have a striking resemblance to juvenile Cocos nucifera. Here are the pics.

 Thanks again Joe.

 

 

Alex,

that is a nice looking one! All the best with it!

Do you know by chance how old she is - I `ve got two very young ones in the ground (doing very well so far) -

and I am wondering when they will start to go pinnate....?

 

best regards

 

[GottmitAlex]

30 minutes ago, palmfriend said:

Alex,

that is a nice looking one! All the best with it!

Do you know by chance how old she is - I `ve got two very young ones in the ground (doing very well so far) -

and I am wondering when they will start to go pinnate....?

 

best regards 

 

I asked Joe Palma the same question. He said it's between 3 and 4 years old. (He grows them from seed) 

But from what I have read some B. Alfredii start developing some pinnate leaves from two years.

Unlike cocos where the rule is "after 12 fronds they go fully pinnate". It seems to be a toss up with B. Alfredii.

I also know this particular B. Alfredii was in full sun. Hope that info helps.

Kind regard Palmfriend!

 

 

Edited March 28, 2017 by GottmitAlex

[palmfriend]

Alex,

Thank you very much for your quick and helpful reply - very much appreciated!

My babies are now a good year old - one is in full sun and the other in half shade under a

plumeria tree (the shady one looks very strong) - and I will keep a close a eye on them...

(documentation on PT will follow)

 

best regards

palmfriend

 

[foxtail]

6 hours ago, DoomsDave said:

Thinking about it some more, maybe cut a strip out of your concrete for its entire length? I

Or some sensual curves!

[Aleitalyyy]

On 28/3/2017 at 23:29, GottmitAlex said:

Ho fatto a Joe Palma la stessa domanda. Ha detto che ha tra i 3 ei 4 anni. (Li coltiva dal seme) 

Ma da quanto ho letto alcuni B. Alfredii iniziano a sviluppare delle foglie pennate da due anni.

A differenza dei cocco dove la regola è "dopo 12 fronde vanno completamente pennate". Sembra essere un problema con B. Alfredii.

So anche che questo particolare B. Alfredii era in pieno sole. Spero che le informazioni siano d'aiuto.

Cordiali saluti Palmfriend!

 

 

hi alex how is alfredii? grown up a lot?