Just dug out a specimen beccariophoenix alfredii

[Josh-O]

On 2/9/2017, 10:15:33, Pando said:

Maybe you planted it upside down?

[Josh-O]

On 2/9/2017, 12:22:27, DoomsDave said:

Slapping myself. Same thing happened to me, except I dug mine into a 32-gallon and kept it in the shade.

(OUCH.)

Slap a cheek for me 

[Josh-O]

On 2/9/2017, 3:10:22, Sandy Loam said:

Me too.  I transplanted my Beccariophoenix Alfredii and it died almost immediately afterwards.  Some palms just don't like to be transplanted, like Archontophoenix Cunninghamiana and Dypsis Decipiens too. My theory (with no supporting evidence) is that it's the palms with extensive lateral root systems that don't like to be transplanted, as opposed to palms which send a lot of roots straight downward. 

Josh, I really hope your Alfredii survives!   

 

Thanks! Me to  

[Josh-O]

14 hours ago, DoomsDave said:

How about a picture of your rejuvenated transplantee? For inspiration?

[Palm Tree Jim]

So, has it shown any improvement?

[sonoranfans]

On 2/9/2017, 9:01:54, Josh-O said:

here it is just 2 weeks later.

out of all the palms I have ever dug that are 10 X's more sensitive this one has me a bit puzzled and worried.

looks like I'm gonna cut off a couple leaves

the spear actually sunk 1/8" the wrong way. SHI@!!!! I put the date on the spear and left the petiole clean. this is not good.

 

Shrinking sounds like dehydration from loss of plant fluid.  The roots likely now cannot take up enough water for all the leaves as they transpire.  Ken Johnson often cuts roots little at a time over a few months when he transplants a big palm, this causes lots of small roots to grow in the rootball that will not be severed in transplanting.  A cut and pull transplant will leave a small functional root area to supply water for all those leaves.  Ive only transplanted a small 2.5 ft alfredii and it did stall for several months before taking off.  today its 20' overall.  Good luck ith that transplant Josh, I thin itll pull through, but leaves probably need to be cut, may be half of them.

[Josh-O]

1 hour ago, sonoranfans said:

Shrinking sounds like dehydration from loss of plant fluid.  The roots likely now cannot take up enough water for all the leaves as they transpire.  Ken Johnson often cuts roots little at a time over a few months when he transplants a big palm, this causes lots of small roots to grow in the rootball that will not be severed in transplanting.  A cut and pull transplant will leave a small functional root area to supply water for all those leaves.  Ive only transplanted a small 2.5 ft alfredii and it did stall for several months before taking off.  today its 20' overall.  Good luck ith that transplant Josh, I thin itll pull through, but leaves probably need to be cut, may be half of them.

Thanks for the feed back Tom.

I'm defiantly keeping this palm hydrated and giving it lots of B1, super thrive and liquid kelp.

I may just need to cut a couple fronds off or cut them in half?

[Josh-O]

2 hours ago, Palm Tree Jim said:

So, has it shown any improvement?

no not a bit. Just when I think my dig skills are are invincible this happens ...lol

Of all the big palms I have dug over the years this is the only problem child I have had.

[Josh-O]

so far I'm understanding these are fairly root sensitive but eventually bounce back with the proper care. This is very good info to know. I was planning on field growing some of these but may have to rethink this strategy??

[Phoenikakias]

Have you ever tried to transplant a Sabal minor?                              

[Josh-O]

5 hours ago, Phoenikakias said:

Have you ever tried to transplant a Sabal minor?                              

I have not dug a sabal minor before. I'm guessing it would be a very easy dig.

[Hammer]

8 hours ago, Josh-O said:

so far I'm understanding these are fairly root sensitive but eventually bounce back with the proper care. This is very good info to know. I was planning on field growing some of these but may have to rethink this strategy??

The only chance for field growing would be the Ken Johnson method of digging. Even then, that works in humid Florida.  SoCal is a different story, imho.

I think the best method would be boxes.  But Alfies grow roots like crazy fast.  They would be root bound in boxes pretty fast I think.

[DoomsDave]

1 hour ago, Hammer said:

The only chance for field growing would be the Ken Johnson method of digging. Even then, that works in humid Florida.  SoCal is a different story, imho.

I think the best method would be boxes.  But Alfies grow roots like crazy fast.  They would be root bound in boxes pretty fast I think.

It would be interesting to see how long they'll take being in a container. They certainly are rooty buggers.

[Hammer]

23 hours ago, Josh-O said:

I will see about some pics in the daylight tomorrow. 

[palmfriend]

Josh,

I am imploringly hoping that you won`t lose this beauty. But however, your documentation about its development

after the relocation is an important piece of work for all of us who are growing this species and might come into a

similar situation one day, please keep us updated - even if it will turn out "...not nicely".

Best regards

 

[Josh-O]

11 hours ago, Hammer said:

I will see about some pics in the daylight tomorrow. 

sweet

[Josh-O]

4 hours ago, palmfriend said:

Josh,

I am imploringly hoping that you won`t lose this beauty. But however, your documentation about its development

after the relocation is an important piece of work for all of us who are growing this species and might come into a

similar situation one day, please keep us updated - even if it will turn out "...not nicely".

Best regards

 

will do

[Hammer]

On 2/12/2017, 8:42:50, Josh-O said:

sweet

Sorry, took me a bit...

The smaller Alfie was planted on the same day. Two weeks later I moved it 3 feet and in the process I broke a major root.  The palm stalled for nearly a year. Once it put out new leaves, the leaves went from pinate, backwards to bifid.  It was crazy.  

The bigger one kept right on rolling. 

Both palms were about 18 inches tall at the time they were planted.

The stick my son is holding is 3 feet tall for perspective. 

[DoomsDave]

Very nice!

 

how old is you son?

[GottmitAlex]

How's the beccariophoenix alfredii?

[Josh-O]

On 2/14/2017, 6:58:39, Hammer said:

Sorry, took me a bit...

The smaller Alfie was planted on the same day. Two weeks later I moved it 3 feet and in the process I broke a major root.  The palm stalled for nearly a year. Once it put out new leaves, the leaves went from pinate, backwards to bifid.  It was crazy.  

The bigger one kept right on rolling. 

Both palms were about 18 inches tall at the time they were planted.

The stick my son is holding is 3 feet tall for perspective. 

glad to know they made it.

Cute kid BTY  

[Josh-O]

I hope all this rain will help the tree. it still looks pretty damn sad IMO.

[Hammer]

7 hours ago, Josh-O said:

I hope all this rain will help the tree. it still looks pretty damn sad IMO.

Right it is probably pumping every bit of energy it has into root production.  The rain is probably saving it.  You are super lucky with the timing of the water imo.

[Ben in Norcal]

8 hours ago, Josh-O said:

I hope all this rain will help the tree. it still looks pretty damn sad IMO.

Did you cut more leaves off as folks thought would help?

[Josh-O]

34 minutes ago, Ben in Norcal said:

Did you cut more leaves off as folks thought would help?

nope, but the spear moved up just a tic though

Now all I need is 3 more inched of movement and I should be ok??

[Ken Johnson]

I see some interesting comments so I thought I would say hey and try to learn a few things about this palm.

I do know how to avoid the "sulking" part...

[Hammer]

2 hours ago, Ken Johnson said:

I see some interesting comments so I thought I would say hey and try to learn a few things about this palm.

I do know how to avoid the "sulking" part...

Ken what are your thoughts on cutting back leaves?  

[Ken Johnson]

I like to transplant with lots of time and without cutting any live leaves. If I have no time I may cut off all the leaves including the spear.

[doranakandawatta]

If I have no time I may cut off all the leaves including the spear.

How does it look then?
How long does it take before a new leaf appears? 
Does the palm stay in a stand-by attitude many months ?

Thanks,

[DoomsDave]

On 2/18/2017, 6:29:32, Josh-O said:

nope, but the spear moved up just a tic though

Now all I need is 3 more inched of movement and I should be ok??

Slap!

The neighbor. Slapped me back .  . . 

[Phoenikakias]

10 hours ago, Ken Johnson said:

I like to transplant with lots of time and without cutting any live leaves. If I have no time I may cut off all the leaves including the spear.

Hmmm, not sure whether this can work in a temperate region with many months of winter 'dormancy'.

[Josh-O]

On 2/20/2017, 5:41:52, Ken Johnson said:

I see some interesting comments so I thought I would say hey and try to learn a few things about this palm.

I do know how to avoid the "sulking" part...

I saw the palm today and I'm not very hopeful. I'm still going to give it some TLC and hope for the best

[Josh-O]

On 2/20/2017, 12:24:47, Ken Johnson said:

I like to transplant with lots of time and without cutting any live leaves. If I have no time I may cut off all the leaves including the spear.

I wonder If I should have tried this method on Alfredii?

[Phoenikakias]

4 hours ago, Josh-O said:

I saw the palm today and I'm not very hopeful. I'm still going to give it some TLC and hope for the best

To soon yet, to give up hope. It will definitely look thrashed in the coming weeks, but it is to early for an opinion on survivability, even if it spear pulls! 

[Hammer]

4 hours ago, Phoenikakias said:

To soon yet, to give up hope. It will definitely look thrashed in the coming weeks, but it is to early for an opinion on survivability, even if it spear pulls! 

You just alluded to an excellent point.  Might not hurt to use some fungicides on the plant.  It is weakened right now. Plus all the cool rainy weather.  That is a recipe for a fungal attack.

[Ben in Norcal]

8 hours ago, Josh-O said:

I saw the palm today and I'm not very hopeful. I'm still going to give it some TLC and hope for the best

Have you cut the leaves off yet?  You are probably in last chance saloon, so I would do it ASAP if you haven't already.  They are likely sucking the thing dry if not.

[Josh-O]

57 minutes ago, Ben in Norcal said:

Have you cut the leaves off yet?  You are probably in last chance saloon, so I would do it ASAP if you haven't already.  They are likely sucking the thing dry if not.

I cut off 6 leaves and left 3 on.

Im gonna cut the other 3 asap~

oh well, I have 3 in 24" boxes I'm gonna plant in its place?

[Ken Johnson]

Even in the worst climates root pruning will allow you to transplant without cutting any leaves except the ones that die naturally. The palm may accelerate the browning of leaves during a root prune but it will also send out new leaves even if a little slower. Observing the old verses new leaves DURING the root prune is a diagnostic technique. You will also notice new ROOTS during a root prune!

Again in extreme conditions where root pruning is not possible, even if its the middle of winter, one technique that has shown some evidence of giving an advantage is removing ALL the leaves.

In the best conditions root pruning may be a moot point.

[Jan Jo]

On Sat Feb 25 2017 18:24:26 GMT+0100, Josh-O said:

I cut off 6 leaves and left 3 on.

Im gonna cut the other 3 asap~

oh well, I have 3 in 24" boxes I'm gonna plant in its place?

Hope it works out in the long run, and my transplant of the same species too, even tho mine is a lot smaller  fingers crossed...

[Josh-O]

On 2/27/2017, 11:01:45, Jan Jo said:

Hope it works out in the long run, and my transplant of the same species too, even tho mine is a lot smaller  fingers crossed...

I hope it makes it too